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DL's 763ER Economy Seats?  
User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3217 posts, RR: 10
Posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4561 times:

Hi all,

as we all know DL are going to upgrade the 767-300ER, but I was wondering if anybody knew when that process is suppose to start?

Also, I'm thinking of getting on DL's LAX-GRU service in Feb next year. Assuming the new product won't be in service by then, does anybody know if the current ER's have winged headrests. They're aren't many pictures in the data base, and those that are there are old and don't look so crash hot. Like seats from 1993 type seats with no headrest at all.

Now i know not to expect PTV's etc on this flight, and I intend on popping a sleeping pill to knock myself out so (i will have come in from Australia to connect to it) So winged headrests are important for the economy passenger. It would look just about impossible to sleep using those old fashioned seats minus the headrest. One needs some neck support! If they're not being used on the 767-300 I'll connect in one of the other hubs or jump on the korean air flight instead. Can anybody share any insight?

24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGilesdavies From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 3037 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 4407 times:

I really don't get DL's attitude to upgrading the long haul 763's in the fleet...

While they have been happy to attach all the "bells and whistles" to their domestic 763's, they are doing minimum upgrade to the long haul fleet!

These 763's are due to remain in the fleet for a long time, and are completely below par compared to the 764's, 777's and A330's in terms of comfort.

I heard many unhappy passengers who were use to the comforts of NW flying there A330 and have the aircraft type downgraded to an 767...

It makes no sense, considering they fully upgraded the 764's.


User currently offlineInesilio From Italy, joined Sep 2009, 53 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 4397 times:

Flew on them a few times last year. Bad, bad, bad, bad, bad!!!

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 1):
So winged headrests are important for the economy passenger.

None.

Quoting Lufthansa (Thread starter):
I'll connect in one of the other hubs or jump on the korean air flight instead.

Much better idea.


User currently offlineSectflyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 359 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4234 times:

I hope they do it a bit sooner rather than later. People like a consistent product not a mix match.

User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9554 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4065 times:



Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 1):
I really don't get DL's attitude to upgrading the long haul 763's in the fleet...

Has to do with cost and weight.



yep.
User currently offlineJBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4491 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4028 times:

Honestly as I am able to read the lack of IFE doesn't really bother me. I rather like the Delta 763ER...cozy, 2-3-2 seating, decent seats. I find winged headrests just as inconvenient as nothing, but to each his own.


I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1187 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4025 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Thread starter):
but I was wondering if anybody knew when that process is suppose to start?

I understand the first 76T is going in at the end of this month.

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 1):
I really don't get DL's attitude to upgrading the long haul 763's in the fleet...

What attitude? Delta's finances during a huge merger? or the fact that adding the Wingletts in order to do interior upgrades (weight as L10 mentioned) ?


User currently offlineEvan767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2957 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 3835 times:

Quoting Gilesdavies - Reply 1: I really don't get DL's attitude to upgrading the long haul 763's in the fleet...

While they have been happy to attach all the "bells and whistles" to their domestic 763's, they are doing minimum upgrade to the long haul fleet!


How many times does this need to be explained? Delta cannot add PTV's to international 763ER's because the added weight would severely impose limits on routes such as JFK-TLV, JFK-CAI, ATL-LOS, LAX-GRU, ATL-ATH, ATL-SVO, etc. Perhaps you've noticed Delta has upgraded the 764ER's with PTV's. This is because these are used on shorter routes.

NOW, since Delta is beginning to add winglets to the 763ER's, they can afford to add the PTV's while keeping aircraft performance roughly the same as it was before winglets and PTV's. And that's exactly what they're planning on doing.

[Edited 2009-12-07 06:30:15 by Diamond]


The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
User currently offlineATLflyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 736 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 3663 times:



Quoting Evan767 (Reply 7):
NOW, since Delta is beginning to add winglets to the 763ER's, they can afford to add the PTV's while keeping aircraft performance roughly the same as it was before winglets and PTV's. And that's exactly what they're planning on doing.

So, now can you get that through to your brain?

Yes, you are correct. I was listening to a presentation at Morgan Stanley Transportation Day where the CFO said that Delta has decided it is most-cost effective to invest in its current/combined fleet rather than purchase new aircraft. He said Delta will take 4 new aircraft in 2010 and has not made any other plans to purchase aircraft. He said they will invest in its current fleet by upgrading all the 767s with lie-flats and economy will be getting AVOD. Great to hear.


