Boeing757fan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 5115 times:
All 4 engine jets, (excluding the Lockheed Jetstar) are heavies. Military included. The 757-200 from American Trans Air are heavies also. They are about the only airline that adds "heavy" to their call-sign.
Trickijedi From United States of America, joined May 2001, 3266 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 5062 times:
Oooh, Concorde? Interesting. Is this a heavy? Anybody know? I would think the FAA would make up a new term just for Concordes and call them "speedy" instead of heavy. I can see the ATC transmission on this one.
ATC: United 1451 heavy, be advised traffic at your 11 o clock position, no wait 12 o clock position, oh wait a minute 1 o clock, nope 2 o clock now, a British Airways Concorde at 4,000 feet, no 6000 feet, wait correct that 10, 000 feet, oops sorry he's now at Flight Level 28. Oh well, you missed him.
United 1451: Uhhhh, we're looking for him.
United 1451: We're still looking.
United 1451: Traffic NOT in sight!!!
Its better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than be in the air wishing you were on the ground. Fly safe!
TAA_Airbus From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 726 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 5056 times:
I think you find when aircraft adds heavy to there call sign, it is in reference to there Wake turbulence category, its primarily got nothing to do with weight, but how extreme the wake turbulence is that it produces. However, you will find the heavier the a/c the greater the wake turbulence, however, that is not always true.
Anyway, different countries have different classification, generally speaking, ICAO references heavies as anything >136tonnes, what that is in lbs, I have no idea. Aviation laws in the UK state heavies as anyting heavier than 162 tonnes and the US 115 tonnes. So really, there is no international standard, however as far as Im concerned there should be. Aviation needs to be more in line all around the world.
ICAO, make a stand!
TAA_Airbus From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 726 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 5042 times:
Concordes are certainly not heavy aircraft, but due to there huge thrust and there wing size and shape, they would create such a huge amount of lift, so vortices would have to be huge coming from a concorde. However, I have seen a picture of a concorde showing the intricies of airflow, I think I counted over 10 pairs of vortices, which would surely mean you would not want to be anywhere near the rear of one. Not to mention jet blast!@
RayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8174 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 4989 times:
From monitoring the ATC conversations at SFO's tower frequency (120.500 MHz), the following airplanes are considered heavies:
The Boeing 757-200 is only considered a heavy above 255,000 lb. gross weight, which is the case of the ATA 752's that regularly visit SFO. Otherwise, SFO tower usually gives a wake turbulence warning to any plane near a 752 taking off and landing.
It's definite that the 757-300 was be classed as a heavy when NW and CO start their 753 opeations to SFO starting in 2003.
Some authorities include B707/DC8/IL62 when operating at maximum weights and require the aircraft to call both the type and "heavy" but again, with modern displays, the info is in front of the controller.
Strangely the TU204 (757 look alike) is classified as "medium".
LMML 14/32 From Malta, joined Jan 2001, 2565 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 4925 times:
There seems to be some doubt regarding the 757. But, yes. All versions of B757, irrespective of weight are considered heavy. Ask any small jet pilot and he will tell you that he has to wait 2 minutes before taking off behind a rolling 757. I beleive, as someone already mentioned, the 757 was designated as such following an accident.
25 Max Q
: The official designation of a 'heavy' aircraft is any aircraft with a gross wt CAPABILITY of over 300,000 lbs for take-off, this most assuredly includ
26 Red Panda
: Is 767-200 considered as heavy too? it's not a too big plane after all. How about A321 then? r panda
: I don't know if 757's are classified as heavies. I guarantee you that Delta doesn't add heavy to its call sign in 57's.
: Amazing. After taking the trouble to research and list the internationally accepted list of "heavy" aircraft, explaining how the call is being used le
29 Max Q
: 767-200 gross take-off weight, is 300,000 lbs+, it is therefore a heavy.
