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BA Add 2nd Weekly LAD Flight  
User currently offlineBALHRWWCC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 5112 times:

BA will increase the frequency of it's flights to Angola from 1 to 2 weekly from the 6th October. As with the current weekly flight the new flight will operate using a 4 class 777 configured 13F/48J/32W/127Y

The new flight will depart LHR on a Tuesday at 18:10 and land in LAD at 04:10 local. With return flights departing LAD on the same day at 23:55 and land at LHR 07:35 on Thursday morning. Due to the requirement for the extra aircraft on this route BA will reduce the frequency of it's 14 x weekly CPT service to 13 x weekly. This will mean BA043/042 will not operate ex LHR on a Tuesday.

This is a much needed boost to the LAD route. BA's current weekly departure is often overbooked with customers waitlisted in all 4 cabins.

As posted in earlier post, In addition to LAD BA have also over recent months announced capacity or frequency increases on 2 more routes.

From 11th October :

BA's ACC service will go from being operated daily using a 3 class 767 configured 24J/24W/141Y to being operated by a mixture of 3 and 4 class 777's. The exact days when the four class operates up to the 25th October vary. However from the 25th October the four class will operate on a Wednesday and Thursday, with the three class operating Friday-Tuesday. The 4 class 777 will be configured 14F/48J/40W/124Y and the 3 class 777 will be in the new 48J/24W/202Y configuration.

The change of aircraft is down to the high demand for seats on the route. Flights to and from ACC are often overbooked with waitlists in J. The use of a 4 class 777, on certain days, will mean the route will see the return of First Class. The First product was removed from the ACC route when the 767's where embodied with CW flat beds.

From 25th October

EBB will increase from 3 to 5 x Weekly. The flight will still be operated using a 3 class 767, however the flight times will change.

At present the flights depart LHR on a Tue/Thu and Sun at 21:15 and land at EBB 07:45 the next day. With return flights departing EBB on a Mon/Wed/Fri at 09:05 and land at LHR 16:00.

From the 25th October flights will depart LHR on a Tue/Thu/Fri/Sat/Sun at 10:45 landing in EBB at 22:10. Return flights depart EBB on a Mon/Wed/Fri/Sat/Sun at 00:35 and will land at LHR 06:45

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2324 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 5088 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Thread starter):
BA will increase the frequency of it's flights to Angola from 1 to 2 weekly from the 6th October. As with the current weekly flight the new flight will operate using a 4 class 777 configured 13F/48J/32W/127Y

Wow how did they get the extra weekly right? I'd love to see the revenue figures for one of these flights, must make a killing.



oh boy!!!
User currently offlineBALHRWWCC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5042 times:



Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 1):
Wow how did they get the extra weekly right? I'd love to see the revenue figures for one of these flights, must make a killing.

Where the aircraft came from I can and have told you that. The slot and permission to add a flight to LAD who knows?. I am not sure but is there restrictions on how many flight can fly from the EU to LAD??. Maybe the EU lifting TAAG's ban had something to do with it.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32572 posts, RR: 72
Reply 3, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5047 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Thread starter):
The change of aircraft is down to the high demand for seats on the route. Flights to and from ACC are often overbooked with waitlists in J. The use of a 4 class 777, on certain days, will mean the route will see the return of First Class. The First product was removed from the ACC route when the 767's where embodied with CW flat beds.

It is my understanding that F service will not be offered on the route. F seats will have C service, and be given to elites and higher-fare passengers.



a.
User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2324 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5037 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Reply 2):
I am not sure but is there restrictions on how many flight can fly from the EU to LAD??

Yes it is (or was) common to be restricted to 1x/week excluding Portugual.



oh boy!!!
User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2324 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5032 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 3):

It is my understanding that F service will not be offered on the route. F seats will have C service, and be given to elites and higher-fare passengers.

Where did you get your information? Because FIRST is currently offered on the 777 LHR-LAD. Are you saying it will not be offered on the 2nd weekly flight?



oh boy!!!
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32572 posts, RR: 72
Reply 6, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5026 times:



Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 5):

Where did you get your information? Because FIRST is currently offered on the 777 LHR-LAD. Are you saying it will not be offered on the 2nd weekly flight?

