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DL Adds SLC-FAI (follows F9's DEN-FAI)  
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7037 posts, RR: 13
Posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6106 times:

Delta will add SLC-FAI in June. They have not flown the route since 2008. The service will be 5 per week which is one more per week than F9's just announced FAI-DEN service. F9 starts a few weeks earlier, but they both end on virtually the same day (Labor Day).

This is prettty clearly a response to F9 which is interesting in that DL code shares with YX which isn't even an airline any more, but is actually a cobbled together fleet of Republic and Frontier aircraft. This would imply that the relationship is not so cozy in that this is how they treat AirTran, for example.

It is loaded on delta.com.

[Edited 2010-01-04 08:26:40 by enilria]

36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10351 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6053 times:



Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
This is prettty clearly a response to F9 which is interesting in that DL code shares with YX which isn't even an airline any more, but is actually a cobbled together fleet of Republic and Frontier aircraft.

I don't see where YX is a codeshare partner, any longer....I see AS, American Eagle, China Airlines and Royal Air Maroc. This is from Delta.com



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6521 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6023 times:

Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):
I don't see where YX is a codeshare partner, any longer....I see AS, American Eagle, China Airlines and Royal Air Maroc. This is from Delta.com

There are still some DL/YX codeshare flights hanging around in the GDS...here's one I just found.


1 *DL 4225 /FAY MSYMCO 0615 1141 D95 1 06APR
BMHQKLUT
2 *YX 4326 /CYB MSYMCO 0615 1141 D95 1 06APR04SEP
HVQKWMTROP
3+ NW 7226 FPY MSYMCO 0615 1141 D95 1 06APR
BMHQVLTK

[Edited 2010-01-04 08:43:56]

User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7037 posts, RR: 13
Reply 3, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6020 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):
I don't see where YX is a codeshare partner, any longer....I see AS, American Eagle, China Airlines and Royal Air Maroc. This is from Delta.com

Was it there before? Hmm...maybe it's gone already. I haven't seen that discussed. Republic was talking loosely about being in SkyTeam a few weeks ago. Not sure how serious that was, though.


User currently offlineCrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 698 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5958 times:

DL already flies to FAI twice daily from MSP in the summer. Is this new service in addition to that? If so, will be MSP flights be kept at twice daily?

User currently offlineFrostbite From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 396 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5949 times:

I am pretty sure that DL's SLC-FAI service was already loaded before F9 announced its DEN service.

Quoting Crosswinds21 (Reply 4):
If so, will be MSP flights be kept at twice daily?

Yes, MSP will be served twice daily through peak summer with 757s. Once daily during shoulder periods (May/Sept), I think.


User currently offlineCrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 698 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5919 times:



Quoting Frostbite (Reply 5):
Yes, MSP will be served twice daily through peak summer with 757s. Once daily during shoulder periods (May/Sept), I think.

That's good. I make semi regular trips to Alaska for the hiking. I foresee myself possibly non revving on a DL flight to and/or from FAI this summer.  Smile


User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10351 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5902 times:



Quoting Crosswinds21 (Reply 6):
I foresee myself possibly non revving on a DL flight to and/or from FAI this summer.

Good luck with that. Not sure how the flights are, out of MSP, but trying to non-rev to ANC or FAI out of SLC, in the summer, is miserable.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineSNCntry32 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 1516 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5861 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 7):
Good luck with that. Not sure how the flights are, out of MSP, but trying to non-rev to ANC or FAI out of SLC, in the summer, is miserable.

It is pretty bad. Last I knew ANC was 3x a day on the 753 in MSP, FAI varies from 1x 2x a day out of MSP too.

I have a feeling that MSP FAI will take a hit in favor for the new SLC FAI service since DL will have to 'right size' these flights.



Long Live Memphis!
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10351 posts, RR: 14
Reply 9, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5825 times:

Are the services MSP-FAI, seasonal? For awhile, SLC-FAI was all year long, then it was seasonal, then dropped altogether, then back to seasonal.


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7037 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5826 times:



Quoting Frostbite (Reply 5):
I am pretty sure that DL's SLC-FAI service was already loaded before F9 announced its DEN service.

