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Air New Zealand's B 747-400 Fleet  
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15468 times:

Heard that the oldest Air New Zealand B 747-400 ZK-NBS will be broken up soon. Can anyone confirm that? Or have they already done so? Was this being leased to CX for a while?

What are the remaining B 747-400 routes?

Will AKL-HKG-LHR go B 747-400 again? And will it go daily again? Maybe during Northern winter?

[Edited 2009-08-31 05:09:43]

74 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineKiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8544 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15429 times:
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Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):
Will AKL-HKG-LHR go B 747-400 again? And will it go daily again? Maybe during Northern winter?

I doubt if it will go back to 744 , I hope it will go back to daily once the economy starts to improve - though I know that Koruman would disagree with me  Wink

Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):
Heard that the oldest Air New Zealand B 747-400 will be broken up soon.


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Photo © Jonathan Rankin



as per the caption for this photo the aircraft departed New Zealand for the last time 06 June this year and arrived same evening at Roswell ( via LAX ) - have not heard any update on the scrapping process , so no idea whether it has started ( or maybe even finished !)

I think the plan was for all the 744s to leave by the end of 2012 ( the 77Ws start arriving next year , the first one is due around October IIRC ) . Whether the ongoing delays with the 787-9s will affect this I dont know .



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineKiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8544 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15416 times:
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Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):
Was this being leased to CX for a while?

yes , this one was leased to CX for around a year right at the beginning of its career as NZ could not resolve a dispute with their crews over the operation of the aircraft .



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15410 times:

It will still be around for a while.

So where does NZ fly its B 747-400s to?

I was told that the B 747-400 will return for AKL-HKG-LHR during northern winter. Anyway let's see.


User currently offlineKiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8544 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15390 times:
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Quoting United Airline (Reply 3):
So where does NZ fly its B 747-400s to?

I think that they are mostly used these days on the AKL-LAX and AKL-LAX-LHR flights , and some of the AKL-YVR flights . Not sure if they are still used on some of the transTasman routes in between longhauls .



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15379 times:

Do they still have plans to fly to South America?

User currently offlineEcuadorianMD11 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15366 times:



Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Do they still have plans to fly to South America?

Fingers crossed!!

That´d be convenient!!

Ecuadorian MD11.


User currently offlineKiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8544 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 15340 times:
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Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Do they still have plans to fly to South America?

sadly I think that is a long way off . As the launch customer for the 787-9 NZ were talking about AKL-GRU as one possible route , but I guess the 787s are not going to arrive until at least the end of 2013 so any service would not happen soon . Then there is also the question as to whether EROPS restrictions will apply . I would love to see a *A link from New Zealand to South America but I am not going to hold my breath waiting ( perhaps JJ could use the A340-500 to operate GRU-AKL-SYD eventually once they have been freed up from other routes )



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Reply 8, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 15210 times:

Does QF fly to YVR? If not will they resume service? I know they fly to South America. NZ should, once they get the B 787s

User currently offlineVincewy From Taiwan, joined Oct 2005, 767 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 15007 times:

Perhaps BG or AR could pick this 744? Please don't scrap it!

If they have the right aircraft, there's potential for AKL-GRU, AKL-EZE, and AKL-LIM (this one can connect upper part of South America, perhaps also partnership with LAN Peru or TACA)

Quoting United Airline (Reply 8):
Does QF fly to YVR?

Their SFO flight used to be routed SYD-SFO-YVR, but it looks like there was no traffic right between SFO-YVR.


User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 14843 times:

Will QF return to YVR?

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 9):
Perhaps BG or AR could pick this 744? Please don't scrap it!

If they have the right aircraft, there's potential for AKL-GRU, AKL-EZE, and AKL-LIM (this one can connect upper part of South America, perhaps also partnership with LAN Peru or TACA)

Exactly


User currently offlineSunriseValley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4883 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 14830 times:



Quoting Kiwiandrew (Reply 7):
Then there is also the question as to whether EROPS restrictions will apply

I believe you are referring to the soon to be adopted EDTO standard. As I understand the Australian version which the N.Z. one is expected to be the same, there should be no difficulty in this respect. Ultimately it will be up to the airline's comfort level and their ability to satisfy the regulator. If the 789 comes out of the blocks at 330mins. it should not be an issue. No doubt Boeing will be striving for this.


