LHR380 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 4362 posts, RR: 15 Posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 21232 times:
With regards to the current situation in the US with the "failed" attack on a DL/NW 330 in DTW, security on US bound planes has now been upgraded.
Quote: The US Department of Transport has revised its security arrangements for all passengers flying into the US from other countries. This includes 100 per cent secondary screening of all US-bound passengers and their hand luggage before boarding. The normal requirement is 10 per cent secondary search.
BA has just reduced its baggage allowance in the cabin from 2 to 1 piece, and I have a feeling security queues are going to be HUGE today.
Im sure all other carrier's to the US are doing the same, but can only see the info on BA.com at the moment.
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)
Slinky09 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2009, 477 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 21236 times:
There's a note on the BAA Web site for Heathrow which currently infers it is at the airlines discretion but that extra security checks are being put in place.
All US flights seems to have departure delays of 1 to 3 hrs.
Swiftski From Australia, joined Dec 2006, 2692 posts, RR: 2 Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 21144 times:
Quoting LHR380 (Thread starter): With regards to the current situation in the US with the "failed" attack on a DL/NW 330 in DTW, security on US bound planes has now been upgraded.
I hate that one stupid moron is able to cause problems for everyone else travelling.
Brilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 2091 posts, RR: 1 Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 21118 times:
Quoting Swiftski (Reply 2): Quoting LHR380 (Thread starter):
With regards to the current situation in the US with the "failed" attack on a DL/NW 330 in DTW, security on US bound planes has now been upgraded.
I hate that one stupid moron is able to cause problems for everyone else travelling.
I hate the fact that security is so lax in Europe that people's lives were put at risk because some idiot in security did not do their job properly. If you have proper security screening and competent screeners who could spot fireworks(I can't believe that) and be stopped before they even got through to departures let alone the aircraft then this would never have happened.
LHR380 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 4362 posts, RR: 15 Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 21060 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 3): I hate the fact that security is so lax in Europe that people's lives were put at risk because some idiot in security did not do their job properly
Hey, don't say that!
If it was powder, I don't think currently (other than Manchester) there is a security screening device other then a full pat down to see if a person is carrying powder concealed under his trousers
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)
OA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 22455 posts, RR: 60 Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 21061 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 3): I hate the fact that security is so lax in Europe that people's lives were put at risk because some idiot in security did not do their job properly.
Im sorry but thats just rubbish. Its just as likely to happen in YYZ YUL or JFK LAX DFW as anywhere in Europe. Remember 9/11?
OzGlobal From France, joined Nov 2004, 2299 posts, RR: 5 Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20972 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 3): I hate the fact that security is so lax in Europe that people's lives were put at risk because some idiot in security did not do their job properly.
Uhm, all 9/11 successful attacks were a direct result of failed DOMESTIC US security procedures. All attackers were already in the US.
RESPONSE: Focus all effort on international arrivals security....?!?!?
Please. Most airport security worldwide is badly stage managed theatre and the US version is perhaps the greatest farce.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
If it was powder, I don't think currently (other than Manchester) there is a security screening device other then a full pat down to see if a person is carrying powder concealed under his trousers
Well it got through didn't it? If only 10 percent of pax have secondary screening in Europe I consider that lax.
Quoting Swiftski (Reply 4): That's a MASSIVE generalisation there.
Is AMS not in Europe? I thought it was. AMS security allowed it on the aircraft.
Davehammer From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 471 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20888 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 11): If only 10 percent of pax have secondary screening in Europe I consider that lax.
Where did you get that figure from?
And yes AMS is in Europe, well noticed. It still doesn't follow that because the guy got through there that all security screening on an entire continent is lax.
Brandonfsu05 From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 130 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20820 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 3): I hate the fact that security is so lax in Europe that people's lives were put at risk because some idiot in security did not do their job properly. If you have proper security screening and competent screeners who could spot fireworks(I can't believe that) and be stopped before they even got through to departures let alone the aircraft then this would never have happened.
