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New Frontier/Midwest #7  
User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 14715 times:
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It was pretty much business as usual in the previous thread. Most seem interested in the future, and, of course, especially the name that will be chosen for the conjoined airlines.

A few still proclaim that Frontier=toast. I wish I had a buck for every time I've been told that on a.net. LOL.

N205FR was revealed at Finkenwerder and there are a couple of photos floating around the internet.

I was going to change the title to "Republic - Frontier/Midwest", but then it would probably have to change again when the name is announced, so I'll leave it for now.

Carry on. Enjoy. Lets hope the cookie lives.

 



mariner


aeternum nauta
257 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinebjorn14 From Norway, joined Feb 2010, 3412 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14732 times:

Here is my compromise...keep the Frontier name and the Midwest code YX (you know the whole DNA thing) Plus the animals and the cookie.   


"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14722 times:

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 1):
Here is my compromise...keep the Frontier name and the Midwest code YX (you know the whole DNA thing) Plus the animals and the cookie.

I couldn't agree with you more! That is how the company should be. That is how I want it to be. Simple solution and everybody wins.



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5501 posts, RR: 29
Reply 3, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14714 times:

Who knew a cookie could be so important? (Of course, I say that with a bag of 'em sitting next to me, but I digress.)  

-Dave



Next Trip: SEA-ABQ-SEA on Alaska
User currently offlinebjorn14 From Norway, joined Feb 2010, 3412 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14704 times:

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 2):
I couldn't agree with you more! That is how the company should be. That is how I want it to be. Simple solution and everybody wins.

Thanks, Airframe you made my day...I'm feeling smarter already   But as you know, it's too simple so management will never go for it or screw it up beyond recognition.



"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
User currently onlineFRNT787 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1320 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14686 times:

Quoting mariner (Thread starter):
A few still proclaim that Frontier=toast. I wish I had a buck for every time I've been told that on a.net. LOL.

HAHA me too...then my college/flight training would be paid for.



"We have a right to fail, because failure makes us grow" --Glenn Beck
User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 6, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14676 times:
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Interesting piece in the Denver Post about the pilot integration. It just sets out the case, it doesn't come on to any conclusions:

http://www.denverpost.com/headlines/ci_14743420

DP: "Pilots for Frontier, other Republic units vie for seniority"

Four pilot unions under Republic Airways' umbrella have begun what experts say may be the most-complex arbitration of seniority integration.

Frontier, Lynx, Midwest and Republic pilots have everything hinging on how the arbitrator determines the seniority of about 3,200 pilots. A ruling is not expected until August at the earliest.


I know nothing about it. I'm not going to comment.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 14671 times:

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 3):
Who knew a cookie could be so important?

It's a symbol of hospitality and 800 calories of stuff-your-face chocolatey goodness. 
Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 2):
I couldn't agree with you more! That is how the company should be. That is how I want it to be. Simple solution and everybody wins.

        

Couldn't agree more!

---------------------------------------------

  

So we're still in this brand predicament, eh? Well I gots me just the solution! Instead of the hassle of renaming, rebranding, and all that mumbo-jumbo, why not keep the F9 livery, but make some slight adjustments geared toward conveying a more aggresive image geared at Southwest? Forget cute and cuddley animals! That was so 1994.   

We're heading into a fierce, more aggresive era in aviation in America's most competitive airport. Let's celebrate that by introducing some new animals on the tail to send Southwest a message!


 

 

 


 

 


 

 
 

 

Or if you wanted to go for subtlety...



  

Whaddya think? Am I a marketing genius or what?! Frontier should just hire me to solve all their problems!   
(Cut me some slack, it's 5 in the morning where I am right now.  )

Cheers!
Anthony/Airport

By the way, here's the original photo:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Konstantin Von Wedelstaedt


[Edited 2010-03-24 04:28:14]

User currently offlinebjorn14 From Norway, joined Feb 2010, 3412 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 14592 times:

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):
Whaddya think? Am I a marketing genius or what?! Frontier should just hire me to solve all their problems!

As they say at the GLA airport "Pure. Dead. Brilliant." Especially the last one   



"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
User currently offlinelegacytravel From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 1067 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 14551 times:

Excellent work well done.   All you need to do is add a jackelope. LOL I am dating myself with that one.