User currently offlineAirxliban From Lebanon, joined Oct 2003, 4507 posts, RR: 53
Reply 12, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 14706 times:

How many of the remaining NZ 744s are RB211 powered? Is there anyway to know for a given NZ1/2 service between AKL and LHR whether the 744 will be RB211 or CF6 powered?


PARIS, FRANCE...THE BEIRUT OF EUROPE.
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26376 posts, RR: 76
Reply 13, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 14682 times:



Quoting Airxliban (Reply 12):
How many of the remaining NZ 744s are RB211 powered?

Two. The two oldest left in the fleet.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineSunriseValley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4883 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 14570 times:



Quoting United Airline (Reply 3):
So where does NZ fly its B 747-400s to?

at this time of the year, so far as I can see; weekly, 7x AKL-LAX-LHR and return; 6x AKL-LAX -AKL; 2x AKL-YVR-AKL; 7x AKL-BNE-AKL


User currently offlineCXA330300 From South Africa, joined May 2004, 1560 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 14423 times:



Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 14):
at this time of the year, so far as I can see; weekly, 7x AKL-LAX-LHR and return; 6x AKL-LAX -AKL; 2x AKL-YVR-AKL; 7x AKL-BNE-AKL

I'm pretty sure at least one rotation for SYD as well.



The sky is the limit as long as you can stay there
User currently offlineDJ748 From Australia, joined Jul 2006, 355 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 14305 times:



Quoting Kiwiandrew (Reply 4):
I think that they are mostly used these days on the AKL-LAX and AKL-LAX-LHR flights , and some of the AKL-YVR flights . Not sure if they are still used on some of the transTasman routes in between longhauls .



Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 14):
7x AKL-BNE-AKL

They definitely fly them trans Tasman, but they currently only fly them 2x to 3x weekly from AKL-BNE-AKL, depending on the time of year. I've booked myself onto one of the 744 flights from BNE-AKL at the end of January, and it's only 3 hours block time.


User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5621 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 14285 times:



Quoting United Airline (Reply 10):
Will QF return to YVR?

There are rumors floating around that the B788s will go directly to QF, not JQ first as had been planned. I'd say there is a good chance of QF returning to YVR with B788s.

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 9):
Their SFO flight used to be routed SYD-SFO-YVR, but it looks like there was no traffic right between SFO-YVR

QF has full 5th freedom traffic rights between USA & Canada on the routes designated in the Australia/Canada bi-lateral treaty, which are YVR-SFO & YVR-HNL.

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineCanyonblue17 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 442 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13880 times:

I flew NZ from LAX-AKL-LAX a few months ago. On the way down under I flew the 777. On the way back I caught the 744. I gotta tell ya....the 744 in coach was much more comfortable, even though the 777 was half-empty and the 774 was completely full. Shame to see the 744s go.

User currently onlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6408 posts, RR: 38
Reply 19, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13863 times:



Quoting CXA330300 (Reply 15):

Generally the 772 goes AKL-SYD, not the 744.

Quoting Canyonblue17 (Reply 18):

When the 77Ws are released, there'll be a new product to go along with it and it's set to revolutionise economy travel. Nothing else has been said about it but come the end of next year, we'll all know.



It's all about the destination AND the journey.
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Reply 20, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13750 times:



Quoting Canyonblue17 (Reply 18):
I flew NZ from LAX-AKL-LAX a few months ago. On the way down under I flew the 777. On the way back I caught the 744. I gotta tell ya....the 744 in coach was much more comfortable, even though the 777 was half-empty and the 774 was completely full. Shame to see the 744s go.

Well they have not officially announced the retirement of the B 747-400 fleet. They have just retired ZK-NBS and that's it. Hope they will order some B 747-8 or even the A 380.

They will be around for a while

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 19):
Generally the 772 goes AKL-SYD, not the 744.

Looking forward....


User currently offlineDavidByrne From New Zealand, joined Sep 2007, 1634 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13544 times:



Quoting United Airline (Reply 20):
They will be around for a while

I wouldn't be too sure of that. I'd expect to see them retired as 77Ws start arriving next year on a one for one basis. Mind you, there are seven 744s left in the fleet, and only five 77Ws on firm order (2 on option).Whether the options are taken up will to a large extent depend on how the economic slowdown is affecting things in the longer term, I suspect.



This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
User currently offlineVincewy From Taiwan, joined Oct 2005, 767 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13472 times:

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 17):
QF has full 5th freedom traffic rights between USA & Canada

I tried to nook it and it wasn't available in OW's timetable, maybe I should've looked further.