ACC, not LAD.



a.
User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2324 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5015 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 6):
ACC, not LAD.

Oh well then, I can't even remember when BA has offered F to ACC. Flown the 767 in Club World before LHR-ACC.



oh boy!!!
User currently offlineBALHRWWCC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4973 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 3):
It is my understanding that F service will not be offered on the route. F seats will have C service, and be given to elites and higher-fare passengers.

It looks like your are right. Whenever this usually happens the aircraft details on the timetable usually reflect just J/W and Y even though it is a four class aircraft. However I believe the aircraft details will be updated shortly.

Just spoke to someone in planning. They had a look and the plan is the 14F seats will be blocked out for on line check in. The ground staff will upgrade Prem and Gold cardholders into those seats once the normal J cabin is full. The service, amenities and soft furnishings will all be as J. So that mean the two flights with a F cabin will have 62J seats available instead of the current 24.

Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 7):
Oh well then, I can't even remember when BA has offered F to ACC. Flown the 767 in Club World before LHR-ACC.

They removed F from the ACC just over 4 years ago.

Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 4):
Yes it is (or was) common to be restricted to 1x/week excluding Portugual.

That's what I thought. However I think LH added a second flight at the end of May.


User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2324 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4955 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Reply 8):
It looks like your are right. Whenever this usually happens the aircraft details on the timetable usually reflect just J/W and Y even though it is a four class aircraft. However I believe the aircraft details will be updated shortly.

Just spoke to someone in planning. They had a look and the plan is the 14F seats will be blocked out for on line check in. The ground staff will upgrade Prem and Gold cardholders into those seats once the normal J cabin is full. The service, amenities and soft furnishings will all be as J. So that mean the two flights with a F cabin will have 62J seats available instead of the current 24.

Good to see BA 777 in ACC. Africa sure is holding up well for BA.  thumbsup 



oh boy!!!
User currently offlineGoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1825 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4767 times:

AF as also announced a 2nd weekly flight CDG-LAD. But I don't know if the traffic rights have been confirmed yet

User currently offlineFlySSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7401 posts, RR: 57
Reply 11, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4752 times:



Quoting Goldorak (Reply 10):
AF as also announced a 2nd weekly flight CDG-LAD. But I don't know if the traffic rights have been confirmed yet

AF has already added this long time requested second frequency during this summer 2009.

AF928/AF929 is operated on Mon & Wed (return on Tue & Thu) with a B77W.


User currently offlineSlz396 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4740 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Thread starter):
BA will increase the frequency of it's flights to Angola from 1 to 2 weekly from the 6th October.



Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 1):
Wow how did they get the extra weekly right? It is (or was) common to be restricted to 1x/week, excluding Portugual.



Quoting Goldorak (Reply 10):
AF as also announced a 2nd weekly flight CDG-LAD



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Reply 8):
I think LH added a second flight at the end of May.

SN also operates a second weekly flight to LAD, so it seems the bilaterals have been modified, or somebody found a way around it (through a codeshare with TAAG using their weekly slot, currently unused?) and everybody is now copying this. Whatever, it seems all operators are now going from once weekly to twice weekly.

Wonder if all the added capacity will not create over-capacity...


User currently offlineBALHRWWCC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4715 times:

When BA operate to LAD the aircraft stays on the ground all day. I know the crew go to a hotel and have minimum rest before bringing the same aircraft back.

I noticed that both LH and AF's aircraft also stay on at LAD all day before returning to europe. Does anyone know if the crew just have there required rest and bring the same aircraft back or do they stay longer?? and If the crews do just have minimum rest why do they do that?? Surely it would be cheaper to get the aircraft back to europe to operate another flight rather than have it sit on the ground all day

Thanks in advance for info


User currently offlineLH506 From Ecuador, joined May 2007, 463 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4715 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Reply 11):


Quoting Goldorak (Reply 10):
AF as also announced a 2nd weekly flight CDG-LAD. But I don't know if the traffic rights have been confirmed yet

AF has already added this long time requested second frequency during this summer 2009.

