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Brazilian Aviation News # 2  
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 14568 times:
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I've been a lot busy for a lot of reasons and did not bring to the forum some valuable informations concerning to Brazilian Aviation.

Trying to update you all i decided to open the second thread about Brazilian Aviation rather than open several threads !

Lets GO !

1) KL will reduce the frequencies on its current AMS-GRU service to 6x weekly from Daily eff.
October 25, 2009 till March 29, 2010.

2) AC will again upgrade YYZ-GRU during the IATA winter season (probably because they do not need the 77W to some European routes) to the 777-300ER
Period will be from December 1, 2009 till March 27, 2010.

3) JJ will introduce new service ASU-LPB resuming services to La Paz, Bolivia 4x per week.

PZ710 LPB 0130 ASU 0445 - Mon, Wed, Fri, Sun
PZ711 ASU 2345 LPB 0100 - Tu, Thr, Sat, Sun

Aircraft A32A (with Business)

4) As already discussed, 4M will introduce EZE-GIG service, 3x weekly. But they will reduce EZE-GRU service to 6x weekly, from Daily.

5) AR is using less frequencies to both GIG and GRU

EZE-GIG from 21 weekly to 14 weekly
EZE-GRU from 30 weekly to 18 weekly

6) During a good portion of the IATA winter, IB will fly 13x GRU and 7x GIG (less 1 weekly flight to GRU, more 1 weekly flight to GIG)

7) LIM will see further reductions together with the new service to POA:

TA - LIM-GRU from 14x weekly to 10x weekly
LIM-GIG - unchanged 4x weekly
LIM-POA - new service - 3x weekly
LP - LIM-GRU from 10x weekly to Daily (JJ code-shares)
JJ - LIM-GRU unchanged (LP code-shares)

8) Domestic news

NEW ROUTES:

G3 GIG-UDI
G3 GIG-THE
JJ FOR-MAO
JJ POA-SSA
JJ POA-CWB-SSA

So far, that's the news from Brazil.


New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
268 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4007 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 14550 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
8) Domestic news

NEW ROUTES:

G3 GIG-UDI
G3 GIG-THE
JJ FOR-MAO
JJ POA-SSA
JJ POA-CWB-SSA

The last one - POA-CWB-SSA is not new, but there is something interesting about it: FOR-MAO has been plugged onto the same flight number as POA-CWB-SSA-FOR-MAO.

On US carriers Brazil-USA holiday season, it is worth noticing that:

The only airline using extra peak season rights this end of the year is AA - but just two extra frequencies a week.

The only other airline fully using its traffic rights is CO, flying all its three daily fligths.

DL will not use two weekly frequencies of its restricted non-GRU/GIG frequencies at all and will not use any extra peak season frequencies. DL closed REC but is opening BSB.

UA is only using its 21 weekly frequencies over a few weeks during the holiday - 7 frequencies are unused for almost the entire year.


User currently offlineAF086 From France, joined Jan 2007, 1059 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 14523 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
5) AR is using less frequencies to both GIG and GRU

EZE-GIG from 21 weekly to 14 weekly
EZE-GRU from 30 weekly to 18 weekly

I noticed that AR used a larger aircraft to GIG a few days a week (weekends IIRC) that should give a boost in the seat offering in the route.

Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
7) LIM will see further reductions together with the new service to
LIM-GIG - unchanged 4x weekly

When will TA finally increase GIG? Loads are good and Rio, becoming more and more an economical hotspot and there are available Brazil-Peru frequencies.

[Edited 2009-10-09 11:47:02]


Please insert a "smart" joke here.
User currently offlineNeo From Brazil, joined Jan 2001, 672 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 14510 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
G3 GIG-UDI
G3 GIG-THE
JJ FOR-MAO
JJ POA-SSA
JJ POA-CWB-SSA

also.. eff. December

AD SSA-POA
AD VCP-FLN

Rgs,

Neo


User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3694 posts, RR: 19
Reply 4, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 14501 times:

Quoting AF086 (Reply 2):
When will TA finally increase GIG?

There must be a reason why they are starting POA, so it's best if they wait a while, since more GIG service will surely cannibalize POA. Aires' and Aerorepublica's new GRU-BOG flights will also have an effect in the operation.

[Edited 2009-10-09 12:05:23]

User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3694 posts, RR: 19
Reply 5, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 14442 times:

BREAKING: TAM's president, David Barioni, has just resigned!

User currently offlineRobffm2 From Germany, joined Dec 2006, 1117 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 14414 times:



Quoting C010T3 (Reply 5):
BREAKING: TAM's president, David Barioni, has just resigned!

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20091009-712376.html


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 7, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 14362 times:
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Quoting Incitatus (Reply 1):
The last one - POA-CWB-SSA is not new, but there is something interesting about it: FOR-MAO has been plugged onto the same flight number as POA-CWB-SSA-FOR-MAO

You're right. CWB-SSA is a current operation, but seems that is becoming more popular. At least now there's some Northeast-North and South-Northeast. The only missing point now is a more difficult South-North flight.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 1):
The only airline using extra peak season rights this end of the year is AA - but just two extra frequencies a week.

The only other airline fully using its traffic rights is CO, flying all its three daily fligths.

AA is recovering fast due to the strong demand from Brazil. CO is amazing, their three flights are always with very high loads and i believe they have the best yields with business class almost full.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 1):
UA is only using its 21 weekly frequencies over a few weeks during the holiday - 7 frequencies are unused for almost the entire year

UA focus in South America is very limited. I do believe they will allow CO soon to use such 7 weekly flights with EWR-GIG and UA would include their flight code.

Quoting AF086 (Reply 2):
I noticed that AR used a larger aircraft to GIG a few days a week (weekends IIRC) that should give a boost in the seat offering in the route

Correct, with the 73G.

Quoting AF086 (Reply 2):
When will TA finally increase GIG? Loads are good and Rio, becoming more and more an economical hotspot and there are available Brazil-Peru frequencies

Good question, it seems that we shall see also LP flying LIM-GIG soon.

Quoting C010T3 (Reply 5):
BREAKING: TAM's president, David Barioni, has just resigned!

That's interesting news, and their CFO is now a temporary CEO.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4007 posts, RR: 13
Reply 8, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 14150 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 7):
You're right. CWB-SSA is a current operation, but seems that is becoming more popular. At least now there's some Northeast-North and South-Northeast. The only missing point now is a more difficult South-North flight.

Here is some more stuff on the domestic front:

Even though we tend to look mostly at new routes, there is a lot of frequency changes in Brazil's domestic flights. TAM has been adding more flights to the Northeast and South regions from BSB, with CWB, POA and FOR up to 3 x day. They are setting up BSB as a competing connecting point to Azul at CPQ. Azul's presence there also led GOL and TAM to increase service at CPQ adding POA, SSA and REC.

The migration of flights from GIG to SDU is far from over. Once repairs at SDU are over, TAM is going to cut some more shorthauls at GIG, and add a few more at SDU. And now, POA-SDU is into the fold because Azul started it. TAM is going to have 2 x daily. Just a question of time for GOL to announce it too.