Quoting United Airline (Reply 20):
even the A 380

There's a potential need of probably 5, up to 8 frames. 3 for AKL-LAX-LHR and 2 for either another AKL-LAX or AKL-YVR, there's a lot of potential for AKL-YVR since NZ can connect people out of AKL into many secondary cities in Australia. As for South American flights, IMO only NZ will be able to launch dedicated nonstop from AKL because it can offer connections to Australia and Asia, unlike JJ, AR or LA, where their only sensible option is SYD.

edit: I know AR and LA offer AKL-SYD, but should QF increase frequencies to EZE, other South American carriers will have to go nonstop to SYD.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 19):

Generally the 772 goes AKL-SYD

It was discussed in NZ thread that the AKL-SYD flight in the morning sometimes goes even further down to A320, OTOH, MEL and BNE get 744 and 777, Given the option of LAX-SYD flights, no one wants to fly to SYD through AKL unless NZ offers rock bottom fare, something NZ definitely doesn't want to do.

[Edited 2009-08-31 20:12:19]

User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9160 posts, RR: 15
Reply 23, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 13333 times:

Maybe........ But I think it will take a while longer.

Umm....... not sure.

Will NZ bring back SYD-LAX? It's an important route


User currently offlineSXDFC From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 2299 posts, RR: 19
Reply 24, posted (4 years 11 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 13333 times:



Quoting NZ107 (Reply 19):
When the 77Ws are released, there'll be a new product to go along with it

I heard in another thread ( on a-net) that the 77Ws will have all new products and a new livery. Can you confirm about first and business if they too will have a new product?