It is a generalization. You can only do so much with security...there will always be lapses. People always complain about having to reclear security after coming in internationally lol. It's a good idea I think. Two times of security is better than one. I'll never forget when a German pax brought a gun in from US 705 FRA-CLT. He went through customs and immigration. When he tried to take his flight for Phoenix I think it was TSA discovered the gun. I had to go translate since he didn't speak any English.Turns out he meant nothing by it and it was a gift for a friend...I think he was the German equivalent to an American redneck. He had been screened at FRA. We all know TSA misses tons of things too. That's just the nature of the beast.
WorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20802 times:
Once again, this is typical US government reaction to terrorist threats that punish millions of people who have absolutely no involvement w/ terrorism and never will. Furrther, the response is so directly related to the threat that just occurred that all the terrorists have to do is wait until the hooplah over the last attempt has died down, change their tactics, and try again - after millions of innocent people have been needlessly harassed by the government.
I'm no security expert but can the technology not be developed to definitely identify any kind of explosive/incindiary device and keep that off of passenger aircraft forever.... and allow the rest of the world to move on?
OA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 22455 posts, RR: 60 Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20753 times:
Quoting Swiftski (Reply 17): You said European security is lax. Not that AMS security is lax. You are therefore criticising the whole of Europe, wrongly.
Maybe the poster is not aware that Europe is made up of many different countries.
PanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 6018 posts, RR: 27 Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20723 times:
Quoting Finnaviation (Reply 10): You can't hold a pillow or blanket during the landing in US.
why not hand-cuffing passengers one hour before landing? Or putting everyone into a straight jacket?
Must all passengers really suffer just because of one guy who could have been singled out for extra screening if it wasn't for political correctness?
It is about time to make ethnic and religious backgrounds of passengers a reason for added security. Let' learn from Israel. They do it and they are happy to share the know-how. And fire wheoever was in charge at TSA for not putting this guy up on a list that requires special screening, Once again that agency f....d it up. They have the guy on the Radar and still he is able to get on a US bound flight. Unbelievable.
Concerning the screenings in Europe or elsewhere. Fact is that 99,99999% of the pax do not pose a threat to aviation and their screening is just white ointment. That fact deters screeners from doing their job professionally and make their shift a happy party on whoich they can report and discuss with their co-workers what they did over the weekend or last night at home. Tell them to do their jobs and shut up while doing it.
And, most important, scrap political correctness.
Kole Feut un'n steiffen Wind gifft en krusen Büdel un' 'nen lütten Pint.
JpetekYXMD80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 3942 posts, RR: 35 Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20709 times:
Most of these are emergency measures that will only be around temporary. When it rains, it pours and at this point you need to assume this was a part of a larger terrorist plan. This is the right course of action at the moment while this plot is being investigated.
Maddog888 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2007, 154 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20670 times:
Quoting Finnaviation (Reply 7): Finnair got new procedures on flights to US from FAA:
All internet connetions banned during the flight.
All calls via satellitephones banned.
How does this increase security? I was not aware that any terrorists had used either to sieze/blowup a plane.
Quoting Finnaviation (Reply 7): No moving on aisles one hour before landing in US.
Again, kneejerk reaction. What about people who might have bladder problems or just need to go. If you gotta go, you gotta go. Do they want a wet seat for the next flight?
LHR380 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 4362 posts, RR: 15 Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20637 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 3): I hate the fact that security is so lax in Europe
These are your words. This sentence implies that all airline and airport security in the WHOLE of Europe is lax!!
Thats a lot of countries that according to this sentence have bad security.
It was a powder that was let thru, and as I said above, only a few places IN THE WORLD have the "sniffing" devices installed, or the full body xray devices, and one of those places is in Europe!!
(Well, in Manchester, but it is in Europe)
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)
WorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 20614 times:
Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 21): When it rains, it pours and at this point you need to assume this was a part of a larger terrorist plan. This is the right course of action at the moment while this plot is being investigated.
no it is not right and it only makes the terrorists happy to see the inconvenience they have caused - and it validates in the minds of people throughout the rest of the world that the terrorists are alive and well which is exactly what they want us to believe.