: Some people touched on this-- Heavy aircraft came from the categories of wake turbulence (as defined by the FAA and ATC's "bible") The categories are
: Penguinflies, Wrongo. The 757 is NOT designated as a heavy unless the gross weight of the plane is over 255,000 lbs. The 757-200's flown by AA, CO, DL
: After speaking with a controller at JFK Tower many times in the past regarding this issue, the 757 is not classified as a heavy, except for the one ai
: The rule of thumb I have noticed basically for modern transports is whatever needs a double bogey (DC10) or triple bogey (777) main landing gear can b
: As far as the US goes i don't know, but here in Canada a heavy is an aircraft of or over 300,000 lbs and it has nothing to do with the wake turbulence
: I can't understand why there is such confusion about the B757. To all intents and purposes it is classified as a "heavy" aircraft because of wake turb
36 Aer Lingus
: I've heard an ATA 757-200 once been called a "Heavy" So I presume a 757 CAN be one
: PhilB: 757's are not classified as heavy but they do however use the same separation as a heavy on finaldue to their nasty wake turbulence carateristi
: From "Pilot Magazine's A to Z of Aviation Jargon" - Heavy - suffix used in RT callsigns to indicate that the aircraft is a large transport, alerting c
: Ray Chuang and anybody else who cares to listen. The 757 is not clasified as a heavy aircraft. It's MGTOW is below 255,000 pounds for all models (not
: Nicolaki, Those are Canadian Air Regulations - they apply in Canada with regard to the CERTIFICATION of the aircraft. Nav Canada class the 757 as a he
: PhilB, Why are you so sure that a B757 is considered a heavy? How often do you hear "heavy" used with the callsign of a flight being operated with a 7
: Critter, Do they teach you to read and comprehend English at your school? If you had read read and understood my posts in this thread you wouldn't hav
: Yes they teach me to comprehend Grammar at school, if you really need to know. Is their any good reason for you to come out with a post like you just
: I don't know why some people are convinced that 757s CANNOT be classified as "heavy." I, for sure, have been on numerous United 757s whereby the calls
: sometimes 757s are considered and sometimes not. From what I've been told it depends on how many passengers and how much baggage/cargo and fuel it is
: If you want to argue semantics with me ...fine, you'll lose. You asked two questions which had been very fully answered earlier in the thread, therefo
: You're very arrogant, PhilB. Anyway onto the topic... Straight from Boeing's website, the MTOW is 255,000 lbs. The URL for those skeptics is as follow
: I'm going to make a statement that I GUARANTEE is a FACT: The reason that the definition of a heavy aircraft is 255,000 lbs. or more is because that i
49 Boeing nut
: This has turned out to be an interesting debate. I think in a sence that everyone, to a certain extent, is correct here. The 752's max weight is 255,0
: I am looking at the definitions of all the aircraft classes and it states that a heavy aircraft is anyone capable of takeoff weights of more than 255,
: Critter, If you were so mature yourself, you would of dropped it already and stopped blowing hot air up everyones ass.
52 Max Q
: RayChuang Not sure where you get your aircraft limitation information, but the 757 I fly for continental
53 Max Q
: Don't think it's really worth as much grief as some people think in this post, but there is one more point to remember, and that is that each particul
: USAFhummer and Critter, Typical teens, read a little, experienced less but know it all and have the nerve to call an experienced adult who has worked
: PhilB: You seem to think that aircrafts are classed by the wake turbulence they produce.You couldn't be more wrong, they are classed by their weight w
: The 757 is a heavy, but not all airlines use heavy in the callsign... Also, I have heard a Concorde depart IAD, and, HE USED "HEAVY" in the callsign.
: Nicolaki, You wrote, "ATC base their separation criteria on the classes of aircrafts (heavy, medium, light) and the classes of the aircrafts are deter
: For god's sake Phil if you'd pay more attention and scroll up a bit you'd see that i wrote PhilB: 757's are not classified as heavy but they do howeve
: This thread has gotten totally out of control and degraded into personal attacks. This is why I don't visit here much anymore. The "heavy" designation
: Nicolaki, from my post immediately following your first post on this thread: "To all intents and purposes it is classified as a "heavy" aircraft becau
: >>Question to whomever can answer: If a heavy aircraft is defined to be any aircraft capable of weighing more than 255,000 pounds at takeoff whether o
: HeavyJet, but my definition doesn't say 255,000 OR more. It says capable of more than 255,000 pounds.
: Well, you guys answered my original question, thanks. Now I'm really interested in this 757 debate. I will be flying to SFO in a 757 and I'm gonna do
: Would Canada 3000 and Royal's 757-200ER be heavy then I know that they have all coach class and that C3 USE to fly them to Australia? So I think that
: Trickijedi-"3)How about I resart this topic when I get more info?" I would just find out for yourself on the trip and just keep it to yourself. Judgin