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AA...What's The Go-forward Strategy?  
User currently offlineSeatback From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 782 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 7634 times:

My opinion, where has AA's marketing department gone and what's the long term strategy? The airline that created the airline VIP lounge, the first FF program, hub and spoke system to name a few, it seems they have stopped being innovative. I'm struck by Delta's announcement that they are solidifying NYC with US' slot swap...where are the plans at AA?

Delta seems to be making solid moves to become or remain the leader.

Anything happening that's remotely exciting (other than the BA deal)?

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlyPIJets From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 926 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7587 times:

I'm betting that AA is happy to no longer be the leader. Traditionally, AA has been a conservative player. I think they will continue with that strategy.


DC-8, DC-9, DC-10, F28, 717, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, IL-62, L-1011, MD-82/83, YS-11, DHC-8, PA-28-161, ERJ 135/145, E-1
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 2, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7530 times:



Quoting Seatback (Thread starter):
What's The Go-forward Strategy?

Profitability.

Quoting Seatback (Thread starter):
the first FF program, hub and spoke system to name a few

AA can't quite claim credit for these two, depending on how you interpret things. AAdvantage was the first modern frequent flyer program, but there were other sorts of traveler loyalty schemes at airlines back decades earlier. As for hubs, those were around for decades at other airlines just as long as at AA, if not longer.

Quoting Seatback (Thread starter):
it seems they have stopped being innovative

They have.

AMR management has been dominated by one thing and one thing only for the last eight years since September 11: profitability and stabilizing the balance sheet.

In that regard, they have had tremendous success considered relative to their peers. AA has managed to cut their net debt dramatically, even in the midst of September 11, Afghanistan, Iraq, SARs, oil, etc. And all of that while they didn't freeze and/or dump their pensions in or out of bankruptcy (like every single one of their network peers), and without wiping out their creditors, vendors and shareholders. Oh, and in that time, they've also managed to take delivery of dozens of new narrow- and widebody aircraft, and place orders for dozens upon dozens more.

Not all that bad.

Quoting Seatback (Thread starter):
I'm struck by Delta's announcement that they are solidifying NYC with US' slot swap...where are the plans at AA?

Only time will tell.

Many here on A.net and elsewhere (myself included) have been highly critical of AMR for not taking more risks, and not being more willing to take a chance, and jump into new opportunities, be they mergers and/or acquisitions, asset sales, new routes/markets, etc.

However, that being said, again - it bears repeating: AMR has managed to eliminate mountains of debt while still keeping their business running, investing in new facilities and aircraft whenever possible and feasible, etc.

They're fighting with (at least) one hand tied behind their back, and yet - to date - they've still fought the fight to at least a draw.

Quoting Seatback (Thread starter):
Delta seems to be making solid moves to become or remain the leader.

Delta is doing well right now. They're well-run, innovative, and have money behind them.

That's today.

In this industry, things change, and pride cometh before a fall.

Now, before people start jumping on my comments, I'll make two things very clear:

1. I only bring up Delta because you did and because, as you indicated, Delta is the largest player in the U.S. now and a logical topic of discussion

2. I am not - in any way - predicting doom and gloom for Delta. That is no doubt how some of the fanboy apologists will construe and recount it in future discussions, but that's not what I'm saying. Not in the slightest. And I'm not saying that Delta is being arrogant, or acting prideful, or pretending to be invincible. No.

I'm just saying that, precisely because Delta is doing rather well now, they need to be careful to avoid getting too far ahead of themselves, since, in this industry, when you stick your head up too high above everyone else, you get it knocked off and handed to you.


User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7485 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 2):

I'm just saying that, precisely because Delta is doing rather well now, they need to be careful to avoid getting too far ahead of themselves, since, in this industry, when you stick your head up too high above everyone else, you get it knocked off and handed to you.

It just seems that DL has pretty much done a 180 on how they have generally done business in the past. Much like how AA is now, they have always been known to be very conservative, taking the wait and see option first before jumping into thing head on. And it worked for them because although they were always considered a relatively small carrier to the likes of UA/AA/EA, they were always on their ass at the same time and made money for rolling years. DL's history has always been a mystery to me. I'm not to sure what it was that caused them to start spill cash (not talking about recent Leo Mullin days but 7.5, etc). I understand their operating costs went through the roof but why



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineGSP psgr From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 180 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7466 times:

One component of it has to be some sort of long term deal with APA on a 70-110 seat aircraft, particularly to stabilize things at Chicago/O'Hare and allow for long term growth at Miami; Dallas/Ft. Worth is the least affected of the three big hubs by the lack of an F-100 type aircraft. I think they also have to figure out what's in their best long term interests regarding St. Louis, which is also possibly tied to the 70-110 seat aircraft issues.

