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Republic Wins F9 Auction  
User currently offlineAirFrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2826 posts, RR: 42
Posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18604 times:

From: http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/a...08/southwest-bid-not-selected.html

Quote:

DALLAS, TX--Aug. 13, 2009--Southwest Airlines (NYSE: LUV) confirmed today that its bid to acquire Frontier Airlines was not selected. Southwest submitted a bid of more than $170 million to Frontier Airlines on Monday, Aug. 10, 2009, in accordance with the procedures established in the U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the Southern District of New York.

from: http://newsticker.welt.de/?module=smarthouse&id=929954

Quote:

"I look forward to welcoming Frontier to our Republic family,” said Bryan Bedford, Chairman, President and CEO of Republic. "Frontier has made impressive strides in returning to sustained profitability in a challenging and uncertain economic environment. We congratulate the employees of Frontier. Their commitment and perseverance during the bankruptcy process has allowed the Frontier brand to survive and thrive. Now, we have to turn our attention to the important work of integrating two great brands: Frontier and Midwest Airlines, which enjoy strong loyalty in Denver and Milwaukee.”

Given that everyone handicapped WN to win, this is a huge shock from 24 hours ago. WN and F9's inability to come to a agreement on seniority, when that was a contingency of the WN bid appears to be the nail in the coffin. It also appears that the original bid from Republic was the winning bid.

267 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18631 times:

The pilots have created this outcome. We'll see what they have done in the months to come. Look for Southwest to react after DOJ confers its approval.

User currently offlineAirFrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2826 posts, RR: 42
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18617 times:

Lots of interesting questions. What will happen with Southwest. Will they appeal? What's the strategy for merging YX?

User currently offlineCO777DAL From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 613 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18539 times:

Congratulations to Republic! I wish F9 the best. I'm really interested in seeing what Republic does with F9 and YX. I'm glad Republic is rebuilding YX and now with ownership of F9, Republic will be able to explore new opportunities with the combine operations.


Worked Hard. Flew Right. Farewell, Continental. Thanks for the memories.
User currently offlineUSFlyer MSP From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2124 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18541 times:

YX and F9 moved in together at MSP this morning; they have seperate gates but one combined check-in area (the former DL counter).

User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18539 times:



Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 2):
Lots of interesting questions. What will happen with Southwest. Will they appeal? What's the strategy for merging YX?

There will be a lot of hand-wringing tomorrow and Wall Street will jump all over WN for missing this opportunity.

Don't rule out WN now making a bid directly to REP to buy F9 after the purchase is complete. REP has now gotten F9 for $70 million less than WN was willing to pay and now they wouldn't have to share that $70 million with the unsecured creditors if they turned around and sold to WN.


User currently offlineFlyibaby From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1017 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18459 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 5):
Don't rule out WN now making a bid directly to REP to buy F9 after the purchase is complete. REP has now gotten F9 for $70 million less than WN was willing to pay and now they wouldn't have to share that $70 million with the unsecured creditors if they turned around and sold to WN.

I would bet my next paycheck that WN makes no such offer..but it would be interesting.

In all seriousness, If I had the available cash, I would start selling WN shares short in the first hour of trading tomorrow morning. You are right that they will take at least a short term hit on their stock price.


User currently offlineN917ME From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 730 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18460 times:



Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 2):
Lots of interesting questions. What will happen with Southwest. Will they appeal? What's the strategy for merging YX?

I don't think you will see a full merger of YX and F9. I think what you will see is two separate branded airlines that will have a full codeshare, FF program, etc. Cities that F9 and YX share will likely see a combined ticket counter and gate. F9 has a very loyal following and so does YX. Republic is full aware of this, thus they will most likely operate them closely, but not as one. They don't want to get the loyal customers upset by eliminating one of the "hometown" airlines.


User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18408 times:



Quoting AirFrnt (Thread starter):
It also appears that the original bid from Republic was the winning bid.

Not true...it's an enhanced bid.

Republic submitted the highest and best bid, which included substantial improvements from its original investment proposal. Republic waived virtually all conditions precedent to closing and has advised Frontier that it yesterday received Hart-Scott- Rodino antitrust clearance for the transaction. Republic also agreed to waive distributions on its $150 million prepetition unsecured claim, which is expected to result in a 94 percent increase in the distribution to Frontier’s general unsecured creditors. The selection of Republic’s bid was made in consultation with the Creditors’ Committee appointed in Frontier’s Bankruptcy Case.o


User currently offlineAirFrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2826 posts, RR: 42
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18414 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 1):
The pilots have created this outcome. We'll see what they have done in the months to come. Look for Southwest to react after DOJ confers its approval.

Doubtful. The condition that led to WN loosing the bid was their own.

Quoting Enilria (Reply 5):
There will be a lot of hand-wringing tomorrow and Wall Street will jump all over WN for missing this opportunity.

As well they should. WN giving their union a veto over this deal, and asking the union to act in the best interest of the company, rather then the unions own best interest was disasterous in retrospect.

Quoting Enilria (Reply 5):
Don't rule out WN now making a bid directly to REP to buy F9 after the purchase is complete.

It's quite possible, but not likely. Instead I think you will see WN openly start to mimic F9's airfares and Lynx experiments. It's going to be interesting. When WN was making money hand over fist, no one quibbled about the losses in DEN. WN now has to justify their prescence by making money, instead of just providing platitudes about growth. Can they continue their huge build up?

Who knows.

Things get much much more interesting with regard to YX as well. Why was F9 staff in France a few weeks ago? Airbus is one happy camper today. Do they give F9 a bit of a discount on new planes for F9/YX?

