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BA 90th Birthday Livery?  
User currently offlineSpeedmarque From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 684 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 4 months 16 hours ago) and read 9054 times:

According to internal communications it's BAs 90th next week with lots of celebrations! Will we finally see a retro BA livery????

57 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLHR380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (5 years 4 months 11 hours ago) and read 8670 times:

I so wish we could see a Landor or BEA livery, but thats a lot of cost at the moment, even though ti would bring a lot of pride to see something like that. (Maybe even get some crew in retro uniforms)

Doubt we will see anything, but we can only hope.


User currently offlineComorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4903 posts, RR: 16
Reply 2, posted (5 years 4 months 10 hours ago) and read 8608 times:

I do hope BA will do a retro BOAC livery - it looked wonderful on the Comets.

My first flight ever was on BOAC DEL-CCU-BKK in 1950, grateful if someone can tell me what type of aircraft it might have been.


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User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2104 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (5 years 4 months 10 hours ago) and read 8549 times:

Well if BA was going retro for its 90th Birthday, surely it'd want to pay homage to Handley Page Air Transport or Instone Airline?

Mind you, 2009 is also the 85th anniversary of the formation of Imperial Airways. Whilst in 2010 we see the 75th anniersary of the formation of the original British Airways, the 70th anniversary of the fourmation of BOAC, and the 40th anniversary of the formation of British Caledonian.

So many anniversaries...



Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25983 posts, RR: 22
Reply 4, posted (5 years 4 months 9 hours ago) and read 8473 times:



Quoting Comorin (Reply 2):
My first flight ever was on BOAC DEL-CCU-BKK in 1950, grateful if someone can tell me what type of aircraft it might have been.

In 1950 I think it would have been a Canadair DC-4M, called Argonaut by BOAC, the license-built variant of the Douglas DC-4 with R-R Merlin engines and certain early DC-6 features including pressurization. BOAC acquired 22 Argonauts in 1949-50 and they were mainly used on their Africa and Far East routes.

http://www.stinsonflyer.com/prop/can4-2.jpg


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Photo © Malcolm I H McCrow



User currently offlineComorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4903 posts, RR: 16
Reply 5, posted (5 years 4 months 9 hours ago) and read 8435 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 4):
Quoting Comorin (Reply 2):
My first flight ever was on BOAC DEL-CCU-BKK in 1950, grateful if someone can tell me what type of aircraft it might have been.

In 1950 I think it would have been a Canadair DC-4M, called Argonaut by BOAC, the license-built variant of the Douglas DC-4 with R-R Merlin engines and certain early DC-6 features including pressurization. BOAC acquired 22 Argonauts in 1949-50 and they were mainly used on their Africa and Far East routes.

Thank you! That looks very much like the fading pictures I have of deplaning in BKK.

Cheers,

Comorin


User currently offlineTonystan From Ireland, joined Jan 2006, 1447 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 8157 times:

At a time when our management are claiming to be "fighting for survival" and trying to take everything away from its employees including a fair wage if they suddenly started painting up aircraft in retro liveries I can assure you there would be a massive outcry!


My views are my own and do not reflect any other person or organisation.
User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 7978 times:



Quoting Tonystan (Reply 6):
if they suddenly started painting up aircraft in retro liveries I can assure you there would be a massive outcry!

I fully understand your sentiments. But are they thought through and well founded?

All aircraft need painting once every five to eight years. So BA will repaint a significant number of aircraft currently in their fleet over the coming year.

And all new aircraft also have to be painted. These include the new 732s and 320s delivered to BA over the past year. Over the next 12 to 18 months it will include the new 318s and 320s, the new 773s and a whole fleet of new EMB170s and 190s.

Looking back over the last 12 months we have seen half a dozen BA 744s that were due to be repainted rolled out in the special oneworld livery:

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Photo © Konstantin Von Wedelstaedt
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Photo © Brian Gershey


Have painting these aircraft cost BA any more than those they repainted in the standard colours? I think not.

Over the next 12 to 18 months I would hope to see BA role out aircraft in special colours for the London 2012 Olympics be they one of the new aircraft mentioned above or some of the current fleet that require repainting. Why? Well BA are major sponsors of London 2012. And it would be a terrible waste to pay out all of that sponsorship money and that then not take full promotional advantage of the expenditure.

I also hope that they might celebrate one of the anniversaries mentioned in this thread with someting special in the way of liveries.

But the important thing to note is that the aircraft have to be painted (if they are new) or repainted (in they are getting shabby). And the cost of one colour scheme hardly varies from that of another. So to be upset because BA paints an aircraft in a retro livery is, with respect, like crying when none of the paint - sorry, milk - has been spilt.