User currently offlineUSPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3295 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7454 times:



Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 3):
It just seems that DL has pretty much done a 180 on how they have generally done business in the past. Much like how AA is now, they have always been known to be very conservative, taking the wait and see option first before jumping into thing head on. And it worked for them because although they were always considered a relatively small carrier to the likes of UA/AA/EA, they were always on their ass at the same time and made money for rolling years. DL's history has always been a mystery to me. I'm not to sure what it was that caused them to start spill cash (not talking about recent Leo Mullin days but 7.5, etc). I understand their operating costs went through the roof but why

Put bluntly, the old DL is dead, and tt's never coming back. When they bought PA's transatlantic assets and northeast shuttle back in 1991, they grossly overpaid for them. Therefore, their debt got out of hand. Icahn wrecked everybody in one way or another by deliberately raising the ante each time a key asset came available, whether that be LHR (he made AA pay way more than they had to) or the transatlantic assets (same thing--DL seriously overpaid because Icahn bid first). Secondly, DL had never laid anyone off, period, before Leadership 7.5, Allen's cost-saving measure. In simple forms, 7.5 worked, but it also did a great deal to kill off the great employee culture DL had. Some forms of it have returned, particularly the family atmosphere at small stations. But the "promotion-from-within" that DL was famous for, was over. It's never coming back. Basically DL is now being run by mostly ex-NWA people, with more of an eye towards the bottom line, than on taking great care of the employees. DL's innovation lately came from people like Ed Bastian, Glen Hauenstein and Joanne Smith, all of which are still there, in upper management. But the basic tone has changed permanently. We will see how DL fares in the years to come.



It's a Great Day for Hockey!
User currently offlineOzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5236 posts, RR: 21
Reply 6, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7404 times:



Quoting FlyPIJets (Reply 1):


Traditionally, AA has been a conservative player.

The Bob Crandall years being a notable exception. There was risk taking and innovation galore during his tenure. Not everything he tried turned to gold, but he left AA as well placed in the industry as anyone could have. Nothing conservative about the way he ran AA.

Don Carty as well made a few bold moves, the (failed) UA/US/DCAir asset scheme as well as the TWA fiasco, and I mean fiasco only in hindsight. 9/11 screwed up the TWA strategy big time.



The best IFE: A window seat and a good book.
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4764 posts, RR: 44
Reply 7, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7372 times:

Lets not turn this into an AA vs DL fight.

AA is doing what AA does very well - working toward running a good AAirline and reducing debt where/when they can. Their conservative state, while some may view as old fashioned, has kept AA in business for years. They're very good at doing what they do well.

In essence AA's go-forward plan is exactly what AA's management believes AA needs to weather the storm and ensure survival. DL's management is doing what DL believes they need to do.

Neither approach is wrong, they're just different.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineCopter808 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1136 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7372 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 2):
AA has managed to cut their net debt dramatically, even in the midst of September 11, Afghanistan, Iraq, SARs, oil, etc. And all of that while they didn't freeze and/or dump their pensions in or out of bankruptcy (like every single one of their network peers), and without wiping out their creditors, vendors and shareholders. Oh, and in that time, they've also managed to take delivery of dozens of new narrow- and widebody aircraft, and place orders for dozens upon dozens more.

CO has continued to fund more than the minimum pension funding and purchased additional aircraft as well.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 9, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7350 times:



Quoting Copter808 (Reply 8):
CO has continued to fund more than the minimum pension funding and purchased additional aircraft as well.

According to this (which could well be wrong - correct me if it is):

Continental has frozen the defined benefit pensions of their pilots, Delta has terminated its pilots' pensions and frozen their other employees', Northwest has frozen all their plans, and United and USAirways have each terminated all their plans.

AA, by contrast, has not frozen or terminated any of their employees' defined benefit plans, and has continued to actively contributed to the plans of every one of their employees, unlike any one of their legacy peers.


User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9700 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7350 times:

IMO AA is now looking at one thing and one thing only.....WTF are they going to do about the unions.


yep.
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 11, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7286 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 10):
IMO AA is now looking at one thing and one thing only.....WTF are they going to do about the unions.

