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WN At LIT, BHM, Etc?  
User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3006 posts, RR: 2
Posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3031 times:

I keep seeing that WN is concentrating on larger, congested, already well-served (by LCC's) markets, and not really looking to the smaller, nearby-to-larger-metros type markets any more, and have heard rumblings that they may even dump some smaller stations like CRP & JAN.

With that in mind, how is WN faring in places like LIT & BHM? Are they happy with those markets?


Finally made it to an airline mecca!
31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMASTYC From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 144 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2805 times:

I've heard that JAN is getting cut by some of their employees, but who knows.

User currently offlineAtrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5692 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2751 times:



Quoting GSPSPOT (Thread starter):
and have heard rumblings that they may even dump some smaller stations like CRP & JAN.

Not happening, I quoted you in another topic and replied to that. Kerlly confirmed our rumors we heard and stated on the airline's website NO CITIES will be dropped from SWA's Map for the time being.

As for drops by JAN and other stations, well if JAN made the Jan/Feb 10th cuts they are safe until spring/summer rolls around then.

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2749 times:



Quoting GSPSPOT (Thread starter):

With that in mind, how is WN faring in places like LIT & BHM? Are they happy with those markets?

I'm guessing BHM does well enough for them to stay. There are folks in the Atlanta area who opt to drive to BHM to fly on WN instead of driving less time to fly out of ATL on DL, FL, or another airline to the same destination. For those that live west of Atlanta, it's a nice alternative to ATL. I'm sure that BHM also attracts passengers that would normally use MGM since flights out of there are on regional affiliates to ATL, MEM, DFW, and CLT. WN flies to 13 cities out of BHM (7 of those being among their top 10 markets.) and is the top carrier at BHM.


User currently offlineLuv08 From United States of America, joined May 2009, 128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 2711 times:

Gary Kelly said that CRP was safe, and BHM seems to do really good and as mentioned before alot of there flights are to top ten cities. I haven't hear any rumors about JAN.

User currently offlineHestaman From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 89 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 2668 times:

How about HRL - that has to be one of (if not THE) smallest WN station... I've always wondered how they manage to keep it open down there...

User currently offlineMASTYC From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 144 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 2668 times:



Quoting Atrude777 (Reply 2):
Not happening, I quoted you in another topic and replied to that. Kerlly confirmed our rumors we heard and stated on the airline's website NO CITIES will be dropped from SWA's Map for the time being.

Cool. I actually NR into JAN quite a bit. It seems to do well especially for a city it's size. I wish they would bring back to DAL-JAN flights.


User currently offlineLrockeagle From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 82 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2597 times:

I'm fueling WN today at LIT. They seem to be doing very well and seem quite happy(mostly..). There's been talk of losing the PHX, LAS, BWI flights when Wright Amendment dies to the level so they can operate them out of DAL, but that's just ramp talk.

User currently offlineATLgaUSA From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 143 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2483 times:

While BHM is not one of SW's larger markets, it is not one of the smaller markets either. BHM is the roughly the same size as SDF, OMA, OKC, MSY, etc.

User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22680 posts, RR: 20
Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2483 times:



Quoting Lrockeagle (Reply 7):
There's been talk of losing the PHX, LAS, BWI flights when Wright Amendment dies to the level so they can operate them out of DAL, but that's just ramp talk.

Why would LIT lose flights so that DAL can have them? PHX, BWI, and LAS aren't slot controlled, and gates aren't an issue at at least PHX and BWI.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3006 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2469 times:



Quoting ATLgaUSA (Reply 8):
While BHM is not one of SW's larger markets, it is not one of the smaller markets either. BHM is the roughly the same size as SDF, OMA, OKC, MSY,

Wouldn't that be stretching it just a bit?

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 3):
There are folks in the Atlanta area who opt to drive to BHM to fly on WN instead of driving less time to fly out of ATL on DL, FL, or another airline to the same destination

Why, when FL is the home-town LCC, and has nonstops to most major destinations? I know BHM drew lots of ATL pax when WN 1st came to town, and before ValuJet/Airtran, but I don't see the reason now.



Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22680 posts, RR: 20
Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2444 times:



Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 10):
Wouldn't that be stretching it just a bit?

We'll take MSA populations as a rough proxy for market sizes...

BHM: 985,000

SDF: 1.09 million (also draws some bleed from CVG)
MSY: 1.16 million
OMA: 788,000
OKC: OKC: 1.19 million

...and some others

ALB: 903,000
PVD: 970,000
TUL: 860,000
RSW: 593,000



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineLexy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2515 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2437 times:



Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 10):
Wouldn't that be stretching it just a bit?

Not really. It is about the same size in a number of ways.



Nashville, Tennessee KBNA
User currently offlineATLgaUSA From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 143 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2438 times:



Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 10):
Wouldn't that be stretching it just a bit?

No, that is not "stretching it just a bit."

The BHM MSA is the 48th largest MSA with a population of 1,117,608, which is almost twice as large as LIT, which has a MSA population of 675,069.

For reference, here is the population and rank of comparable WN MSAs:

SDF 1,244,696
OKC 1,206,142
BDL 1,190,512
BUF 1,124,309
BHM 1,117,608
SLC 1,115,692
RDU 1,088,765
TUS 1,012,018
TUL 916,079
ALB 853,919
ABQ 845,913
OMA 837,925
ELP 742,062
LIT 675,069


User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2405 times:

If any city would be dropped on WN's route map, I'd imagine it'd be BOI. WN has been on a very steady and sure decline here particularly over the last year. We're now down to 15 daily flights, and while that's nothing to gloss over, the fairly rapid decline over the last year makes me wonder where we'll be two or four years from now. I remember reading that BOI has the lowest average load factor of any WN city, and I don't think fares are particularly high here either. Another signal is that in the recent WN expansion in DEN, GEG got a flight and we haven't, despite being similarly sized cities. Lastly, I've also heard around that WN has been slowly losing market share here against QX, though I can't confirm...anyone?