Denver needs to start putting together a bid for Republic to move ther headquarters and MX to Denver now.


User currently offlineDfanucci From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18415 times:

Congrats to F9's MX and FA folk!

You folks were in a very bad place 24 hours ago, and now you can smile a little bit.

If I'm FAPA, I'm shaking a little bit right now as I really want to hear from Bedford and Menke.

If I'm SWAPA, I'm king of the world as I just kicked Kelly in the teabag.... hard.

and most of all, if I'm a paying customer (and I am) I'm happy that I still have options....

-D

Bring on the 320's!!


User currently offlineRacko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4856 posts, RR: 20
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18376 times:

This means the animal tails will stay, right?

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25148 posts, RR: 46
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18376 times:

Well hopefully it works out for everyone, but I am a little surprised.

To me the SWA deal was the best outcome for everyone.
Creditors maximize their return, employees have a stronger potential future,(I'd rather be on the bottom of any SWA list, then on a RAH one) and the US airline industry can happily shed and rationalize excess capacity.

As they say, you sleep in the bed you make and the parties here made such a choice.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineN917ME From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 730 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18325 times:



Quoting MSP" class=quote target=_blank>USFlyer MSP (Reply 4):
YX and F9 moved in together at MSP this morning; they have seperate gates but one combined check-in area (the former DL counter).

You will be seeing a ot of that soon


User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18333 times:

Statement from WN:

We have a mission to preserve and protect our Culture and the best interests of our Employees, Customers, and Shareholders. This was a great opportunity that required us to act fast. A lot of people worked very hard with every intention of making this work. We were fortunate to be in a position to examine the acquisition to see if it was the right decision for Southwest Airlines. We chose not to amend our bid to remove the labor requirement, a key reason our bid was not selected.

...

"We began serving Denver in 2006 with just 13 flights and have grown to offer 112 nonstop daily flights today. We are very pleased with the response we have seen to our service and growth in Denver, and we will continue to compete vigorously in the market."


I think the latter is a veiled threat...


User currently offlineDevildog2222 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18330 times:

This is wonderfull news, I knew in my heart that Republic would win the bid. This is great news for the F9 employees. I've been thinking about my friends at the F9 SFO station this whole time and I hope when my health is 100% better I can return to SFO and work for F9.

User currently offlineLUV08 From United States of America, joined May 2009, 128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18252 times:

Congrats to YX and F9!! You just pissed off WN, so be prepaired to pay for it! I keep hearing that F9 is profitable....LMAO...You guys cant hide behind the court system forever! When they exit BK court....Its like WN and Gary Kelly say in the commercials " Its On"!!!!!!

User currently offlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12450 posts, RR: 25
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18243 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 8):
Republic also agreed to waive distributions on its $150 million prepetition unsecured claim, which is expected to result in a 94 percent increase in the distribution to Frontier’s general unsecured creditors.

So how much did this concession end up costing Republic in dollars?

Quoting Dfanucci (Reply 10):
If I'm SWAPA, I'm king of the world as I just kicked Kelly in the teabag.... hard.

It's Kelly's fault if he didn't get his ducks lined up in advance.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25140 posts, RR: 85
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18210 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Dfanucci (Reply 10):
You folks were in a very bad place 24 hours ago, and now you can smile a little bit.

I did try to send you a big hint twenty four hours ago, Dfanucci. I had to be a bit subtle.  Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineAirFrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2826 posts, RR: 42
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18152 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 14):
I think the latter is a veiled threat...

No, if it were a threat, they woudl say "we plan to expand rapidly to mexico in Denver, and copy F9's lynx"


User currently offlineDfanucci From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18097 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 18):
I did try to send you a big hint twenty four hours ago, Dfanucci. I had to be a bit subtle.

I thought you were Master Mariner, but I just was not too sure.  Wink

I can't wait for Airframe to post. He has got to be feeling pretty good right now....


User currently offlineFlyibaby From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1017 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18098 times:



Quoting LUV08 (Reply 16):
You guys cant hide behind the court system forever! When they exit BK court....Its like WN and Gary Kelly say in the commercials " Its On"!!!!!!

In all fairness...I believe its been on since F9 had to file BK. The fact that they have had to report earnings monthly and be under such a microscope (including their books and any transactions they want to make) makes their last few months of profit even more impressive. You need to take into account that the time in BK, especially here the last couple of quarters, has actually dilluted their earnings while WN has been loosing money in the same market. Only time will tell.....I prefer to wait on the sidelines before saying something critical so soon after the auction.


User currently offlineLUV08 From United States of America, joined May 2009, 128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18102 times:

I think this works out better for Southwest. Why pay all that money for an airline like F9...Put that toward my profit sharing. Once they come out of BK it's a whole diffrent ball game. They think they would have been out of jobs if they merged with Wn...well I think I would have taken that because we see what they looked like before they went bankrupt.... Oh welll!

User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25140 posts, RR: 85
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18060 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Dfanucci (Reply 20):
I can't wait for Airframe to post. He has got to be feeling pretty good right now....

I hope so, because he was miserable last night. I was getting despairing emails from him, from the hangar, until midnight my time.

Quoting LUV08 (Reply 16):
You just pissed off WN, so be prepaired to pay for it!

Ah - so very gracious in defeat, I see.  Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineLUV08 From United States of America, joined May 2009, 128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18051 times:



Quoting Flyibaby (Reply 21):
The fact that they have had to report earnings monthly and be under such a microscope (including their books and any transactions they want to make) makes their last few months of profit even more impressive

Whats your point??? I had to go home and show my parents a report card while I was in school...I was under a microscope...LOL! It couldnt be that bad! Thats ok, because the free ride is almost over!