The references by Azul on a duopoly in Brazil are silly. The market is indeed very competitive. Azul gets most of the press space, but Trip and Webjet are doing a great job at expanding and improving their schedules, systems and distribution. Ocean Air and Webjet are giving GRU-SDU a try with four services a day each.

GIG-SLZ is new with service by both GOL and TAM.

On International:

BSB-EZE on TAM is no more.

With both MAO-CCS and MAO-BOG disappearing, Copa should be able to get a few more passengers on its MAO-PTY service.

GOL seems to be firm on POA-COR and POA-ROS despite news on them being axed.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32691 posts, RR: 72
Reply 9, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 14146 times:

AA will increase MIA-GIG to 13x weekly in July 2010.


a.
User currently offlineNeo From Brazil, joined Jan 2001, 672 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 14096 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 9):
AA will increase MIA-GIG to 13x weekly in July 2010.

What's new there????

Rgs,

Neo


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 11, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 14089 times:
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Quoting Incitatus (Reply 8):
Even though we tend to look mostly at new routes, there is a lot of frequency changes in Brazil's domestic flights. TAM has been adding more flights to the Northeast and South regions from BSB, with CWB, POA and FOR up to 3 x day. They are setting up BSB as a competing connecting point to Azul at CPQ. Azul's presence there also led GOL and TAM to increase service at CPQ adding POA, SSA and REC.

It seems that TAM is looking to create a 3rd hub bank at BSB.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 8):
The references by Azul on a duopoly in Brazil are silly. The market is indeed very competitive. Azul gets most of the press space, but Trip and Webjet are doing a great job at expanding and improving their schedules, systems and distribution.

Agree 100%, WebJet is growing in many airports while Azul just offer now more services thru CPQ. Nothing new in fact.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 8):
GIG-SLZ is new with service by both GOL and TAM.

And with THE, Rio become the first to offer service to all Northeast capitals in the Southeast. G3 seems to be trying to take advantage on WebJet, OceanAir and TAM having use more SDU than GIG.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 8):
GOL seems to be firm on POA-COR and POA-ROS despite news on them being axed.

As i said when we discussed this, GIG-POA-COR and BSB-POA-ROS are two great routes with good demand and yields. I do not expect G3 to give up on them.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 8):
Copa should be able to get a few more passengers on its MAO-PTY service.

AFAIK, seems that shortly Copa will upgrade this route back to Daily.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 9):
AA will increase MIA-GIG to 13x weekly in July 2010.

And will not be enough. The demand for Brazil-US during the next 12 months will exceed the capacity. We're closer to a situation where fares will begin quickly to move back to very good levels.
Even US is getting very good numbers for January. I believe they will get 84% loads.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently onlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4465 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 14092 times:

GOL has launched service to Aruba.
That service will operate once a week. It would be scheduled as Rio de Janeiro - Sao Paulo - Caracas - Aruba.


G3 7622...........GIG 09:00............GRU 10:00..........Su..........738
G3 7622...........GRU 11:00...........CCS 14:30..........Su..........738
G3 7622...........CCS 15:10...........AUA 16:55..........Su..........738


G3 7623...........AUA 20:20...........CCS 21:05..........Su...........738
G3 7623...........CCS 21:45...........GRU 06:00+1......Su...........738
G3 7623...........GRU 07:00...........GRU 08:00..........Mo..........738




.

Quoting AF086 (Reply 2):
When will TA finally increase GIG?

As far as I'm aware, it depends when the current bilateral agreement between Peru and Brazil would be extended in the future. The opening of TA LIM-POA is undermining the possibility to increase their weekly frequencies to GIG for the time being.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32691 posts, RR: 72
Reply 13, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 14086 times:



Quoting Neo (Reply 10):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 9):
AA will increase MIA-GIG to 13x weekly in July 2010.

What's new there????

An additional two flights a week.



a.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 14, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 14087 times:
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Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 12):
As far as I'm aware, it depends when the current bilateral agreement between Peru and Brazil would be extended in the future. The opening of TA LIM-POA is undermining the possibility to increase their weekly frequencies to GIG for the time being

But AFAIK, when TA got the 4 frequencies to GIG they were additional to the 14 already in use for the Lima-Sao Paulo 2x daily. Now they are using just 10x. I think POA come from this.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 13):
An additional two flights a week

And TAM should announce soon that GIG-MIA will be operated by A332 with First Class.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4007 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13847 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 11):
AFAIK, seems that shortly Copa will upgrade this route back to Daily.

Right now it is at 3 x week off season and 4 x week over holidays. I will be surprised if it changes significantly. MAO does not generate very many passengers to Central America or Colombia/Venezuela and there are not a lot of other travel options - Copa does not have to compete on schedule.


User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 16, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13845 times:

More news:

- Air China will resume GRU from 20 December 2009:

CA907 PEK0100 – 0640MAD0835 – 1620GRU 330 47
CA908 GRU2215 – 1120+1MAD1230+1 – 0715+2PEK 330 47

CA was codesharing GRU-MAD-PEK with TAM but it decided to come back to GRU with its own planes.

Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
1) KL will reduce the frequencies on its current AMS-GRU service to 6x weekly from Daily eff.
October 25, 2009 till March 29, 2010.

Seat supply will remain unchanged because KLM is using the B77W on Fridays and Sundays in GRU with additional +200 weekly seats. Some days KL also uses the B77W on Mondays which means in fact additional capacity.

Interesting to note that AMS remains the Northernmost nonstop link to GRU which makes AMS not so attractive hub for connections. KLM remains focused on the Asian and North American markets because of its natural hub vocation. Nevertheless GRU remains one of KL strong performers hence the use of the B77W. As a side note, KL B77W with SkyTeam colours landed in GRU several times over the last month.

[AF took similar decision, it reduced its daylight CDG-GRU from daily to 5 weekly - total 12 weekly fliggts - but introduced the B77W 3 weekly in the red-eye flight on Sa, Tu and Th leading to unchange capacity]

GRU will see AF/KL B77W 5 weekly: 3 x week with AF colours and 2 x week with KL colours.

Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
2) AC will again upgrade YYZ-GRU during the IATA winter season (probably because they do not need the 77W to some European routes) to the 777-300ER
Period will be from December 1, 2009 till March 27, 2010.

Mainly because of strong performance. In fact AC has plans to introduce the B77W in GRU year around, as per the words of AC Director for Brazil. In the meanwhile, the B77W will increase capacity in 40% during 4 months of the year (December-March). AC is also using the B77W in SCL-EZE.

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 11):
Agree 100%, WebJet is growing in many airports

Webjet is offering excellent connectivity GRU-SDU 4 weekly.

Rgs @ JFK

[Edited 2009-10-13 19:36:38 by hardiwv]

User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 17, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 13801 times:
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Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 16):
Mainly because of strong performance. In fact AC has plans to introduce the B77W in GRU year around.

That's the third or forth year with the same history (before with A343). It's clear to me that they use the 77W because European routes do not perform so well as in the Summer.
I don't see such demand to Sao Paulo to justify the 77W year round, specially now with more alternatives to CNF, GIG, SSA, REC, MAO and FOR (and soon BSB)

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 15):
Right now it is at 3 x week off season and 4 x week over holidays. I will be surprised if it changes significantly

They apply to ANAC for daily flights, lets see if they run them.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 18, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 13750 times:

More news about Brazil -

- El Al will replace the B772 with the B747 during December 2009 because of stronger demand. Load factor of LY in GRU has been very good (77%-86%) therefore the need for bigger capacity plane.