People are making that out to be a huge thing, but the truth is that I - personally - tend to think that this problem will sort itself out. It will be painful, but they'll get it worked out. People sometimes tend to forget that antagonistic mistrust and bitter resentment between management and labor is just considered another day at work for AA. AA has survived through even worse management-labor relations before, and today, the unions know the score. They can piss and b*tch and moan, but they all know - when it comes down to it - that they're now paid more than their counterparts at almost any of AA's competitors, and that AA has - by far - the highest labor costs in the industry. AA is going to pound that fact home, again and again, over the entire course of the negotiations.

And again, I may be a bit too optimistic, but I personally see AA and the unions ultimately coming to some sort of an arrangement. It will definitely be painful and difficult, but I still suspect that they'll ultimately get there.

And, while we're on the subject: what's going on now at AA is going to be setting up a lot of what is probably coming at some of the other network carriers in the next few years when their workers see AA continuing to get paid more, even while their carriers are actually outperforming (by many metrics) AA financially.


User currently offlineOP3000 From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 1786 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 7179 times:



Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 6):

Traditionally, AA has been a conservative player.

The Bob Crandall years being a notable exception. There was risk taking and innovation galore during his tenure. Not everything he tried turned to gold, but he left AA as well placed in the industry as anyone could have. Nothing conservative about the way he ran AA.

Yes, despite the negative parts of his legacy Crandall is a key reason for why they focused on marketing innovations before. He started his career in that area (with TWA I believe) and was AA's marketing chief before becoming CEO. He was the chief sponsor not only of the mileage program, the lounges and the flagship service, but also of Sabre (the computer system) and all the revenue management tools that came with it, plus the international expansion piggybacking off of other failing carriers.

The other explanation besides what's already been said before (higher labor costs now, weaker financials, 9/11) is the stage of the business cycle the airline has been in as compared to before. In the early 80's when a lot of the innovations came AA was far from the largest airline, in a market with a lot more competitors of similar size. And it was also scrambling like everyone else to become more competitive due to the recent deregulation.

Since the early 90s AA has been consistently been the largest carrier or within the top 3, a size which makes growth less possible and the potential for fat higher (thus needing to focus more on costs). Add to that the onslaught of the LCCs against all the legacies which has compounded that focus even more.


User currently offlineNYC2theworld From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 666 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 6912 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 9):

As of this past April - http://www.continental.com/web/en-US...apps/vendors/default.aspx?i=PRNEWS

Quote:
Continental currently expects to contribute approximately $150 million to its defined benefit pension plans in 2009. Since the beginning of 2002, Continental has contributed nearly $1.7 billion to its defined benefit pension plans.




Always wonderers if this "last and final boarding call" is in fact THE last and final boarding call.
User currently offlineFXramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7367 posts, RR: 85
Reply 14, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 6896 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Commavia (Reply 2):
AMR has managed to eliminate mountains of debt while still keeping their business running, investing in new facilities and aircraft whenever possible and feasible, etc.

I can't see past the good until

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 10):
WTF are they going to do about the unions.

 no 

AMR needs to get this taken care of and quickly!


User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 15, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 6704 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 2):

 checkmark 

I was going to respond to this post, but Commavia did it for me. Excellent, balanced analysis of the current lay of the land.

The only thing I would add is that it is becoming more and more clear that AA, DL and CO are the strongest legacies out there. UA and US, in my view, have much more to worry about, both in the short and long term.



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9700 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 6645 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 11):

I hope you right. I just have a bad feeling this could end up as something that really hurts AA.



yep.
User currently offlineAAR90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3498 posts, RR: 46
Reply 17, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 6116 times:



Quoting NYC2theworld (Reply 13):
Quote:
Continental currently expects to contribute approximately $150 million to its defined benefit pension plans in 2009. Since the beginning of 2002, Continental has contributed nearly $1.7 billion to its defined benefit pension plans.

CO is "funding" their plans, but the benefits from those plans have been "frozen." IOW, as a pilot's pay & longevity increase, his retirement does NOT. A First Officer at CO today who upgrades to CA and retires 20 years later will never see a CA's retirement. He/she will receive a FO's retirement... a FO with just a few years seniority, not 20+ years! Still... much better than a "terminated" plan as so many others have done --I hate broken promises!  thumbsdown 

OTOH, AA has not frozen any of its defined benefit plans. At a minimum, a FO at AA will see an increase in his/her retirement benefits every year --AA's defined benefit plan uses both annual salary AND longevity to determine retirement benefit amounts. That same FO who upgrades to CA for 20 years at AA will see his A-fund retirement based upon his last 5 years at CAPTAIN pay and 20+ years seniority. A much much better retirement.