User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3011 posts, RR: 26
Reply 9, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 3633 times:



Quoting Evan767 (Reply 7):
How many times does this need to be explained?

It amazes me how many times people have to ask and read the same things over and over again and still don't get it. Especially great are the "logical" questions asked by members... "Why doesn't DELTA add PTVs?" Then they go on to bash the product with no basis and fundamental knowledge. Many people here have selective reading skills - that's what I've learned over my 5+ years on this forum.

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineTommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6657 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 3476 times:

I flew LAX-ATL on a DL 763ER and while there were no PTVs, it was clean, had new LCD screens throughout and even had winged headrests. Overall it was decent, certainly not the worst or the best. Probably just as on par with AA 763s.


"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 11, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 3393 times:
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The 76Ts (ships 1607 - 1613) had winged headrest Y seats but I'm not sure if these were retained after they replaced the cloth seats with the blue leather ones. I am tempted to say that they still do as they kept the winged headrests on the 764ERs and the 777-200ERs even after they replaced them with the leather-upholstered seats.

If this is the case, then the OP should have winged headrest seats in Y as LAX-GRU is operated by a 76T.


User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 12, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3356 times:



Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 9):
Many people here have selective reading skills

This I agree with...

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 9):
Then they go on to bash the product with no basis and fundamental knowledge

... but not with this. DL's product in the 763ER are not good. Seats are uncomfortable (only with DL does my back hurt after a flight) and they have no PTV's. Despite the fact there are reasons for this, the fact remains that their product is subpar. The passenger does not care why the product is subpar, only that it is...



L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
User currently offlineJetSetter629 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 442 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3253 times:

I am wondering what kind of planes they fly internationally, but on short segments such as ATL-GUA and ATL-SJU. While these are "international" flights, they do not warrant the ER. Do they send the domestic 767s?

User currently offlineMMEPHX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3206 times:

Compared to the CO product or the NW A330 product, DL is behind the curve with the 763ER. I can understand the lack of IFE due to weight (and it's not important to me as a book, ipod and sleeping pills all work better for me) but the seats are really uncomfortable, I've had very short seat backs the last few flights which make sleep for a 6 foot+ guy a real challenge.

Could they not split their large 763ER fleet so they could install improved seats and IFE on enough aircraft that can serve the TATL market and leave another fleet for longer haul without upgrades? Though I guess that adds another level of cost and complexity they could probably do without.

I assume the Thompson cozy suites have gone bye-bye in Y and we won't be seeing them installed any time soon?


User currently offlineLuckyone From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 2185 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3194 times:



Quoting Kappel (Reply 12):
Seats are uncomfortable (only with DL does my back hurt after a flight)

It's also amazing that because someone finds that they and five of their like-minded friends don't like the seat/food/airplane that EVERYONE must not like it. They fail to realize that nobody likes the same thing. I, personally, like the Delta econ seat. I think it's very comfortable. I find that I'm too tall for headrests (at least the one on Delta, KLM, and Lufty) and I end up putting a blanket/pillow/jacket/extra t-shirt under my NECK because no matter what my head ends up falling backwards.


User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 16, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3125 times:



Quoting Luckyone (Reply 15):
It's also amazing that because someone finds that they and five of their like-minded friends don't like the seat/food/airplane that EVERYONE must not like it.

Fine, I'll change my sentence to IMHO the seats are uncomfortable  Yeah sure



L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3096 times:



Quoting MMEPHX (Reply 14):
Could they not split their large 763ER fleet so they could install improved seats and IFE on enough aircraft that can serve the TATL market and leave another fleet for longer haul without upgrades? Though I guess that adds another level of cost and complexity they could probably do without.

I assume the Thompson cozy suites have gone bye-bye in Y and we won't be seeing them installed any time soon?

The Thompson Cozy Suites are indeed dead, however, the 763ER fleet will instead get Weber 5751 slimline seats in Y (probably with winged headrests), and the Thompson Vantage flat-bed seats in J. All 763ERs are planned to get AVOD in Y along with the new seats. The 76Ts (ships 1607-1613) will be first in line for the upgrades, which I believe will start in late 2010 after the 764ER fleet is completed with the J flat-bed seat mods.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineTommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6657 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3016 times:



Quoting JetSetter629 (Reply 13):
While these are "international" flights, they do not warrant the ER. Do they send the domestic 767s?