Since there are plenty of US born people who have leanings to terrorism, you can't exclude people based on race or nationality.
we can and should develop the technology to eliminate the threats from wherever they come....
Unless there is clear evidence that there will be more of these types of attacks using the same methods, then all of these knee jerk responses are worthless. If you have evidence that something like this is going to happen again, they you also will have evidence of WHERE it will happen or by whom.... expecting flights from Argentina and Taiwan which carry no one that can even remotely be connected w/ the current terrorist to be treated the same as flights from Europe or the Middle East is completely illogical...
but this validates even more than the amount of information about each traveler and how that information will be analyzed will only grow with every terrorist threat.
26 FCA767: Or having to wait for an attempt to bring one down before Doing the 100% security check
27 Francoflier: Great, another useless knee-jerk reaction that will change nothing but cause more trouble and restrictions for the general public, all because of a t
28 JpetekYXMD80: I wouldn't be so quick to jump on European security measures. This absolutely could have happened anywhere more times than not. It's not a simple thin
29 LHR380: When going thru security at the moment you get the people who set off the alarm for a reason, and the people who set off the alarm as a random pick t
30 JpetekYXMD80: This was not a firecracker... Excluding? Who am I excluding from anything? You can, however, make some educated guesses...
31 Airbuseric: Well, ok understandable. I guess a lot of crew will not comply with this regulation anyway. And if this is a new regulation, then the USA will not se
32 B747forever: Well how about the map function on the PTVs?
33 JpetekYXMD80: For those talking about knee-jerk reactions, how about the knee jerk reaction.. how about you lot thinking that these emergency procedures intended t
34 Luftfahrer: How is this going to work? All hand baggage must be stowed in the overhead bins, and those will be locked one hour before arrival? I guess this funct
35 JpetekYXMD80: Ask yourself one thing, would you be complaining about temporary security measures while we try to get a trip on the scope and characteristics of this
36 JpetekYXMD80: One potential impact down the road could be on domestic luggage fees in the U.S. i think. It is really not a good idea to have the overwhelming amount
37 Miami1: Every reaction has a reaction. knee jerk or otherwise, get used to it , its always going to be a case of everything seems ok then one idiot goes and d
39 WorldTraveler: nobody said "business as usual" What is being said is there is a huge need to fix the problem of being able to bring any type of explosive or incendi
40 Varig md-11: Don't talk to loud or a handcuff manufacturer will try to influence TSA to issue a worldwide recommendation for US bound flights Having worked at AMS
41 LTBEWR: Let us not forget that there were a number of temporary security measures as to all pax aircraft to, from and within the USA just after 9/11 that were
42 RussianJet: Unbelievable. Simply unbelievable. Do you seriously think that this couldn't have happened elsewhere? Words fail me. That is by far the most foolish
43 Varig md-11: That's already the case with the "selectee" procedure from the EU to the US at least The guy was apparently granted a US visa for a "religious" meeti
44 FCA767: I think normal X-rays until Departure Lounge. Then a Ticket Style Queue System while they are waiting and browsing shops for the flight...Calling the
45 WorldTraveler: doesn't solve a thing... as long as the passenger can bring on the ONE thing they want to bring on, you have a problem. it's not a question of specif
46 FCA767: I agree with you...We shouldn't Generalise a country...I got a 2 Litre Bottle of Tropicana through Heathrow and it wasn't even busy. They miss things
47 Readytotaxi: Okay, how about NO carry ons at all, NOT A THING ! Would it really be that bad if you had to check-in everything? (at no extra cost) Security to the g
48 FCA767: Except for Plane spotters Camera's offcourse
49 Francoflier: Yes it does. It is actually the only thing in this thread so far that makes any sense at all. Reducing the amount of carry on would reduce the amount
50 Travellin'man: Israeli security, as most other competent security agencies, uses criminal profiling, which is not the same thing as racial profiling. Criminal profi
51 Lijnden: As I mentioned in 2006 in a topic; I guess where it all finally comes down to is that everybody who is taking a plane will have to strip and hand over
52 Tootallsd: I guess because every reaction to 9/11 and the follow-on attacks has been additive. Building up a massive layer of checks that does not to be proacti
53 Par13del: Since your country is not a colony of the US and they cannot mandate every security screening item you use to screen pax you put on a/c flying into t
54 YYZRWY23: More like leaving controlled Finland.......... This is absolutely foolish. The no touching hand luggage and no moving in aisles is similar to that ru
55 LAXdude1023: I cant imagine why. I mean seriously who hates Finland? Scandinavia is like the one reigion of the world that nobody thinks poorly of. Yep. Thats wha
56 Kaiarahi: Umm - he was issued a U.S. visa, by U.S. authorities, despite being on a U.S. list of people with connections to known terrorists. Guess who messed u
57 Ushermittwoch: When will belts be banned? They are clearly way more dangerous than nail clippers or files. I mean, how difficult is it to strangle somebody with one?