Rgs,

[Edited 2009-10-14 04:54:35 by hardiwv]

User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4007 posts, RR: 13
Reply 19, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 13692 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 16):
More news:

- Air China will resume GRU from 20 December 2009:

Overall the Brazilian market for international travel seems to be on the rebound, especially with the US dollar rated at R$1.72.

Though Air China keeps on trying to make its flight work, there is too much competition from other airlines serving Brazil-China with one-stop, daily service with multiple departure time choices like AF.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 20, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 13690 times:
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TP numbers for 09/2009 - Brazilian Routes

LIS-GRU - 10018 pax - 88%
GRU-LIS - 9980 pax - 89%
GIG-LIS - 9194 pax - 89%
LIS-GIG - 8279 pax - 80%
FOR-LIS - 6194 pax - 86%
SSA-LIS - 6042 pax - 84%
BSB-LIS 5910 pax - 82%
LIS-BSB - 5467 pax - 76%
LIS-FOR - 5301 pax - 77%
REC-LIS - 5293 pax - 74%
LIS-SSA - 5263 pax - 73%
LIS-REC - 4087 pax - 57%
CNF-LIS - 3799 pax - 71%
LIS-CNF - 3434 pax - 65%
NAT-LIS - 2500 pax - 63%
OPO-GIG - 2415 pax - 91%
GIG-OPO - 2170 pax - 82%
LIS-NAT - 2113 pax - 50%
GRU-OPO - 2042 pax - 85%
OPO-GRU - 1976 pax - 83%

OPO with fantastic results, LIS recovering fast to Brazil while only SSA at this point show increased passenger numbers. Good numbers to GIG and GRU were possible with less frequencies (Rio lost 5,000 passengers compared to previous year and Sao Paulo 3,000)



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 21, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 13666 times:



Quoting Incitatus (Reply 19):
Overall the Brazilian market for international travel seems to be on the rebound, especially with the US dollar rated at R$1.72.

Though Air China keeps on trying to make its flight work, there is too much competition from other airlines serving Brazil-China with one-stop, daily service with multiple departure time choices like AF

You are correct, Brazilian market shows signs of recovery and it looks like IATA Winter will be strong.

There are many reasons why CA wants to keep GRU in its network, from long-term market strategy to the fact that in China all Government-issued tickets must give priority to national carrier network and CA will now count on TAM Star membership which is due to be completed in April 2010.

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 20):
TP numbers for 09/2009 - Brazilian Routes

LIS-GRU - 10018 pax - 88%
GRU-LIS - 9980 pax - 89%
GIG-LIS - 9194 pax - 89%
LIS-GIG - 8279 pax - 80%
FOR-LIS - 6194 pax - 86%
SSA-LIS - 6042 pax - 84%
BSB-LIS 5910 pax - 82%
LIS-BSB - 5467 pax - 76%
LIS-FOR - 5301 pax - 77%
REC-LIS - 5293 pax - 74%
LIS-SSA - 5263 pax - 73%
LIS-REC - 4087 pax - 57%
CNF-LIS - 3799 pax - 71%
LIS-CNF - 3434 pax - 65%
NAT-LIS - 2500 pax - 63%
OPO-GIG - 2415 pax - 91%
GIG-OPO - 2170 pax - 82%
LIS-NAT - 2113 pax - 50%
GRU-OPO - 2042 pax - 85%
OPO-GRU - 1976 pax - 83%

OPO with fantastic results, LIS recovering fast to Brazil while only SSA at this point show increased passenger numbers. Good numbers to GIG and GRU were possible with less frequencies (Rio lost 5,000 passengers compared to previous year and Sao Paulo 3,000)

We will see TAP transporting less pax between Brazil and Portugal (as you noted numbers decreased), however yields must be higher due to rescheduling which became effective in September in GRU, GIG and BSB where now flights are red-eye.

Rgs,


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 13620 times:
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Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 21):
You are correct, Brazilian market shows signs of recovery and it looks like IATA Winter will be strong.

I do see some signs of recovery however, the business market continues to show not so strong activity and this might continues till the first months of 2010. The demand is too strong for economy and leisure trips and we will see one of the summers with best results in loads, but i'm not sure about the yields. Mostly airlines are trying to fill their business and First cabins with discounted fares, and it's easy to find a ticket US-Brazil for less than US$ 2,300 on Business.
I believe this summer (IATA winter) will be the upgrade season !



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4007 posts, RR: 13
Reply 23, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 13608 times:

Interesting to notice in the ANAC stats for September Webjet has a larger market share than Azul. Webjet took 18 months to go from one to three 737s but now they are adding airframes and routes at a steady pace.

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 22):
the business market continues to show not so strong activity and this might continues till the first months of 2010. The demand is too strong for economy and leisure trips and we will see one of the summers with best results in loads, but i'm not sure about the yields.

ANAC is saying domestic traffic up 29.93% in September compared to a year ago. The soft business market creates interesting results: Airlines and flights right-sized to be sustainable on leisure traffic do well. Airlines and flights right-sized to business markets struggle. Even with international business travel soft (I was at the Admirals Club in GRU a few weeks ago and I have never seen it so empty) I think travel between Brazil and Florida will do particularly well.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 24, posted (4 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 13569 times:
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Quoting Incitatus (Reply 23):
ANAC is saying domestic traffic up 29.93% in September compared to a year ago. The soft business market creates interesting results: Airlines and flights right-sized to be sustainable on leisure traffic do well. Airlines and flights right-sized to business markets struggl

