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Jackson Hole Airport - Cattle Shipments? LAX?  
User currently offlineMozart From Luxembourg, joined Aug 2003, 2182 posts, RR: 13
Posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 6568 times:

I have two questions about Jackson Hole airport:

1. I read on Wikipedia that "In addition, Jackson Hole Airport is one of the only airports in the nation that ships live cattle by airplane. Cattle shipments are extremely lucrative and earn the airport 5% of its summer income."

Very interesting. Where do these cattle fly to? Which airline does that, on which aircraft type?

2. Supposedly there are seasonal services to Los Angeles. I checked for the coming winter months, nothing there, neither by UA nor by any other carrier. Can someone tell me more about this?

Thanks

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTrucker From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 190 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 6528 times:

They ship top end horses by air....to races, shows, breeding farms, etc. And if someone buys a horse and lives on a different continent they'll have it shipped home by air. I can't see regular run of the mill cattle being shipped by air but if you had a very special bull that had to be shipped to a different continent or perhaps even a long trip in th US I'm sure he'd get an airplane ride. I believe you can even ship a horse with FX so maybe a bull too.

User currently offlineMozart From Luxembourg, joined Aug 2003, 2182 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 6470 times:



Quoting Trucker (Reply 1):

Thanks for that Tucker.

However, what you describe is something that I believed would happen everywhere if needed. However, the text specifically mentions "Jackson Hole Airport is one of the only airports in the nation" doing that. Now, if the author's information are as good as his English ("one of the only" (sic) - "one of the few" is probably what he wanted to say) then maybe there indeed is no big deal there.


User currently offlineDazed767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 5498 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 6409 times:

I'd guess Kalitta or Capital Cargo.

User currently offlineRFields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 31
Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 6363 times:

FedEx used to have a specialized group to ship race horses. They were quite good at moving the high value, extremely lucrative for the airline, cargo.

Quoting Mozart (Reply 2):
"Jackson Hole Airport is one of the only airports in the nation"

I think there is a semantics issue here - because if they ship live cattle out - there has to be another airport somewhere for them to land. Right?

None of the references cited refer to cattle being shipped - but the Wiki article indicates one dedicated aircraft for cattle shipment is based at the airport.


User currently offlineTrucker From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 190 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 6150 times:

I visited the website in question.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackson_Hole_Airport

Also the Jackson Hole airport website.

http://www.jacksonholeairport.com/

I noticed this airport only has 1 runway with a length of only 6300 feet at an elevation of 6451 feet. One thing I've learned from my years of visiting A.net is that that's going to be a problem for a large heavy cargo plane. It's also entirely located within Grand Teton National Park so aircraft going in there have to be Stage-lll compliant noisewise. Another little tidbit I've picked up on A.net is that cargo aircraft tend to be old and noisey. I also took a look at the airport on google earth specifically looking for stock pens and didn't see any. I supose whenever they had cattle going through they could set up portable pens but I would think if they shipped large numbers of cattle on a regular basis they'd have permenent stock pens with ramps to unload them from trucks. And the Jackson Hole airport website makes no mention of shipping cattle. So although the occasional bovine might get shipped from this airport I'm inclined to believe that line on wikipedia might have been a bit overstated.

You can pretty much ship horses from any airport that can handle say a B737 size plane. They put them in an aluminum stall that's kinda shaped like a cargo container, sissor lift it up to the door and roll them in. Of course this is rather tramatic for the horse so they'll quite often tranquillize and/or blindfold them. I imagine they could ship individual cattle the same way. But I think herding a large group of cattle onto an airplane would be too much trouble and too costly.

Few other things. If you were bringing cattle into the US from places like Europe or South America the airport would have to have quarrentine facilities. Also you can ship bull semen anywhere in the world so the need to ship cattle for breeding purposes really isn't there. And I don't see a feedlot loading cattle in a truck...taking them to an airport...flying them to another airport...and loading them in a truck again to take them to the packing plant. Much easier to find a packing plant in Wyoming and truck the meat to LA.


User currently offlineJHCRJ700 From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 377 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 6061 times:

Keep in mind you are sourcing Wikipedia for your information....


RUSH
User currently offlineCrimsonNL From Netherlands, joined Dec 2007, 1872 posts, RR: 41
Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 6028 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR



Quoting Mozart (Thread starter):
Supposedly there are seasonal services to Los Angeles. I checked for the coming winter months, nothing there, neither by UA nor by any other carrier. Can someone tell me more about this?

I was there for 2 days in the summer of 08, on both days I spotted a UA 752 though I wouldn't know what destination it went. I also spotted a FX ATR and a C-32 of which I suspect was picking up/dropping off Cheney at his house in the area.

UA on final with the Teton range in the background
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3654/dscf2548.jpg



Nothing's worse then flying the same registration twice, except flying it 4 times..
User currently offlineTb727 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1597 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 6005 times:



Quoting Dazed767 (Reply 3):
I'd guess Kalitta or Capital Cargo.

Yep, but I don't think we will be bringing the 727 into JAC.



Too lazy to work, too scared to steal!
User currently offlineTrucker From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 190 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 5972 times:



Quoting Trucker (Reply 5):
might have been a bit overstated.



