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Southwest Reports 3Q Loss, Rev Falls 7.8 Pct  
User currently offlineHatbutton From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1500 posts, RR: 14
Posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 8441 times:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Southw...s-as-apf-1979370124.html?x=0&.v=13

Some of the interesting parts:

Quote:
Southwest Airlines lost $16 million during the third quarter, and its CEO said there's no sign that business travel is on the verge of picking up.

"There's no reason to believe business travel will return anytime soon to help bail us out," said Gary C. Kelly, Southwest's chairman, president, and CEO.

The airline reported that about 17 percent of its passengers paid the full fare instead of discounted fares, down from 24 percent during the same period last year.

Southwest pinned the quarterly loss on fuel hedges and an early retirement program. Not counting those, it would have made a $23 million profit. Revenue fell 7.8 percent to $2.67 billion.

Traffic rose 4.7 percent for the quarter. Even with more customers, Southwest trimmed unprofitable routes and capacity dropped 5.8 percent for the quarter. It can be hard to cut costs as fast as flying, though, and Southwest's unit costs -- the expense in flying one person one mile -- rose 6.6 percent from a year ago, not counting fuel. Southwest said its unit costs will keep rising as it cuts fourth-quarter capacity by 8 percent.

Looks like it was a few special items that caused the loss rather than the operation.

100 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSPREE34 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 2241 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8358 times:



Quoting Hatbutton (Thread starter):
Looks like it was a few special items that caused the loss rather than the operation.

Yep.

Excluding these one-time items, the airline reported a profit of 3 cents per share.

I wonder what the others carriers will be reporting.



I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6584 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8318 times:



Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 1):
I wonder what the others carriers will be reporting.

Based on analyst estimates:

DL/CO will perform about the same as WN.
US/UA/AA will be worse than WN.
FL/B6/G4 will do better.


User currently offlineN471wn From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1517 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8270 times:
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I agree that all in all this is good for WN and that things are looking up for them. Of interest they are not necessarily going to retire any more aircraft next year though their CFO says they could deal with 10 new 700's they will receive with 10 lease retirements---but they do not have to depending on the traffiic. My read is that they are going to stay ready to pounce where it pays to do so....and they have the fleet to do so....

User currently offlineUa2162 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 495 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 8048 times:

Grab your angry shareholders.

It's on.


User currently offlineDL Widget Head From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2086 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 7845 times:

quote from the article cited:

"Southwest Airlines Co. is the only big U.S. airline that doesn't charge baggage fees, but that's not going to stop it from looking for other add-ons to sell to travelers, its CEO said on Thursday."

Translation: We wish to hell that we didn't box ourselves in with this silly "bags fly free" campaign because now we see that the other airlines are right. We'll just have to charge for everything else under the sun just to save face and possibly make a little money. Hey Kelly, how does that crow taste? Still going to make fun of the other airlines ancillary revenue programs? It's on!


User currently offlineN471wn From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1517 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 7771 times:
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Quoting DL Widget Head (Reply 5):
Translation: We wish to hell that we didn't box ourselves in with this silly "bags fly free" campaign because now we see that the other airlines are right. We'll just have to charge for everything else under the sun just to save face and possibly make a little money. Hey Kelly, how does that crow taste? Still going to make fun of the other airlines ancillary revenue programs? It's on!

I guess you do not read the RPM reports of what the legacy carrriers reported in September versus what SWA reported (up 8.8%) so SWA guessed right and that is that many legacy carrier passengers would walk away due to these ridiculous "we care not about you" fees and go to SWA and guess what they were right and the RPM numbers show it.......nice try at trying to spin this but the facts do not support you.


User currently offlineThegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2310 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 7720 times:

Can they stop this preserving our culture thing and lower overheads....


Our Returning Champion
User currently offlineMcdu From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1448 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 7721 times:



Quoting N471wn (Reply 6):
SWA guessed right and that is that many legacy carrier passengers would walk away due to these ridiculous "we care not about you" fees and go to SWA and guess what they were right and the RPM numbers show it.......nice try at trying to spin this but the facts do not support you.

Of course WN charges fees to stand in line. Grab your Hypocrisy, It's on.