That's true. I believe that's why airlines are putting bigger equipment looking to offer more Y seats to take care of this demand.
I just don't understand AA. I really believe it could be better to run one pair of 772 on GIG-MIA instead of up to 4 daily flights in the weekends to Sao Paulo. One 763 wouldn't make such a difference.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
25 Incitatus : The bilateral is specific and in its latest version allows Copa to run daily flights to MAO, GIG and CNF. It also allows for other three daily flight
26 C010T3 : What he means is that CM's MAO HOTRAN already allows daily flights.
27 Hardiwv : The soft business environment is true for flights Brazil-US (although Brazil-US tourism increased the number of Brazilians arriving on business in th
28 LipeGIG : Thanks, that's exactly what i meant. But Hardi, many airlines, including TAM says that the business market in all routes is not so stong. Wherever th
29 Hardiwv : Indeed, Lipe, but the situation is better than Brazil-US especially in premium market. As I said, because of connections among other issues. Basicall
30 SJOtoLIR : Proposed schedule: TA 088.........LIM 21:45...........POA 05:45+1.............Mo, We, Fr.......319 TA 089.........POA 07:55.........LIM 09:45........
31 Hardiwv : Some indicators of Brazil-Peru business: - 49% increase in arrivals of Brazilians in LIM in first Semester of 2009; - 70% are from 3 cities in Brazil
32 LipeGIG : Yes, on this you're right, UA and AA offer F but in fact attract now just a very few number of customers. Good for airlines on Europe-Brazil. I have
33 Hardiwv : F cabin has become a problem for many carriers in the current scenario, no doubt. This is why KL currently outperforms AF. IB and TAP are the two air
34 Incitatus : TAM is adding back CNF-REC-CNF so this route will have service by both GOL and TAM.
35 LipeGIG : Not only KL, but all airlines that have a less premium airline. An example is US: the first flights on January (GIG-CLT) are around 90% in terms of l
36 Post contains links Hardiwv : Indeed, but the level of discount is nowhere near the level of Brazil-US fares, and it does not imply availability. For example, a generic search for
37 MAH4546 : F demand is down, but it's far from "very few." AA's F demand to GRU/EZE is far out-performing Europe and Asia right now. It's not hurt anywhere near
38 LipeGIG : I agree in part as this applies to the North America-Brazil market also. There's days where you can find a lot of availability on Discounted Business
39 Incitatus : GOL is about to switch its city code for Viracopos from CPQ to VCP. I expect TAM to follow suit.
40 Incitatus : I am yet to see GIG-UDI, GIG-THE and POA-SSA available anywhere. FOR-MAO was made available for sale briefly but then it was pulled out.
41 LipeGIG : They will be available soon. And GOL is studying CGB-GIG. There's a lot of potential new routes that shall be available during the next year consider
42 LipeGIG : Thanks to Incitatus that advise me, here's the DOT data for 04/2009 that just become available (US-Brazil-US) TAM Highlights - Good signs of recovery
43 LipeGIG : For Korean... (KE) Highlights - There's no comparison with 2008, but their numbers continue to be very bad. - LAX O&D for this flight is terrible and
44 LipeGIG : AA ! Highlights - New services to CNF, SSA and REC are not performing well in terms of passengers. However, AA has been able to manage some cargo. - C
45 Incitatus : TAM's results at MCO are amazing. At least they are filling the seats up. Whether they are making money is a different story...
46 LipeGIG : Something i use to say is that, MCO is A332 route, and it's the last one using C+Y old config. Even GIG-JFK got the updated A332 with new C seats and
47 LipeGIG : CO Highlights - Lost 4th position to UA but shall recover it later this year with the new service to GIG - All routes except IAH-GRU-GIG, lost cargo.
48 LipeGIG : United UA Highlights - Show small increase in passenger numbers. - The highest concentration, with more than 83% of their passengers boarding from Sao
49 Viasa : Does GENSA - General Servicos Aéreos operate flights with the two former Capital Airlines (from Nigeria) Embraer Emb 120? MSN 120119, PR-GSA (ex. 5N-
50 Hardiwv : Some positive international developments in FLN as airlines prepare for the busy Summer holiday: Eff 18/12 FLN 04h50 EZE 06h55 737-800 daily EZE 23h01
51 C010T3 : Perhaps the fact that CPQ is the IATA code for Campinas-Amarais...
52 LipeGIG : Also LA requested ANAC to run a seasonal service SCL-FLN. LA776 SCL 0145 FLN 0500 LA777 FLN 0550 SCL 0920 To begin 16-JAN till 28-FEB, weekends only
53 Incitatus : Using VCP enables Campinas flights to appear under Sao Paulo in some reservation systems. If one searches for SAO-POA, GOL and TAM flights from CGH a
54 C010T3 : That may have been the case in the past, but I haven't seen it for years. Amadeus, for example, does not recognize VCP under the SAO city code. Funny
55 LipeGIG : Hope construction begin soon in Sao Paulo (GRU), Brasilia (BSB), Belo Horizonte (CNF), Porto Alegre (POA), Curitiba (CWB) otherwise we will see more
56 Hardiwv : SAA JNB-GRU upgrade from daily to 11 weekly starting 02 June 2010 is already online for bookings for the World Cup: SA222 JNB1030 – 1600GRU 346 D SA
57 LipeGIG : Agree, but i shall include GIG as the main structure for the World Cup will be between GRU and GIG, and GIG by it self for the Olympics.
58 Post contains links LipeGIG : Interesting information about the origin of passengers from Brazil going to Europe as per Panrotas. Sao Paulo - 35% Rio de Janeiro - 24% Rio Grande do
59 Incitatus : I did not say no investment. Probably SSA needs repairs (and will get them) but at this point its capacity is considered sufficient. Also REC is bran
60 LipeGIG : LA is looking to resume SCL-GIG non-stop service by January also. It would be 3x or 5x weekly service. I believe SSA biggest problem is the lack of sp
61 Hardiwv : SSA and FOR need expansion as during peak hours many flights depart from remote. As mentioned, the situatioin is not critical but shold not be neglec
62 SJOtoLIR : US Airways is adjusting schedules on Charlotte-Rio de Janeiro service on [Monday and Tuesday] departures from Charlotte as follows: US 800............
63 Hardiwv : Brazil pax traffic January-September 2009 Top 30 airports (percentage growth) ------------------------------------------------------------------------
64 Incitatus : Iberia announced a restructure and focus on growth in Latin America. As Iberia serves many secondary destinations already - like Quito or Guatemala Ci
65 AF086 : IB already serves SSA with their code on Iberworld's weekly MAD-SSA flight. Perhaps their MAD-GIG service could be flown redeye both ways once again.
66 Hardiwv : GIG red-eye and opening BSB could be possibilities. SSA is operated by Oberworld codeshared with IB (I saw Iberworld crew at Pestana Bahia hotel last
67 Incitatus : Isn't this a charter flight? I could not get the flight to display on iberia.com or on other many websites. I think it is dead as of November 2009. S
68 AF086 : Used to be but now it's regular: IWD9807 (IBE7935) - MAD 1035 - 1940 SSA - A333 - Tu IWD9808 (IBE7936) - SSA 2205 - 0640 MAD - A333 - Tu Yes but MAD
69 Hardiwv : I meant Argentina. Apparently UX posponed the flight to SSA. Rgs,
70 LipeGIG : I didn't understand the reason for this. But i believe a 9:15 AM arival works better for connections in the United States. First flights and January