ATL-SJU is a domestic 763 route (typically.) The 763ERs generally do deep south america and Europe from both JFK and ATL.



"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
User currently offlineTristarcrazy From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 323 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2783 times:



Quoting Kappel (Reply 12):
. but not with this. DL's product in the 763ER are not good. Seats are uncomfortable (only with DL does my back hurt after a flight) and they have no PTV's. Despite the fact there are reasons for this, the fact remains that their product is subpar. The passenger does not care why the product is subpar, only that it is...

I am amazed how everyone thinks that the seats in the back of DL 763ER's are so bad. They are no worse than AA, CO or UA. The new slimline seats suck. They have less cushion than the current seats and just because they have PTV doesn't make the seats more comfy...just more entertaining. All seats, including first/business class hurt my back. DL needs to shop at the Lazy-Boy showroom. Now that'd be a comfy seat!!!



717,722,732,733,737.738,739,742,744.752,763,764,772,L10,L15,DC3,DC6,DC8,DC9,DC10,MD11,MD80,MD90,CV880,A310,A319,A320.A33
User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2746 times:



Quoting Tristarcrazy (Reply 19):
The new slimline seats suck. They have less cushion than the current seats and just because they have PTV doesn't make the seats more comfy...just more entertaining.

Actually, I found them to be quite comfortable the last time I flew on one of DL's domestic 763s. And they did not even have winged headrests! I'm guessing the ones that will be installed on the 763ERs though will have winged headrests, as DL stated their long term goal is to have winged headrests on all international aircraft.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3011 posts, RR: 26
Reply 21, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2694 times:



Quoting Kappel (Reply 12):
Seats are uncomfortable (only with DL does my back hurt after a flight) and they have no PTV's. Despite the fact there are reasons for this, the fact remains that their product is subpar.

That's all personal opinion. One can't just go bash something because he/she doesn't like it.

Quoting Kappel (Reply 16):
Fine, I'll change my sentence to IMHO the seats are uncomfortable

 checkmark 

I, for one, have never had a problem with DL's economy seat, which is exactly why I choose to fly Delta for all my long-haul transoceanic flights. I could care less about PTVs and therefore couldn't give a rats a** about the fact that DL doesn't have them. It doesn't make them sub-par. Bottom line though, even though I find US Airways' seats uncomfortable for my own personal liking, I don't go out and bash their product since I know they have hundreds of thousands of loyal fliers that keep them in business - so they must be doing something right.


User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 22, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 2655 times:

Quoting Tristarcrazy (Reply 19):
All seats, including first/business class hurt my back. DL needs to shop at the Lazy-Boy showroom. Now that'd be a comfy seat!!!

That sucks man, makes travel really uncomfortable for you...

To be honest, I only ever had this problem (back pain) with DL. I have flown CX (old Y seat in a343), KL (743, 744 and 772), PY (way back when on the DC8), LH (a300 and a346), AF (763 and 77W) and DL (763) long haul and DL had the only seat that hurt my back. That's what I base my opinion on. And it was on one of the shortest long haul flights I have taken (AMS-JFK) too. I recently flew MUC-SIN-MUC on LH's a346 for example and was quite comfortable in their seats for the entire flight.

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 21):
I could care less about PTVs

I, and lots of other pax, do. It helps pass the time for those of us who have a hard time sleeping in a plane. So I'll stress that this is just my opinion, but DL lags behind in the other carriers I mentioned (well, don't count PY, I haven't flown them in 10 years)... IMHO.... in Y that is, I only have C experience with KL.

Edit: BTW, I realise I may have come off a bit snippy in my previous post. That's not my intention so apologies for that.

[Edited 2009-12-08 01:43:28]


L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
User currently offlineJetlanta From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 3309 posts, RR: 35
Reply 23, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 2468 times:

What amazes me is that people are STILL complaining about the bad 767-300ER seats, despite the fact that Delta has already said that they are replacing them all with new seats with AVOD. People are trying to convince Delta to do something that they've already decided to do. Or maybe people just like to complain.

User currently offlineCessna172RG From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 749 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (4 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 2430 times:

What would you prefer on a long haul route IF you had the choice (can't wait for people to say "but they don't fly the type any more!" so here goes):

-Delta 763
-NWA DC-10
-NWA 747-400
-NWA 757-300

If I had a choice, it would be A330.



Save the whales...for dinner!!!
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