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AA Eyes MIA-BSB  
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32171 posts, RR: 72
Posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8503 times:

American Airlines has finally publicly said they are interested in adding service to Brasilia in 2010. Fourteen frequencies new U.S.-Brazil (non-GRU) will become available for July 2010.

http://www.panrotas.com.br/noticia-t...ilia-em-2010_50959.html?pesquisa=1


a.
78 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJDAirCEO From Uruguay, joined Jan 2006, 252 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8402 times:

Good to hear. I hope AA continues to strengthen itself in the one International market it dominates. I know the CNF loads in Y have been very good.

On a side note:
Does any other airline operate the same level of infrastructure in Latin America that AA does? With eight reservations centers, tons of city ticket offices, and the SCL crew base, it is quite an investment.



An MD-80 is great... in first class
User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2887 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 8220 times:



Quoting JDAirCEO (Reply 1):
and the SCL crew base

..and EZE and LIM...


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32171 posts, RR: 72
Reply 3, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 8170 times:



Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 2):
Quoting JDAirCEO (Reply 1):
and the SCL crew base

..and EZE and LIM...

And BOG, for that matter.



a.
User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4373 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 8111 times:

Great, BSB will be good for interlining passngers to regional destinations inside the country. The city is also lacking sufficient service to the US.

AA is definately moving in Brazil, not letting CO and DL catch up.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 5, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 8075 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR



Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 4):
Great, BSB will be good for interlining passngers to regional destinations inside the country. The city is also lacking sufficient service to the US.

AA is definately moving in Brazil, not letting CO and DL catch up.

BSB works fine for the center west and for it's own O&D.

AA for sure is trying to keep its position, but lets wait and see what CO, DL and even US will do next year.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineCrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 698 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 8036 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):



Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
American Airlines
has finally publicly said they are interested in adding service to Brasilia in 2010. Fourteen frequencies new U.S.-Brazil (non-GRU) will become available for July 2010.

You've predicted this before. It's only a matter of time.


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7318 posts, RR: 24
Reply 7, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7943 times:

I wonder when AA will shoot for JFK-GIG.


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineCrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 698 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7930 times:



Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 7):
I wonder when AA will shoot for JFK-GIG.

It was flown last winter seasonally for about 2 months or so.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32171 posts, RR: 72
Reply 9, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7908 times:



Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 7):
I wonder when AA will shoot for JFK-GIG.

Too much capacity in GIG right now. But with UA having retreated and with US likely to retreat (they have an application pending with DOT to switch CLT-GIG to CLT-GRU), maybe they will give it another look.



a.
User currently offlineAwysBSB From Brazil, joined Sep 2005, 561 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7137 times:

UA has taken too long to get interested in IAD-BSB.

[Edited 2009-09-14 07:33:26]

User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2300 posts, RR: 26
Reply 11, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6819 times:



Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 7):
I wonder when AA will shoot for JFK-GIG.

I don't know how well that flight did. I imagine that there is not much room for another player on the route. Seems like not enough business travelers/cargo to warrant the flight.

BSB I think will be a hit. And MIA is the perfect station for it.



"The low fares airline."
User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1104 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 6574 times:

AA needs to act and stop thinking and circling around. DL is in aggressive expansion and possible codesharing deals. AA is still hoping for AA/BA, now JL is thinking about jumping ship. oneworld cannot afford to lose JAL and a partner in the region. AA does not have the capacity to support expansion in Japan markets. AA needs a total makeover staying out of bankruptcy and just lining CEO's pockets is not enough. At this rate, AA will be the next TWA; bad service, old planes, downsizing, bad labor relations, low employee morale, outdated uniforms...a true recipe for disaster.

User currently offlineXkorpyoh From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 819 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 6249 times:



Quoting PRAirbus (Reply 12):
At this rate, AA will be the next TWA; bad service, old planes, downsizing, bad labor relations, low employee morale, outdated uniforms...a true recipe for disaster

 thumbsup  I have been saying that for some years.. they are at least stagnant


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5734 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 9):
Too much capacity in GIG right now. But with UA having retreated and with US likely to retreat (they have an application pending with DOT to switch CLT-GIG to CLT-GRU), maybe they will give it another look.

I disagree. Flights are performing very well and GIG has been the busiest routes out of United States even with additional flights. Plus, the oil booming industry needs space. CO for sure is happy with their first results, JJ just upgraded JFK-GIG to a premium aircraft with First Class.
This could be with AA right now if they decided to run on a year basis JFK-GIG with the 5 frequencies they share between GRU-DFW and GIG-MIA.