71 AF086 : UX will re-start MAD-SSA on December 17th: UX083 - MAD 1620 - 2145 SSA - TuThSa - 332 UX084 - SSA 2345 - 1235 MAD - TuThSa - 332
72 Hardiwv : It was scheduled for July but then posponed for December. TAP also covers quite well Northeast Brazil. The leisure traffic Spain-Northeast Brazil is
73 SJOtoLIR : I have previously read some inputs in this forum announcing the opening of IB secondary stations in South America by means of smaller planes as compa
74 MAH4546 : The A330-200 and the A340-300 are nearly identical, except the latter has four engines.
75 OA412 : It's the A330-300 that's the same size as the A340-300.
76 Rafabozzolla : Don't you think, in case of an expansion to "secondary" LA cities, that Monterrey or Guadalajara in Mexico have far more potential to generate traffi
77 Hardiwv : Could be, but MEX had a drastic drop in traffic numbers to the point that GRU is expected to overtake MEX as the no. 1 airport in Latin America in te
78 Incitatus : Again, I have not seen any evidence that: 1. This flight is still operating, 2. It is a regularly scheduled flight, and 3. IB is still codesharing. U
79 LipeGIG : That was a quick confirmation from LA. Hope it continues and will only be replaced with the expected service to Europe (CDG) with B763.
80 Hardiwv : You are totally correct. Lets hope LA CDG service materialises. I was also expecting SCL-GIG to come online daily and not only 4 x week. Unfortunatel
81 Incitatus : That is an interesting comparison. I regard the economy in Argentina as less air-travel intensive than in other countries. Buenos Aires is simply a t
82 Hardiwv : As you explained very well, secondary destination in MEX already have good air link to US gateways or MEX from which connections are readily availble
83 Rafabozzolla : That's an interesting argument, but remember that both Varig and TAM have attempted COR-GRU as a non-airport-change alternative to the AEP/EZE commut
84 Hardiwv : Both TAM and RG flights into COR would not match their bank network in GRU this is why the flight did not work. In the case of TAM the flight also ma
85 Incitatus : Each one of these airlines at COR has a unique story. First TAM never served COR-GRU nonstop. It served it through either Ciudad del Este or Asuncion
86 Hardiwv : This is the best schedule option. I also agree with you that RG in the past (not during the new RG) made COR word perfectly while it fitted in its do
87 LipeGIG : Today there's zero frequencies available to Argentina and i can't see TAM reducing services to EZE in order to begin COR non stop. Fortaleza agreemen
88 Hardiwv : You are 100% correct, but they could reduce one frequency GRU-EZE and introduce another widebody GRU-EZE. However, they will not do this. And G3 cann
89 Hardiwv : Another positive development in the Chile-Brazil market, TAM will introduce a new seasonal flight MCZ-GRU-SCL from 19/01 until 18/02. Rgs,
90 Camiloa380 : What kind of A/C? I've heard that EL AL will instead of using 777, they will use the 747 for the flight to GRU. CamiloA380
91 Camiloa380 : Pluna will also do MVD-LFN and back, and is thinking of adding Brasilia. CamiloA380
92 Incitatus : Yes I had forgotten about that. With GOL flying 6 frequencies GRU-EZE, I agree, I doubt TAM would be willing to move a frequency to COR and go from 5
93 PZ : It should be more like PZ is introducing this new service instead of JJ I know I know... PZ is JJ
94 Hardiwv : I just realised that TAM upgraded another GRU-EZE frequency to widebody. Now 2 out of its 6 daily GRU-EZE will be operated with A330. It could be a g
95 LipeGIG : First they will upgrade GIG-JFK to Daily. Some rumors says that this will happen by IATA summer 2010 with TAM adding a second plane (A332). O GLOBO y
96 Hardiwv : This would be a very good development as many were waiting for this to happen. TAM already uses the A330 in some flights to JFK replacing the B767. D
97 Hardiwv : Another good development: from 15/11 TAM resumes GRU-JFK double daily, the daylight flight will resume daily operations. Rgs,
98 LipeGIG : In fact all JFK-GIG nowadays are performed with A332 and this is a market requirement as First Class is getting very good loads around 75% (3 out of
99 SJOtoLIR : TAAG Angola will operate a mix of Boeing 747-300COMBI and 777-200ER on the Luanda - Rio de Janeiro service. Boeing 777 will be launched on the followi
100 LipeGIG : Thanks for the news, this confirms what i heard from a high staff TAAG member some months ago. GIG will become soon all 772 destination.
101 Hardiwv : Some more domestic news in Brazil: AZUL announced its next destination after launching NAT, it will be FLN which will receive 3 daily flights VCP-FLN.
102 RICARIZA : Is O6 improving in some way?
103 Robffm2 : Does GIG-EZE also requires premium cabins? Or would a A321 (with 220 Y seats) good enough?
104 Hardiwv : Yes. GIG-EZE operated by TAM offers premium cabins as it is operated with the 2-class A320 2 x day. Premium cabins on the route are also offered by A
105 Incitatus : Wow. It seems the crew will spend a whole day in Cruzeiro do Sul - I wonder if there are even hotels in there.
106 Hardiwv : Why? It seems the aircraft rotation in CZS is only 2h30min which means the crew could remain onboard and crew could change in RBR for example. I thin
107 LipeGIG : Gol is announcing a new GIG-JPA-GIG service effective Dec 01. It's the second daily non-stop flight between Rio and Joao Pessoa. G3 1080 GIG 2348 JPA
108 Hardiwv : Thanks for the interetsing development. This is very smart move by AZ. Connections in MXP have been severely undermined with AZ move to FCO which now
109 LipeGIG : Another interesting development. Seems that TAM is looking to fight with AA for MIA/MCO market: With limited duration (Brazilian summer only) and subj
110 Hardiwv : More of the same. Thats a lot of flights to BPS. I am impressed. Perhaps they are CVC charters? Rgs,
111 LipeGIG : Probably there are negotiations with travel operators, but the flights are regular ones. For example: TAM 3634 GIG 1200 BPS 1335 TAM 3635 BPS 1420 GI
112 Dgehfx : Thank you , LipeGIG for your information. You report that 4M will start service between EZE and GIG. Do you know when this will happen? I have checked
113 LipeGIG : ANAC should approve this flight soon. I expect that LA group got the approval in no later than 10 days.
114 MAH4546 : No surprise there. A few weeks ago Alitalia announced MIA-MXP will resume, but did not give a date. Maybe it will be using the aircraft from this rou
115 LipeGIG : Not in fact, they shall use the A332 to fly MXP routes. The B772 will be used from FCO only. On this i have to say that i agree a lot with you and th
116 MAH4546 : Yup. Just saw it. Does look like MIA-MXP is resuming, but with an A332.
117 Hardiwv : In fact from a pax perspective the A332s are better than the B772s because they have the new lie-flat seats, also fitted on the B767 fleet. Even with
118 WorldTraveler : These numbers are very close to what DL showed for LF on its FOR and REC services; the difference being that AA operated near daily serving both citi
119 Hardiwv : Dont forget AC PEK-MAD-GRU which is also injecting unwanted capacity in MAD-GRU. Rgs,
120 SJOtoLIR : CA Air China into PEK-MAD-GRU. Regards
121 Incitatus : You don't live in this planet do you? How many times do I have to say this - all it takes for DL to leave a small market in Latin America is for AA t
122 LipeGIG : Possibly. All international flights will be packed in January and if there's more 3 daily flights to the United States and another 3 to Europe, they