User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8412 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 7683 times:



Quoting DL Widget Head (Reply 5):

Translation: We wish to hell that we didn't box ourselves in with this silly "bags fly free" campaign because now we see that the other airlines are right. We'll just have to charge for everything else under the sun just to save face and possibly make a little money. Hey Kelly, how does that crow taste? Still going to make fun of the other airlines ancillary revenue programs? It's on!

Your translation seems to have a point of view that bag fees are good. WN's main problem is they have too many jets flying marginal routes. They benefit greatly from the "different" identity they have. WN is doing fine. Bag fees are not going to help them. It's not part of the WN personality to charge for bags.

The real translation was, we believe we can add new _improvements_ to the WN experience that will generate revenue.


User currently offlineAviatortj From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1838 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 7512 times:



Quoting DL Widget Head (Reply 5):
quote from the article cited:

"Southwest Airlines Co. is the only big U.S. airline that doesn't charge baggage fees, but that's not going to stop it from looking for other add-ons to sell to travelers, its CEO said on Thursday."

Translation: We wish to hell that we didn't box ourselves in with this silly "bags fly free" campaign because now we see that the other airlines are right. We'll just have to charge for everything else under the sun just to save face and possibly make a little money. Hey Kelly, how does that crow taste? Still going to make fun of the other airlines ancillary revenue programs? It's on!

Look how well Delta is doing with their bag fees. They're so profitable because of all their fees. I know all my friends line up to jump on Delta just to give them money.

Quoting Mcdu (Reply 8):
Of course WN charges fees to stand in line. Grab your Hypocrisy, It's on.

Really? Which fee is that? I thought their checkin service brought you to the front of the line if you wanted to.


User currently offlinePITops From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1442 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 7448 times:



Quoting Aviatortj (Reply 10):
Really? Which fee is that? I thought their checkin service brought you to the front of the line if you wanted to.

There is no line to stand in. The early bird check in is doing really well. Most of that should show on the 4Q results.



Ground Ops, Southwest Airlines, CMH
User currently offlineUal777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1546 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 7428 times:



Quoting Mcdu (Reply 8):


Of course WN charges fees to stand in line. Grab your Hypocrisy, It's on.

LOL thats awesome!

The WN cheerleaders are coming out of the woodwork. Lets see how the others do first....



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlineGentFromAlaska From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3056 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7259 times:

Here is GK 3Q interview with Fox Business this morning (Thursday) http://video.foxbusiness.com/#/10686...d75741dd8d848434d8fc081ad9df23585a

GK talks about capacity, fuel hedges and potential new city expansion in 2010.



Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4567 posts, RR: 23
Reply 14, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7224 times:



Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 1):
Excluding these one-time items, the airline reported a profit of 3 cents per share.

And excluding those pesky one time items, LUV would have shown several more losses in the past - but the hedging bailed them out. Now its costing them.


User currently offlineByrdluvs747 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2351 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7189 times:



Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 14):
And excluding those pesky one time items, LUV would have shown several more losses in the past - but the hedging bailed them out.

Funny how LUV'ers forgot all about that.



The 747: The hands who designed it were guided by god.
User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3803 posts, RR: 29
Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 7126 times:



Quoting Flighty (Reply 9):
The real translation was, we believe we can add new improvements to the WN experience that will generate revenue

Which gets at the point that every ancillary revenue opportunity introduced by WN has been a value-added feature to enhance one's travel experience in tangible ways at reasonable cost if one so chooses, while services essential to pax in general continue to be included in the fare paid...

...as opposed to the checked baggage fees of the legacies and copycat LCCs which are rightly perceived as a "got ya!" money-grubbing $hakedown.


User currently offlineKingCavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1302 posts, RR: 17
Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 7112 times:



Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 16):
Which gets at the point that every ancillary revenue opportunity introduced by WN has been a value-added feature to enhance one's travel experience in tangible ways at reasonable cost if one so chooses, while services essential to pax in general continue to be included in the fare paid...

What happened to the "No Fees Zone?"

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 16):
as opposed to the checked baggage fees of the legacies and copycat LCCs which are rightly perceived as a "got ya!" money-grubbing $hakedown.

Does WN have the copyright to Low Cost Carrier? So, because WN was the 1st no other airline can come forward now? Who are the copycats? There is no LCC in the U.S. that copies WN's business plan. FL and F9 are both close to WN's cost structure, and I don't think they resemble WN at all.



Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineFloorrunner From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 259 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 7025 times:



Quoting Byrdluvs747 (Reply 15):
Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 14):
And excluding those pesky one time items, LUV would have shown several more losses in the past - but the hedging bailed them out.

Funny how LUV'ers forgot all about that.

It is funny how everyone always brings this up. If Southwest did not have their hedges, does anyone in their right mind think that they would have been charging the same fares and not higher fares? My common sense tells me they probably would have charged higher fares. Everyone forgets that all the other airlines could have done the same thing too but many did not. Southwest took advantage of an income opportunity so that they could continue to charge lower fares.


User currently offlineMaverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 5570 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 6812 times:



Quoting Ual777 (Reply 12):

The WN cheerleaders are coming out of the woodwork.

As are other airline cheerleaders, and "anyone but WN", check out some of the handles (including yours):

Quoting Ua2162 (Reply 4):
Grab your angry shareholders.

It's on.



Quoting DL Widget Head (Reply 5):
Hey Kelly, how does that crow taste? Still going to make fun of the other airlines ancillary revenue programs? It's on!



Quoting Mcdu (Reply 8):
Grab your Hypocrisy, It's on.



Quoting Byrdluvs747 (Reply 15):

Funny how LUV'ers forgot all about that.

In case you haven't heard, we're in the middle of some crappy economic times. All the major carriers are doing poorly. There's no need to get all emo about it.



"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
User currently offlineLuv2cattlecall From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1650 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 6726 times:
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Quoting DL Widget Head (Reply 5):
Translation: We wish to hell that we didn't box ourselves in with this silly "bags fly free" campaign because now we see that the other airlines are right. We'll just have to charge for everything else under the sun just to save face and possibly make a little money. Hey Kelly, how does that crow taste? Still going to make fun of the other airlines ancillary revenue programs? It's on!

Yes, an attitude that is clearly reflected in their recent HUGE ad-buys promoting no bag fees during SNL, late night TV shows, Primetime shows, sporting events, etc..

Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 7):
Can they stop this preserving our culture thing and lower overheads....

I'm not sure I follow what you're trying to say?

Quoting Mcdu (Reply 8):
Of course WN charges fees to stand in line. Grab your Hypocrisy, It's on.

And US Airways charges a $5 fee to pay another fee.... G4 charges a fee just to book a ticket online, and most carriers charge $15+ for a 5 minute phone call to book a ticket over the phone (didn't realize res agents cost $180/hr..). What's that? Jessica's stuck in a well and you'll miss your flight? That'll be a $150 change fee. And you'd like to use your own frequent flier miles to book another flight? Sure, for a fee of $150, the other guys will be happy to let you use your own miles (if you can find an empty seat, of course).

I guess I'd rather patronize a company that's upfront and honest, and has a CEO who tells shareholders bad news instead of buttering it up vs. one who spends his evenings getting DUIs.

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 16):

Which gets at the point that every ancillary revenue opportunity introduced by WN has been a value-added feature to enhance one's travel experience in tangible ways at reasonable cost if one so chooses, while services essential to pax in general continue to be included in the fare paid...

Exactly. This is a service that wasn't offered before, just like P.A.W.S... the only "fee" that they previously didn't charge for is the $25 for kids, which is still $75 cheaper each way vs. what the other guys charge, and it's not really a service many travelers use.



When you have to breaststroke to your connecting flight...it's a crash!
User currently offlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13517 posts, RR: 62
Reply 21, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 6648 times:
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Quoting Flighty (Reply 9):
WN is doing fine.

Is that so?

Signed,
LUV Shareholders

Quoting Flighty (Reply 9):
Bag fees are not going to help them

If around $300-400M per year in extra revenue won't "help," then I'm not sure what will.

AS is projecting around $70M/year minimum from their first bag fees alone - profit that would ordinarily require an additional $1 BILLION in annual ticket revenue to generate if it were obtained solely from normal flight operations.

I don't see WN adding enough RPMs in this weak-demand, low-yield environment to generate anywhere near that kind of profit. Or does WN have some other magic trick up their sleeves that we don't know about yet which they feel will generate a few hundred million in new revenue?

Fact is, every carrier that has implemented first bag fees hasn't seen enough book-away as a result to justify NOT charging a fee. WN is needlessly leaving piles and piles of cash on the table and it's only a matter of time until they implement first bag fees, or the shareholders demand the BOD direct the company to do so.