25 AirFrnt : Probably between 16 and 19 million dollars. That doesn't sound like a lot, but remember that most of WN's advantage over F9 was actually cash going t
26 ATLFlyer323 : So down the road do you think we will see Q400's in YX colors, or even Airbus in YX colors? The same can be said for the E170's and E190's and F9? Tha
27 AirFrnt :
28 AirFrnt : I think that the F9 brand is almost certainly the brand that survives the Integration. It's going to be interesting to see if YX moves over to A319s
29 LUV08 : LOL!!!Yeah! I have had to listen for the last week all the cry babies on here trashing WN because they just wanted to take out the competition or the
30 Flyibaby : Are you serious what's my point? Do you actually know anything about business other than you work a job and you get a paycheck? In business being und
31 Mariner : I think any of those things is possible. According to Midwest staff, here, Republic has already been talking to Airbus and Boeing, and some suggested
32 OzarkD9S : All I can say is, thank the GODDESS for this....praise be.
33 Dfanucci : Oh come on, take your lumps, brush yourself off and get back in the game. I'm sure WN is going to try everything possible to lesson the sting of what
34 Flyibaby : A little money? $38M in one city? You should run for congress with that train of thought.
35 Mariner : I surely remember the fares when United started Ted at DEN. mariner
36 Dfanucci : Yup. We had the 190's out here briefly (GEG) and I loved 'em. No TV, but the 2+2 config was nice... -D
37 N917ME : Honestly, I don't see an integration. At first, back when it was first announced , yes, I thought it. But after seeing how each respective airline ha
38 LUV08 : LOL...OK! Southwest will be perfectly fine, I can assure you that! I am pretty sure that WN will be around way longer than F9!!! LOL
39 FrmrCAPCADET : Any accountants out there to summarize what Republic already had in F9 plus what they paid, and what the additional concessions were worth. Likewise a
40 USAFDO : Can someone out there please tell me how it could be fair that the F9 pilots would have been stapled to the bottom of the SW seniority list? Merely be
41 F16arm : Just wanted to say to all the Frontier folks out there... WELCOME TO THE FAMILY!
42 MMEPHX : might just be right. If WN has $170M for a bid on F9 they sure have $170M to launch an all out offensive at DEN. within 24 months DEN might just be t
43 Lightsaber : Wow... F9 employees must be dancing in the streets. I admit I'm eating crow. I was certain WN was a shoe in pre-SWAPA. WN must now figure out another
44 Dadoftyler : Okay, my turn. Good luck, Frontier employees. I hope things turn out well for you. I have a couple of extended family members that fly for you (one up
45 AWACSooner : And I'm gonna sit and wait for RW to start doing all the downsizing and cutbacks that all you WN bashers were accusing them of doing. Wait and see...R
46 Post contains images AirRyan : Guess we know who wears the pants in the family. If GK is still running the show at WN, perhaps the SWAPA calls for a new contract will fall upon dea
47 AirFrnt : Go read the statement today. They explicitly state that they will be starting integration as soon as possible. We will never know. There is no reason
48 WNCrew : What does that mean? Do you think the pilots need to hear that too? Just curious. I agree though, everyone from WN needs to just move on. It's over..
49 Enilria : Which they put in because of their tradition of good employee relations. Hard to fault them for that as an airline employee, right? Wall Street, howe
50 Post contains images KingCavalier : It sure does. The 4th A320 arrives soon. There sure are some sore losers on this board. LMAO
51 Dadoftyler : AirRyan, No worries. Trust me. Of course, you may be assuming some things.....so take my statements at face value, please. They apply to EVERYONE post
52 BA : And you've drawn this conclusion based on what facts???
53 Post contains links AirRyan : We know exactly why WN lost the bid.... http://www.bizjournals.com/denver/st...009/08/10/daily76.html?jst=b_ln_hl But how will anyone be able to argu
54 JayDub : What was the name you submitted for this one, KC?...something about Southwest and a vacuum?
55 SYfan100 : I hope Republic leaves Frontier alone with their fleet with how they have those tails painted with wildlife.
56 KarlB737 : The result here is of maximum embarrassment to Gary Kelly. Personally I think his expansion ideas are to steep. In an earlier post on the other threa
57 F9mechanic : It would be a little premature, just cause REP won the auction it doesn't mean that their jobs are safe in den. I see the c-check moving in the near
58 AirFrnt : Actually no. By renouncing the bid, they simply released their own portion of the pool that they would have been paid. Since the Republic bid was goi
59 WNCrew : I certainly wasn't arguing... I agree. The pilots also put a hold on code-shares as well..... I seem to forget when I go to work that the airline exi
60 Post contains links BA : The Metro Denver Economic Development Corporation which is an affiliate of the Denver Metro Chamber of Commerce is trying to lure Republic's headquart
61 F9fan : I was convinced this was WNs to lose. Well, WN lost it thanks in no small part to SWAPA and FAPA. Who said that unions weren't good for anything? Unle
62 Artsyman : So, where do the Frontier Pilots fall on the Republic seniority lists then. They were going to the bottom of the WN list, but I doubt the Republic pi
63 AirRyan : But if that were to be the case, that somehow RW theoretically upped their bid by what is essentially $150m than it would have been preferable in my
64 AWACSooner : Hey...if all the WN bashers can say for certain that WN was gonna cut all the F9 employees and they were being evil for buying out their beloved F9,
65 AirFrnt : Actually, no it wasn't. Not as cheap as the intra-california routes that WN flew, but then again, very few of those routers were as short as the intr