123 Incitatus : The DoT just release May 2009 traffic data, so let's just add up how many passengers AA and DL transported to/from their non-GIG/GRU destinations in
124 Ike : DL ATL GIG ATL has changed the 767-300ER to 767-400ER
125 LipeGIG : JJ got the approval from ANAC for their seasonal service from Sao Paulo to Miami. It was limited to Dec 16-Jan 15. Gol applied for the rights to a new
126 LipeGIG : Information from DOT regarding 05/2009 In load factor DL ATL-GRU - 83.6% DL ATL-GIG - 81.6% CO IAH-GRU-GIG - 81.4% AA MIA-GIG - 79.3% CO EWR-GRU - 76.
127 SJOtoLIR : Continental is also to assign its Boeing 767-400ER aircraft on the Houston - Rio de Janeiro nonstop route. Regards.
128 C010T3 : That's already the case since August. The post you saw on airlineroute.net was about the next IATA Summer, for which the 762 was still assigned. From
129 LipeGIG : That's a clear indication how the Oil & Gas industry links Houston and Rio de Janeiro. The flight is for sure already a success and it was upgraded e
130 Hardiwv : TAM announced POA-SSA nonstop. This is a major development as South-Northeast links start to develop. Because of strong competition on other markets I
131 Post contains links Robffm2 : I just notices that seatguru now shows TAM. Only the A32x, but hopefully the rest will follow shortly. http://www.seatguru.com/airlines/TAM_Airlines/i
132 Hardiwv : More news about aviation in Brazil - LAN as usual will operate SCL-FLN and now decided to expand its operations in FLN operating COR-FLN andf EZE-FLN:
133 Incitatus : For now those are night flights operated 3 x times week. I think a very big factor in their appearance is Azul attracting TAM traffic through VCP. CW
134 WorldTraveler : didn't forget CA... this hasn't been a terribly successful route either. not just the same planet but the same country as you. I can show you as many
135 Incitatus : Financial performance is not publicly detailed for us discuss. We can only speculate. Are you going to make me scan "The Brasilian" consolidator ads
136 LipeGIG : Both ATL-GIG and ATL-GRU has been performing above average levels but DL has not been so well with other routes like JFK-GRU, LAX-GRU, ATL-MAO and AT
137 Hardiwv : This is true, Lipe, but what LAN is planning this time is also to attract local pax from FLN to Chile and elsewhere in order to keep the loads and de
138 Incitatus : GOL is launching a second frequency on CNF-REC in December and a new market, CNF-FOR. With Webjet service to NAT and Trip service to MCZ, CNF is going
139 LipeGIG : TAM is trying to get an additional GRU-EZE flight with A332 (the 3rd !) They will be using the frequency in the past used by BSB-EZE, which has been c
140 MAH4546 : UA's LatAm operation is a pretty big money loser. Considering that Brazil represents the majority of it, its safe to say UA does not make any money t
141 LipeGIG : Also, as i expected before, TA applied to ANAC for daily flights to Rio de Janeiro: TA142 LIM 2254 GIG 0549 A320 - Daily TA143 GIG 0652 LIM 0937 A320
142 C010T3 : That's great news! I thought they would wait until LIM-POA were consolidated. The LIM-GIG market must be very strong at the moment.
143 Dellatorre : If that was the case why do they keep flying to South America then??
144 Neo : Says who, you..?? I'm sorry but I just don't think it's any safe to conclude UA is loosing big time money to Lat Am, based on that comment. In fact,
145 Hardiwv : This was expected, I mentioned here last week. BSB-EZE never took off. While I think TAM could use a widebody for GIG-EZE at least in December/Januar
146 C010T3 : You mean 24 weekly.
147 LipeGIG : And as per ANAC information, TA is looking to use A321 to POA ! Seems that they saw something that no one never imagined and hit a big " oil field ".
148 SJOtoLIR : Delta Air Lines' 2010 summer weekly-operations in Brazil: .....Route..............09/10 winter..........10 summer...........................Remarks DL
149 LipeGIG : Nothing different from Summer 2009. Summer is for sure more difficult to airlines to offer more services as both Europe and South America demand addi
150 C010T3 : Is DL returning two frequencies?
151 LipeGIG : Good point. I believe AA would love to increase CNF service with them.
152 MAH4546 : Say publicly published statistics which are available by a quick search on A.net. UA loses money to LatAm. Quite a bit, actually.
153 Hardiwv : INFRAERO released traffic January-October 2009 - 1. GRU-São Paulo 17.602.907 ( 2,9% ) 2. CGH-São Paulo 11.134.429 ( -2,8% ) 3. BSB-Brasília 9.967.5
154 Incitatus : It seems Terminal 3 for GRU is finally starting to move with the government publishing rules and time line for contractor bidding. Fingers crossed - i
155 Hardiwv : There are 6 bidders for the tender. I agree that there is a good chance T3 is finalised before the World Cup 2014. It would be a disaster for the gov
156 SJOtoLIR : December 02nd: TACA is beginning [Lima - Porto Alegre] service today ! TA 88.............LIM 22:23..........POA 06:23+1...............Mo, We, Fr TA 89
157 Post contains links OP3000 : Azul CEO David Neeleman is forecasting the airline to grow by 50% in 2010. http://www.nasdaq.com/aspx/stock-mar...lines-2010-passenger-traffic-up-50
158 LipeGIG : LIM-POA 80 pax POA-LIM 56 pax Source: Brazilian forum Contato Radar I believe the 319 will be the default plane for this route.
159 WorldTraveler : There are clear strategic issues involved.... DL obviously looks at Brazil as a unit - they use their strong performance on ATL-GRU and GIG to subsid
160 SJOtoLIR : Aerolineas Argentinas is showing the Boeing 737-700 on selected Brazilian cities as follows: Porto Alegre..................March 10th Rio de Janeiro..
161 PPVRA : Didn't that already pass?
162 SJOtoLIR : BD code is being displayed on TAM [Sao Paulo - Lima] service. Code-share flight number as follows: .........ROUTE.....................BD Code-share...
163 LipeGIG : AR is about to begin EZE-SSA service 2x weekly. Sao Paulo will recover its 4th flight and Rio will got back its 3rd flight.
164 Post contains links OP3000 : From Flightglobal, Gol is to begin installing GPS-based landing systems on its fleet once Brazilian authorities approve the use of such mechanisms, wh
165 Post contains links Incitatus : Ah, it is not splitting hairs at all. What AA and DL are doing in Brazil is very different. Here is an example of how different these two airlines ar
166 MAH4546 : Or, rather, a better use from might be to use them with seven other frequencies they can newly acquire to launch 3w FOR and 7w BSB, reducing CNF to 3
167 LipeGIG : More news: JAL is about to reduce JFK-GRU to 2x weekly during March/April 2010. Mark, don't super estimate BSB over CNF. CNF is a better market, speci
168 Argentina : That is already on GDS, starting March 1st 2010, AR will have two weekly scheduled flights EZE-SSA-EZE, on Thursdays and Sundays, using B737-700. Fli
169 Incitatus : Lan Chile obtained the rights for another 14 weekly frequencies to Brazil. What are they going to do with them?
170 LipeGIG : SCL-GIG-CDG And i believe SCL-POA or FLN Thanks Argentina, that's a very important development on Brazil-Argentina market, the first non-stop regular
171 MAH4546 : I wouldn't hold my breathe on that happening. We've all heard the rumors, but such a route, especially right now, is very unlikely. As if Rio needs a
172 C010T3 : Well, we will have to wait and see. It's not a question of how many airlines fly GIG-CDG, but rather how many GIG-CDG frequencies is a reasonable qua