58 CosmicCruiser: Unfortunately all it takes is one stupid moron! Another one of life's laws is that 5% cause all the problems for the other 95%.
59 Par13del: They are not the target, the US is, they would be used as a stepping off point to the US. Reality is somewhat different, because such countries usual
60 YYZRWY23: This was in the Toronto Star? I am shocked that such a paper would publish this absolute trash. Could we see the source please? A quick search of the
61 PanHAM: Many people fly because they work, not for pleasure. Handing out everything from laptop to cellphone to baggage handlers on a two day trip to the US
62 YYZRWY23: Excellent quote! This would not be acceptable to any business person. They would either stop travel and use tele-conferencing or web conferencing or
63 Spencer: I think this is quite interesting that (so far) it's only FIN with any such regulations! Surely this can't be the case? If FIN has to abide by these
64 Kaiarahi: But the agencies here knew and still issued a visa. Whatever profiles exist (and I have no objection to proper criminal/terrorist profiling, not supe
65 Par13del: I may agree with all these thoughts but our American friends may have to correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the general consensus in the US legal
66 Brilondon: It was quoted in the OP. OK AMS is the problem so I will now only avoid AMS and they should just increase security at AMS.
67 Rcair1: I'm sorry - the 9/11 attacks were direct result of terrorist actions. Security did fail to anticipate the approach used by the terrorists, including
68 YYZRWY23: Pardon my ignorance, but what does this acronym means? YYZRWY23
69 Trex8: we really dont know that and there is a big difference between being on a "watch list" and being on some intelligence agency's list of people with co
70 Phoenix9: Air Canada and WestJet have announced tighter security for US bound flights as well: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/0...ational/airlines_security_
71 AVLAirlineFreq: I thought that was called flying in a CRJ....
72 Jeffrey1970: I happen to agree with most everyone else. This could have happened anywhere.
74 Dufo: They failed before, they failed now and they will fail in the future.
75 PanHAM: LOL, yeah, you got a point there. he may have a British passport. In that case he falls under the WV program, Still, he would have been pre-cleared a
76 DocLightning: Yes. INTELLIGENCE and not security is how you stop these things. We, as the American public, need to make it clear that we are not OK with being trea
77 PlymSpotter: Right now I'd say AMS is the safest place to depart from to the US. Do you think they are going to make a mistake like that again? No way, the compan
78 Slinky09: And then an over reaction in response: just what the terrorists want, restrictions on the freedom of the many. IF one US agency issued a visa and ano
79 LTBEWR: DWB = Driving While Black. Up until some very pubic mistakes that caused changes, often dark skinned persons (African-American, African, even some In
80 Ontime: Can someone explain what security he would go through in AMS? If this idiot started his journey in Nigeria, wasn't he just transiting in AMS? Is that
81 Jhooper: Credit goes to the crew and passengers of the flight who stopped the terrorist. That's the only real effective security we have.