User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2104 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7245 times:

The repainting thing can be contrasted by the attitude of UA and DL. UA's new livery was launched five years ago, and is still not carried by all aircraft. They are repainting them when they are due. DL on the other hand are repainting NW aircraft like crazy as part of the rebranding. They don't want partial repaints but full ones - so that is extra money that is being spent.

CO recently took delivery of a brand new 737-924ER in retro colours, so as has been said, BA could do this should it want to paint an aircraft in a retro scheme, or when an aircraft is due for a scheduled repaint.

The issue for BA is that so many airlines came together in its formation, that which one should it honour? Instone Airline or Handley Page Air Transport were both around for five years, so any retro scheme would be very bland, as "liveries" were hardly existant in the 1920s! BA could honour Imperial Airways, who introduced the original Speedbird logo, that went on to serve BOAC and BA, before evolving into the Speedwing and now the Speedmarque. But again, we'd have a polished/grey aircraft with some lining. So does BA then honour BOAC? What about BEA? The LGW operation is largely a legacy of the acquisitions of BCal and the remnants of Dan-Air - should they be honoured?

If BA marks the 90th anniversary, it'll be that it can trace its history back that long rather than by honouring specifically one of the many airlines that came together to make BA today. In many ways there is too much heritage to honour. And to those who say bring back a one-off Landor - would BA really want to have an aircraft flying around in its 1980s/1990s livery? It was - and is - a classic livery, but it was very tied up with the BA brand at the time, and thus - IMHO - it is too soon to see that scheme in the sky again on a current BA jetliner.



Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7202 times:



Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 8):
So does BA then honour BOAC? What about BEA?

Well every aircraft has two sides just like this:

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Photo © George Canciani
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Photo © George Canciani



User currently offlineAviateur From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1360 posts, RR: 11
Reply 10, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7153 times:

I wanna see a 747 in the old BOAC "Speedbird" livery.

I wanna see it because I am (barely) old enough to remember one or two BOAC 747s landing at BOS in the early/mid 1970s.

Plus, the Speedbird colophon is just so damn cool. Taken from Imperial Airways, if I'm not mistaken.


PS



Patrick Smith is an airline pilot, air travel columnist and author
User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7110 times:



Quoting Aviateur (Reply 10):

Plus, the Speedbird colophon is just so damn cool. Taken from Imperial Airways, if I'm not mistaken.

 checkmark  Agreed!

I wish more airlines did what US did -- paint more than one aircraft in a retro livery. Imagine a BOAC 747 and a Landor 747, a BEA 747, and so on! I'd be in aviation heaven! Big grin


User currently offlineAmerican 767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3993 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7087 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR



Quoting Airport (Reply 11):
Imagine a BOAC 747 and a Landor 747, a BEA 747, and so on! I'd be in aviation heaven!

Well I'm sorry to be picky but BOAC did have 747's and the 747 did fly in the Landor scheme (I believe it's the blue/gray livery dating from the mid 80's). If you had said a BOAC 747-400 then I would agree with you. A 747-400 painted in BOAC retro livery, that would be cool. A BEA 747 yes, that I agree, because BEA never flew the 747.

I would propose these:
BEA A320
BOAC 747-400 and 777
BA 777 late 70's/early 80's livery
British Caledonian 777

Ben Soriano



Ben Soriano
User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 6988 times:



Quoting American 767 (Reply 12):

Well I'm sorry to be picky but BOAC did have 747's and the 747 did fly in the Landor scheme (I believe it's the blue/gray livery dating from the mid 80's). If you had said a BOAC 747-400 then I would agree with you. A 747-400 painted in BOAC retro livery, that would be cool. A BEA 747 yes, that I agree, because BEA never flew the 747.

Not being picky at all.  Wink But I do know that they flew 747s, I just meant it'd be cool to see them grace the skies again as a throwback to the old days.


User currently offlineLeezyjet From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 4042 posts, RR: 53
Reply 14, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 6762 times:



Quoting VV701 (Reply 9):

That was what I first thought of when I saw the thread title !!.

There was also this back in 1998 :-


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Photo © Dennis Lau



 Smile



"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 15, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 6480 times:



Quoting Leezyjet (Reply 14):
There was also this back in 1998 :-

But, of course it never flew a revenue flight and although it stirred the memory buds the same aircraft in actual BOAC livery was differentin appearence in several respects, not least because only one side of 'NA was given this treatment back in 1998. Here is the original alongside the facsimile:

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Photo © George W. Hamlin
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Photo © Dennis Lau


As a matter of interest also note that the upper cabin was converted (by Boeing in the early 80s) from the origtinal 3-window First Class Lounge and Bar shown in the first photo into a conventional 12-window passenger carrying cabin shown in the second.