173 Dellatorre : So far only rumors..........
174 LipeGIG : Mark, i agree 100% with you. Not only FRA, but also MXP or LHR seems to be more interesting from Rio de Janeiro.CDG is already being serviced 3x dail
175 Dellatorre : That doesn't mean it will start SCL-GIG-CDG, since they are currently not using all of their frequencies.
176 SJOtoLIR : LY El Al from Israel has slightly modified its service on the Tel Aviv - Sao Paulo route. Saturday service sees flight number operating as LY109/110 i
177 Hardiwv : More news - >> LX will upgrade ZRH-GRU A340 from 6 weekly to daily from February; >>EK will upgrade DXB-GRU from B777-200LR to B777-300ER daily from S
178 C010T3 : O Globo as well.
179 Incitatus : EK has been advertising GRU-DXB-SYD as an opportunity to fly on the A380. But GRU-DXB and DXB-SYD are each almost as far as the nonstop distance GRU-
180 Hardiwv : Good point. One the other hand flying GRU-SYD with AR or LA involve 2 stops (SCL/EZE and AKL) while GRU-SYD with EK is 1-stop only and daily schedule
181 OP3000 : This is probably for the World Cup only. IMO CDG is the wrong end-point, but strategically they're dying to enter the Brazil market so they may try i
182 Incitatus : Passengers looking for convenience and short travel time would interline at EZE, using JJ 8000 and QF 18, elapsed time 17:40h. The return can have an
183 LipeGIG : AR applìed to Anac last week and updated yesterday the request, for a 2x weekly service EZE-POA-MIA using their A340. Due to restrictions in place, C
184 C010T3 : In fact, Rio is the only city connected nonstop to all Northeastern capitals.
185 Post contains links Hardiwv : Pls refer to - http://envivodesdescl.blogspot.com/2...irlines-con-mas-vuelos-brasil.html The above is a very credible/reliable source regarding Lan.
186 Post contains links Hardiwv : " target=_blank>http://envivodesdescl.blogspot.com/2....html The correct link is - http://envivodesdescl.blogspot.com/2...is-es-el-nuevo-destino-de-l
187 OP3000 : " target=_blank>http://envivodesdescl.blogspot.com/2....html Thanks for posting - interesting. They seem to be set on the idea, but as the article po
188 Hardiwv : Flying via GIG (or even worse GRU) LAN would face fierce competition and sure that AF already captures the nonstop SCL-CDG traffic. I am very sceptic
189 SJOtoLIR : Aerolineas Argentinas from January 03rd launches EZE-SSA as 1x weekly. From March 01st, service doubles to 2x weekly: AR 1910..........EZE 21:00......
190 LipeGIG : That's why to be successful they need to work in order to provide EZE-GIG and LIM-GIG to feed this operation. Thanks, but still, does not make sense
191 OP3000 : Good point, LIM-GIG in particular. EZE-GIG wouldn't help very much except very low-yield, since EZE-CDG has nonstop AF too and plenty of efficient on
192 LipeGIG : EZE is not so well serviced to CDG as it could be and i'm sure convenient 1-stop service can obtain 40-50 PDEW. I agree 100% with you, i just pointed
193 SJOtoLIR : Routes from VARIG’s 1972 Northern summer international network, taken from airlineroute.net: ...............................Route...................
194 MAH4546 : In addition to suspending LAX-GRU for part of the spring, Delta has now eliminated the third weekly frequency (the one flexible frequency) from LAX-GR
195 SJOtoLIR : DL LAX-GRU would be cancelled on Wednesdays and consequently DL GRU-LAX will not be available on Thursdays. It will come into force onward June 04th.
196 C010T3 : Delta's firefly GRU-LAX service is completely absurd. If it goes on like that, it will never even have a chance to consolidate before being called unv
197 LipeGIG : California to Brazil is too complex and divided between AA, DL and UA to be operated by a single player or alliance. Does not surprise me this reduct
198 WorldTraveler : I'm sure DL is trying to get KE to drop their extra frequencies as well..... regardless, DL managed to obtain two extra frequencies to Brazil and desp
199 MAH4546 : Delta's LAX-GRU frequencies are not unrestricted. They must be used on LAX-GRU. And AA controls them, because if Delta requests for them to be used el
200 C010T3 : That's not true. They were used during the entire IATA Winter 2008/09 and now for these three weeks of holiday. I really AA should have them in order
201 LipeGIG : KE is not doing well but up to now, never drop one of the three weekly flights. But whats the advantage of having frequencies without using it ? I ca
202 C010T3 : Such an agreement is not possible, since the other airlines would object to it. AA did everything wrong. They should have gone for it in 2008, not in
203 WorldTraveler : they are assigned to a specific route but they are unrestricted frequencies. There still is no expectation that longterm DL can't make LAX-GRU work;
204 C010T3 : UA operated IAD-GIG for 15 weeks in 2009. AA's problem is at MIA. I was just pointing out the missed opportunity at JFK. There used to have an excuse
205 Dgehfx : > Could someone please tell me when this new service on 4M between EZE and GIG will start? Much obliged. Doug
206 WorldTraveler : I'd like to see the comparison, but I am quite certain that DL is operating its frequencies at far more than 1/3 of its frequencies. And who is telli
207 C010T3 : I'm going to stop you right there. I am not defending AA, nor am I attacking DL. I'm just criticizing DL's strategy for LAX. I really think that ther
208 WorldTraveler : would you care to tell us the basis you have for that assessment. DL hasn't EVER promised that it would operate any route if it was not profitable. T
209 FutureUScapt : The 21 frequencies that became available in 2008 could not be used for flights to GIG.
210 C010T3 : I'm sorry, but which airline applied for LAX-GRU? Which airline is pouring money down the drain by having to invest and reinvest in remarketing a rou
211 FutureUScapt : Oops, I should've read that more closely.
212 MAH4546 : Delta, long term, cannot make LAX-GRU work. Despite the fact that Delta and Korean Air now fly LAX-GRU, American Airlines is: 1) the market-share lead
213 Incitatus : Apparently that was made to turn JFK-GRU into a daily service again. After August 2010, both ATL-MAO and ATL-FOR will be eliminated for low season. D
214 MAH4546 : And now, surprise surprise, the re-start of LAX-GRU has been pushed back another month. This is all so laughable how Delta has failed miserably on AT
215 LipeGIG : It's not impossible. They just need to make a change for any asset in the USA like DL vs US. Agree with you. I doubt any airline has now the ability
216 C010T3 : Well, I'm not sure if these frequencies are negotiable. DL negotiated only the restriction, not the frequencies themselves.
217 MAH4546 : They are not negotiable. Also, DOT has yet to approve the DL-US swap, so that also might not be negotiable. Let's see what DOT says about that.
218 C010T3 : DOT's delay in delivering a response in that case may hinder start of the 2010 US-Brazil proceeding. If the DOT starts it this week like it did last
219 MAH4546 : The carrier selection process is typically initiated by the airline, however, not DOT (that's not a rule - that's just how it normally goes). If AA i
220 C010T3 : Yes, but the DOT stated in a notice issued on July 7th 2008 that: "We will entertain applications for the rights that will become available in 2009 a
221 MAH4546 : That's true, but the window has opened where DOT is likely ready to entertain new applications. An airline can initiate it, and DOT will likely grant
