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Top 5 US Cities For Int Travelers VS Hubs?  
User currently offlineMudboy From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1167 posts, RR: 5
Posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6197 times:

While reading the other thread about how US hubs were formed it got me thinking. What are the top 5 US destinations for International travelers, and what are the top 5 hubs? And I do not mean ATL as the destination, because they were on a flight from say FCO-ATL-JAN. I know that ATL is the biggest and busiest hub in the states, but if it were not for the DL Hub, how many Int travelers would actually fly into ATL? What I am getting at, is that back in the early days, the obvious destinations would have been NYC, LA, MIA, and Chicago, so one might think that the airlines would have chosen those cities as hubs, which some did. Yet there are others, that made more sense from a geographic standpoint, such as DFW, ATL, STL, DEN, SLC, none of which would be in the top 5 for O&D traffic. The one exception would be the obvious ORD. Please enlighten me? Now please keep in mind, I am speaking only of international travel.

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4714 posts, RR: 50
Reply 1, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6181 times:

So summarizing, you are looking for O/D and connecting traffic figures for international passengers of US airports.


For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineJfkgaylga From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 6058 times:

You kind of answered your own question.  Smile

Nothing scientific here, but the top spots that international visitors come to in the US are:

NYC (Largest City, Financial/Cultural/Entertainment/Fashion/Media/TV Captial)
LAX (Second Largest City, Hollywood)
MIA (Unofficial Capital of Latin America)
LAS (Adult Playground)
MCO (Family Playground)
CHI (Third Largest City, Important business center)
WAS (US government)

NYC has a CO hub at EWR and a DL/B6/AA hub at JFK
LAX has a UA hub
MIA is an AA hub
LAS and MCO really don't have an int'l hub. (WN has a hub, but that's outside the scope of the thread)
ORD has UA and AA
IAD has UA

None of these hubs (short of UA and AA at ORD) are the truly large mega-hubs.

PilotPJ


User currently offlineFlytravel From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 873 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6011 times:

SFO and SEA must be popular as well, esp. for those flying over the Pacific.

User currently offlineItalianFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1099 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5984 times:

I would venture to guess that BOS, following the 'not a hub but major xfer/O&D' criteria is up there on the list.... as would MCO.

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26013 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5810 times:

Top US airport gateways in foreign passenger arrivals - 2008.

JFK - 21,952,364
LAX - 16,153,392
MIA - 15,665,875
ORD - 11,015,251
EWR - 10,923,162
ATL - 9,218,205
SFO - 8,353,143
IAH - 7.577.523
IAD - 5.,978,374
DFW - 4,828,654

Source DOT



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineGilesdavies From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 3047 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5738 times:

How about Orlando Sanford (I think its code is SFB)?

Even though in the grand scheme of things not a major airport by comparison to other US airports... It is serviced by several of the major UK charter airlines and brings the Brits and the Irish to sample the delights of Disney!

Monarch, Thomas Cook and Thomson Airways fly to the folloing destinations between them to:

BFS, BHX, BRS, CWL, DUB, EMA, GLA, LGW, LTN, MAN, NCL amd SNN

Also Icelandair connect Europe with SFB through KEF.

With several plane loads of Brits each holding 300+ passengers, this must bolster the figures and be one of the larger airports to receive international travellers without being a hub.


User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17122 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5711 times:



Quoting Jfkgaylga (Reply 2):
LAX has a UA hub

Can one really call UAs operations at LAX as a hub?



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineJfkgaylga From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5612 times:

I think UA still calls LA a hub. They're shrinking so fast, it's hard to keep up though.

Pilot PJ


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26013 posts, RR: 50
Reply 9, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5549 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 7):
Can one really call UAs operations at LAX as a hub?

Well they have about ~180 daily departures.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineNYC2theworld From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 666 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 5384 times:



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 5):
Top US airport gateways in foreign passenger arrivals - 2008.

JFK - 21,952,364
LAX - 16,153,392
MIA - 15,665,875
ORD - 11,015,251
EWR - 10,923,162
ATL - 9,218,205
SFO - 8,353,143
IAH - 7.577.523
IAD - 5.,978,374
DFW - 4,828,654

Do these numbers include connecting passengers?



Always wonderers if this "last and final boarding call" is in fact THE last and final boarding call.
User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6184 posts, RR: 24
Reply 11, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 5384 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 7):

LAX is still a United hub. As LAXintl said they are at 180 daily with 110 being SkyWest. Compare that with the Pacific hub at SFO with about 240 daily and SkyWest with an average of 126 daily. Also LAX serves multiple foreign countries from LAX so I would most definitely call it a hub.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26013 posts, RR: 50
Reply 12, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 5312 times:



Quoting NYC2theworld (Reply 10):
Do these numbers include connecting passengers?

The numbers are the total of international arrivals at the respective listed airport.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33182 posts, RR: 71
Reply 13, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 5281 times:

For 2009, with the drop in trans-Pacific travel, MIA has overtaken LAX as the #2 for total international traffic after JFK. International traffic at MIA has only dropped 1% this year.


a.
User currently offlineEADC8 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 4817 times:

I know I'm stating the obvious, but if you combine JFK and EWR's numbers, you are looking at almost 33,000,000 intl passengers. More than double the second place city.


