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DL BOD To Vote On Major Upgrades To 747-400 Fleet  
User currently offlineDL747400 From United States of America, joined Sep 2008, 318 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 21027 times:

According to a recent online chat session with DL President Ed Bastian, a presentation will be made to the DL BOD seeking approval to upgrade Business Elite cabins of the 747-400 fleet from WBC to a full lie-flat BE product. Another piece of the proposal would be to install VOD IFE throughout the a/c. He noted that he has been flying the aircraft a lot in the last few months (going back and forth to NRT as part of the ongoing JAL negotiations, no doubt) and he says these aircraft are in deperate need of refurbishment.

This should be good news for those folks who want the 744s to remain part of the DL fleet for the foreseeable future. And having VOD nose to tail will surely make these aircraft much more pleasant for the long-haul INTL traveler.

122 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9286 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 20910 times:



Quoting DL747400 (Thread starter):

I believe the Y seats on the 744 will be to short for PTVs so I bet they go with new seats like they did on the 763s.(and will likely do on the 763ERs)



yep.
User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6431 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 20904 times:

Good to hear that is being considered. Hopefully the DL BOD votes on it.

I'm guessing the new flat-bed BE product will be the Contour Solar Suites like on the 772LR fleet, although I cannot say for sure.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17322 posts, RR: 46
Reply 3, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 20800 times:

Seems like something you'd want to vote on after you know the outcome of the JL deal.


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9286 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 20750 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):

uh why? Even if they dehub NRT it will still see 744 flights (look at UA...)



yep.
User currently offlineIloveboeing From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 794 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 20444 times:



Quoting DL747400 (Thread starter):
he says these aircraft are in deperate need of refurbishment.

Finally, DL management states the obvious! LOL

Anyway, this is great to hear! At least DL (along with CO) is realizing that you need to offer great service in all classes in order to be a successful airline. It is (probably) cheaper to upgrade the 744s, rather than buy 748s or A380s.

I hope they do this. A fully upgraded and modernized 744 that offers great service in all classes by DL will be difficult to beat. This will hopefully give UA the kick in the rear that they deserve and prompt them to upgrade Y class (no, overhead LCDs and new seat covers doesn't count) and make further modifications to their 744s, as a competitive response.

GO, DL, GO!!


User currently offline777STL From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3545 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 20402 times:

That's great to hear. Nice to see DL committing to the 744s for a while longer.


PHX based
User currently offlineRIX From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1787 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 20214 times:



Quoting 777STL (Reply 6):
Nice to see DL committing to the 744s for a while longer.

- that is, keeping VLA in post-merger route structure. That is, a good chance for eventual VLA fleet upgrade rather than retirement.


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 20161 times:

Given that DL already has routes on both the Atlantic and Pacific which can justify a 744, yes, it makes sense to keep them a while longer....

DL's financial priorities are turning towards finding a solution to the JFK terminal situation. replacing the 744 fleet will cost about the same as what needs to be spent on a fleet of 12-16 77Ws. I'd rather have the new JFK terminal at this point....


User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3186 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 20155 times:

While I could personally never say a negative word about the 747-400 as it's my hero widebody, I will concede that they *really* need a cabin overhaul  Silly

Hopefully they go through with it. With nose-to-tail AVOD and lie-flat business class, the 747-400 could be quite the asset for DL. LAX-SYD, ATL-GRU, and others that see *huge* seasonal capacity demands would be perfect for it.



A340-500: 4 engines 4 long haul. 777-200LR: 2 engines 4 longer haul
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17322 posts, RR: 46
Reply 10, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 19984 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 4):
Even if they dehub NRT it will still see 744 flights (look at UA...)

If they dehub NRT, they'll suddenly have a lot of freed up capacity that would have to go somewhere, and retiring the 744s would be a good option



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineMSPNWA From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1902 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 19982 times:

Please vote "yes", DL BOD!

User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3186 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 19951 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 10):
If they dehub NRT, they'll suddenly have a lot of freed up capacity that would have to go somewhere,

In the form of A330's and 757's. Given how the 744's don't even operate [hardly any] interport flights anymore, they're pretty loosely scheduled anyway.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 10):
and retiring the 744s would be a good option

Considering how the DL higher-ups have told the pilot groups they have long term plans for no less than 11 of the 16 frames, your suggestion doesn't seem to be the path they're actually taking.