Mark in MKE



I love the smell of Jet fuel in the Morning
User currently offlineF9Animal From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 5026 posts, RR: 28
Reply 10, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 14520 times:

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):
We're heading into a fierce, more aggresive era in aviation in America's most competitive airport. Let's celebrate that by introducing some new animals on the tail to send Southwest a message!

LMAO! That is great! I absolutely love it! Was that Jack's teeth? Forgot the one in front of the gas station in LAX!!!!

[Edited 2010-03-24 05:46:52]


I Am A Different Animal!!
User currently offlineHermansCVR580 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 509 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (4 years 5 months 2 days ago) and read 14473 times:

Excellent work well done.   All you need to do is a black widow spider  Mooooohaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!


The right decision at the wrong time, is still a wrong decision. "Hal Carr"
User currently offlinedfanucci From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 14312 times:

In keeping with the light-heartedness, this is just about the funniest thing I have seen in a while. Just what does Hitler think of the Frontier Name going away?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpNLdEWgWHw

 

-D


User currently offlinebjorn14 From Norway, joined Feb 2010, 3412 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 14225 times:

Very cool. Very funny.

Someone should send this video to BB.



"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
User currently offlinePacificF27 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 68 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 14170 times:
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Am wondering if the name "Frontier" is too "unsophisticated" in the minds of those who may ultimately make this decision? I am with those who say "Keep it Frontier, keep the animals and keep the cookies!" The billboard titled Frontier planes with the animals are certainly more memorable than Euro white JetBlue, Euro white Virgin America and Euro white Delta!

[Edited 2010-03-24 10:01:50]


EVA is tops across the Pacific!
User currently offlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5501 posts, RR: 29
Reply 15, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 14150 times:

Love those tails! The last one - VERY effective! It was one of those times where "LOL" really was accurate.

-Dave



Next Trip: SEA-ABQ-SEA on Alaska
User currently offlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5501 posts, RR: 29
Reply 16, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 14120 times:

OK, that video was funny, too.

I have to say, though, that I'm starting to feel like the guy in the room who thinks all the people holding guns. looking ready to conduct some guerilla warfare, are only kidding, but I'm the only one laughing.  

-Dave



Next Trip: SEA-ABQ-SEA on Alaska
User currently offlinealphascan From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 937 posts, RR: 13
Reply 17, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 14051 times:

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):
Am I a marketing genius or what?!

You ARE a marketing genius! Midway pic very effective.



"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
User currently offlineMUWarriors From United States of America, joined May 2005, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 14000 times:

Call me a spoil sport (because I probably am), but I really don't find the humor in mocking an accident where a kid was killed as he sang Christmas carols in his parents car. The rest of the tails I found extremely amusing, but the last one, I don't know, humor about a plane crash where someone dies, seems a little off color. Now, the Burbank gas station, that one I would be just fine with  .

User currently offlineUAL727NE From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 205 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 13993 times:

So on the whole DEN being the only hub thing, where would some of you think a good hub(s) would be for F9? Also I read in last thread I believe someone said OMA being a focus city? Is that right? On the route map there is a few flights out of OMA. I think there could be more out of there sometime, don't know where off hand.


Gotta love 3 holers!!! MD11,DC10,L-1011,B727 for life!!!!
User currently offlineYXwatcherMkE From United States of America, joined May 2007, 986 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 13967 times:

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):
Whaddya think? Am I a marketing genius or what?! Frontier should just hire me to solve all their problems!

              
Thank for the Great photoshop work! It really was what I needed today. Please email that to BB!!!



I miss the 60's & 70's when you felt like a guest on the plane not cattle like today
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 13909 times:

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):

I love what you did with 949 repeatedly. I especially loved how Jack looks pissed off! ROFL!

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):
Or if you wanted to go for subtlety...

Ok, I nearly destroyed my laptop seeing that.... ROFLROFLROFLROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   

Quoting dfanucci (Reply 12):
Just what does Hitler think of the Frontier Name going away?

I posed that in the last thread. But funny as hell!

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 13):
Someone should send this video to BB.

I'm sure he probably has already seen it and took that into consideration. LOL!

Quoting MUWarriors (Reply 18):
Call me a spoil sport (because I probably am), but I really don't find the humor in mocking an accident where a kid was killed as he sang Christmas carols in his parents car.

