OP3000 From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 1790 posts, RR: 2 Posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 5839 times:
Finnair is in talks with Norwegian Air Shuttle regarding a possible commercial pact between both carriers. The point of it is to connect NAS' intra-Scandinavian network with Finnair's long-haul flights (mainly to Asia) from HEL. Finnair currently owns ~ 5% of NAS.
The pact would allow Norwegian Air, which has no inter- continental routes of its own, to boost occupancy on Finnair services to nine destinations in Asia.
“We are discussing different forms of cooperation with Norwegian, including the possibility to feed into our Asian traffic,” Finnair Chief Executive Officer Mika Vehvilaeinen said in an interview yesterday. “It sometimes makes sense for other people to fly into our ‘waves’ into Asia.”
SAS, Finnair’s biggest Nordic rival, has reduced its global network after racking up 9.25 billion kronor ($1.3 billion) in net losses over the past two years. The tri-national carrier no longer provides long-haul services from Oslo, Norwegian Air’s main hub, and offers Asian flights only from Copenhagen.
Up until recently, OW has been busy trumpeting the 'exclusivity' of the alliance, basically quality over quantity. That may have changed though, as Star and Skyteam have expanded so massively over the last few years.
Andaman From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5213 times:
Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 1): Which leads me to wonder: could this mean Norwegian joins oneworld at some point?
Hardly tomorrow but who knows about the future... I wouldn't be suprised if AY and DY get even closer. New moves are expected in the northern skies.
AY also got a feeder/partner from Italy recently, Meridiana flying FLR-HEL and code sharing on MXP-HEL and FCO-HEL.
Someone83 From Norway, joined Sep 2006, 3592 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5178 times:
No, they are not talking about an alliance. What they are discussing, or more are rumours about they discussiong, is a possible feed by Norwegian into Helsinki and AYs long-haul routes.....which is far far away from an alliance
Andaman From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5139 times:
Quoting Someone83 (Reply 9): No, they are not talking about an alliance. What they are discussing, or more are rumours about they discussiong, is a possible feed by Norwegian into Helsinki and AYs long-haul routes.....which is far far away from an alliance
Yes, 'alliance' is too strong word here, but they really are in serious talks, it's not just a rumor. Finnair's CEO hardly whispers rumors to Bloomberg Of course a different question is what really comes out of this, but I believe DY and AY will actually make a deal.
Quoting Someone83 (Reply 9): Yes, 'alliance' is too strong word here, but they really are in serious talks, it's not just a rumor.
That's taking the term "alliance" way too literally, when its simply meant to denote a commercial partnership. Plenty of media outlets used the same term to describe the similar B6- LH and UA- EI agreements.
Quoting Mortyman (Reply 12): Quoting OP3000 (Thread starter):
Norwegian Air, which has no inter- continental routes of its own
I beleave Morocco and United Arab Emirates is on a different continent...
Again way too literal an interpretation. Nobody goes around arguing that U2 has "inter-continental routes" just because they fly to Marrakech or AGA.
joost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3201 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3887 times:
Quoting AAEXP (Reply 3): So now it's clearly OW against Star in Scandinavia (eventhough Finland is technically not part of Scandinavia).
No, it isn't.
Of course, StarAlliance has by far the largest market share in the Nordic countries, mostly because of the presence of SAS and Blue1. Also LH has quite a network to the region (next to CPH/ARN/OSL/HEL, they fly to GOT, BLL, BGO and SVG), and there are CO and TG flying into CPH, ARN and OSL, SQ to CPH, and the seasonal PHL-flights by US. (And of course the routes from CPH/ARN/OSL/HEL by the other European Star-carriers).
Now, for the Oneworld and Skyteam-carriers, it depends on how you want to see it.
BA only flies to the 4 capitals.
AY is of course big in Finland, but their network to the Scandinavian countries is quite limited: they only fly to ARN, HEL, CPH and OSL year-round. BGO is flown as a tag-on on the ARN flight 3x weekly during the summer-season - hardly an important destination in the hub-and-spoke network. BLL-HEL is flown by Sun-air, in BA-colors, and carrying the AY code - 6x weekly using an FRJ; although the times are coordinated with AY's long-haul network.
IB only flies to CPH and ARN. HEL is codeshared with AY, OSL is unserved. Malev flies to CPH, ARN, GOT and HEL, but not OSL. That's it when it comes to Oneworld.
Now, take a look at the Skyteam carriers:
KLM has an extensive network. Next to the 4 capitals, they serve BLL, GOT, KRS, BGO, SVG, TRF, TRD and LPI. LPI, TRD, TRF and KRS are served 2x daily year-round; the other destinations even more frequent.
Long-haul, DL flies into ARN and CPH.
And then there are the flights from AF (ARN/GOT/OSL/CPH), SU, OK, AZ (not sure if they still fly into the Nordic countries), etc.
I wouldn't say that it's Oneworld vs Star; StarAlliance is defenitely the market leader. In terms of seats flown, Oneworld will rank higher due to Finnair. But for long-haul connecting traffic, I'd say Skyteam carriers are even better positioned in the market than Oneworld carriers.
MYT332 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 9114 posts, RR: 70
Reply 16, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3473 times:
Quoting OP3000 (Reply 13): Again way too literal an interpretation. Nobody goes around arguing that U2 has "inter-continental routes" just because they fly to Marrakech or AGA.
Well it is the meaning of 'inter-continental' to be fair and Dubai is quite along way, it's not like it's just on the border a la Turkey! When I see Emirates or Etihad knocking around at MAN I don't think, hmm, there's a local European carrier. Norwegian should have credit albeit don't ever think for one minute you'll catch me on one of their 738's down there!
B747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17257 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2434 times:
Quoting Andaman (Reply 21): Quoting joost (Reply 14):
AY is of course big in Finland, but their network to the Scandinavian countries is quite limited: they only fly to ARN, HEL, CPH and OSL year-round.
Also GOT and NRK (FinnComm) but yes relatively limited.
Maybe AY's network in Scandinavia is limited, but they have a big presence in ARN stealing a lot of pax from SK and other competitors heading to Asia.