Quoting JHCRJ700 (Reply 6):
Keep in mind you are sourcing Wikipedia for your information....

Actually I was very tempted to use a pun and call that line so much of what comes out of the posterior end of an uncastrated male bovine in it's more common term but I spent alot of time on that post and didn't want the mods deleting it.


User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2458 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 5898 times:

Well maybe a good source would be to call the airport admin folks at JAC and see if they can shed light on the subjct you are asking about.

I was there in September and saw one of UA's 757s there as well. Very bright and sunny day. They are doing terminal expansion there so it was a bit dusty lol.

That was the first time since 1976 that I'd been to Teton area.

On a sidenote, in mid '70s a Korean Air Lines 707 was taking a load of cattle (to Korea,I assume) from BOI and one of their main gear broke thru the asphalt on the taxiway (if IIRC). That must've been fun lol.

[Edited 2009-12-01 11:30:25]


"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineThegreatchecko From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1128 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 5864 times:



Quoting Mozart (Thread starter):
Supposedly there are seasonal services to Los Angeles
. I checked for the coming winter months, nothing there, neither by UA nor by any other carrier. Can someone tell me more about this?

While there is very good skiing in JAC, it is much busier in the summer months when both Grand Teton and Yellowstone National Parks are fully open. The inner park roads are not plowed in the winter and most of the parks are essentially closed to vehicular traffic.

Quoting Trucker (Reply 5):
entirely located within Grand Teton National Park

According the charts I use at the airline, it's just outside of the park borders (we are asked to avoid overflying the park when able). However, you are correct that the airport is closed to stage II a/c.



"A pilot's plane she is. She will love you if you deserve it, and try to kill you if you don't...She is the Mighty Q400"
User currently offlineTrucker From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 190 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5708 times:



Quoting CrimsonNL (Reply 7):
I was there for 2 days in the summer of 08

That log cabin terminal must have been nice.

Quoting Thegreatchecko (Reply 11):
According to the charts I use at the airline, it's just outside of the park borders

More good info from Wikipedia. Second paragraph says JAC is one of only two airports in the US that's in a national park along with Provincetown Municipal Airport in Massachusetts. Wonder if they got that one right?


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25338 posts, RR: 22
Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5670 times:



Quoting Trucker (Reply 1):
can't see regular run of the mill cattle being shipped by air but if you had a very special bull that had to be shipped to a different continent or perhaps even a long trip in th US I'm sure he'd get an airplane ride.

Cattle have often been shipped by air. Air Canada (DC-8) and Martinair (either DC-10 or MD-11) examples below.

http://www.historyofaircargo.com/img/air-cargo-airmail-image-261.jpg



User currently offlineBorism From Estonia, joined Oct 2006, 431 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5604 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 13):
Cattle have often been shipped by air. Air Canada (DC-8) and Martinair (either DC-10 or MD-11) examples below.

Thanks, finally one useful answer on this thread besides Wikipedia bashing.

Aircraft in second picture seems a bit too narrow for DC-10/MD-11 to me, besides can JAC really handle aircraft so large? To me it seems B757 is the biggest one they get...


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25338 posts, RR: 22
Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5577 times:



Quoting Borism (Reply 14):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 13):
Cattle have often been shipped by air. Air Canada (DC-8) and Martinair (either DC-10 or MD-11) examples below.

Thanks, finally one useful answer on this thread besides Wikipedia bashing.

Aircraft in second picture seems a bit too narrow for DC-10/MD-11 to me, besides can JAC really handle aircraft so large? To me it seems B757 is the biggest one they get...

I wasn't implying that those photos were taken at JAC. I was only referring to cattle shipped by air in general. The Martinair photo was probably taken at AMS. I'm pretty sure it's a DC-10 or MD-11 from the window panels (a convertible passenger-cargo aircraft).


User currently offlineTrucker From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 190 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5574 times:

I don't think these are regular run of the mill cattle. They appear to be dairy cattle...holsteins I think. I would guess they are very high quality dairy cattle being transported somewhere to upgrade a dairy herd or herds somewhere. I won't deny that cattle get airplane rides(I mentioned top bulls do), but like with horses, only the very best will ever see the inside of an airplane.

User currently offlineRFields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 31
Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5545 times:

I like the Martinair stickers on their foreheads.

Was that their boarding pass?


User currently offlineABpositive From Australia, joined Nov 2005, 226 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5524 times:

Recently, a pair of pandas was transported to Adelaide zoo from China. I believe they had a 747 all to themselves.

Not sure if they had joined the mile high club...


User currently offlineTrucker From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 190 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 5471 times:



Quoting Borism (Reply 14):
finally one useful answer on this thread besides Wikipedia bashing.

 Confused 3 out of 18 posts reference Wikipedia.

Quoting MtnWest1979 (Reply 10):
maybe a good source would be to call the airport admin folks at JAC and see if they can shed light on the subjct you are asking about.

I kinda thought this was a good answer.

Quoting ABpositive (Reply 18):
Not sure if they had joined the mile high club...

 biggrin  They wish....given how hard it is to get Pandas to breed.


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