Quoting Luv2cattlecall (Reply 20):
an attitude that is clearly reflected in their recent HUGE ad-buys

They were already committed to this shortsighted ad campaign, and these ad buys were likely planned a year ago as part of the annual budget.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineMaverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 5570 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 6559 times:



Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 21):

Is that so?

Signed,
LUV Shareholders

Yes, it is so. WN is faring better financially than any major network carrier. Charging for bags isn't the only way to generate additional revenue, ya know. And it seems any other idea they come up with just lowers your opinion of them anyways.

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 21):
Fact is, every carrier that has implemented first bag fees hasn't seen enough book-away as a result to justify NOT charging a fee.

Because every carrier outside of WN is charging for bags... not too many places to go.

Quoting Mcdu (Reply 8):
Of course WN charges fees to stand in line.

And I love it how when Southwest does implement a fee, you guys bash them for that also. Be honest. You'd love to see them go under.



"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
User currently offlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13517 posts, RR: 62
Reply 23, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 6515 times:
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Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 22):
Is that so?

Signed,
LUV Shareholders

Yes, it is so. WN is faring better financially than any major network carrier.

 redflag 

Not from a stockholder's point of view they're not. LUV's shareholders have been getting increasingly upset over the past 10 years, as the stock has not gone anywhere.

And if you want to talk about liquidity as a percentage of total revenue, WN is second to AS in that regard.

Trust me, it's not if, but WHEN WN moves to a first bag fee. They're simply leaving too much money on the table otherwise.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 22):
Charging for bags isn't the only way to generate additional revenue, ya know.

True, but it's the easiest and the one the customers are least likely to moan about since everyone else is charging them as well. Besides, the only other revenue-generating levers WN has available (aside from ancillary) are:

- increasing fares
- adding RPMs

And neither of them will work in the current low-demand, low-yield environment, particularly because WN's customer base tends to be more price-conscious.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 22):
And it seems any other idea they come up with just lowers your opinion of them anyways.

When have I said I had a low opinion of WN? I don't think they're making a smart decision to hitch their wagon to the "No first bag fee" wagon, but you can tell they're at least thinking about coming around to some degree - at first it was "no HIDDEN fees" but now they're taking the time and energy to promote that it's only about bags - other items are suddenly fair game.

Again, look for WN to implement a first checked bag fee within 18 months.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineSPREE34 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 2241 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6479 times:



Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 23):
LUV's shareholders have been getting increasingly upset over the past 10 years, as the stock has not gone anywhere.

 redflag  Really? Then why do they continue to hold the stock?