721 722 731 732 733 73G 741 742 744 752 753 762 764 DC8 DC9 MD80 DC10 L1011 A300 A319 A320 A332
User currently offlineFlyMIA From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7242 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4556 times:



Quoting EADC8 (Reply 14):
I know I'm stating the obvious, but if you combine JFK and EWR's numbers, you are looking at almost 33,000,000 intl passengers. More than double the second place city.

Yes and given this years 2nd place is MIA with a metro area of a bit over 5,400,000 people and NYC with 19,006,798 million people it makes sense. Also Miami has FLL so add about 2.9 million international passengers for FLL also.
LA is metro population is 12,872,808 but has more O/D percentage then EWR and JFK as there is no "major" hub in LAX unlike CO in EWR or DL in JFK.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineFlytravel From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 873 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4507 times:

JFK and EWR also are popular for those from Philadelphia metro region. I think 20 years ago people would drive to JFK, but now there are more int'l options from EWR, and that drive is more tolerable from Philadelphia. I'd assume areas in upstate NY, CT, NE PA also are drive to NY airport distance, then back home the same day, as well.

Also now Boltbus makes it easy to get from Baltimore to NY, and low costs airlines (B6) make connections to JFK equivalent to shuttle service.

Myself, I dislike having to drop family at EWR for an int'l flight, as the drive up and back down consumes a good amount of day (where I have to take off from work if its a weekday), so we look for PHL first, but it's definitely doable otherwise.

[Edited 2009-12-27 18:53:27 by flytravel]

User currently offlineFlyMIA From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7242 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4379 times:



Quoting Flytravel (Reply 16):
JFK and EWR also are popular for those from Philadelphia metro region

This is true JFK and EWR bascially server all of NY,CT and a good amount of NJ too. While airports like MIA and LAX serve their metro areas and thats it. But MIA is also a large international hub unlike LAX.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7681 posts, RR: 17
Reply 18, posted (4 years 11 months 17 hours ago) and read 2982 times:

The number of passengers flying between LHR and the top ten US gateway airports will not answer the question but probably will confirm many of the responses already given and may help fwith the production of further estimates.

Here are the (provisional) figures published by the British CAA for last month (November 2009):

JFK: 197,797 (21.9%)
LAX: 89,839 (10.0%)
ORD: 79,003 (8.8%)
EWR: 75,881 (8.4%)
MIA: 72,859 (8.1%)
IAD: 71,652 (8.0%)
BOS: 58,108 (6.4%)
SFO: 57,310 (6.4%)
IAH: 39,247 (4.4%)
DFW: 32,465 (3.6%)

Other: 127,072 (14.1%)

Total: 901,233 (100.0%)


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7757 posts, RR: 25
Reply 19, posted (4 years 11 months 16 hours ago) and read 2893 times:



Quoting VV701 (Reply 18):
The number of passengers flying between LHR and the top ten US gateway airports will not answer the question but probably will confirm many of the responses already given and may help fwith the production of further estimates.

Are these O&D numbers or total numbers? Are these numbers for November only or by quarter?



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User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7681 posts, RR: 17
Reply 20, posted (4 years 11 months 16 hours ago) and read 2834 times:

The numbers quoted in Reply 16 are the total number of passengers arriving from the listed airports at LHR and departing from LHR on flights to the listed airports between 1 and 30 November inclusive.

The figures will therefore include passengers departing from the listed American airports on 31 October (who will have arrived at LHR on 1 November) and exclude those departing from the same airports on 30 November (who will not have arrived at LHR until 1 December).


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26013 posts, RR: 50
Reply 21, posted (4 years 11 months 15 hours ago) and read 2805 times:

The numbers are total passengers, not pure O&D.

multitude of airport, airline and route statistics from the CAA is available at http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=80&pagetype=90



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineCODCAIAH From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 177 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (4 years 11 months 15 hours ago) and read 2754 times:

I'd be really curious, too, to know the largest international O&D airports in the US. Places like HNL, PHX or LAS (Grand Canyon, Las Vegas, etc.), MSY, MCO, DEN would probably be pretty high on the list -- next to heavy int'l premium traffic/business destinations like IAH, NYC, and LAX -- as these are nearby lots of popular tourist destinations.


CO/IAH-loyalist happily driven into the arms of WN/HOU
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26013 posts, RR: 50
Reply 23, posted (4 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 2716 times:



Quoting CODCAIAH (Reply 22):
I'd be really curious, too, to know the largest international O&D airports in the US

A list was posted here prior, suggest you search the archives.

But as I recall LAS was the #1 domestic O&D airport. If international traffic is added in then LAX is the nations #1 O&D airport. However if overall market and not specific airports are considered then NYC is the nations largest O&D market.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineKleiner From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 144 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (4 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 2715 times:

The original question was international O&D traffic vs Largest Hub Traffic. Does anyone have this?

User currently offlineFlyDeltaJets87 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 25, posted (4 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 2698 times:



Quoting Jfkgaylga (Reply 2):
None of these hubs (short of UA and AA at ORD) are the truly large mega-hubs.

Why wouldn't you consider MIA a mega-hub for AA? What MIA lacks on the domestic side compared to ORD it makes up for on the int'l side. And why not IAD for UA?


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