We have a better safety record than they do. And who has the 10 year Diamond Awards?    I am fortunate to be a part of that in the last year and PROUD of it! So that tail deserves some recognition.   

Ok, now I must behave..... I am being watched....  



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineberyllium From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 13875 times:

Quoting Airport (Reply 7):
We're heading into a fierce, more aggresive era in aviation in America's most competitive airport. Let's celebrate that by introducing some new animals on the tail to send Southwest a message!
Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 15):
Love those tails! The last one - VERY effective! It was one of those times where "LOL" really was accurate.

To send Southwest a message you, guys, should probably paint them all like the last one...
I don't know if it is VERY effective or not, but in any case, "he who LOLs last, LOLs best"...
Humor is good though.  


User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 23, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 13853 times:
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Quoting dfanucci (Reply 12):
n keeping with the light-heartedness, this is just about the funniest thing I have seen in a while. Just what does Hitler think of the Frontier Name going away?

I love those Hitler spoofs. One of the funniest was the Southwest one, with Gary Kelly as Hitler.

Southwest didn't think it was so funny - they had it taken down within days and Holly Hegeman posted a prize for anyone who could get her a copy.

Happily, it has resurfaced on Youtube.  
Quoting UAL727NE (Reply 19):
On the route map there is a few flights out of OMA. I think there could be more out of there sometime, don't know where off hand.

The intention seems to be to restore much of the Midwest route map, so I guess OMA-LAX has to be a possibility.

mariner

[Edited 2010-03-24 12:39:44]


aeternum nauta
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 24, posted (4 years 5 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 13793 times:

Quoting mariner (Reply 23):
Happily, it has resurfaced on Youtube.  

Still lookin' for it, cannot find it. 

That was a great video, however!  