I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
25 FlyingAY : And the stockholders of the legacies have not been getting upset? I just looked the 10 year graphs for LUV, DAL, AMR and CAL - it seemed that you los
26 Pfletch1228 : WN are going to have to review their "Baggage Policy". Their strategy is fundamentally flawed. If you unpack it a bit, to excuse the pun, you will see
27 EA CO AS : You'd have to ask them about that, although many of these upset stockholders are also employees who had been seeing great earnings at one point via t
28 UALWN : You mean as opposed to all other airline stocks, which have all been going somewhere, i.e. down? So you are saying that what is really good for a com
29 Par13del : So why did the other airlines or the govt. bail them out by giving them the fuel hedges? I was always under the impression that WN had purchased thei
30 Flyguy89 : I think a lot of people are missing the bigger picture here. The fact that WN does NOT charge bag fees and is posting better financial results than th
31 FlyPNS1 : Only problem is that WN's results are probably the worst of all LCC's and not really any better than CO or DL (based on analyst estimates). If WN is
32 Flyguy89 : I'm not saying that and never did say that, I was merely trying to make a point that charging for bags is not a remedy to financial woes but simply a
33 MAH4546 : The extra revenue that Southwest might be getting from customers deflecting from other airlines because of baggage fees - most of these customers bein
34 Lexy : I think this is a rather good point. I doubt the money being "made" by WN on these types of flyers is enough to cancel out a baggage fee revenue loss
35 FlyPNS1 : And no airline has said that bag fees alone would fix their bottom line. Frankly, I've found WN's results to be a bit disappointing. For an LCC like
36 Flyguy89 : no, but some of their more vocal supporters on here are apparently of that opinion.
37 BN727flyr : Correct. Let me add to that thought since no one has mentioned this key point yet: Charging baggage fees are a fine revenue stream, from an accountin
38 Par13del : Now you done it, expect to see responses like if WN had seating assignments rather than cattle call this would not be an issue, other airlines turn i
39 FATFlyer : But I know a few frequent fliers who got a little nervous yesterday and this morning. Gary Kelly in the conference call indicated that Rapid Rewards w
40 Mcdu : It is not the fees that they implement it is the hypocrisy that they try to create them under. As for WN going under....I don't care one way or the o
41 Cubsrule : Can you cite some evidence to support this proposition? In my experience, since the implementation of checked bag fees, the amount of garbage carried
42 Hatbutton : I have one problem with this argument...the implementation of baggage fees has not somehow magically changed the carry on limits or policies. These p
43 Lightsaber : Nitpick, since airlines do not say "we would have lost money if we didn't have a special charge a year (or two) ago... I tend to 'peanut butter' thes
44 PHLBOS : While you certainly have the right to make such a prediction, there's a couple of things you need to know: 1. In addition to NOT charging a fee for t
45 Mariner : I think the baggage fee issue is clouding what happened, which is that given the appalling airline times Southwest did pretty good for the quarter. Th
46 MaverickM11 : ...is dead. Has been for years. Is it even a cattle call at this point? It's been segmented 99 ways to Sunday with Early bird and Business select as
47 ExFATboy : Hoo, boy, always fun on A.net when WN releases earnings! I think the "bag-fee revenue" argument here is clouding a lot of other factors that explain t
48 LUV08 : And who do you work for?
49 Atlwest1 : Oh Puhlease if WN was already here they wouldnt be a big enough force here to cause FL to not to DARE top dop anything. Sorry to let you know but eve
50 ThegreatRDU : Another ignorant comment....are you clueless to what the other airlines made off their baggage fees? As stated before, more money and lighter plane=l
51 Aviatortj : Put down the peace pipe and show us where bag fees = profits. You have no back up showing that bag fees = less fuel, less money, less anything. I say
52 Lightsaber : So true! They lead off and it becomes a cat fight. Funny how things change after everyone has reported... I'm going to bookmark this thread and see h
53 Aaron747 : The way people talk in some of these threads you'd think WN was the national carrier of Iran. I just don't get it after all these years - what have th
54 ADent : What airlines have you been flying? I spent over 45 minutes sitting on a US A320 waiting for all the bags to be stowed last December. A thousand anno
55 Hatbutton : Well in my experience there were already a high number of carry ons taken on the plane before bag fees and I haven't really noticed a difference in f
56 N1120A : Actually, they wouldn't have actually lost money. They would have made less, however. They weren't the first.
57 Threewests : I read alot of speculation that bags fees equals less bags and less bags equals less fuel burn - but, I think just the opposite. Bag fees excuse heavi
58 Flyguy89 : ...and yet those amazing orgasmic bag fees still haven't seemed to stem the billions lossed among those network carriers or helped their multi-billio
59 GentFromAlaska : It is not always what they do wrong, rather what they do right. If you can' beat them badmouth them. At the end of the day WN is just another thing w
60 MaverickM11 : They're barely the gorilla in markets they do serve. NW and CO have effectively all but kicked them out of their Midwest hubs, they've got their ass
61 N1120A : Well, WN was flying pre-deregulation. Is that really true? I don't see it.