66 F9Animal : I have said it before, and I will say it again! FRONTIER LIVES! LOL! Congrats to Republic, and congrats to Frontier. Republic got themselves one hell
67 Cross757 : You are referring to YOURSELF in that statement as well, correct?
68 Atomsareenough : Everyone? Come on, there's no way that's true. Exactly. Or a DEN or Colorado resident/member of the flying public. Again, there were obviously winner
69 Quickmover : I would predict that Republic is going to have it's hands full trying to defend F9 in DEN and YX in MKE. WN will compete even harder in DEN. Maybe I'm
70 AirFrnt : The discussion was over the amount. I was simply asserting - again - that there was not a 150 million dollar payout. I am told that the analysis by t
71 GentFromAlaska : I guess it is fair to say the critters couldn't find the Luv!
72 AWACSooner : Yes I was...hence the underhanded glass houses comment... Oh really? Why were they the "least-bad" option? Do you have some information that conclusi
73 Flashmeister : It's not just a matter of embarrassment, but more importantly the loss of credibility of Gary Kelly and his management team, from many perspectives,
74 MSNDC9 : Airbus in Republic Colors out of DEN and MKE Embraers and Q400s out of Denver in Frontier Colors Embraers and Q400s out of MKE in Midwest Colors
75 GentFromAlaska : I did write in the first WN/F9 thread that contract law can be a strange bedfellow. There is no doubt in my mind that SM leadership was tested over t
76 Mariner : I'm sure they're going to have their hands full - but isn't that that the fun of it? Who wants to be bored at work? Who doesn't want challenges? Thes
77 Atomsareenough : Fair enough, they were perceived as the least-bad option by a lot of people. The reason for this? They had promised to maintain the F9 brand and oper
78 GentFromAlaska : After the shock wears off and it settles down a bit, should we anticipate a Tower road move to IND?
79 AirFrnt : There is a interesting point here. WN has to be very very careful, as the Go! transaction proved, having knowledge of your opponents books can lead t
80 Steveswa737 : Congratulations to Republic Airways! I wish nothing but the best for all Frontier Airlines employees.
81 AirFrnt : And in Celebration, I just booked a (very reasonable) ticket to MSP next week on F9. Cheers!
82 Iloveboeing : So, now will we see WN go after FL? That would be an interesting combination. They would have to pay a lot more for it. FL's market cap is about $833
83 AirFrnt : If the city of Denver has any sense at all, they will pull together a massive bid to try and entice RAH to move to DEN. They have a lot of weapons, n
84 GARUDAROD : Does anybody else think this may actually revitalize F9 and make them STRONGER in Denver? The community will rally around Frontier now and may just sh
85 AirFrnt : Doubtful. It it occured, it would occur as a merger, not a buyout. I don't see WN being willing to spend that much capital on the project, for a mark
86 Luv08 : No thanks...I will fly WN over to MSP!!!!!
87 Alphascan : Thank God LUV has a BOD made up of adults.
88 GentFromAlaska : I just checked LUV ticker symbol on the CNBC URL. The top seven stories discuss WN & F9 and today's news
89 Cross757 : Hey there...why all the anger directed at the F9 supporters? There are more than a few people on this thread and in associated threads that are not "
90 AirFrnt : I would, but it was $50 more expensive, and my company policy requires me to use the cheapest airfare, or United. How very ironic.
91 GentFromAlaska : Would I dare guess you work for the federal government!
92 AirFrnt : Thankfully no. I work for a company with a headquarters in MSP, I am home officed in Colorado. Our plan requires us to use the cheapest option, or el
93 Enilria : The total bid went up by nearly $70 million, but I guess the only out of pocket difference for them is $15 million. The rest just goes out of one poc
94 ExFATboy : "Integration" doesn't necessarily mean eliminating one of the two brands - there's substantial cost efficiencies and cross-marketing opportunities th
95 Ny-jfk-lga : This is pretty much a standard move for anyone in the airline industry. Simply doing what is best for themselves/the company at that time.
96 MSNDC9 : Could mean a new two-class configured carrier though...Cookies and animals all around...
97 MKENut : Maybe Frontier can celebrate by serving Midwest chocolate chip cookies on every flight after the deal closes this fall. It is probably impossible bec
98 GoDIA : Latest from KUSA Channel 9 here in Denver...Great news for our city, for DIA and for all of Colorado. We're thrilled! Frontier goes to Republic, not S
99 9252fly : I was cheering for the underdog!
100 PlaneAdmirer : Just booked our Thanksgiving tickets for 5 from DEN to LGA on Frontier. Glad they are going to be here.
101 Luv08 : Yeah, I bet it was! OK...sure
102 AirportGuy1971 : If the grapes are so sour, stop chewing on them... Sounds like what someone from Braniff would have said in 1973...[Edited 2009-08-13 20:41:41]
103 N936FR : F9animal - classy post. LUV08 - not so much. As a proud F9er I thank SWA for validating our potential. Further, you have nothing to worry about. SWA i
104 USAirALB : I can see WN unleashing a full blown expansion plan at DEN, as what FL did at MKE after YX did not approve of the merger. I can also see a F9 tail, an
105 USAirALB : In the WN PR, Kelly said "Our congratulations to Republic Airways and Frontier Airlines." I wonder if he even means it...?
106 Chrisair : I don't think shorting the shares would do much. You're not going to see a huge selloff of LUV shares. Probably -1 to -2% if that. Gary Kelly might h
107 WNCrew : AMEN! I, for one, am so glad its over. I can only go to work, do my job to the best of my abilities and see what happens. I only have control over th
108 AirFrnt : The wording here is very important. Highest means the highest payout for unsecured creditors. Best includes labor and what not. You can report me to
109 AirFrnt : I don't think WN's expansion is sustainable in the current market conditions. Unless the price of oil goes up, and the economy gets better, I think W