User currently offlineAviateur From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1360 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 6407 times:

What a great picture that is, above, of the BOAC 747 at BOS in '72.

I remember seeing that livery at BOS, but I couldn't tell you the year -- I was like 7 or 8 years old.


Which one is the Landor scheme, by the way? Not the current "Pepsi" livery, right?


PS



Patrick Smith is an airline pilot, air travel columnist and author
User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 6374 times:



Quoting Aviateur (Reply 16):
Which one is the Landor scheme, by the way? Not the current "Pepsi" livery, right?


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Photo © Normando Carvalho Jr.



User currently offlineBlueShamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 3058 posts, RR: 23
Reply 18, posted (5 years 3 months 4 weeks ago) and read 6253 times:

The Daily Telegraph has done a small but interesting photomontage of BA's history:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/n...6628/BA-A-History-in-Pictures.html

Rgds



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
User currently offlineDano1977 From British Indian Ocean Territory, joined Jun 2008, 515 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6108 times:



Quoting American 767 (Reply 12):

Also add to the mix:


Dan-Air London: A320 or one of the B737's down at LGW



Children should only be allowed on aircraft if 1. Muzzled and heavily sedated 2. Go as freight
User currently offlineEDICHC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (5 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6098 times:

Why 90th birthday now? BA will not be 90 until 2062?

User currently offlineRutankrd From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 3038 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (5 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 6036 times:

Just few questions re Dan Air, what exactly did BA buy from Davies and Newman Group.
Was it just the Traffic rights,a few B733/B734 leases and The Gatwick based scheduled service operations with associated crews.

Is it not true that the Dan Air owned aircraft were parked immediately and that the maintenance arm Dan Air Engineering remained with Davis and Newman Group (A mainly maritime business) for sometime after.
If that is the case BA probably have no ownership of Dan Air intellectual property such as the the compass/ensign logo.

Remember at the time these were swiftly removed by BA unlike the BCAL situation.

Fact is British Airways Group was formed on 1 September 1974.

What you are talking about is a lineage going back 90 years of British Civil Aviation but its not really a 90th Birthday of BA is it.

British Airways was formed out of the Government decision to have a single National airline and global brand rather than two entities BEA and BOAC along with regional operations of BEA subsidiary BKS/BAS Group those of Cambrian and Northeast.
For many years it really was just branding exercise with the operations remaining separate to all intents and purposes.

So the next real milestone for BA would surely be their 40th in 2014 !

However the opportunity of London 2012 must give BA a marketing opportunity to do something special (More so that a sprayed Golden/red nose and few tacky OW transfers anyway)


User currently offlineBlueShamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 3058 posts, RR: 23
Reply 22, posted (5 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 5901 times:



Quoting Rutankrd (Reply 21):
Is it not true that the Dan Air owned aircraft were parked immediately and that the maintenance arm Dan Air Engineering remained with Davis and Newman Group (A mainly maritime business) for sometime after.
If that is the case BA probably have no ownership of Dan Air intellectual property such as the the compass/ensign logo.

Remember at the time these were swiftly removed by BA unlike the BCAL situation.

Not true regarding immediate parking IIRC. Someone will no doubt have exact dates, but I recall that whilst the 733s were disposed of pretty quickly, some of the 734s stayed with BA for quite some time after the takeover, and were repainted in the full Landor scheme.

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z192/PrimavistaGiantSchnauzers/Aircraft%20Archived%20Pics/Aircraft0025.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z192/PrimavistaGiantSchnauzers/Aircraft%20Archived%20Pics/Aircraft0026.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z192/PrimavistaGiantSchnauzers/Aircraft%20Archived%20Pics/Aircraft0067.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z192/PrimavistaGiantSchnauzers/Aircraft%20Archived%20Pics/Aircraft0033.jpg

Rgds



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
User currently offlineRutankrd From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 3038 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (5 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 5780 times:

Blueshamu330

That what said the B733/B734 leases were the only Dan Air aircraft to be taken on .

The remaining BAC1-11 /Bae146 and the B722 used for the Charter flights were parked if memory serves.
These were never to operate for BA.

The BAC1-11s were to sit at Southend and the B722s were to be taken on by Sabre.