Nope, it was loaded the week between Christmas and New Years. Some DL routes have been blinking on/off, but I watching things pretty closely and I haven't seen it loaded before.


Quoting Crosswinds21 (Reply 4):
DL already flies to FAI twice daily from MSP in the summer.

Didn't say new station, said new route...

Quoting SNCntry32 (Reply 8):
I have a feeling that MSP FAI will take a hit in favor for the new SLC FAI service since DL will have to 'right size' these flights.

Probably, which is why I think this is definitely retaliatory. The MSP services makes more sense/cents. Clearly they didnt even fly it last year so it must be worse than MSP and now it has competition from F9...and lower fares. So this is not a decision made with profitability as the primary goal. Maybe AS will jump into DEN-FAI just to make it more fun.


User currently offlineMKENut From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 699 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5784 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):
I don't see where YX is a codeshare partner, any longer....I see AS, American Eagle, China Airlines and Royal Air Maroc. This is from Delta.com

I thought it was a one way code share agreement. YX can put their code on DL flights but not the other way around.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25008 posts, RR: 85
Reply 12, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5765 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting MKENut (Reply 11):
I thought it was a one way code share agreement. YX can put their code on DL flights but not the other way around.

 checkmark 

That's what it was - I don't know where it stands now. I'm surprised if that still exists, but apparently it does.

I wonder for how long?

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineMKENut From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 699 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5727 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 12):
That's what it was - I don't know where it stands now. I'm surprised if that still exists, but apparently it does.

I wonder for how long?

Just checked on Midwestairlines.com and through the code share with Delta you can fly MKE - FAI. The Delta code share flight is more expensive than the Frontier code share flight to FAI.


User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7037 posts, RR: 13
Reply 14, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5678 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 12):
I wonder for how long?

We agree on that.


User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10351 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5598 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 10):
Didn't say new station, said new route...

Well, even SLC-FAI isn't a new route.......just hadn't been used in awhile.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineCrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 698 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5566 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 7):
Good luck with that. Not sure how the flights are, out of MSP, but trying to non-rev to ANC or FAI out of SLC, in the summer, is miserable.

I was easily able to non rev to and from FAI this past June...took AS SEA-FAI there and DL FAI-MSP back. Both flights we half empty and DL even gave me an F seat. Although, I was told later by several people that the FAI-MSP flight being that empty was an anomaly.


User currently offlineGentFromAlaska From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3052 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5488 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 15):
Well, even SLC-FAI isn't a new route.......just hadn't been used in awhile.

Late Semptember 1996 to be exact. DL flew SLC-LAX-SEA-JNU-FAI. RON in FAI.



Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
User currently offlineOcracoke From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 680 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5447 times:



Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
This is prettty clearly a response to F9

Conspiracy theory again?  Wink

Yet another DL response to another airline invading their turf?

DL has flown to FAI in the past, first as part of the WA merger until the late '90s, then recently, a SLC-FAI seasonal summer flight since 2004 (or maybe it was 2005?) This is not a new route, and certainly not a response to F9.


User currently offlineGentFromAlaska From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3052 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5275 times:

I think DL untimely announcement of seasonal service is their attempt to pardon the pun, kill two birds with one stone. Lets not forget AS inaugurated service between SEA-ATL in late October. Even though DL and AS are code-share "partners". All is fair in love and war.

A few pro's and con's I see. F9 offers IFE for until the satellites quit receiving, about two hours from FAI. F9 service from DEN will roughly be an hour longer DEN being on the opposite side of the Rockies on smaller A319-A320 vs DL 757. The flying public will decide, After price it will ultimately be about service. My wife was not thrilled with her last DL flight.



Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8894 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5248 times:



Quoting Crosswinds21 (Reply 16):
Although, I was told later by several people that the FAI-MSP flight being that empty was an anomaly.

Getting up to FAI this past summer was pretty easy - coach went out full, but First had about 8 passengers in it - I was on a coach award ticket and was easily upgraded into F. This was mid-June at summer solstice, so pretty much peak time.

ANC-MSP on the way down wasn't bad either - I again cleared on an award ticket upgrade, and an AS MVP (not Gold) was sitting next to me down to MSP, and we had a few opens in the back.