110 Swa4life : I'm surprised of the outcome, but not terribly upset one way or the other. I agree with GK's statement concerning the failed bid. Nothing is worth spo
111 Mariner : I don't know what they will do tomorrow, obviously, but LUV shares dropped 3% after hours. But LUV may get a bounce. The institutional investors migh
112 Atrude777 : Who cares? He said it, whether he meant it or not, it is good PR to congratulate, show you are NOT a sore loser, and can rise above it. Unlike some W
113 Jolau1701 : Now I feel like going up to the Frontier counter and calling them "Republic"
114 AirFrnt : From what I can tell, you might be too late on that. At least judging by some comments. I am really impressed (more on other boards) with how many So
115 Swa4life : Well to be honest, it is sort of "bewildering". All I know is that from day one in my career in the airline industry, I had one goal and it was to be
116 FreequentFlier : This industry is a roller coaster sometimes. A truly shocking development!
117 FreequentFlier : Mariner, I had sent a much longer post to you in private but it got erased down the memory hole. In any case, I wanted to acknowledge that you were ri
118 Post contains links StasisLAX : From a just released article from the Associated Press: "Southwest said its $170 million bid was deemed unacceptable because the carrier would not bac
119 Mariner : I really do appreciate that. And I do understand that I can be a bloody-minded old geezer sometimes. The past is another country, so here's to the fu
120 AirportGuy1971 : This is why I am still at F9. Sean Menke has BALLS OF STEEL. I have a feeling that Bryan Bedford does too. They stood up to the bohemouth that is WN.
121 MASTYC : Where I came from, that thought was the exact same. I am happy that you are happy at SWA, but everyone does not want to work there. SWA is a good com
122 Mariner : The Wizard of Tower Road. mariner
123 AirFrnt : A part of this that did not get touched on earlier is risk. The WN bid was risky - too many contingencies that would allow them to pull out of the bi
124 AirFrnt : I think the reverse is true. I think Southwest Employees doesn't understand that there are great airlines out there, not named Southwest, that people
125 PlanesNTrains : Because Frontier is in Bankruptcy and needs a sponsor to exit. Unfortunately, that put the employees of F9 in a position where they were not in contr
126 YXwatcherMKE : I Pray that you will be back to 100% good health and back at work very soon. Also I sure that F9 and YX will have a great future with Republic this w
127 FreequentFlier : Long term, I think WN is in some trouble. They are running out of places to grow and their labor costs are now the highest in the industry. The fuel h
128 Chrisair : While I certainly can't speak about 100% of the employees at WN, the FAs that I talk to on my flights are very complimentary of a variety of airlines
129 PlanesNTrains : I agree with your basic premise of WN being in a bad spot from a cost standpoint, but I think if anything they underestimated how many stupid rich in
130 AirFrnt : The arguement has been made that WN succeeded pre-9/11 because of low labor costs, and post 9/11 because of fuel hedges. I don't think it's quite tha
131 Luv08 : I hope so!!! I hope WN adds all the flights they can, and pound away at F9!
132 Flashmeister : Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. F9 probably wouldn't mind WN adding all the flights they could, either: higher losses for WN and a potential lawsuit for dumping and/o
133 Sunking737 : Congrats to all my friends at the "NEW" Frontier. We all can't wait to see what happens with RJET and MIDWEST!!!!!!!!!! Watch out there is a New Anima
134 Ouboy79 : Yes...because this industry just needs more capacity being dumped in markets that are already saturated. Also, what is this whole train of thought th
135 Luv2cattlecall : The last true case of "dumping" that the feds looked at was the AA one...and the jury found AA innocent (the course of normal competition, etc) in no
136 Mariner : Don't fall over in shock when I say I agree with you. I am really astonished at how badly they have handled the Frontier issue, not just this bid. Th
137 Wowpeter : If I am not mistaken, Republic Airways Holdings has been consistently profitable... In fact, Southwest has been reporting 4th quarter 2008 and 1st qu
138 AirframeAS : At the time of the announcement, I was really freaking out trying to figure out what 9news was trying to announce until someone told me that Republic
139 Sbworcs : Can someone now please tell me what is going to happen to the F9 employees - how are they going to fit into the Republic structure?
140 KarlB737 : There must have been a good reason Herb left DEN behind years ago. I still think that Gary Kelly has gotten reckless with WN's money.
141 Aloha717200 : I am happy beyond measure at this news! I just heard it on the radio and shouted for joy. Don't get me wrong, I love WN and I love Frontier, but I def
142 Mrocktor : Every company who has a union that can't see that in the long run both are the same thing is headed south - just a matter of time. I disagree. From t
143 Stburke : It was the move to the new airport accompanied by higher rent/fees at the new DEN. It didn't exactly mesh with Southwest's structure.
144 Enilria : I expect some ugly things are soon coming, just from REP instead of WN. Now is not the time to celebrate by running up the credit card with a new foun
145 Rampart : That wouldn't be very veiled, would it? Very classy. Thank you. Also very classy. Thank you, too. Bitter people and overt fanboys, look to Dadoftyler
146 MSYtristar : I'm late to the party here (hard to get a good signal on a long distance train doing 79mph through the woods) but let me just say that I am really hap
147 Steveswa737 : How come every time we open a city in another airlines hub, people say we're there to kill them? Do you have any idea how you sound? I agree 100%.