A340-500: 4 engines 4 long haul. 777-200LR: 2 engines 4 longer haul
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9286 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 19743 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 10):
If they dehub NRT, they'll suddenly have a lot of freed up capacity that would have to go somewhere, and retiring the 744s would be a good option

Like Tpac said, they routes they run to and from NRT(1x daily DTW,MSP,ATL,JFK,LAX,HNL,MNL(the only intra-Asia flight) again they wouldn't be pulling many, if any 744s out of NRT. Most of NRT is now 757s with a few 330s (HKG on the 333 and PEK,PVG,SIN,BKK on the 332)



yep.
User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 19593 times:

Why upgrade the B744s when DL could by brand new B748s  Big grin

KrisYYZ


User currently offlineUSAirALB From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 3034 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 19390 times:

Do the upgrades include the Boeing Signature Interior?


E135/E140/E145/E70/E75/E90/CR2/CR7/717/732/733/734/735/73G/738/752/753/762/772/319/320/321/333
User currently offlineHigherflyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 131 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 19390 times:



Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 14):
Why upgrade the B744s when DL could by brand new B748s

One big reason....$$!


User currently offlineAerokiwi From New Zealand, joined Jul 2000, 2683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 19208 times:



Quoting DL747400 (Thread starter):
This should be good news for those folks who want the 744s to remain part of the DL fleet for the foreseeable future.

Which is nice, but a 748 would be so much easier, no?

Quoting Iloveboeing (Reply 5):
It is (probably) cheaper to upgrade the 744s, rather than buy 748s or A380s.

Yeah, probably true, sadly.

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 14):
Why upgrade the B744s when DL could by brand new B748s

Sigh, my sentiments exactly - that'd be a sight!


User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17322 posts, RR: 46
Reply 18, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 19040 times:



Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 12):
In the form of A330's and 757's. Given how the 744's don't even operate [hardly any] interport flights anymore, they're pretty loosely scheduled anyway.



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 13):
Most of NRT is now 757s with a few 330s (HKG on the 333 and PEK,PVG,SIN,BKK on the 332)

Right, but those intra Asia widebodies that do as little as a NRT/ICN roundtrip can do transatlantic turns in about the same amount of time. A rework of the NRT hub would free up a ton of capacity that is not optimally used right now.

Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 12):
Considering how the DL higher-ups have told the pilot groups they have long term plans for no less than 11 of the 16 frames, your suggestion doesn't seem to be the path they're actually taking.

That announcement was also well before JL came into play... Then again I wouldn't be surprised if those 11 frames were included in a scenario where NRT is smaller, regardless of whether DL draws it down on its own or as part of an agreement with JL.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineLuckyone From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 2162 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 18987 times:



Quoting Aerokiwi (Reply 17):
Which is nice, but a 748 would be so much easier, no?

Several billion dollars vs. the cost of refurbing an aircraft that is most likely due for heavy maintenance and downtown anyway??? I'm not an airline bean counter but you'd have to work very hard to convince me the former is more cost effective!!!lol


User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3186 posts, RR: 13
Reply 20, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 18956 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 18):
Right, but those intra Asia widebodies that do as little as a NRT/ICN roundtrip can do transatlantic turns in about the same amount of time. A rework of the NRT hub would free up a ton of capacity that is not optimally used right now.

Exactly my point, that the capacity you'd free up is in the form of A330's and 757's. The A330's could, indeed, be placed on the Atlantic, Africa, or South America. The 747-400's, however, most likely would continue to be used to NRT and Asia.

If they get complete interior refurbs, they may see a greatly expanded scope of the routes and destinations they serve.

Quoting Aerokiwi (Reply 17):
Which is nice, but a 748 would be so much easier, no?

No.

The cost to upgrade the interiors of the 744's would cost nickels on the dollar compared to the cost of leasing (much less buying) brand new 748's.