As an employee, I much prefer AA's integrity.  goldmedal 
As a former business owner, I accept CO's attempt at integrity.  silvermedal 
As both, I have severe distaste for those who simply broke their promises (terminated plans in BK) .  thumbsdown 



*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 18, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 5403 times:



Quoting NYC2theworld (Reply 13):
As of this past April - http://www.continental.com/web/en-US...RNEWS

See AAR90's Reply 17. Dead-on.

Quoting AAR90 (Reply 17):
As an employee, I much prefer AA's integrity.   
As a former business owner, I accept CO's attempt at integrity.   
As both, I have severe distaste for those who simply broke their promises (terminated plans in BK) .   

Too bad more AA employees don't see things in quite this way - or at least not vocally so.


User currently offlineCkfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5312 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4886 times:

One other point is that some of AA's moves before 9/11 didn't pan out. AA bought QQ with the idea of trying to build up traffic in and out of the Silicon Valley. The tech and dot.com collapse hurt that plan.

More Room Throughout Coach didn't do well, becasue AA wasn't able to increase revenue for the extra leg room to make up for the coach seats removed from each airplane. Personally, I think that AA's failure to do a national marketing campaign hurt MRTC. AA only advertised in its major markets, Boston, New York, Miami, Chicago, D/FW, and Los Angeles, where it had substantial traffic, and ignored the spoke cities via network television and major magazines.

Then there was STL/Trans World. Buying TWA made sense after the miserable summer of 2000 at ORD. Having a second Midwest hub 300 miles from ORD would have simplified dealing with passengers affected by bad weather in Chicago. 9/11 doomed that plan.

So, with several moves, made during the 2-year period preceeding 9/11, not having the projected positive impact on AA, it makes sense for AA to play things conservative for the time being.

Granted, if AA can work things out with its labor unions, especially the APA, then it undertake some programs for the benefit of the customer, such as a 2-class aircraft that fills in the gap left by the F100 retirement.


User currently offlineAAR90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3498 posts, RR: 46
Reply 20, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4738 times:



Quoting Ckfred (Reply 19):
AA bought QQ... More Room Throughout Coach.... STL/Trans World.

Carty's legacy is a real barnburner.  vomit 



*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 21, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4694 times:



Quoting AAR90 (Reply 20):
Carty's legacy is a real barnburner. vomit

If Carty could have predicted 9/11 and the dot-com bust, I seriously doubt he would have made these moves.

As previous posters have pointed out, the TWA merger looked like a great idea after the summer that almost killed ORD, and I personally loved MRTC.



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineAAR90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3498 posts, RR: 46
Reply 22, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4445 times:



Quoting Ssides (Reply 21):
If Carty could have predicted 9/11 and the dot-com bust, I seriously doubt he would have made these moves.

Carty was the driving force behind AA's purchase of QQ. AA has never successfully run a west-coast (relatively low revenue/profit) operation and neither the dot-com bust or 9/11 had anything to do with the ultimate failure of another AA attempt at a west-coast operation --just changed the timing is all.

TWA purchase was also Carty's "vision." What began as a competitive response to the propsed UA/US merger should have died when the need evaporated --US Gov't denied UA/US merger. Total cost to AA had it backed out... $40M. All the other reasons claimed by AA's PR dept. were just attempts to justify continuing ahead with the TWA purchase when the primary reason no longer existed. AA had previously tried using BNA as an "alternate hub" to ORD when weather hits and learned.... it doesn't work. Great concept, terrible financials.

MRTC was a nice idea, but the vast majority of pax.... simply don't care. The increased cost per seat/mile was never recovered in increased revenue per seat/mile. This was one of the first things AA cancelled after "retiring" Carty.



*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
User currently offlineOP3000 From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 1786 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 4407 times:



Quoting AAR90 (Reply 22):
This was one of the first things AA cancelled after "retiring" Carty.

I'd agree that Carty was no great innovator, probably more of a good foot-soldier while under Crandall which is why he got the job. The main problem with autocratic and micro-managing guys like Crandall is that they don't allow for other leaders to develop well. A lot of the most promising execs he had left AA and a couple of them went on to become CEOs at other airlines (Wolf at UA was one), largely because Crandall refused to give them enough input and authority.