148 Mrocktor : I, on the other hand, think that this move is part of a strategy that ultimately has Republic become a network carrier - using all the RAH knowledge
149 GentFromAlaska : As opposed to Southwest!
150 AirFrnt : It is surprising that WN did not end up matching their offer with new capital. They might have just figured that they were screwed anyways, but it mi
151 Joeljack : I'm just hoping that Republic has something up their sleeve with United. I kind of have the feeling they do. I know the loyal F9'ers don't want to hea
152 AirportGuy1971 : Of course you do...
153 AirRyan : What chapter is that, chapter seven? With this economy and the fact that fuel is already over inflated upwards of 40%+ and there isn't any real deman
154 AirFrnt : The day Enilria stars saying positive things about F9, is the day the smart money sells every share they have ever owned in Republic.
155 Kiwiandrew : I cant really see this . It was one thing for WN to try to combine the number 2 and 3 players in the DEN market , quite another for Republic to try t
156 Rampart : Exactly. More choice for the people of Denver. Jobs stay in Denver. More use of the airport. An attempt to attract more RAH headquarters action. Tax
157 Mcg : I too want to acknowledge Mariner for understanding the value of the RAH claim. In the final analysis it's value was way more than $15 million millio
158 Post contains links KingCavalier : The YX/F9 codeshare starts on September 8. It will be a limited number of cities to begin with, but it will be expanded very soon. F9 does have ovens
159 Dfanucci : I am just amazed how some of the WN supporters are acting. You would think they were defending the Holy Grail's resting place.... How anyone could bel
160 DELTA7478 : I am glad that Southwest didn't get Frontier, they woudoff rip that airline to pieced sold all the Airbuses and fired all the employess, just because
161 KingCavalier : Sean Menke, Ted Christie and Matt Henry are on F9 505 from LGA as we speak. They are scheduled to land in DEN at 1107AM. There will be a water cannon
162 Enilria : Actually they just bought all the same functions in MKE, so they don't technically "lack it". I just have a different view of the big picture. The tr
163 Ridgid727 : With all this, Republic proved to be the better airline to take Frontier. I don't believe that WN will retaliate as some have suggested. I don't belie
164 Frontierflyer : I say all we f9 fans on a.net should get together In DEN and celebrate the rebirth of frontier. Maybe we can go kidnap Mariner.
165 AirFrnt : The arguement has been made that WN succeeded pre-9/11 because of low labor costs, and post 9/11 because of fuel hedges. I don't think it's quite tha
166 Enilria : If they do, you have to promise not to say: "I'm sure it was already planned and is coincidental to recent events". I actually heard that after B6 ad
167 Ridgid727 : Kind of reminiscent of a time in Milwaukee a few years ago, when YX which was a much bigger airline at that time was celebrating. The euphoria quickl
168 Smcmac32msn : I just price checked both for Aug 20-23: F9: 279.20 WN: 279.20 Don't act like F9 can't match or beat WN on routes.
169 PlaneAdmirer : The best way to celebrate Frontier's remaining independence is to fly them.
170 Post contains links and images DocLightning : View Large View MediumPhoto © Gerard Helmer one can only dream...
171 Frontierflyer : Yes, fly to DEN on F9. We can celebrate on board buying cocktails , in DEN and on our way back. I wonder if we can get SM to join us. Would love to s
172 MKENut : AirTran and Midwest are euphoric because the merger never happened between the two.
173 KingCavalier : Not in my opinion. Those are two different things. You can't compare what happened to YX/NW/TPG/AirTran in MKE as to what F9 has been able to accompl
174 ExFATboy : To some extent, I think you've answered the question already - it's an acquisition, and - like the Midwest acquisition - an acquisition of a carrier
175 GSPSPOT : I love it. At least Frontier now has a chance of survival under its own name (or BRAND name, anyway)
176 PlanePainter : I just want to say cheers to the pilots and both CEO's for getting the deal done. Definitely glad this ordeal is over and looking forward to seeing wh
177 Charlienorth : Congrats to the Frontier folks,don't listen the crap from the WN Fan Club,they(WN) do not have a very good history with the employees of airlines that
178 Trigged : I hope this is a good thing for F9 as I am a huge fan. Alot of my flights are ATL-DEN-ATL, and from my recent experiences on F9, I will probably use t
179 9252fly : Midwest Frontier seems like a catchy name.
180 Antoniemey : You seem to be under the mistaken impression that WN always has the cheapest fare. They do not. Indeed, many of the legacies routinely have lower far
181 AirFrnt : My fare was ~215 and change. They are retaining all staff.
182 HermansCVR580 : I too would love to see that myself, but maybe its best to leave Herman alone, espcially if this all goes south, I would hate to see the real Hermans
183 TxAgKuwait : You know, folks have made that claim on here. Repeatedly. Kindly provide some source or documentation proving this allegation. There are still boatlo
184 Rjnut : I'll bet Great Lakes is breathing a sigh of relief as they were faced with a loss of connectitity of about a third of their services had WN won out! i
185 PlanesNTrains : Obviously they were hoping F9 would die, saving them $150M. Oops! I wonder what the implications would have been on the other side - the WN stockhold
186 AirframeAS : AFAIK, this is only a change in ownership. All jobs are staying put for now. If Republic decides to relocate some ops, then I believe Republic will m
187 MSYtristar : And the results will still likely be the same for WN in DEN....especially now, as I imagine F9 has even more public support in the DEN market than it
188 KingCavalier : They had a company record load factor of 92% in July and a 98% load factor this past Monday. They must be doing something right. I think AirFairs has