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
25 Kiwiandrew : first certainly wont , they got rid of it a few years ago when they went to true lie-flat ( rather than "slippery slope" so called "lie-flat" as many
26 United Airline : NZ is now 2 class. Do they have plans to reintroduce first class?
27 CHCalfonzo : 3 class, they have premium economy too. I would be extremely surprised if they did.
28 NZ107 : The AKL-SYD morning flight which leaves at 7am is never operated by the 772. It is either a 763 (6x weekly) or A320 (Sunday) operation. At the moment
29 Post contains links Gemuser : There is even a trip report on this site about a local YVR-SFO QF flight! YVR-SFO In QF F Class (by Zrs70 Aug 10 2007 in Trip Reports)?threadid=10646
30 United Airline : Oh yes I forgot all about the premium economy. Should they bring first class back? I suppose it can attract premium passengers. Make something revolut
31 DJ748 : The 744's and 77E's have 3 classes - Business, Premium Economy and Economy, but the 763's, A320's have 2 - Business and Economy. The rest of their fl
32 767ER : Hi Nick, Currently SYD gets 2 772s pw on Sat/Sun as NZ118/119 only. Alas, that will change from Nov when the Sat service is the god awful A320 and Su
33 NZ107 : Ah, so you are right. The Air NZ timetable was playing tricks on me! Thanks for that.. What's going to trick me even more is the change of numbers ba
34 NZ1 : Not going to happen. 744 fleet should be fully retire by 2013 at the latest. NBT is currently parked, and used maybe once or twice per fortnight if o
35 United Airline : Well.......never say never. Will it be back again?
36 Kiwiandrew : sorry Desmond , while normally I would agree with you in saying "never say never" ( as you know from my posts in another thread ) in this case I woul
37 NZ1 : If it makes it to CHC, then yes, it will be back in AKL for its end of lease check, and maybe the odd ad-hoc flight here and there, but thats about i
38 Koruman : NZ1 is of course correct when he states that the future fleet for long-haul operations will be the 777-300ER and the 787-9. That is the airline's poli
39 KiwiRob : Apart from giving all economy class passangers sleeper seats what else could NZ do to revolutionise economy travel?
40 SXDFC : Does anyone know what the regis will be of the upcoming 777-319ERs?
41 PA515 : ZK-OKI (Nov 2010) ZK-OKJ (Jan 2011) ZK-OKK (Mar 2011) ZK-OKL (Nov 2011) ZK-OKM (Feb 2012) ZK-OKN (Option for Sep/Oct 2012) ZK-OKO (Option for Oct/Nov
42 NZdsgnr : You are so right Koruman, management has got absolutely NO idea how to run an airline , and that is probably why they still managed to return a profi
43 DavidByrne : There's often been speculation on these threads as to the longer-term future of the 772s, especially now that seven of the eight are leased. Can we i
44 Koruman : I am on enough committees and similar entities to understand that a purchasing decision like the 787-9 one and the 777-300ER one is invariably based
45 Cchan : With the 787 delays, which are likely to affect the 789 for NZ, will these 772s (and 763s) stay for longer than originally planned? By the time the 7
46 Mariner : I'm a little confused here - is there not commonality among the 777 models? mariner
47 Cchan : Considering NZ needs to carry quite a substantial number of Y passengers in and out of New Zealand, they won't configure their aircrafts with lots of
48 Koruman : The 788 would have been ideal for this. At present there is a single 744 flying AKL-LAX-LHR, configured 46J / 39U / 269 Y, and only offering a single
49 DavidByrne : What I was meaning was that instead of having three aircraft types (77W, 77E and 789) you would have only two (77W and 789). I'll leave it to the exp
50 LAXintl : Why even serve LHR directly -- why not feed Star partner United's double daily LHR and FRA services from SFO? Also If you are looking for domestic co
51 NZ1 : Correct, though they may hang around a wee while longer than planned due to the delays to the 787. NZ1
52 Kiwiandrew : I take it that you have not flown both airlines in longhaul for comparison - they are not even remotely similar in quality and forcing NZ pax to fly
53 TG992 : The 773 will initially operate NZ6 AKL-LAX, (plus to SYD and BNE for crew training) and when enough frames are delivered will start on NZ2 to LHR, fol
54 Mariner : As a cost hawk I worry about that and I have always thought the beauty of an aircraft family is that you mix and match as the need/demand arises. But
55 DavidByrne : This is strictly armchair CEO stuff, and I'll freely concede that there are many, many factors that I don't have knowledge of, but a few of the facto
56 Mariner : I confess I have a little trouble with that "game-changing" thing. Just because an aircraft is technically able to fly a route doesn't mean it is a r
57 Kiwiandrew : which strongly suggests that either : at least one of the options will be converted or NZ38/39 is not planned to ever go back to daily I base this on
58 AirNz : There is nothing obvious about it all, and you are ignoring many factors. Additionally, you really need to clarify your "i.e least profitable" to mea
59 NZ1 : Be patient, you will see the last 2 options exercised in due course. There was talk of it, but whether it will happen or not I don't know yet. If we
60 DavidByrne : In the current economic climate, I'm 100% behind you on this. All my prognostications are based on the possibility that by the time the 789s arrive f
61 TG992 : I'd be quite happy to work on those glorious 767s until they hit 50 years old
62 Manfredj : How many 747's does NZ have in service? What year is their newest 744? Are the newest one likely to go to a new home?
63 Post contains links Kiwiandrew : 7 "in service" but as per NZ1s post effectively 6 as one is parked and only used as a backup not too sure but their website gives an average age of 1
64 Post contains links Kiwiandrew : http://www.planespotters.net/Airline/Air-New-Zealand looks as though ZK-NBW is the youngest - it will be 10 years old next week .
65 UALWN : Last year I flew HKG-AKL-HKG on NZ, both legs on 744, and I have to say I found the plane very comfortable, and the service excellent. Truly memorable
66 Columba : Any chance that NZ is considering the 747-8I ?
67 Cchan : I'd be happy to fly on the 767s for years to come, but I think 25-30 years old is more realistic. Among all the types in the current NZ fleet, I like
68 SunriseValley : No. They passed on it when they ordered the 77W's.
69 Mariner : I don't think you are wrong. Despite all the gloom and doom sayers, the world economies have always been cyclical. The economic news out of Australia
70 Gasman : Completely agree. 2-3-2 config, nothing beats it.
71 Koruman : Laxintl, what you don't seem to be aware of is that LAX-LHR is Air New Zealand's prize and highest-yielding route, because it can send AKL-LHR throug
72 Mariner : As you know, it is a mystery to me, too, and the only answer I can find is that wretched ghost of Ansett. Sooner or later, that ghost will have to be
73 Gemuser : Source. please. According to ABC National News last night QLD had a GDP growth of -1.something% last quarter while NSW had a GDP growth of +0.5%. Not
74 Post contains links SunriseValley : I can't see where anyone has referenced the interview with John Palmer . See link below. Nothing new in his comments that I can see. That the Governm
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