I'd love to see US-based 748's as much as the next bloke but I think the most realistic scenario to see continued 747 service at DL is for them to put lie-flat beds in J-class and AVOD PTV's in Y-class on their existing 744's.



A340-500: 4 engines 4 long haul. 777-200LR: 2 engines 4 longer haul
User currently offlineDLDTW1962 From United States of America, joined May 2009, 393 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 18702 times:

This is one aircraft I have never been on. I would love a chance to fly on a DL B747-400
some time in my life. Or at least go on board and look around. Upgrading any of their
aircraft would be cheeper then buying or leasing one would be. Way to go DL. Keep on
doing a good job.

Chuck


User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8395 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 18591 times:



Quoting DLDTW1962 (Reply 21):
This is one aircraft I have never been on. I would love a chance to fly on a DL B747-400
some time in my life.

Nobody has been on a DL 744 yet, just NW 744s with a possible DL paintjob on the outside and safety videocassette on the inside.

This thread is about what a true DL 744 might be like, if they decide to develop them into a true DL aircraft in the future, with a Delta flight experience.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16810 posts, RR: 51
Reply 23, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 18588 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 8):
DL's financial priorities are turning towards finding a solution to the JFK terminal situation. replacing the 744 fleet will cost about the same as what needs to be spent on a fleet of 12-16 77Ws. I'd rather have the new JFK terminal at this point....

It's not that simple, which is easier to get financing for in the current economy. I would think it would be the 77W's as they can be repossessed and placed back into service fairly quickly. If DL goes into bankruptcy again and defaults on it's lease/bond obligations vis a vis the JFK Terminals as it had done in Boston there's really no other tenant to pursue. MASSPORT brought in CO to takeover some of the gates they repossessed from DL, whom would want the JFK terminals?.. Not AA or B6, they in fine shape facilities wise.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9286 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 18512 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 18):
Right, but those intra Asia widebodies that do as little as a NRT/ICN roundtrip can do transatlantic turns in about the same amount of time. A rework of the NRT hub would free up a ton of capacity that is not optimally used right now.

This i agree too but it wont be 744s.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 18):
That announcement was also well before JL came into play... Then again I wouldn't be surprised if those 11 frames were included in a scenario where NRT is smaller, regardless of whether DL draws it down on its own or as part of an agreement with JL.

not really. Anderson told the pilots only a few weeks ago(maybe a month month and a half) that they will be keeping them.

Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 20):
Exactly my point, that the capacity you'd free up is in the form of A330's and 757's. The A330's could, indeed, be placed on the Atlantic, Africa, or South America. The 747-400's, however, most likely would continue to be used to NRT and Asia.

the 744s may find there way to Europe or South American. Plus they will be doing JFK-TLV in S10.