82 Slinky09: Virgin Atlantic flights to the US today have the IFE turned off all the way, presumably they have no way to turn the flight map off without the whole
83 Nonrevman: Even this would not be 100% effective. You are also going to have to ban wristwatches in flight as well. If the flight is 8 hours long, then I could
84 WorldTraveler: removing excess baggage changes does not automatically translate into a reduction in carry on luggage. The only thing that will reduce the amount of
85 Par13del: It's early stages in the investigation, one of the reasons for the new Homeland Dept. creation was to ensure that all agencies spoke to each other in
86 Comorin: As mentioned previously, you have security checks right at the gate in AMS, even though the gates are in the secure zone. So transit passengers do ge
87 Kaiarahi: But profiling for criminal/terrorist indications is not. Can someone explain how they screwed up? The guy apparently had the substance attached to hi
88 Devildog2222: I do have to agree with him, though not fully. Anyway security first failed in Nigeria, then it failed big time in Europe. Either they did not put hi
89 Jhooper: Say "hello" to the virtual strip-search machines coming to a TSA checkpoint near you!
90 Hawaiian763: These new rules are absolutely ridiculous and for passengers here in Canada who are flying to the US to have undergo not only a full searchdown at the
91 Kaiarahi: What should they have done to find a substance attached to his body in the crotch area? And would you be willing to have it done to you every time yo
92 Alasdair1982: So, have all the transatlantic airlines removed the moving map feature on the IFE systems?
93 Adambrau: [quote=WorldTraveler,reply=39]Quoting Finnaviation (Reply 7): Finnair got new procedures on flights to US from FAA: All internet connetions banned dur
94 Par13del: Well it has already been mentioned in this thread that 9/11 was a failure of US domestic security, so if they increase domestic security to counter i
95 Slinky09: Virgin Atlantic flights to the US have IFE completely switched off, apparently because people might use the in seat messaging to communicate with eac
96 Motopolitico: I for one believe that it was wrong for Finnair to publicize the additional security measures on USA bound flights. According to CNN, earlier today, "
97 LJ: The Dutch media reports that the person wasn´t on any no-fly list and was pre cleared by US customs.
98 Swiftski: Again, that's like saying "I will never travel domestically in the US. They have failed before, they will fail again"
99 Burnsie28: Sorry but on 9/11 they didn't bring anything illegal through security. Secondly customs is a joke in Europe. Everytime I flew through FRA or AMS, the
100 Mir: First of all, I don't think these rules are permanent - we'll likely see some amendments to them in the coming days and weeks as the threats are evalu
101 Flybyguy: Yay! Yet another knee jerk reaction brought to you by the U.S. Department of Homeland Security! This incident did not happen for lack of security, but
102 Swiftski: Shame. I'm always one to shoot people down for wanting free flights because of broken IFE, but on a day flight it can be a really easy way to pass th
103 NASCARAirforce: What if I have to take a shit an hour before landing from bad airline food? Or wait, do they still feed you on International flights? I guess they wi
104 Mir: I don't need to use that laptop, but I really don't need to lose that laptop. Thus, I carry it on. The passengers would have known, and they would ha
105 MadameConcorde: Reports are that some airlines are now taking all pillows and blankets from passengers one hour before landing.
106 Lewis: I think that as soon as they were communicated to the airlines, the airlines will have to communicate them to their passengers, thus the information
107 Spencer: Coming from an American this really brings home the extent to what kind of manipulation they're willing to hit us with! I say this as I'm 100% sure t
108 Readytotaxi: It goes without saying, how else would we get our trip reports.
109 Agent99nzboi: Sercurity is a joke. as someone posted earlyer, its just a stage act to make you "feel" safe. It is a huge operational cost anbd our airfares would be
110 DUALRATED: correct we must keep the roaches out, if they are not here they cant function within the US. not rocket science
111 ATTart: All, I see in regards to the knee jerk reaction. Is coming from A-netters on this list, in regards to what may or may not happen with security. As, is
112 DAL763ER: Why is AMS Security lax? Or Europe security for that matter? The guy came from Nigeria, and as far as I'm concerned, you don't pass through security
113 JetBlast: Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AMS do screening at the gate? Or is it not screening of all pax?