Quoting AA767400 (Reply 11):
I don't know how well that flight did. I imagine that there is not much room for another player on the route. Seems like not enough business travelers/cargo to warrant the flight

I flew a few times the JFK-GIG service, always packed, and fares were not cheap. AA does the same as other airlines and charge the same as Sao Paulo, but considering the high demand for IATA winter, DOT reports shows that JFK-GIG, even launched just a few weeks before it's launch, got bigger loads than Sao Paulo service, available for sale 10 months before.
So, in my view performs very well but diluted the yields for Sao Paulo service, so in the end, profit against less profits are not so great.

Quoting AA767400 (Reply 11):
BSB I think will be a hit. And MIA is the perfect station for it.

As UA is not interested, IAD-BSB would be the best route, MIA-BSB become the best option.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 3964 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5655 times:



Quoting PRAirbus (Reply 12):
DL is in aggressive expansion and possible codesharing deals.

At least as it relates to Brazil, DL has been aggressive but not successful. MAO = flop, FOR = flop, REC = flop, GRU-LAX = flop and the code-share with Gol, AA got it, DL did not.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11116 posts, RR: 62
Reply 16, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 5239 times:

Makes a lot of sense.

AA would definitely be successful on MIA-BSB, far more successful than any other U.S. carrier would be from their prospective hub (IAD-BSB would never work, in my opinion).

Hope it happens. Any sense on where else they might be interested in for the next round of new frequencies? I remember hearing FOR mentioned a lot in the recent past.


User currently offlineJeffrey1970 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 1336 posts, RR: 12
Reply 17, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 5231 times:

When does US start their flights to Brazil? If they have already started them does anyone know how good they are doing?


God bless through Jesus, Jeff
User currently offlineThegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2310 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 5169 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 5):
and even US will do next year.

Absolutely nothing I'm skeptical of CLT-GIG....

Quoting Jeffrey1970 (Reply 17):
When does US start their flights to Brazil? If they have already started them does anyone know how good they are doing?

CLT-GIG December 2nd, as for the latter honestly it looks bleak to me



Our Returning Champion
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32171 posts, RR: 72
Reply 19, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 5074 times:



Quoting Jeffrey1970 (Reply 17):
When does US start their flights to Brazil? If they have already started them does anyone know how good they are doing?

Currently set to start December 2nd. However, US has an application with DOT to effectively cancel CLT-GIG and replace it with CLT-GRU as soon as possible. It is part of the Delta slot switch.



a.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 20, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 4832 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR



Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 18):
CLT-GIG December 2nd, as for the latter honestly it looks bleak to me

I'm against half of A.Net, but i believe they will got their space.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32171 posts, RR: 72
Reply 21, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 4654 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 20):
Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 18):
CLT-GIG December 2nd, as for the latter honestly it looks bleak to me

I'm against half of A.Net, but i believe they will got their space.

Whether or not it launches is one thing, but we can't ignore this fact: US Airways has applied to give up CLT-GIG in exchange for CLT-GRU. That's a fact. Maybe they will do CLT-GRU-GIG, but the future of US Airways to GIG is very bleak. In my opinion, in order to gain favour with DOT, US Airways will launch CLT-GIG, but will replace it quickly with CLT-GRU in the spring. While it will be expensive for US Airways to fly to GIG for such a short period, it is necessary to protect their ability to potentially expand in Brazil and keep favour with DOT.



a.
User currently offlineAwysBSB From Brazil, joined Sep 2005, 561 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 4613 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 14):
As UA is not interested, IAD-BSB would be the best route, MIA-BSB become the best option.

In my opinion, instead of MIA-BSB, a daily 763 on ATL-BSB would be a better option.

Quoting Commavia (Reply 16):
IAD-BSB would never work

At least TransBrasil's experience on IAD-BSB was not that successful because its code-share partner (DL) did not have the hub UA currently has in IAD.
Nowadays UA could take advantage of pax traffic between BSB and cities/capitals in North America and in Asia, since most of those pax are loyal to Star Alliance, due to JJ's and TP's services out of BSB.





[Edited 2009-09-14 20:03:04]

User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32171 posts, RR: 72
Reply 23, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 4578 times:



Quoting AwysBSB (Reply 22):

In my opinion, instead of MIA-BSB, a daily 763 on ATL-BSB would be a better option.

