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YX Announces MCI-CMH/MSY  
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 50
Posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2979 times:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Midwes...s-Announces-bw-4159975769.html?x=0

CMH service...6X weekly on E190...begins 5/3/10.
MSY service...daily on E170...begins 5/20/10.

23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7191 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2967 times:

MSY will be OK. I don't think CMH will work. It's too short a market to have once per day service and it's on an E190 which is too big.

User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 50
Reply 2, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2942 times:

Wasn't MCI-CMH a former YX route as well, or am I dreaming here?

User currently offlineMKENut From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 699 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2932 times:

If I remember right, Midwest left MSY because of Hurricane Katrina?

User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 50
Reply 4, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2919 times:

Quoting MKENut (Reply 3):
If I remember right, Midwest left MSY because of Hurricane Katrina?

Yeah that's right. They were doing double daily 717's to MCI seasonally if I remember correctly. CO was handling the check-in.

Actually this is a big milestone as now all the U.S carriers who were flying to MSY before Katrina will have all returned once YX and F9 touches down. Pretty big milestone.


User currently offlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5582 posts, RR: 28
Reply 5, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2867 times:

Somebody's itch is getting scratched today.  

I like MSY, but I don't know one way or the other if CMH would work. Nice news nonetheless.

-Dave



Next Trip: SEA-ABQ-SEA on Alaska
User currently offlineboydatageek From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2820 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 1):
MSY will be OK. I don't think CMH will work. It's too short a market to have once per day service and it's on an E190 which is too big.

I think the CMH route is based upon the thought that long-term they want to re-enter and right now they had extra E190 downtime for that aircraft. In that case, the "ownership costs" of the aircraft is "free" and all they have to cover is the operating costs to increase the profitability. The alternatives would most likely to A.) Sit the plane, B.) Do a Red-eye west coast round-trip route, or C.) fly it on a route like this.

I expect that CMH will morph into a 3X on a smaller aircraft soon, and the E190 allocation will change with the next seasonal schedule change.

Having said that, I would have preferred SAT coming back with this aircraft slot.


User currently offlineflyCMH From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 2282 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2784 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 2):

Wasn't MCI-CMH a former YX route as well

You are indeed correct. The route was served twice daily on Skywest CR2s. This was at the same time that multiple CRJ routes were being flown from MCI, such as PIT, MSN, and I believe AUS. I was able to glimpse at the loads for the flights often while they existed and they seemed to do well; there was a noticeably good proportion of O&D to Kansas City for certain. My impression is that the route was cancelled moreso due to the rather grave problems that were going on with Midwest at the time than the route's actual performance.

I will agree, though while it will be nice having the E190 here on a regular rotation from a spotter's percpective, that the size aircraft is a bit overkill. It's my sincere hope that it does well, but second frequency and smaller aircraft is definitely needed. It's possible that the E190 was chosen to rotate the aircraft and crew into another base, but in that case why not just offer a E170.

Either way, I'm excited to see the return of this service, as well as MSY. There's no doubt in my mind that MCI-MSY will do well, though I must say I'm surprised MKE didn't come first. MKE-MSY is a rather large city pair to not be served by neither Midwest nor AirTran. Maybe this is the first step in seeing the former make an attempt at the market, as a daily E70/E90 to MSY would no doubt be a hit.


User currently onlinekingcavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1306 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2747 times:

I like the timing on the MSY-MCI flight. F9 only had the one flight to DEN scheduled at 550P. This morning flight from MSY-MCI will allow connections to DEN and other cities for people that want to leave MSY earlier in the day.


Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineItalianFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1099 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2712 times:

Does RJET have a 190 line mx coming online in CMH? I noticed this is an RON and am wondering if they are just rotating planes through and making the flight live for the heck of it  

User currently offlineDeltaRules From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3771 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting flyCMH (Reply 7):
You are indeed correct. The route was served twice daily on Skywest CR2s.


Didn't Skybus run CMH-MCI for a time simultaneously with YX & even with the ULCC competition, YX was able to hold their own on the route?



Let's Kick the Tires & Light the Fires!!
User currently offlineflyCMH From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 2282 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2610 times:

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 10):
Didn't Skybus run CMH-MCI for a time simultaneously with YX

That is correct.

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 10):
even with the ULCC competition, YX was able to hold their own on the route?

To be completely honest, I am not completely sure. I was able to monitor Midwest's loads until around the time that Skybus started. Though from what I had heard, Skybus' existance did negatively impact Midwest's ability to serve the route. So I should have added in my post that my experience on the viability of the route was prior to Skybus' entrance. Though again, Skybus was more than likely a second factor in the route's closing 2 years ago.


User currently offlineRJNUT From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1222 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2584 times:

Quoting ItalianFlyer (Reply 9):
Does RJET have a 190 line mx coming online in CMH? I noticed this is an RON and am wondering if they are just rotating planes through and making the flight live for the heck of it

that was what i was thinking as well!


User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25260 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2558 times:
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Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 5):
Somebody's itch is getting scratched today.

Who can you mean? LOL.

I think MCI-MSY is pretty good idea - I was surprised they brought back DEN-MSY when they had this opportunity but I agree with KingCavalier in post #8.

But I really like MCI-CMH.  

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 50
Reply 14, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2549 times:

Quoting mariner (Reply 13):
Who can you mean? LOL.