114 TOGA01: Affirmative - screening in AMS is at the gate in the non-Schengen gate area.[Edited 2009-12-26 10:28:28]
115 DocLightning: Well, given that many of these things have been put in place now, its not knee-jerk. How is turning off IFE going to make us safer? A passenger can t
116 Slinky09: If that really is true, then this is either: a) a Christmas farce b) lunatic are loose in the asylum c) there's a plot to take over the world, not by
117 ATTart: Do, you know for a fact that this is happening on all airlines or flights? So, you are guessing this is what may happen or not? Speculation
118 PanHAM: wrong, that Irish Lady was singled out and detected because Israeli security knew that she had an Atrab boyfriend and they hit the jackpot with that
119 YULWinterSkies: It is rather one stupid moron in charge of airline security causing problems to everyone else. Instead of investigating in depth the security breache
120 Swiftski: air canada now also requiring pax seated for final hour of flight
121 Multimark: Maybe its time pax had to declare their religion before flying. The one thing in common all the men involved in these incidents have had is that they
122 Kiwiandrew: Is that meant to be a serious suggestion ? So , if someone says that they are muslim you are going to refuse to let them fly even though the vast maj
123 Kaiarahi: The other thing they all had in common is that they were men. Hence ban all men from flying. Intelligently used intelligence would work much better -
124 I380North: Describing the constitution with the S word, I hope it is not due to lack of vocabulary but in the heat of the moment reaction. Under normal circumst
126 Avrich: I also don't need to sit in my window seat and watch that laptop fall off the conveyer belt, get kicked around the tarmac and then thrown back up the
127 Brilondon: This is what I am talking about. Thanks for spelling it out Chris. So you can quit trashing my posts thank you.
128 Padster: ..what happens on flights where hand luggage does not fit into overhead lockers on busy flights that have full overhead lockers (such as when people c
129 TheCol: It's really nothing worth bitching about. The new security measures are only in place for a few days.
130 UALWN: It is not illegal at all. Maybe you should consider banning all travel to/from the USA. Either that or moving the whole country to Mars. I have said
131 IrishAyes: We flew CO 1455 from SJO to IAH. We were given an extra pat down in the jetway before boarding the aircraft. Before pushback, the captain announced th
132 PITingres: I minded, and complained. It was obvious from the beginning that 9/11 was a one horse trick. The security measures put in place were bogus theater th
133 Multimark: As some have pointed out El Al already does successful profiling when screening pax. Why should a Presbyterian, causcasian tween from Boston or a a C
134 Par13del: See the entire post below, I was actually defending the document and its strengths in response to a "racial profiling" post, a smiley was also added.
135 Teneriffe77: What I'd like to know is how do they enforce some of these new regulations? I mean if I have my binoculars around my neck they are around my neck not
136 Rcair1: No - it is a deterrent. It forces terrorists to change methods, come up with new techniques, adapt. A terrorist cannot count on a particular security
137 Slinky09: Really. I mean, taking pillows off old ladies an hour before landing is going to stop the next terrorist training camp in Pakistan, right? Not watchi
138 ATTart: I can tell what did happen on a couple of flights that I worked into DCA right after 9/11.. We, had some yahoos who decided not for follow the rules
139 DUALRATED: All travel no, but certain travelers absolutely! Not hard at all especially when you capitulate to terrorist demands.
140 Nonrevman: Hopefully noone has stomach flu, food poisoning, or an upset stomach. Like someone else said, you are going to have more maintenence write ups for se
141 StarAC17: I hope you are right but that nonsense liquid ban is still in effect 3 years after those incidents were thwarted in the summer of 2006. I am going to
142 AirNz: So what's your proposal for those which happen within the US, by US citizens? That's surely not rocket science either, neither is the fact that they
143 FCA767: A good Idea would be to have Business only flights, with Companies registered...so those companies know who their employees are, and you would have n
144 MadameConcorde: Sorry to say, I will keep flying just as much as I have always done, only avoiding any US carrier and US airport as much as possible. I will vote with
145 FCA767: Damn you Yes! we are about 25% of the travelling market There'd be no SXM if it wasn't for us landing there to ironically watch the landings
146 76794p: Can we say bye bye to inflight wifi and the air map on the IFE?