189 Post contains links Mariner : That's happened anyway. There's a 3% sell off in LUV shares and RJET is up about 8%. Some folk at the Dallas News are going crazy trying to work out
190 GentFromAlaska : WN synergy should be directed at Boston Logan. I believe new service begins there in two days, Aug 16.
191 Flyibaby : Care to make this one interesting? Wow...I can call it! WN shares opened at $9.10 a share and went down within the first hour to $8.82 a share...a $.
192 AirframeAS : IMO, more brand awareness beyond DEN. This has captured a lot of people's attention nationwide! Now that this phase is over.... lets hope that F9 bri
193 RogerThat : Or perhaps: Mid-tier
194 PlanesNTrains : WN chose to enter Denver. WN chose to ramp up the pressure. WN chose to bid on Frontier. WN chose not to increase the bid or make it viable. It is ab
195 MSYtristar : And other cities which I will not mention at the moment. I think F9 has a chance now to spread its wings and not be as DEN-centric.
196 PlanesNTrains : Honeymoon's don't last forever, and money doesn't grow on trees. No, that's not very original, but I think it's perhaps an appropriate comment to mak
197 AirframeAS : I don't think MSYTristar was even suggesting that at all.
198 Flyibaby : I agree...and I believe that will happen as a result of the Republic buyout. Lets not forget though that one of the main things that Sean Menke did t
199 Enilria : I'm sorry, were you talking about Go or Southwest in DEN??? Actually, reading that makes me REALLY angry. Colorado and Denver did NOTHING to help F9
200 Mariner : No, they don't, and we'd be fools to think there wont be "issues" down the way. But this didn't spring up overnight. SM and BB have been plotting thi
201 PlanesNTrains : So are we speaking again? Good, because it was getting uncomfortable. Alas, my view is very two...no, very one-dimensional of Frontier and their whol
202 Post contains links HermansCVR580 : Here is an interesting link sorta related to all this. http://www.jsonline.com/business/53241102.html Best of Luck to anyone that got their notice tod
203 PlaneAdmirer : So they have 11 A320's on the way? Over how long of a period? Do the remainder of the 318's go away?
204 Sunking737 : I for see Airbuses at Midwest and more for Frontier. I also see a controlled growth for both airlines. It will defiantly be interesting in the next fe
205 MSYtristar : You're right AirframeAS...certainly, I'm not talking about a MCI hub (just for example) overnight. I just think RAH would be a fool not to expand the
206 Chrisair : Well, I think I win. I said a loss of 1-2%. LUV was -1.73% RJET was +10% for the day. A nice little pop for them, especially on a down market day. Ye
207 Par13del : So it look as if the folks who were smart enough to run a profitable airline for the last few years including hedging their fuel cost suddenly cannot
208 Mariner : I think it is more than 11. There is an A318/A320 swap happening in the next three or four weeks (A320 from US3000). There is another A320 due this y
209 Mrocktor : That is an interesting question, isn't it? Perhaps they were betting on FAPA getting dazzled by the WN pay rates and strong-arming F9 into a deal tha
210 Flyibaby : Good call! I was only wanting to sell short for the first hour of trading though...I would have made a decent profit off of it if I only had an extra
211 Flyibaby : I have known quite a few pilots that were laidoff from airlines like Midway, etc. that immediately hired on with WN, only to leave after a year or so
212 Atomsareenough : ...What's wrong with OAK?
213 Chrisair : Um, have you ever been in that Burger King parking lot on Hegenberger by the Coliseum? It's a mine field there between the used needles, shell casing
214 Atomsareenough : I agree, that sounds like good reason not to hang out in the Burger King parking lot. There are plenty of nice places in the East Bay, though. Even i
215 Post contains links Mariner : There's some funny stuff in the wash-up. Anyone remember this - it was only a few days ago: http://www.bizjournals.com/sanfranci...co/stories/2009/08/
216 Ikramerica : So true. You don't need to live right by OAK. There are plenty of nice neighborhoods in the East Bay. And if you are Jonesing for fast food before or
217 Chrisair : You're absolutely right. It's just that the airport is in a rather "rough" area of town. There was even a murder at one of the hotels I stayed at a f
218 Flyibaby : I think my point by mentioning OAK isn't that it is a bad place, however in comparison to a good majority of the bay area, it is kind of thought of a
219 Post contains links Mariner : This analyst in the Dallas News agrees: http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/a...frontier-execs-pilot-deal-may.html Dallas News/Garfinkle: "This SW man
220 JoseKMLB : Republic Airways Holdings won the bankruptcy court auction for Frontier Airlines on Thursday, buying the Denver-based carrier for almost $108.8 millio
221 Chrisair : I prefer the In n Out off Hegenberger and the 880. It's cheaper than paying the robber barons inside the airport, and is a bit safer on the west side
222 Post contains links F9fan : The federal government has pre-negotiated rates for airfairs. From the General Services Administration For example, using AirFrnt's MSP-DEN flights,
223 AirportGuy1971 : Thinking about this, RW could have not asked Santa for a better gift. Just think of it. 2 weeks ago RW was a company who would have simply bought F9.
224 Post contains links MKENut : Looks like Frontier might exit bankruptcy by mid September and help run Midwest Airlines. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...LnYDuMyZKacbDkCmt1cPB
225 Mcg : I'm thinking that the next A320 should have a fern on the tail and be called "Mariner".
226 Post contains links Mariner : From the article: "And Republic Chairman, President and CEO Bryan Bedford said Friday that Frontier's managers, including CEO Sean Menke, will run Fr
227 Mcg : How about we put a fern in the parrot's beak? Think of it as a two-for-one.
228 Mariner : I'd go for a Kiwi with a fern in its beak. mariner