And why? When MIA accounts for about half of U.S.-BSB traffic, how is it a better option to overfly half your market?



a.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 24, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days ago) and read 4438 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
Whether or not it launches is one thing, but we can't ignore this fact: US Airways has applied to give up CLT-GIG in exchange for CLT-GRU. That's a fact. Maybe they will do CLT-GRU-GIG, but the future of US Airways to GIG is very bleak. In my opinion, in order to gain favour with DOT, US Airways will launch CLT-GIG, but will replace it quickly with CLT-GRU in the spring. While it will be expensive for US Airways to fly to GIG for such a short period, it is necessary to protect their ability to potentially expand in Brazil and keep favour with DOT.

I don't know what will happen Mark, but in my view, US will keep the service at least for a while. They mentioned that they expect to launch GRU just by 2010 but don't say when. Advance bookings are improving, and for some days the flights are more than 60% booked.
US is not selling Sao Paulo, is not using TAM yet, and the advertisement is still limited.

What i heard from ANAC is that, besides the fact the US have the ability to manage their frequencies, there's still a capacity constrain in place for GRU, and in order to avoid the same procedure to happen with the next draft (i.e. AA apply for GIG frequencies in order to use GIG-MIA current frequencies for example on a ORD-GRU flight), they are trying to see what they can do.

As two side notes, first i heard from AA sources in Brazil that they are looking to ask a daily MIA-BSB service plus 5 weekly JFK-GIG.
Second, from JJ not to begin a new thread, they are looking serious to fly to EWR instead of JFK !