yep.
25 Flyiguy : And would also add more weight to the overall aircraft which is one reason why UA didn't put PTV's in coach when they upgraded their 747's...upgradin
26 Flighty : Using 2010+ technology they should be able to rework the cabins without increasing weight by very much. Their premium product should be lighter than
27 DeltaL1011man : If that is they want to get money from the Port. Talk now is they are going to take over T4 (save) KL and build something in T2/3s place. Ed just got
28 Transpac787 : The OEW of the NW/DL 747-451 is significantly less than the UA 747-422. Despite the UA 747-422 having a higher MGTOW of 875,000# vs only 870,000# for
29 Post contains images Phatfarmlines : I don't think DL's priorites are there as they did not do this with their 763's, although it would be nice to see the AI-style modified cabin interio
30 STT757 : And the 36 other airlines that are tenants of T4 would go where?..
31 WESTERN737800 : I think this is great news. The 744 looks great in DL colors. Its good to know they plan on keeping them around for a while.
32 Aerokiwi : Yes I realise that. Sorry, I should've plopped a tongue-in-cheek emoticon in there. Still, while financially it would be more difficult (especially g
33 DLPhoenix : Which Delta flight experience are you refering to? The 16 up do date 777s (8 of them with recliners is J) or the 50+ 76Es with recliners in J and no
34 DeltaL1011man : They haven't upgraded the 763ERs yet. Couldn't tell you, And fact is, once there leases are up it becomes the Ports problem.
35 Flighty : That is a good question my friend! We are all waiting to see what Delta really turns into, in terms of their fleet and their overall product. I just
36 STT757 : But they don't expire all at the same time, and many are long term.
37 DeltaL1011man : One would think they will be able to work all of this out. all I know is Delta should have a new terminal by 2012.
38 JetBluefan1 : Forget the upgrades! How about they just order some A380's?! One can dream, right?
39 United Airline : UA and DL might order the B 748 when it comes to B 744 replacement. Who knows? Maybe UA will now be forced to upgrade their B 747-400s with PTVs in c
40 FlyCaledonian : BA, CX and QF all have IFE throughout their 744s, and operate the type on some very long sectors. Other airlines manager okay. What is it about DL(NW
41 WorldTraveler : DL will put nose to tail IFE on the 744s.. they have to in order to be competitive and they know it. There are no more technical limitations to puttin
42 Smi0006 : I don't know the details but I believe that there is something along those lines, I have been told that is the reason UA doesn't operate into MEL non
43 RwSEA : Am I the only one who thinks it's funny that these planes got this bad after years of neglect, but only after the execs are forced to fly this product
44 Post contains links Kiwiandrew : I am curious about the economics of this investment if DL decide to go ahead , the oldest NW 744s date from 1989 so are already 20 years old ( accordi
45 Smi0006 : Indeed this is very true, but is there some way to also formulate the cost in damage to the brand if they don't? That is of course if there is any da
46 Xdlx : I am crushed ! Thought they were going to trade for 77W
47 STT757 : DL has and will have the oldest least efficient fleet of the US carriers, it's ridiculous. MD-88s (old) 757s (old) 767s (old) DC-9s (very old) 747-40
48 FlyCaledonian : * AA operates a much bigger fleet of MD-82s/-83s than DL does MD-88s. * CO and US operate all three versions of the 737 classic (-300/-400/-500) betw
49 MaverickM11 : I realize that, but none of the NRT network needs to be flown on a 744, especially in an environment where the NRT hub is reduced. MSP/DTW-NRT *defin
50 STT757 : Airline fleet age: CO 9.5 UA 13 DL 14 years AA 15 years NWA 18.5 years
51 Sxf24 : As of?
52 STT757 : 2008
53 Rangercarp : Old planes are certainly more expensive to fly and maintain, but they are a heck of a lot cheaper to own. Think G4. There is a reason why most millio
54 Mayor : Does older necessarily translate into less efficient? I don't think so. Age of aircraft isn't a very good parameter to be used when referring to a/c
55 STT757 : The MD-88s burn 30% more fuel on average than 737NGs, A319/20s. The DC-9s burn 50% more fuel on average, there is a point where that becomes a major
56 Surfdog75 : DC-9-30/40s will be gone by the end of 2010. When you compare efficiency you should also throw in the finance costs of newer aircraft vs an older pai
57 MaverickM11 : It almost always does at least in terms of operating costs; the disadvantage can be totally offset by ownership costs however.