User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9289 posts, RR: 14
Reply 21, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5236 times:



Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 19):
DL 757

738



yep.
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7037 posts, RR: 13
Reply 22, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5193 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 15):
Well, even SLC-FAI isn't a new route.......just hadn't been used in awhile.

If your definition of a new route is a route that has never been flown before I'll have to consult the 100 year flight plan database before posting anything else.  Smile

Quoting Ocracoke (Reply 18):
This is not a new route, and certainly not a response to F9.

If you haven't flown a route in 2 years it is new. Give me a break.

They added it 10 days after F9 and didn't fly it the prior year. Who is drinking the Kool-Aid?


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8894 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5175 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 22):

They added it 10 days after F9 and didn't fly it the prior year. Who is drinking the Kool-Aid?

Given that it was being flown 2x daily out of MSP in a year when the economy was in the absolute tank, and it's back now on approximately the same basis as it was before hand with an improved economy, it's not a huge surprise.

The MSP hub competes quite well with most of the markets that Frontier will be connecting. The SLC service adds in some connectivity from the Rockies area, but not a whole lot of extra traffic. In addition, it can connect some of the West Coast in, as SAN/LAX-SLC-FAI isn't a horrible routing (though AS via SEA will still be the preferred option).

This is about giving more options to FAI for Delta - if Delta's seeing good loads on it's current MSP-FAI bookings, then they could do three options:
(a) Upgauge MSP-FAI to a 757-300 (which might not be the most effective use of that plane, given that there might be other markets that need it more)
(b) Add a third frequency to MSP-FAI
(c) Resume SLC-FAI

Assuming an upgauge isn't the best option (limited number of 753s and MSP-FAI-MSP is a long turn, looking at 12 hours minimum), adding SLC-FAI and adding new markets to connect into FAI is much preferable on paper than a third MSP-FAI frequency.

Delta is also the second largest carrier into Alaska - 8 flights into Anchorage during the summer, 3 now into FAI for 11 daily flights (as well as 3 year-round flights, two more than any other non-AS competitor), plus the code-sharing/FFP arrangements between Delta and Alaska will drive customers to Delta as well.


User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10351 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5168 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 22):

If your definition of a new route is a route that has never been flown before I'll have to consult the 100 year flight plan database before posting anything else.

Perhaps you should because you have a different definition of "new" than most of us do.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
25 Knope2001 : Delta flew SLC-FAI nonstop during summer for several years in the 2000's, including as recently as 2008, but was pulled from the 2009 summer schedule
26 Post contains images Ocracoke : First you say this: Then you say this: Well, which one is it? If you yourself admit that SLC-FAI hasn't been flown for 2 years now, then how can you s
27 DeltAirlines : I'll also add in another theory as to why it did not run last season - last summer was the first summer under which the merger had been finalized. In
28 KingFriday013 : I noticed these are all operated on DC-9-50 aircraft ("D95"). Does (did?) YX still have DC-9 classics (i.e. non-80 series)? I thought they went all M
29 Jeffrey1970 : That is good news for the people of Fairbanks that an LCC such as F9 is going to fly there. That should help bring fares down a bit to the lower 48.
30 SANFan : Agree completely with you Knope'. Pulling the flight from this summer's seasonal offerings made sense, as does trying it again next year. The timing
31 Mayor : Yes, the flight is operated by NW on a DC-9-50.
32 UAL757 : If DL and AS would just work out reciprocal upgrades for elites then maybe SEA-SLC-FAI would be a nice way to route to Fairbanks (especially since AS
33 Slcdeltarumd11 : DL/F9/UA compete for alot of the same western connecting traffic in DEN/SLC. Not sure who was first or simply a coincidence but im sure they have both
34 Post contains links Mariner : But maybe they are only bringing fares down on the days that they fly - at least on DEN-FAI: http://www.alaskadispatch.com/voices...ravel-guru/3594-f
35 GentFromAlaska : I think DL announcement to increase checked baggage fees, if I understood correctly $2 for the first bag and a $3. for the second each way might help
36 Slcdeltarumd11 : DL could be trying to defend its turf it is a major player in the FAI and Alaska market and it could be extremely profitable......since the timing was
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