User currently offlineBlueShamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 3058 posts, RR: 23
Reply 24, posted (5 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 5765 times:

Ah, I see now !!  highfive 

Nice to reminisce !  Smile



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
25 VV701 : Have a look at the link in Reply 18. It is a pictorial review of 90 years of history. No. Quite a few 737s in service with Dan-Air when BA took them
26 Rutankrd : Again thats what i said the ONLY Dan Air aircraft brought into BA were the leased B733/B734s , however the owned aircraft consisting of a variety of 1
27 EDICHC : I am aware of the history. I was questioning given that BA was formed in the 1970's just how do BA calculate the fact they are 90 years old? They are
28 Post contains links LHR380 : Come on!!!!!! The family line starts with AT&T and is now BA, with all the other airlines and names it has had along the way, simply as that really.
29 EDICHC : Well as I have traced my family tree back 150 years to my great, great, great grandfather but I don't claim to be 150years old! Because it is mislead
30 LHR380 : Might be because you are not a company, you a a person. The company can trace its history from the start of AT&T, what is hard to understand about th
31 Rutankrd : LHR380 Don't think Companies House would see it like that at all Date of incorporation 1 September 1974. Lineage can be traced back but that really Br
32 EDICHC : Au contraire, just in pursuit of truth my freind.
33 LHR380 : Right then, so your both saying the airline has no history to. BA can only celebrate from when the British Airways name ONLY was first used, and cant
34 Rutankrd : LHR380 I am not discrediting the lineage, heritage and indeed history that culminated in modern day company trading as British Airways Group. Indeed t
35 EDICHC : No denying that but prior to Apr 74 BA did not exist. 1974-2009 = 35 years not 90. If you are suggesting the 90th anniversary of commercial aviation
36 LHR380 : Thats how far the airlines history goes back!!! Back to the VERY start. What other UK airline can say that?
37 Post contains links and images SXDFC : Ask and you shall receive! Aviation-Design.Net:Design © Bobby CatoneTemplate © RP Abraham
38 GDB : When the retro 747 was done in 1998, to mark the end of G-BNWA's service, some pilot bitched in the BA News about 'wasting money'. It was pointed out
39 FlyCaledonian : BA's lineage can be traced back 90 years, but not the airline. Of course British Airways was formed in 1974 as it was a merger, and neither BOAC or BE
40 VV701 : Ah! I see. If the name changes the heritage prior to the name change is irrelevant. So, for example, when BAe (also known as British Aerospace at the
41 Viscount724 : I think you mean "10-window" (not 12). That modification also included installation of a second upper deck emergency exit on the left side, in additi
42 VV701 : Yup. Sorry. Must learn to count!
43 EDICHC : None, but neither can BA. BA's history goes back to 1974. It's predecessors' collective histories go back to 1919.
44 EDICHC : Regardless of the analogies, the date of British Airways incorporation was 01/09/1974 upon acquisition of all the assets of the dissolved BOAC and BE
45 Evomutant : Why so anal about it? Geez. BA has a very easily traced history back to 1919. And they are entitled to celebrate it. Lighten up.
46 BlueShamu330s : Bravo. Don't worry Evo; there are some trolls on here who would turn up for the opening of an envelope if they thought there was something disparagin
47 LACA773 : It would be great to see BA do various retro liveries on each a/c type. BA is so far reaching it would be great for everyone to be able to experience
48 EDICHC : Thank you for such an enlightened debate! Factually incorrect! It has been posted twice now in this thread that the date of incorporation of British
49 LHR380 : EDICHC The company as a whole can trace its history back to 1919 (By history, I meant all the different companies and names it has been up until now),
50 DIJKKIJK : How about painting one of their 772ERs in the old BOAC Speedbird livery? That would look fantastic IMO.
51 LHR380 : That would be nice, as close to a 707 as ya can get. Maybe a BEA 320, very nice indeed.
52 Speedmarque : EDICHC and LHR380 Enough already, playtime is over. Lets keep the tit-for-tat-one-upmanship no value postings for PMs so we dont all have to suffer. S
53 EDICHC : With all due respect to you I entered this debate as I was in disagreement the information you shared in your original post... Now that is a statemen
54 LHR380 : Just let it lie now. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wonder what if any the
55 Cadmus : I always thought that the current British Airways was formed in 1972, with BEA and BOAC operating as wholly owned subsidiaries until 1974 when they we
56 Rb211 : Hopefully they will pick three 777's and do the BOAC livery, BEA livery, and a Blue Tail Landor livery. Sweet!!!
57 TravellerPlus : I can see both side of the debate re the incorporation date of BA. Here's my 2 pence worth. I thoroughly enjoy BA, but my first flights were on BOAC,
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