I can think of a few people lol

Actually this news brought me out of quasi a.net retirement. Thanks YX!


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7191 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2335 times:

Quoting boydatageek (Reply 6):
In that case, the "ownership costs" of the aircraft is "free" and all they have to cover is the operating costs to increase the profitability.

I understand that argument, but you can keep telling yourself that and all the sudden you have a money-losing an airline.  
Quoting boydatageek (Reply 6):
I expect that CMH will morph into a 3X on a smaller aircraft soon

That would probably be better. I agree.

Quoting mariner (Reply 13):
I think MCI-MSY is pretty good idea - I was surprised they brought back DEN-MSY when they had this opportunity but I agree with KingCavalier in post #8.

What's really funny is that this MCI-MSY starts before DEN-MSY doesn't it? DEN-MSY was announced almost a year in advance for some oddball reason. It gave WN plenty of time to announce another roundtrip...which they did.

On another note, while the DEN strategy looks very little like the old DEN strategy in terms of route network growth, the "YX" strategy is starting to look very much like the old YX strategy. They keep adding back "classics" from the YX growth era. It's important to note that the VP of Revenue at Republic, Aretakis, was the Planning VP at F9 and YX. It's also important to note that YX (as a company) lost a boatload of money before when they were flying all these routes they are adding back. Now there is even more competition and the economy is worse (fuel is lower, though), so it is hard to imagine things will be better.

More and more I'm seeing YX/F9 as a dumping ground for idled regional aircraft and moreso crew (but with different aircraft). While that's not a bad thing, it's having the effect of causing a lot of growth at YX/F9. One of the analysts posed that exact questions on the call and its a good one. When YX started growing too fast they lost too much money. When F9 started growing too fast they lose too much money. What's different now? PHF instead of ACA. SBA instead of FAR. Same song, different notes. I think they need to watch the growth rate. How many stations have they committed to opening so far this year? 6, 7, 8?


User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25260 posts, RR: 85
Reply 16, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2314 times:
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Quoting enilria (Reply 15):
I think they need to watch the growth rate. How many stations have they committed to opening so far this year? 6, 7, 8?

I thought it was a couple more than that, but you could be right - I haven't been keeping count.

Maybe you are subtracting the dropped cities from the total?  

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlinen917me From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 730 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2160 times:

The CMH-MCI on the 190 is actually a thru flight to SEA which should do well, especially for Alaska cruise season. On the return, MCI-CMH actually is a thru flight as well.. SFO-MCI-CMH.

User currently offlineboydatageek From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1962 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 15):
It's also important to note that YX (as a company) lost a boatload of money before when they were flying all these routes they are adding back. Now there is even more competition and the economy is worse (fuel is lower, though), so it is hard to imagine things will be better.

But that was with a very different equipment/cost mix.

Quoting enilria (Reply 15):
Quoting boydatageek (Reply 6):
In that case, the "ownership costs" of the aircraft is "free" and all they have to cover is the operating costs to increase the profitability.

I understand that argument, but you can keep telling yourself that and all the sudden you have a money-losing an airline.

I absolutely agree. On a broader scale, cost accounting for hub ' n spoke routes is soooo dificult to do! Its not an accident that two of the most profitable carriers ALGT and RYAN in Europe run 100% O/D routes. Everything is clean, you know whats working and what isn't. In a hub, EVERYTHING is dependant upon how you have ALLOCATED both the revenue and costs!

[Edited 2010-02-25 19:39:31]

User currently offlineMSYPI7185 From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 710 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1822 times:

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 5):
Somebody's itch is getting scratched today

And it feels sooooo good.

Now if we could only get TACA to get back here!

Quoting enilria (Reply 15):
What's really funny is that this MCI-MSY starts before DEN-MSY doesn't it? DEN-MSY was announced almost a year in advance for some oddball reason. It gave WN plenty of time to announce another roundtrip...which they did.

This may be unrelated but now UA is running a 757 to DEN in the afternoon at 1450 IIRC. The inbound leg runs basically on top of one of WN's DEN-MSY flights. Do not know about WN outbound right off hand though.

MD


User currently offlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5582 posts, RR: 28
Reply 20, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1821 times:

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 5):
Somebody's itch is getting scratched today.
Quoting mariner (Reply 13):
Who can you mean? LOL.
Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 14):
I can think of a few people lol
Quoting MSYPI7185 (Reply 19):
And it feels sooooo good.

Wow, I think there's been an outbreak of Poison Oak!  

-Dave



Next Trip: SEA-ABQ-SEA on Alaska
User currently offlineLV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 2005 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1788 times:

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 5):
I like MSY, but I don't know one way or the other if CMH would work.

Doesn't RP have a crew base and some MX at CMH? I'm thinking this is just a way to rotate planes and crew.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23014 posts, RR: 20
Reply 22, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1626 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 15):
When YX started growing too fast they lost too much money.

To where was that expansion? Wasn't the majority of it (by ASMs, maybe not by flights/cities) to leisure destinations? Seems like that might have been part of the problem...



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineDeltaRules From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3771 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1528 times:

Quoting LV (Reply 21):
Doesn't RP have a crew base and some MX at CMH?

They sure do. I wondered if that might have had something to do with them running the 190 on the route.

[Edited 2010-02-26 15:29:32]


Let's Kick the Tires & Light the Fires!!
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