58 HSVflier : I disagree with most of the flying being done with 757s at the NRT hub. i was just there and there were only two 757s on the ground and about 6-7 A33
59 Panamair : For the current interport flying, 757s are used from NRT to KIX, NGO, ICN, PUS, TPE, SGN, SPN, and GUM A330s are used to HKG, PEK, PVG, BKK, and SIN
60 Transpac787 : The DC9's don't carry a $500,000 monthly lease rate either. You just didn't see them, then. 757's operate from NRT to: NGO, KIX, SPN, GUM, SGN, ICN,
61 Post contains images Mayor : Well, since there's only a 5 year difference in the AVERAGE age of the fleet, this hardly seems like much of an argument in favor of CO and we all kn
62 DeltaL1011man : Its not because they were on the aircraft. Ed, Glen and Anderson all took the 744 right after they put it on ATL-NRT. The reason it is just now comin
63 Panamair : Anything to make CO look better, I guess...
64 MaverickM11 : It doesn't change the average age of the fleet.
65 Transpac787 : Which will significantly go down when you get rid of 40x 40-year old DC9-30's and -40's.
66 Jetlanta : Everything save the DC-9-30/40's are getting new slimline Y seats, with AVOD on all but the DC-9's and MD-88's, from my understanding. All internatio
67 Mayor : I didn't say it did. But to have one list with the average age and another with all of DL's older a/c while espousing CO's newer ones, seems like ver
68 Transpac787 : According to transcript of a joint meeting between the DL and NW pilot groups and the corporate higher-ups from 13OCT09, the following will happen: -
69 Flyibaby : Don't forget that they are also going to be adding a crew rest compartment on the 767-400 in the cargo hold. I hear it will be similar to the ones on
70 DeltaL1011man : to? 10 of these have winglets. Also widgetheads says one of the ETOPs birds has them, If this is the case i would bet all 4 get them. 52 738s have th
71 WorldTraveler : Think you need to speak w/ the NW execs that managed those a/c... granted, NW was planning on 787s by now but NW mgmt was in charge of those a/c unti
72 DeltaL1011man : That has less range, less MTOW, less seats.......but yea they will be kinda close. To bad NW went with PW for the 330s. If they went GE/RR they could
73 OA412 : I take it that the decision will be between the lie flats on the 77L and those on the 764 right? They're not going to introduce a third lie flat are
74 DeltaL1011man : I believe the Trents have a 73K thrust and GE has a 72K thrust. PW only has the 70K(which is what NW has IIRC). QF has RR Trents and has done LAX-AKL
75 WorldTraveler : which is why it is smaller in all respects.. but given that it is 50K pounds lighter, it is a pretty impressive a/c to be pushing 14 hr flights. the
76 DeltaL1011man : I was talking about in F class. With the way they are doing meals they have no way to heat F class meals up and there will be a good bit of M80 route
77 Tinpusher007 : Nope...Qantas' A332's are GE-powered.
78 Timf : DL serves only cold meals on flights under 1500 miles. The MD-88s shouldn't be flying any routes longer than this so the lack of ovens isn't an issue
79 GSPSPOT : I'm still working on getting on a DL (or KL while they still have them) 744. They're absolutely heroic aircraft, and so much more graceful than those
80 OA412 : Transpac's info is showing that the M88's will only be losing the aft galley. The forward galley should still be available for F class use.
81 WorldTraveler : I wouldn't hold your breath... it will take years before the MD80s need to be retired en masse... also, there is no assurance that Airbus won't be in
82 OA412 : Interesting but I guess they'll have no other choice. It will be interesting to see how this pans out. I'm a big fan of the 320 series myself and I a
83 Transpac787 : Don't act like you're the first guy to figure this out, NW was looking at it long before DL came along
84 Jetlanta : They'll go for the best deal in this case. This nice thing about operating virtually every Boeing/Airbus aircraft in production today is that there i
85 Post contains links and images Phatfarmlines : Going back to my original post: The quote was in context to the overhead bin redesign asked by USAirALB. You're saying DL has plans to upgrade the ph
86 Post contains links DeltaL1011man : Right but They took the ovens out of the F class galley not to long ago.(which is my point) It depends, IMHO if the economy is good i don't believe D
87 OA412 : Exactly. DL is in a very good position right now in terms of being able to select the best aircraft for their needs. Interesting. I wasn't aware of t
88 DeltaL1011man : What is the rules for F class meals? It has been talked about. Do the upgraded have a weight advantage? (BTW I really think we need a Delta thread, N
89 Nwaesc : The 'bus is an easy plane to love...