62 UAL747DEN : Can you share with us where you got your information? I want to make sure everyone knows not to use that source because it is worthless. Right now ba
63 EA CO AS : Source, please? Otherwise it's just conjecture on your part.
64 IgneousRocks : IMHO, baggage fees are like a finger in a porous dike. You plug one hole and another one lets loose. They 'condone' fundamental flaws in the operatin
65 Flyguy89 : The ailing financial numbers of the legacies are out there for everyone to see and it doesn't take a genius to see that these bag fees are not giving
66 UALWN : Pre-deregulation hangover? But regulation ended 30 years ago! How long the hangover (and the excuse) is supposed to last??
67 MaverickM11 : They only flew intrastate and were not covered by it. Their first interstate route was started after deregulation, which lead to the Wright Amendment
68 UAL747DEN : You can make whatever point you would like but if its wrong I'm going to tell you and its wrong! We have never claimed that baggage fees were the end
69 LoneStarMike : But the LCC's also allow their customers to pick only the services they need (like checking one or more bags, or changing a reservation, or needing t
70 Post contains images Maverick623 : How are they not? They play by the same rules as everyone else. Their fuel hedges aren't what they used to be, so you can't use that excuse anymore.
71 DLflynhayn : Like i said before they only load like 25-35bags on a full flight anyway.So charging for bags wouldn't be so profitable for SWA!
72 DLflynhayn : Are you jokeing?
73 FlyPNS1 : I guess you don't consider double digit profit margins to be strong, but that's your definition. With costs that are 20-30% lower than most legacies,
74 Lightsaber : It would probably cost the same to set up the fee system as it would generate in revenue. First, very interesting post. This is why I think baggage f
75 Post contains links GentFromAlaska : I can only assume you misunderstood my post. A simple search of the BTS Bureau of Transportation Statistics URL clearly documents LCC are carrying mo
76 EA CO AS : Perhaps I did misunderstand - were you trying to somehow equate customers leaving leagacies with global recognition based on fear from terrorists? FW
77 Hatbutton : At AS, the payback on bag fees was 18 hours. So setting up the fee system was a drop in the bucket compared to how much money it is bringing in. And
78 ThegreatRDU : Shows how much you know let me put down my "peace pipe" and teach you a lesson, do you now what ancillary revenue is? What a bottom line is? What I s
79 AirNZ : However, aren't you greatly contradicting yourself? On one hand you state the carry-on rules should be enforced....quite correctly indeed!....but yet
80 Cubsrule : I'm not sure that's accurate. Let's say everyone carries on two items, one that will fit under the seat and a 22 x 14 x 9 roller bag. Each of those r
81 Lightsaber : Including the extra check in time for processing the fee? I find 18 hours tough to believe on the full costs added for charging bag fees. I do not do
82 MaverickM11 : I think you're confusing IFE with bag fees . It's hard to claim that IFE is revenue positive, but bag fees have been without a doubt.
83 Hatbutton : No I meant to say that I don't see how there could be 10 gate checked bags on a flight only 2/3 full like one poster mentioned. If they were excess c
84 GentFromAlaska : Yes, in the U.S. only. The definition of a global carrier used in the study was defined as one who crosses either pond on the left or right coast, fo
85 Cubsrule : Under what seats can a 22 inch roller bag fit?
86 Fxramper : I'm not surprised, they miss all the FX non-rev fees.
87 Hatbutton : Non reving I've had to do it plenty of times. At my height it is uncomfortable but doable.
88 MaverickM11 : I think my seatmate did once on a WN 735. Of course that meant he had to sit spread eagle with his leg in my area .
89 Cubsrule : But is it legal? A 22 inch bag is not going to fit completely under a seat at 32 inch pitch.
90 Hatbutton : I don't know. It sticks out a little bit but I've never had any FA in all the flights I've ever been on say anything about it. If you're in the exit
91 Maverick623 : Again, it's because the airlines have padded block times and increased minimum turn times. I can assure you not only did that specific incident happe
92 Hatbutton : We haven't done that. If you can show me that we have then great. But we haven't. You're just making assumptions that suddenly every airline padded s
93 Tugger : I am trying to figure the calculation, but there is no easy way. But for the sake of argument and as a place to start: 25 bag @ $25/bag X 1,000 flts/
94 Maverick623 : You're not getting it. On time performance is based on flight and turn time goals. I can assure you that both have increased. There was a thread abou
95 Hatbutton : AS is saying for our size operation we can reasonably expect $70 million more per year. Yeah they'll charge the same fee. I can see your point that i
96 Flyguy89 : I know they're only part of the equation and so on, and I respect that bag fees are part of an airlines business strategy, but I do take issue with p
97 Post contains links Lightsaber : I thought it would be interesting to see what is expected of other airlines: http://blog.taragana.com/n/airlines-...quarter-earnings-forecasts-190804/
98 EA CO AS : Not to nit-pick, but that's someone's thesis - not an official university-sanctioned published study. I'd have a hard time lending weight to this, pa
99 GentFromAlaska : It very well could have been 50, 500 or 5000, I dunno. I can only guess groups of ten were more manageable. When all the numbers were crunched the me
100 EA CO AS : Do you really see someone surveying 5000 people in a random street sampling for their thesis? REALLY?
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