AF928/AF929 is operated on Mon & Wed (return on Tue & Thu) with a B77W.

LH also upgraded recently to twice weekly



NOT FLOWN: 707 717 736/9 764 77L 787 300B2 300B4 345 RJ70/146-100 F27 ATR72 CRJ1/4/10 E120/135/40/95 Q1/2/3 M87
User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4670 posts, RR: 50
Reply 15, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 4597 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Reply 13):
and If the crews do just have minimum rest why do they do that?? Surely it would be cheaper to get the aircraft back to europe to operate another flight rather than have it sit on the ground all day

I don't know about Luanda specifically, but it might be due to crew safety concerns.



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineOffloaded From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2009, 869 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 4558 times:

Back in the days when I had some access to the numbers, LAD was BA's 2nd most profitable route out of LIS.

Angola has it all - diamonds, minerals, oil, you name it. Huge wealth and potential to make a lot of money, for some anyway. A friend of mine who does instrument calibration is out there now. He says it's an interesting place, but super corrupt though.



To no one will we sell, or deny, or delay, right or justice - Magna Carta, 1215
User currently offlineVincewy From Taiwan, joined Oct 2005, 767 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 4558 times:

There's also an acute shortage of hotels in Angola, well, if each of those airlines can get 3 flights a week and when InterContinental and others alike open up, perhaps they can bring the aircraft back right away and have the crew stay in Luanda for less than 2-3 days.

Also given the demand of such flight, why aren't those airlines (AF, LH, and BA) using 744 instead? They can pack the flight to the gill and charge the same premiums.

For OP, staying in Luanda for the whole week with just one flight? I heard the hotel rooms (any decent ones with international standards) run at least $300 a night, perhaps there's a reason why the crew get minimum rest.

[Edited 2009-08-14 03:15:03]

User currently offlineBALHRWWCC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4480 times:



Quoting Offloaded (Reply 16):
Back in the days when I had some access to the numbers, LAD was BA's 2nd most profitable route out of LIS.

Angola has it all - diamonds, minerals, oil, you name it. Huge wealth and potential to make a lot of money, for some anyway. A friend of mine who does instrument calibration is out there now. He says it's an interesting place, but super corrupt though.

I believe it is still doing well hence the increase in flights. Interestingly one of the reasons BA has increased the EBB service and changed it's flight times is because they believe there is going to a surge in traffic after the recent discovery of significant oil deposits in the north of Uganda


User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8160 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4363 times:



Quoting BALHRWWCC (Thread starter):
This is a much needed boost to the LAD route. BA's current weekly departure is often overbooked with customers waitlisted in all 4 cabins.

I still say LAD could be a good A380 destination for BA/AF/LH, given the limited frequencies.

Quoting BALHRWWCC (Reply 13):
I noticed that both LH and AF's aircraft also stay on at LAD all day before returning to europe. Does anyone know if the crew just have there required rest and bring the same aircraft back or do they stay longer??

Correct. The same crew brings the aircraft home which is why the flights are scheduled to allow a complete rest period in Luanda.

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 17):
Also given the demand of such flight, why aren't those airlines (AF, LH, and BA) using 744 instead? They can pack the flight to the gill and charge the same premiums.

I don't think the 744's have a higher percentage of premium seats. IIRC, the 744's are typically configured in a high density Y configuration for predominantly leisure destinations.


User currently offlineSlz396 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4344 times:



Quoting Airbazar (Reply 19):
The same crew brings the aircraft home which is why the flights are scheduled to allow a complete rest period in Luanda.

At SN, the plane heads back to FIH and the crew have their lay-over there.

For one reason or the other, LAD doesn't seem to be a good place to stay for long...


User currently offlineAndie007 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 860 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4331 times:

Carriers seems to generate very very high revenues at the moment on the LAD-routes.
Obviously, the hotel situation at LAD is really poor for business travellers.