147 PlymSpotter: On a news report I caught earlier it was reported that he was supposedly already barred from flying to the US.
148 Kaiarahi: That was one of my points. The U.S. (not AMS) issued him a visa anyway.
149 DUALRATED: They can and will receive the same treatment as Mr McVeigh, A terrorist is a terrorist where he is from is no factor, however lets be real we know mo
150 Skyhawk62507: What a very "French" response, Madame.
151 Jreuschl: So lighters and matches are still allowed? If so, what are we thinking?
152 Kaiarahi: But true, despite the snide response. And from her many posts all over a.net threads, I don't think she was atttacking the U.S. So take it as a state
153 CosmicCruiser: Yes but any loop hole left ignored will be capitalized on. History repeats itself.
154 Skyhawk62507: It was intended as neither. Merely an observation.
155 FFlyer: Absolutely not true. I carry two passports, and I know numerous people doing the same.
157 FlyingSicilian: To answer some questions above-Dual citizenship is not illegal in the USA nor is having multiple passports. The only stipulation is you must enter the
158 L410Turbolet: I wish we could get a live view from the Al-Qaida HQ (that is if there are any) to see all those jihadists collectively laughing their asses off at th
159 Bahadir: I am not sure if turning IFEs off will be a good solution with the US airlines charging for drinks now.. What was I supposed to do with 10+ hours of f
160 Flyingfox27: Its very scary, and also unfirtunate that AMS is being blamed rather harshly, was BOS security heavily scrutinized after 9/11 happened? If it was me i
161 UALWN: Care to elaborate about that? Just FYI, the Socialist Party had promised to remove all Spanish troops from Iraq if they won the election. They won th
162 NASCARAirforce: Our Lufthansa flight 464 is the only European flight coming in on time today to MCO, everything else is at least an hour late or more. Come on, I pos
163 Aircellist: Well... Terrorists are winning again, flat out.
164 DTWLAX: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukp...ALeqM5iERutEStJ-QQn-jxoMvZxQCFbIkQ Some airlines are telling passengers that new security regulations prohibit
165 Apodino: My thought was, that by putting in all these extra security measures that cost money, this is giving the terrorists exactly what they want. And we are
166 UALWN: I guess you're right. That's just too bad.
167 L410Turbolet: ...as a result of terrorist attack. If not a total capitulation it was nothing less than a huge moral victory for the terrorists, courtesy of Zapater
168 VonRichtofen: Great...more overreaction from the US over an incident that really wasn't that extreme. The guy managed to set the "bomb" off and all it did was burn
169 UALWN: Did you read what I posted? Did you care to go to the library and read the newspapers of the time? Do you have any idea of what you are talking about
170 LipeGIG: Agree 100%. The question is that the failure was not on all airports but all of us have to pay a tribute for that. I'm flying tonight back to the Uni
171 AirNz: Sorry if I'm missing something, but what has IFE turned off and US airlines charging for drinks got to do with each other? Okay, let's be real if you
172 L410Turbolet: Yes. Zapatero doing nothing more than "keeping an election promise" is the desired, official version of the story, I am afraid the PERCEPTION (especi
173 Copter808: Wow, it took an incredibly long time before anyone asked this question. Methinks the original poster forgot the !
174 Airbazar: Excuse me? The guy was on the US no-fly list. Airlines provide the list of passengers to Homeland Security. If HS had done their job this guy wouldn'
175 UALWN: Those are the facts, that's all. Nothing you can write will change them. No appeasement whatsoever. No capitulation whatsoever. Read again what I pos
176 L410Turbolet: I guess we'll have to agree to disagree...
177 Kellmark: There is a lot that we in the public do not know about this very serious incident. What was the nature of the explosive? How was it deployed on his p
178 Avrich: Couldn't agree more. This is completely pointless and hopefully just a knee jerk reaction from some brainless bureaucrat.