The high debt from the mostly bad purchases of AirCal, Reno and TWA have kept their hands tied in terms of growth, and this was the case even before Carty. Ironically debt has kept labor issues from getting worse, since with AA's debt any potentially long strike would mean bankrupcy.


User currently offlineCkfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5312 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (5 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4191 times:



Quoting AAR90 (Reply 22):
Carty was the driving force behind AA's purchase of QQ. AA has never successfully run a west-coast (relatively low revenue/profit) operation and neither the dot-com bust or 9/11 had anything to do with the ultimate failure of another AA attempt at a west-coast operation --just changed the timing is all.

But AA was doing very well in SJC until the dot.com bubble burst. You had all of these executives, flush with cash from IPOs, constantly flying on whims at full-fare coach or even paying for first.

You have to remember that businesses and individuals had gone on buying sprees for technology prior to Y2K. The tech sector thought people had become addicted to technology and would keep buying. They stopped buying atfer 01/01/2000.

When the stock market plummeted in April of 2000, the dot.com businesses started going broke.

Quoting AAR90 (Reply 22):
TWA purchase was also Carty's "vision." What began as a competitive response to the propsed UA/US merger should have died when the need evaporated --US Gov't denied UA/US merger. Total cost to AA had it backed out... $40M. All the other reasons claimed by AA's PR dept. were just attempts to justify continuing ahead with the TWA purchase when the primary reason no longer existed. AA had previously tried using BNA as an "alternate hub" to ORD when weather hits and learned.... it doesn't work. Great concept, terrible financials.

BNA was never an ORD reliever. BNA was supposed to be the hub from Northeast, Midwest, and West traffic flying into the Southeast, while RDU was the hub for Northeast, Midwest, and Pacific Northwest traffic flying into Florida. The problem is that both hubs wound up overlapping. I know a lot of people who flew AA out of ORD to both Florida and the Southeast, and they would often change plans at BNA one way and RDU the other.

Then, AA started building MIA after EA's collapse. That pretty much killed RDU, while the lack of O&D traffic killed BNA.

On the other hand, something had to give at ORD. The City of Chicago was setting up cots in the baggage claims at least 4 or 5 nights a week during the summer of 2000. Unlike now, where ORD is under capacity, the City was actually relieved to have AA getting STL.

Quoting AAR90 (Reply 22):
MRTC was a nice idea, but the vast majority of pax.... simply don't care. The increased cost per seat/mile was never recovered in increased revenue per seat/mile. This was one of the first things AA cancelled after "retiring" Carty.

My father-in-law is a retired business professor, and he taught marketing. He thinks that the legacies have stunk with marketing since the end of regulation. Some of his students, who worked at DL headquarters at ATL, agreed with him.

In his opinion, a well-run marketing campaign can sell anything, provided the product is good, and that customers see value. You have to advertise, if you even want customers to buy. He lived in the Atlanta area and never saw an MRTC commercial. You have to assume that a significant number of potential AA passengers didn't see the commercials either, because they didn't live in a hub market.

If you live in Atlanta and fly infrequently to GRB, you can either fly hometown DL via CVG or AA or UA via ORD, or maybe NW via DTW. All things being equal, AA with MRTC makes the best choice, if you know it exists.


25 AAR90 : I would disagree. Crandall gave a LOT of executives a LOT of authority. AMR HDQ used to leak managers like a sieve and had the reputation as a "dream
26 USPIT10L : Don't forget Tom Plaskett. Even Carty left briefly to run Canadian Pacific before the CP/PW merger. 1966-1981, he rose from air cargo entry-level emp
27 WorldTraveler : Not true. DL is predominantly run by people who were brought in by DL. NW people are certainly part of the DL mgmt team but they are not by any means
28 USPIT10L : Did you not read my entire post? I stand behind what I said. I have worked at a DL line station, and have been told many times over that the game has
29 OP3000 : Wolf was there in the 70s to early 80s IIRC before being recruited out to CO by Frank Lorenzo. I actually think Crandall was probably the most compet
30 USPIT10L : Actually, when Wolf realized he would never run AA as long as Crandall was around, he left for a senior VP position at Pan Am. A year later, Lorenzo
31 Flaps : This is pretty applicable across the industry. I started at the bottom but my elevator unfortunately ran out of cable about halfway up. Top level exe
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