229 Mcg : That'll work for me! Thanks for your contribution to this board, you really keep it interesting!
230 Mariner : Here's one to ponder. Frontier has an irksome Credit Card Processor (CCP), First Data, who provoked all this and who now have $140 million on deposit
231 TxAgKuwait : Yes, not really, and yes. Yes, I bet Great Lakes is happy. Not really, I think it would astonish you if you knew just how many folks catch Great Lake
232 F9Animal : I did not take the time to read every post. I however have noticed some very emotional feelings expressed from employees of WN, sideline fans, and F9
233 Antoniemey : Just need one of those Aircraft Acceptance Flights to take the long way around... If we're wishing for the moon, how about CLE-PDX and CLE-BNA? Never
234 PlanesNTrains : Why not? Sounds exciting so far - Airbus planes heading to MKE, Menke et al heading up Midwest. Should be fun to watch. -Dave
235 AirframeAS : I never knew we were not speaking.
236 Post contains links Justplanenutz : We'll see how long that lasts if the analyst below is correct saying: "Cutting pilot costs "is the only way Republic's Frontier survives," he said Fr
237 Par13del : " target=_blank>http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont....html The devil is in the details, the WN experts would have to weigh in to say why their pilo
238 Msytristar : I just hope no one else loses a friend over this nonsense. A friend of mine for 14 years and longtime WN employee " disowned " me as a friend yesterda
239 Atlwest1 : You are a true true class act!!! We are all colleagues even at different carriers. I send my best wishes to F9 employees from Atl
240 AirFrnt : Yep. Frontier will have a MKE hub before long. I wonder what that rate is for United Pilots? Also bear in mind that these pilot costs probably do not
241 PlanesNTrains : Well, then good. I must have misunderstood your PM. Wow. That is really unfortunate. We've all had people in our lives who respond negatively to some
242 Mariner : That analyst is Vaughn Cordle, who used to be a pilot. The Dallas News trots him out when they need words of comfort about Southwest. Over the years
243 F9fan : Actually, a MKE hub makes sense. By the way, for those of you wondering about the price comparison between WN and F9, here is a sample comparison for
244 Atlwest1 : The question should be is the 40 dollars worth not having to connect and perchance be delayed connecting through MDW during the holiday season in addi
245 AirframeAS : I just have to ask: Why are the WN employees now making such a fuss and acting like children after losing the bid to Republic? What is it to gain by
246 Ikramerica : I agree. My point was simply that it is not worth risking my life to save $1 or $2 on a happy meal.
247 PlanesNTrains : Perhaps he means swapping the 190's and 717's, though I don't know for sure. Doesn't really matter, because in the end they're going to use the aircr
248 Post contains links Mariner : I'd be fairly sure of that, but, like you, I don't know it for a fact. In any case, he is behind the times. For those interested, there is a good art
249 AirportGuy1971 : Airline financial analysts Vaughn Cordle of AirlineForecasts LLC, is not an employee of RW, F9 or YX. He has a title that prevents him as being more
250 Steveswa737 : Don't forget that a few comments made by a couple of WN employees on this forum does not represent the views of 35,000 employees. A lot of us truly b
251 Atomsareenough : He could mean the E190s, but he could also be talking about the short term. How much longer are the 717s around for?
252 AirframeAS : I know that. I was not real specific, I did not mean all 35,000 employees. Just a select few. Thank you! We, at F9, appreciate it! We also wish you g
253 Mariner : He could indeed. But it was my understanding the the 717's would be gone from Midwest by Christmas. Now I could be wrong about this. It's tough enoug
254 N7371f : The Boeing 717's are gone. They're not staying around. Boeing is taking them back and leasing them to Mexicana Click. Republic has already filed SEC
255 Mariner : That's what I thought. But it was Mr. Bedford who said it - see above - did he just mis-speak? mariner
256 MKENut : Now with the purchase of Frontier, Republic will have no use for the YX Cert. I suspect the Midwest name will slowly be phased out. MKE will be Front
257 MSYtristar : Thing is, I know most WN employees are dedicated professionals, and I never pretended they weren't. People take things too personally nowadays. You w
258 F9Animal : Your future is looking bright kiddo! Now get out there and get those planes working! LOL! Hope your doing good!
259 Post contains links F9fan : Score another one for Mariner! From the Milwaukee Journal-Sentanel
260 Post contains links Mariner : Here's a tiny game one for you, F9fan. What is the inaccurate number in this article?: http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_13095347 Clue - it has to do
261 Smcmac32msn : You're mistaken... they are bringing in 94 seat E190s to replace the 99 seat 717's going to Mexicana Click.... They are shrinking their seating capac
262 Mariner : I think the A319's have a tad more capacity than either the E190 or the B717. mariner
263 Smcmac32msn : Except the speculation is all it is right now... YX dumped 120+ seat MD88s for 74 seat E170s... smaller YX dumped 99 seat 717s for 94 seat E190s... s
264 Mariner : Mr. Bedford - of Republic - spoke of the A319's coming to MKE. Frontier has A320's coming in, some new, some used. mariner
265 Smcmac32msn : We still haven't heard who is actually flying these??? YX pilots, F9 pilots??? What colors will they be in??? Just because they are coming here doesn
266 Mariner : We don't know what order Mr. Bedford will make yet, either - Boeing or Airbus. The money is on Airbus, but we don't know. mariner
267 Post contains links LipeGIG : As this thread become too long , please continue discussion on Part 2 : Republic Wins F9 Auction - Part 2 (by LipeGIG Aug 15 2009 in Civil Aviation)
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