User currently offlineAIR MALTA From Malta, joined Sep 2001, 2486 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4305 times:



Quoting Slz396 (Reply 20):
At SN, the plane heads back to FIH and the crew have their lay-over there.

For one reason or the other, LAD doesn't seem to be a good place to stay for long...

But FIH is not a better place either...

What about a LHR-LAD-WDH-LAD-LHR (or CPT)? That could ease the crew resting problem and might generate some more revenues (not sure though)



Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4670 posts, RR: 50
Reply 23, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4272 times:



Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 22):

What about a LHR-LAD-WDH-LAD-LHR (or CPT)? That could ease the crew resting problem and might generate some more revenues (not sure though)

LAD looks to have no problem sustaining the flight on it's own with very high yield, why change that and dilute the yield with WDH bound passengers? It would be cheaper to just park the plane in LAD for the day than making the LAD-WDH-LAD trip with just a few lower yielding passengers.



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineUs330 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 3866 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (4 years 11 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4188 times:



Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 22):
What about a LHR-LAD-WDH-LAD-LHR (or CPT)? That could ease the crew resting problem and might generate some more revenues (not sure though)

Namibia doesn't attract the same kind of travelers that Angola does--it is mainly an ecotourism destination, with few hard natural resources other than offshore diamond mining operations.
It wouldn't make sense to dilute the yields on a Europe-LAD-WDH route with tourists looking for the best deal.


25 330lover : Maybe FIH is no better place to stay, but at least, you can get back earlier (daily SN flights). 1 weekly LAD would mean staying a week... Not really
26 SW733 : Excellent points. While I would love love love love love this, it will never happen, and I don't blame BA. They are doing something right with the LA
27 ZuluTime : BA has to generate high revenue on Luanda to pay the enormous royalty to TAAG Angolan that it does for traffic rights. The second flight will be no ex
28 Airbazar : That has nothing to do with it. TP crews have no problem staying in LAD for example, and it's not like BA/LH/AF crews camp out in the airplane during
29 TristarSteve : You can't use two crews under EASA rules. The positioning crew is classified as on duty when leaving LHR, so will be no advantage.
30 Yellowtail : The oils folks in IAH are cheering right now....
31 DALCA : Would it even fit at LAD? I can imagine looking at Google Earth that it wouldn't fit the apron or otherwise completly block it. Hope Hainan Airlins i
32 Post contains images Seemyseems : I thought BA ended LAD   Is DT likely to start this route, now that they are off the black list?[Edited 2009-08-14 17:33:28]
33 Cptgirmaytesfa : Instead of having a plane on the ground all day, would it not be more economic to fly on (empty even) to Johannesburg? From there the plane and crew c
34 VV701 : BA's livery is already seen on a daily basis at WDH. A Comair 733 operates JNB-WDH-JNB (BA6275-74) in BA colours as British Airways. This service bet
35 LipeGIG : Good to LAD, getting more and more services to Europe. Angola is the fast growing country in the world IIRC. Not only minerals, oil, diamond, but a lo
36 OP3000 : The ruling specified that they are still not allowed to fly anywhere in the EU other than LIS, so no. And DT does not get a lot of business traffic f
37 JRadier : Considering BA operates the 777 to LAD and the 744 to JNB that would be a fun swap . Even then, I doubt the cotst are worth the few hours the a/c ret
38 Kevin777 : While I understand the return flying times - midnight departure allowing for a full day in Angola, early morning arrival at LHR giving a full day in
39 JRadier : I'd say suggest it to the respective unions and watch hell unfold...
40 Airbazar : Come on, it's LAD. Grease the right set of hands and voila', new apron That would be my guess.
41 Kevin777 : he he... well, yes.. beats working for free, though!
42 VV701 : They also fly from JNB to HRE (BA6267), LVI (BA6291), MRU (BA6399) and VFA (Victoria Falls, Zimbwabe) (BA6285).[Edited 2009-08-15 14:33:57]
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