179 EMA747: This whole fuss is yet another reason to never fly to America again. S**t happens guys, deal with it. If I want to visit my friend in ZRH I just have
180 ATTart: All, those saying they never want to fly to the America again. Well, then don't!!!!!!!!!! If, you don't like our rules. You don't have to visit!![Edit
181 FCA767: What about all airlines stop flying...that will stop the stupid rules as they won't have a job...and then startup again as private charters
182 Jhooper: What's to stop a terrorist from blowing up a plane an hour and a half before landing now?
184 Slinky09: True. Unlike the billions and billions wasted on ineffectual security run by buffoons who say you can't pee in the last hour or a flight!
185 UALWN: Except this is not a matter of opinion, but of just knowing (or wanting to know, or wanting to accept) the facts.
186 MSPNWA: I believe this reaction is exactly what was planned. It's the old "problem-reaction-solution" model. That aviation is always targeted saddens me. Wha
187 CokePopper: Way to generalize huh? your so smart to know what every American is thinking and feeling Canada huh? hmmmmmm
188 Slinky09: The worst you can do is become re-isolationist. Please don't. Some of us vist the US because we have to (work) and we like to (friends and vacation).
189 Skyhawk62507: Now is the time for passenger rights groups to rise up, run to the nearest microphones and essentially tell the US government "it's all right, we'll h
190 ATTart: I agree with you about the US. But I will not stand by a let someone bash my country. I was responding to the person who said that he would not come
191 B727fan: I think its rather sad that instead of putting in place a comprehensive screening system, upgrade of the technology and proper training, we are now lo
192 Skyhawk62507: With so many other countries willing to openly scold us for our behavior, I truly wonder why the United States shouldn't adopt exactly that philosoph
193 USAirALB: and if the elderly woman flying who cant control her bladder will now get in trouble for letting it go. And next...all pax will have to where those s
194 Multimark: Ah yes, the classic knee-jerk reaction. Nevermind the jobs that will be lost in the US transportation, tourism and hospitality industries, already re
195 ATTart: Yes, I am responding to the knee jerk reaction to the person who posted this below. [Edited 2009-12-26 14:56:17]
196 LXA340: There is Europe and there is europe, just because security doesn't do their job at AMS it doesn't mean that the rest of europe has bad security contr
197 UALWN: The USA cannot drill its way out of the oil dependence on the Middle East, and you know that. Energy efficiency and new technologies may achieve that
198 Trex8: feel sorry for those guys on the YYZ-ORD flight! might as well strap them in with chains till they arrive but then the terrorist will be able to look
199 EMA747: I don't really think it was knee jerk. Last time I flew around the world the into and out of US was by FAR the most annoying part of the whole 10+ fl
200 ATTart: Again, I was responding to the people who keep bashing the US. If, they don't like our country don't visit.
201 Skyhawk62507: You're right, I do know that and should have chosen my words more carefully. A combination of drilling, new tech and perhaps rationing/high prices wo
202 Trex8: if you want to get those 2 million barrels/day of oil the extra drilling is supposed to get us, all the Prez has to do is sign an executive order pre
203 ATTart: I agree with you about security, it can be a joke. Also, some of the new rules are a joke. How much fun do you think it is going for us crew to have
204 UALWN: I find myself agreeing with you more and more. Scary thought!
205 Trex8: so Obama (or replace with any US politician of any political leaning you like) would be better??? unless we have El Al level security everything else
206 FriendlySkies: The sad thing is the technology to detect these explosives exist, the machines are just very expensive. My question is, if we can afford to spend bill
207 Skyhawk62507: Ha! Same here... hey, we have different beliefs and approaches but we're on the same team. We (and everyone else posting here) want this problem solv
208 MtnWest1979: LOL, I agree. Or better yet, I bet they could FEEL plane descending lol. Also, if this had been successful, it would have been better for flying publ
209 Trex8: Because KBR, Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Boeing, General Dynamics etc etc have shareholders to pay so we the US taxpayer has to foot the bill,
210 Boeing4ever: Oh really? Then explain these... No Madame, something is wrong with people who bring explosives on airliners. B4e-Forever New Frontiers
211 Srbmod: Since a number of you want to turn this thread into a political discussion, which by the way are not allowed in Civ-Av, this thread is now locked. If
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