222 C010T3 : Let's hope that the DOT initates it quickly, because unless the airline in question only asks for the start, being the first to reveal its intentions
223 LipeGIG : The process shall begin soon. The fact is that the first airline to apply, and last year was Continental, will take the others to ask DOT about dates.
224 MAH4546 : I don't even think it will be a competition this year. AA will ask for seven, and CO might ask for seven (for EWR-GIG, or maybe it will get creative
225 LipeGIG : AA should try 14x in my opinion. I agree CO will go for EWR-GIG after IAH-GIG success. DL will come with 4x more weekly BSB-ATL and might come with a
226 MAH4546 : Delta will have as many as 9 unused frequencies at one time. They don't need to apply for more, and they will not be granted any more from DOT unless
227 LipeGIG : I agree with this comment 100%. And i would say US and DL bids would come as surprise, but they can't use the frequencies they have available on JFK-
228 SJOtoLIR : DL LAX-GRU 3x weekly is cancelling their operations from March 01st till May 02nd. Service initially resumes from May 03rd, but its frequency will be
229 Incitatus : After August 2010 both MAO and FOR get deleted over low season.
230 MAH4546 : Well, EZE has a higher average fare, stronger premium demand, and is around a 60% larger local market. So not quite sure what you mean by that statem
231 Dellatorre : At this point it is safe to say that DL's alternative experiences in Brazil have been a complete fiasco. Honestly, I don't think we'll be seeing DL r
232 MAH4546 : The list of AA/GOL codeshare routes is now public via their DOT application today. Starting April 1st subject to government approval: From Belo Horizo
233 SJOtoLIR : TAM and 4M LAN Argentina have expanded their code-share agreement as shown: LAN Argentina operated by TAM: Sao Paulo - Brasilia Sao Paulo - Belo Horiz
234 C010T3 : Let me correct two mistakes here: Aracaju Belo Horizonte Brasília Campinas-Viracopos Curitiba Ilhéus Maceió Natal Recife Rio de Janeiro-Galeão S
235 LipeGIG : You're looking to EZE as market, not EZE-JFK as city pair. I'm looking to business ties with New York, and while EZE has a lot more connection with M
236 MAH4546 : What's the difference? Again, EZE-JFK is a much larger local market, with a higher average fare, and more premium demand than JFK-GIG. That's reality
237 LipeGIG : You can compare this way, but believe me, JFK-GIG is underserved, EZE-JFK isn't. We can't compare the markets just with previous years information. T
238 VC10er : Wow! Amazing how much attention Brazil gets on airliners. the TAM has been advertising a lot in NYC especially on taxi tops. I think the ad line is "t
239 LipeGIG : They are very good accordingly to TAM sources, even the Sunday daylight is filling faster and getting 80% to 90%. The past 5 times i flew, business w
240 VC10er : Great news for Rio! In 10 years Rio will be a ver different city. My friends at UA at GIG are being strongly courted by US for the Charlotte flight.
241 LipeGIG : As expected, TAM will be using the B763 soon on GIG-GRU-CCS route. Eff. March 01, 2010 * Times on BSB time JJ8050 GIG 2140 GRU 2255 2355 CCS 0555 B763
242 LipeGIG : Plus TAM is also looking to extend the LHR-GRU B77W flight to GIG. This way they will introduce widebodie connection GRU-GIG / GIG-GRU on peak times (
243 Post contains links FutureUScapt : More good news regarding air travel in Brazil, particularly in this economy: http://www.reuters.com/article/idCNN1315550120100113?rpc=44
244 LipeGIG : And this was based on ANAC numbers for 12/2009: Domestic Market share / Load Factor 1- TAM - 43.06% / 69.64% 2- GOL - 41.96% / 77.13% 3- WebJet - 5.6
245 WorldTraveler : I wouldn't make a whole lot of LF data... Brazil removed fare restrictions on US-Brazil markets - one of the largest - and a LFC set up shop at Campi
246 LipeGIG : Yes, but it's not a comfortable second position. Believe or not, but CO, if they got more 7 frequencies, would put such position in risk considering
247 WorldTraveler : but CO didn't ask for more frequencies... and the same thing could be said about DL if they rec'd 7 additional GIG frequencies... DL still runs the h
248 LipeGIG : Yes, but we know CO could apply for more, and i won't see DL going for more. And yes, DL LF out of GIG is very good, but never become a reason for mo
249 C010T3 : DL could still partner up with G3.
250 LipeGIG : Yes, but the question is when and if they will become partners. Up to that point, DL will become the sole player without a partnership in Brazil.
251 Incitatus : Didn't you just write this: Did you mean to say that we should not make a whole lot of LF data unless it makes DL look good? It would have been more
252 WorldTraveler : considering there are now five US airlines operating nonstop GIG-USA flights plus JJ, a 25% market share is well above average. they very well way...
253 AF086 : TAP announced a new destination in Brazil: VCP. The service will be flown 3x weekly from July. That makes me wonder if a flight to MAO wouldn't be mo
254 LipeGIG : Lets see now with US how the division will be. TAM will lead with AA in second, CO in third (year round they offer B764), DL in fourth just ahead of
255 WorldTraveler : CO has yet to fly the route long enough to know what kind of plane they will use year round. The difference in seats between DL's 763s and 764s is ab
256 LipeGIG : You know that yields to Brazil are so good as Europe in June/July. Up to now, and seems to continue, CO allocates the 764 on IAH-GIG for IATA summer.
257 Airbazar : I posted this question on the other thread but this one seems more appropriate. What are the passengers facilities like at VCP? Can the airport handl
258 C010T3 : Humble is perhaps a good description No, it cannot. Take a look on Google Earth. Just type in "Viracopos" and you will find it.
259 WorldTraveler : historically, yes... but we are in a new fare environment between the US and Brazil... nd CO does very well from EWR-Europe during the summer... give
260 Incitatus : It is not the picture that is slim! The terminal is slim!
261 SJOtoLIR : TACA [Lima - Rio de Janeiro - Lima] goes on daily basis by now: TA 142.............LIM 21:44...............GIG 05:54+1..................Daily TA 143..
262 LipeGIG : In my view no problem to fill Y seats, but the problem is with J/C in my view. IAH-GRU-GIG use to fill more J to GIG. Lets wait and see how airlines
263 SJOtoLIR : TACA is adjusting their twenty frequencies aiming to Brazil as follows: TA LIM-GRU................10x weekly TA LIM-GIG...................7x weekly TA
264 Hardiwv : Some more news, now from AR - - From March 2010 all AR flights to Brazil will be operated with the new B737-700. - From February 2010 added 7 weekly f
265 MAH4546 : In the January 21st issue of Miami Today News it was reported that a new Miami-Brazil route will be announced "very soon."
266 SJOtoLIR : And the interesting part consists on TA keeping the same frequencies on TA LIM-GRU 10x weekly and TA LIM-POA 3x weekly. I should have thought the air
267 Hardiwv : Some partial numbers released by INFRAERO, we could see the final 2009 traffic numbers of major Brazilian airports. Here are the top 20 for the full y
268 Post contains links LipeGIG : This becomes too longe, Please continue the discussion here on # 3: Brazilian Aviation News 3 (by Hardiwv Jan 23 2010 in Civil Aviation)
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