I'd really love to see WN stay, but I just can't shake the feeling that the Canyon Blue won't be seen here in the near future.


User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3006 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2380 times:

I can only speak from having lived in Birmingham for many years (until the mid 90's), and it never felt anywhere close to being the kind of metro that the Louisvilles and Omahas of this world are.


Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineATLgaUSA From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 143 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2375 times:

Well, however BHM "felt" to you, the numbers do not lie. I failed to include MSY's MSA which is 1,134,029.

User currently offlineThegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2310 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2354 times:



Quoting Srbmod (Reply 3):

I'm guessing BHM does well enough for them to stay. There are folks in the Atlanta area who opt to drive to BHM to fly on WN instead of driving less time to fly out of ATL on DL, FL, or another airline to the same destination.

I don't believe you because it makes no sense......who in the right mind....



Our Returning Champion
User currently offlineTSS From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 3065 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2297 times:

Quoting GSPSPOT (Thread starter):
With that in mind, how is WN faring in places like LIT & BHM? Are they happy with those markets?

I can't speak for LIT, but WN is said to carry +/- 35% of the over 3 million passengers flying through BHM each year for the last three years, so I'd guess that's reasonably good.
Source - http://www.flybirmingham.com/statreports/dec2008.pdf

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 15):
I can only speak from having lived in Birmingham for many years (until the mid 90's), and it never felt anywhere close to being the kind of metro that the Louisvilles and Omahas of this world are.

I know exactly what you mean. The "but Birmingham is just a small town!" mentality around here, while pervasive, is technically inaccurate.

[Edited 2009-10-06 20:00:36]


Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
User currently offlineSCCutler From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 5484 posts, RR: 28
Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2269 times:

I had never set foot in Birmingham until two years ago, when I went there to buy a plane. Several trips, DAl-BHM, and the flights were always near-full.


...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9255 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 2009 times:



Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 17):


I don't believe you because it makes no sense......who in the right mind....

Are you joking or? I know alot of people who drive over to BHM to fly WN. Its a 2 hour drive tops from the west side of town and its easy to get to.
BHM-LAS 2 months from today is 124$ one way.
ATL-LAS 2 months from now is 154$. one way. In my truck I can get to BHM on 25 dollars worth of gas. Now IIRC parking is free....gotta pay in Atlanta, you may add a little bit of time to your trip but it can be cheaper(abit only by 10-20$). Plus if you don't like the Atlanta airport then BMH is a nice place to go. (and there are alot of people who just like to fly WN, these people would also go to BHM). Now i'm not saying that alot of people are doing it but WN does get feed from Atlanta. (this is one reason why i have always figured WN would stay out of Atlanta. MCN or CHA would be cheaper, fast for them. (and both will get feed from Atlanta.)



yep.
User currently offlineTSS From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 3065 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1971 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 20):
Now IIRC parking is free....gotta pay in Atlanta

Parking at BHM is now $12 a day, up from $8 a day a year or two ago.  Sad



Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
User currently onlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6515 posts, RR: 51
Reply 22, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1915 times:

I think the problem is many people still have a tendency to look at the size of the city itself and not of the metro area when questioning whether a city is small or large. The city of Birmingham is small-ish (around 230,000), but the metro area is over one million.

User currently offlineLuckyone From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 2161 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1908 times:

Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 17):
I don't believe you because it makes no sense......who in the right mind....



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 20):
west side of town and its easy to get to.

The number is very few, you must move in a small circle, not too surprising considering you're relatively young (that's not a slam). I'm sure you know that MOST of Atlanta does not live on the West side of town, and the vast majority of the money certainly doesn't. I would say a fair guess is that for 75% of the metro area's population actually has to drive past ATL to get to Birmingham. Slightly off topic but I believe over half the population of the metro area would have to drive past Atlanta to get to ANY alternative airport due to ATL's perfect location at the intersecation of the four major interstates. A big reason if you ask me why Atlanta doesn't have a secondary airport, the big reason of course being hometown big brother, Delta. Frankly, after slugging through Atlanta traffic (top five worst in the nation in rush hour), $20 and free parking isn't worth an extra four to five hours on the road to most of us. Something tells me those people buy into the WN koolaid and book with them JUST because they're supposed to be cheaper. If they actually took an extra ten minutes to search...

[Edited 2009-10-07 07:15:21]

User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6572 posts, RR: 24
Reply 24, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1900 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 20):
Now IIRC parking is free....gotta pay in Atlanta,

Parking is not free at BHM...it's $12/day.


25 Lexy : Yeah it's $12 a day, but it's still pretty convenient being right there next to the terminal. It's a nice airport and they are doing things to help i
26 MSYguy : This is something we're acutely aware of in New Orleans, of course, with the oft-quoted post-Katrina population figures (which show big declines in t
27 MSYtristar : You're preaching to the choir. And even so, the city of N.O itself is back to around 350,000 if not more. I'm glad the city has been challenging the
28 GSPSPOT : Sounds like a wash to me...
29 Swissair4ever : having lived in BHM for 3 years up until a few months ago...i can assure everyone that WN does VERY well out of BHM. i know several of the staff there
30 Post contains links Srbmod : There are folks who will ride 2-3+ hours each way on a shuttle van between Augusta and ATL, Chattanooga and ATL, and even between BHM and ATL. They w
31 Lrockeagle : That was the word when the latest Wright ruling came out. I don't keep up with where WN can fly to from DAL, so I took it at face value. The agents h
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