90 WorldTraveler : There was a package of mods for the 763s that involved replacing nearly all of the interiors w/ newer technology That extra inch in the seat and extr
91 United Airline : Do they still have plans to fly direct to Hong Kong?
92 Panamair : The 7 764ERs ("76D") already have the FA crew bunks in the cargo hold area. They will be starting nonstop DTW-HKG 5x weekly with the 77L starting nex
93 RIX : - is it because I'm not a big guy at all that I never noticed it? To me, they are same cramped if the cabin is full and same spacious if it's at leas
94 Centrair : Thank the BOD! It is about time they even consider upgrading the NW744s. If they could have one ready by June of next year, it would be greatly apprec
95 Luckyone : Please correct me if I'm wrong but I believe DTW-HKG was announced with the last round of expansion.
96 DeltaL1011man : not if it ends up like the 380 and 787 yes 5x DTW-HKG 77L and 7x weekly NRT-HKG, I believe 333. See I love the 737(most NGs, Delta's 73Gs are little
97 Panamair : NRT-HKG has been loaded as a 332 so far for next summer. However, I think there will still be changes with the 332/333 in the S10 schedule because ba
98 Sectflyer : Try Xanex! I like WBC but I don't it with my kids. We travel in the back with them...torture. Nothing to just keep them still and zoned out.[/quote]
99 Jetlanta : The worst trip I've had in ages was in a 73G last month. Seat 18D. Pure Torture. Worse even than a CRJ aisle seat. "Real" pitch was awful. The guy in
100 WorldTraveler : Those are/will be fine airplanes when the kinks get worked out - it's already happening w/ the 380. Fresh sheets of paper are costly in the aviation
101 Transpac787 : They already have that planned. SEA-NRT 763ER: 3x weekly SEA-KIX 763ER: 5x weekly SEA-PEK 763ER: 5x weekly PDX-NRT 763ER: daily LAX-NRT 772ER: 4x wee
102 DeltaL1011man : Ill agree BUT I think HKG may stay airbus if it and DTW can work together. BTW Id look for the 330s in ATL and the 764s to move up to JFK. More 767s
103 Panamair : The LAX-NRT 777 is supposed to be the LR, not the ER. Right now the S10 skeds look very light on the 333s overall, but the FCOs haven't been adjusted
104 DeltaL1011man : What is ATL-SVO coming back as? (and will all the routes that they cut last year be back for the winter too of just summer?)
105 Panamair : ATL-SVO so far is a 763ER, same as this past summer. As for whether the cuts come back next winter, it will obviously all depend on how demand shapes
106 Jetlanta : I'm 6'3". It was a nightmare. Far worse than any other domestic coach product I've been on in a long time. The seat was comfortable and the tv was ni
107 Papatango : Looks like FCO-ATL/JFK/DTW JFK-ATH will be 300's and ATL_AMS will be a 200.
108 OA412 : I expect the same especially given that OA is now codesharing with DL. It was such a shame when they added the extra seats to increase capacity to 16
109 Jetlanta : I was referring to a 737-700. I have had an experience that bad on a -800. (though I'm upgraded most of the time anyway.)
110 OA412 : D'oh. I guess if I'd actually paid attention to the fact that you specifically mentioned that it was a 73G I might have caught that.
111 DeltaL1011man : Haven't?
112 KingAir200 : The interiors of the older Airbuses were getting a bit ratty, but with the new DL carpets, seat covers, and light bulbs, they really look nice. The 3
113 DeltaL1011man : I did MSP-ATL on one and it was pretty bad.
114 Transpac787 : Which would have been before DL took over all hub-to-hub routes which would have been before the Delta interiors were installed on the Airbuses. He *
115 Michman : The average fleet age NWA mainline passenger jets was 16.1 years at the end of 2008. This was calculated directly from their 10K report. The DC-9's o
116 SurfandSnow : I don't think the sheer capacity of the 744s can be easily replaced without negatively impacting the DL/NW network elsewhere. I think this is a very g
117 RJpieces : How much longer will Delta's MD-88s be around? These are the slimline blue leather seats correct? My last NW/DL DC-9 flight had these....So some of th
118 KingAir200 : Just about all the DC-9-50s have the new covers. Right now, on all the NWA airplanes that have the new interiors, the seat itself is the same as befo
119 C767P : Just going by delivery dates, DL would have an average fleet age of 14.61, NW would be at 17.33. Combine the two of them to get 15.72. All the region
120 PDXBJV : Interestingly enough I saw that DL upgraded JFK-IST to the 764 for this summer. I thought it didn't have the range to do it without restrictions?
121 Transpac787 : I guess we'll find out
122 Luckyone : Istanbul is 300nm shorter than ATL-SVO which Delta ran with full loads on the 764 in 2008.
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