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
25 AwysBSB : As BSB-Florida traffic is significantly seasonal, focusing on the rest BSB-US traffic seems to be more reasonable. Furthermore, ATL is the best optio
26 2travel2know : Without AA in BSB, for Centralamerica, Caribbean, maybe México, MIA and MCO, CM's BSB-PTY happens to be the best option for BSB. If AA is doing well
27 Cubsrule : What western hemisphere markets with significant demand (say, more than 5 PDEW) from BSB are not linked with MIA?
28 2travel2know : HAV ?
29 Cubsrule : I buy that, but it's not linked with ATL either...
30 ElmoTheHobo : Asuncion, Paraguay; Cordoba, Argentina; Cochabamba, Bolivia; Vancouver, British Columbia; Natal, Brazil; Fortaleza, Brazil; Belem, Brazil among many
31 Aacun : I thought Aerosur was flying Cochabamba-Miami already.... Ive seen both the 767 and the 727 at the same time at MIA.
32 LipeGIG : MIA offers good connections, but be in mind that New York, Orlando and Washington, the other three top 4 markets out of BSB, are well connected thru
33 MaverickM11 : DL doesn't stand a chance. Period. It didn't help that there really was no market.[Edited 2009-09-15 10:07:53]
34 AwysBSB : That depends because CM does not serves so many destinations in those regions as DL and AA do. However, total flight duration to main destinations vi
35 Cubsrule : Now we're getting somewhere (no one is flying FOR-ATL-BSB...). But how many passengers combined could those account for? It can't possibly be as many
36 C010T3 : I have info that the US ground staff for GIG has been already hired.
37 MAH4546 : It's not that seasonal to MIA. MIA still account for half the year-round market. IAD-BSB being a large market is one of the biggest myths perpetrated
38 AF086 : I got the same information. Also I heard that US already hired their ground handling agent at GIG.
39 MAH4546 : US Airways needs to prepare everything to launch GIG in December. However, the fact remains: US Airways has applied with DOT to transfer CLT-GIG to C
40 C010T3 : No, US and DL have applied for a contingent swap of frequencies between both carriers. They refer to GIG and GRU as coterminal points from Charlotte.
41 MAH4546 : I can read between the lines and see the obvious, which you aren't doing.
42 C010T3 : You are welcome to read between lines, but do not say that it is a fact. Not everybody in this forum follows this discussion day by day and can triag
43 AwysBSB : US-BSB nonstop route has not been explored for a long time, and speculate that MIA would work as the best hub for that market can be a big mistake.
44 MAH4546 : It is fact that US has applied to transfer their CLT-GIG frequencies to CLT-GRU. That is fact. The CLT-GRU frequencies can be used for CLT-GIG, but i
45 Neo : Certainly not if you take into consideration what is O&D and what is connecting traffic... year-round it shouldn't be more than 20% if that much. I t
46 MAH4546 : It certainly is. Roughly half of year-round O&D between the U.S. and BSB is to Miami. And why is that even hard to believe? Just about every non-GRU/
47 DeltAirlines : Considering that Miami has quite a few appealing options (notably the O&D traffic), is not backtracking by 1200 miles up to Atlanta, and can funnel i
48 LipeGIG : I wouldn't say it's a myth because of the government market, that's plain and very simple. And you believe there's more business traffic from MIA tha
49 Commavia : Yep - absolutely. Miami is the de facto capital of Latin America in many ways, especially when it comes to finance and commerce. You can probably cou
50 MAH4546 : So what? It is less than 20% the size of MIA-BSB. Absolutely.
51 OA412 : Since this all appears to be speculation, does anyone have the actually numbers vis-a-vis IAD-BSB and MIA-BSB. And yes, I realize that neither is cur
52 AA767400 : MIA has more traffic on every level than IAD does from BSB. Just because it is capital to capital, does not make it a winner. Just look at UA's IAD-P
53 LipeGIG : I preffer to wait and see how the market will react to the creation of direct flights from BSB to the United States. Right now the market seems to me
54 Commavia : Agreed. BSB - and, indeed, every non-GRU/GIG market in Brazil - save perhaps SSA and maybe CNF - is simply not large enough, in my opinion, to suppor
55 MAH4546 : I do agree its not big enough for two, but it will undoubtedly become a much, much larger market with the introduction of non-stops to the U.S. becau
56 Neo : Ok, there is not even a single fact here, it's pure speculation.. you say that half of the year-round paxs between BSB and US are going to MIA. That
57 Cubsrule : How is MIA losing its hub power to ATL? The fact that I can connect in ATL if I want to fly EZE-ORD in no way implies that MIA is losing power. You s
58 LipeGIG : I agree with you. The quality of split tickets is very bad in a way to support correct O&D info. That's true and this have been an issue on many disc
59 MAH4546 : It's not. MIA is as strong and well connected a hub to South America today than it has ever been. Plus REC has a very large VFR component. BSB does n
60 MaverickM11 : I think the issue of split ticketing is greatly overstated in such a well connected country like Brazil and especially BSB. It's pretty difficult to
61 LipeGIG : Right. Plus business, as REC is now the 2nd largest state of Brazil in terms of shipyard production and employment, will soon receive a big oil refin
62 ElmoTheHobo : Traffic statistics say otherwise. PTY's growth leads to more competition with MIA, it does not mean by any stretch of the imagination that the hub is
63 2travel2know : For the VFR component, there's GYN to BSB. The number of Goinanos aboard is big, maybe not as big as mineiros, but still quite large.
64 MaverickM11 : There are a ton going to Spain--why is that?
65 SATexan : Not many bureaucrats and government agency officials travel to BSB on a daily basis. Besides in this economy I am sure the Government travel is contr
66 2travel2know : When flying via PTY or LIM passengers don't need to go thru local immigration and customs formalities. That's where PTY or LIM or SJO or SAL win over
67 MAH4546 : "Many more" would rather avoid it, yet MIA still remains the largest transit hub, by a ridiculously huge margin. So there goes that theory.
68 2travel2know : Of course when you compare CM PTY hub to AA MIA hub powerhouse numbers with all those wide bodies and flights from places not served from anywhere in
69 Neo : Exactly, MIA is not attractive as it once was because of the transit Visa requirments, and it facing competition from other strong hubs such as ATL,
70 Rafabozzolla : Sorry but how in the world can you make the point the an airport with annual pax traffic of 4.6M pax is threatening a mammoth that handles 34M pax a
71 2travel2know : If someone is kind to compare how many passengers flying between Southamerica and Caribbean/Centralamerica/México used to connect in MIA when TWOV w
72 Cubsrule : Intra-Latin America? Sure, but there's not a whole lot of service to the States or Canada yet. How many passengers does the transit visa requirement
73 2travel2know : For foreigners it's a hassle to go thru U.S. immigration and customs, regardless if they've visas or are under the Visa waiver programme. Foreigners
74 Cubsrule : Sure, but how often to low-risk foreigners with multi-entry visas misconnect? I would be shocked if that number was not lower than in the general pop
75 Rafabozzolla : That might be true, but running a hub is very different from running a flight. You may have a high yield, low volume route that works, but for a hub
76 Cubsrule : No, but high-volume O&D (who have to clear US immigration regardless) plus high-yield business traffic is generally a recipe for success.
77 MAH4546 : It doesn't effect that many. It's a huge myth that some posters love to talk about, but the facts simply don't support it. It is true that directly a
78 Neo : That's true for most Business Paxs but if we turn into VFR traffic the story changes considerably... afterall, where did all CM pax came from??? Ex-p
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