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
25 Post contains links and images mariner : Just go to Youtube and search for SWA/Hitler. But I'll save you the trouble - here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSUL1_N-acE mariner
26 Post contains images AirframeAS : Thanks! I was going to just put in the keywords you said anyway.
27 surfandsnow : Well, in my opinion, the name "Frontier" and the whole wild animal theme limit you to having major hubs west of, say, Chicago. When you think of the
28 Post contains links kingcavalier : I don't agree. It's like saying WN should only serve PHX because its geographically in the Southwest. AirframeAS - You said that F9 isn't running ads
29 Post contains images AirframeAS : Billboards and TV ads is what I meant, not the entire advertising as a whole. I have not seen any F9 billboards around town since I started working w
30 Post contains images LRDC9 : I do love a cookie. Complicated may be an understatement. For any history/union buffs out there, is this going to unprecedented in its size? One thin
31 Jetmatt777 : Yet they ended. Not saying they won't get picked up again next year, but they are seasonal and if they were a huge hit, I'm sure they'd go year round
32 AirframeAS : Can you explain why you like this name, other than it also being a banana company?
33 kingcavalier : I believe you are thinking of Chiquita. Chautauqua is supposedly an Indian word that means "meeting" or "discussion." Have you been to Chautauqua Par
34 AirframeAS : My bad, totally. The names do look similar and sound nearly the same. Ive been to Boulder many times, of course. Never knew that there was a Chautauq
35 Post contains images LRDC9 : a) It strikes my fancy. b) It sounds pretty nice, good flow c) There is a never ending discussion/meeting of a.netters about RW/RP/S5/F9/YX/Lynx (any
36 AirframeAS : L3. An A.net meet-up??
37 Post contains images LRDC9 : Only virtually. Although I'm sure everybody here (yes even you Beryllium ) would be great fun to meet.
38 UAL727NE : Yea I think those business markets would do pretty well. There is ALOT of old money in OMA. I hope they add LAX and FLL might work pretty good. PHX i
39 enilria : Didn't you say during the auction that there was already a deal on seniority integration and that was what made the Republic deal so much better than
40 Post contains images mariner : The article does stress how big and complicated it is. I would think it is pretty certain there will be some hurt feelings, no matter how fair the re
41 Post contains images USPIT10L : The name Chautauqua Airlines comes from Jamestown, NY, and the Chautauqua Lake is nearby. The name pays heritage to its New York roots, hardly anyone
42 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : I'm still trying to figure out how to say it. Not necessarily the best way to go national with a brand, but we all have our dreams. -Dave
43 Post contains images ERJ : I've heard it cha-ta-kwa or sha-ta-kwa. It is fun to say either way.
44 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : Sha-ta-ka-ka...Chalka-qua-qua....Let's just call it Frontier. -Dave
45 dfanucci : I can't honestly think an arbitrator would pull F9 pilots out of 318/319/320's and train the Rjet folks to fly the Airbus. Some sort of fence is goin
46 F9Animal : I will have to agree with you on this. I think it would be better to change it to the LAX gas station overrun. Out of respect for the loss of life.
47 enilria : I don't know why you say that, it's happen a ton of times. TWA? It's worse in this case because the F9 people are more junior. Fencing is very unusua
48 beryllium : That's a valid point, but I am sure they did not mean to be disrespectful for the loss of life. They just wanted to make some fun of WN...
49 Post contains links and images Airport : Nah you're not a spoil sport... that's a fair point, I should've thought of that. Here's an updated one... These are just too much fun to make. [Edit
50 Post contains links mariner : On a more serious note, some may be aware that there is a hoo-haa going on about slots at DCA and LGA. Delta and US want to swap some slots at both ai
51 Post contains images LRDC9 : Indeed and IMO it was amusing. Let's not make a mountain out of a molehill. No offense, just my personal take. I agree here. I see no reason for fenc
52 Post contains images mariner : Or a parrot on a rampage: mariner
53 Post contains images MUWarriors : I must say, you do an awesome job on those. If they used those tails I wouldn't care what the name of the airline was, it would be cool .
54 dfanucci : I see what you're saying, and I do pretty much agree, but I think this is the first time 3 seperate airlines (4 with lynx) are being "combined" so to
55 LRDC9 : I feel like they have 0 chance at any slots here. They own a ton at both airorts. Maybe if they made a deal with another airline, but short of that,
56 mariner : I agree, as I said I'm not holding my breath. But look for the subtext - I think it would be funny of Southwest got the rules changed and somehow Fro
57 LRDC9 : There's truth in that there statement. Of course having now read the Swelblog post, I think it is doubtful at best the WN end up getting anything out
58 PlanesNTrains : Great as well. You do a great job at these! -Dave
59 MASTYC : I had a question for some Midwest junkies out there. Did YX ever serve CWA? I just ask because they have staff there but I don't know why. There was j
60 AirplaneBoy : I think it's also important to remember that although F9's most senior pilots only have roughly 16 years (since F9 II began operations in 1994), many
61 sunking737 : Three airlines did combine once before, IIRC in1968 when West Coast, Pacific, and Bonanza Airlines merged to form Air West. Air West then was bought o
62 Post contains images Airport : Thank you, thank you! I'm here till Tuesday. What about the formation of Canadian Airlines? IIRC, that was basically a four-way merger between Canadia
63 knope2001 : April 1989 to September 2008, with YX*. They had listings for a city manager at CWA posted in December, and then a listing for CSR's in CWA was poste
64 Post contains links ivo : new addition, old c/s: A320 N205FR c/n4253 Orca tail http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/photos/daxab.jpg Ivo
65 surfandsnow : For being a Wisconsin airline, YX sure doesn't seem to do a great job serving the state. I would think service to CWA and LSE would be a given, it wa
66 MCI10 : She looks awesome!
67 MostlyAir : I believe back when YX pulled out of CWA that they wanted to keep the people that were doing all the work at the airport employed. So they made a dea
68 knope2001 : CWA, LSE and RHI were long-time Beech 1900 markets (EAU actually only had YX* back in early 90's, as did Oshkosh), and serving them with anything lar
69 USPIT10L : When I was training in MKE back in November, on orientation day I spoke with someone from CWA. The HR person from F9 did not even know the code! But
70 knope2001 : I thought the CWA deal fell through and the Skyway people there were gone, but I might be wrong about that. If there was a CWA person in traning in N
71 mariner : It seems a big investment for a fairly small return and perhaps any Canada flights would be to pre-clearance airports? Still, I imagine there is some
72 USPIT10L : Not really anymore, US used to fly MCIOMA with Air Midwest as US Airways Express until 2005, then HP's service was the only one remaining to PHX only
73 SANFan : The city pair is not even listed in the DOT table for 3Q09 so that means less than 10 pax/day O&D (total) -- if any! Sounds like I-29 carries all
74 mariner : I guess that answers my question. LOL. Still, I'd be interested to know how the route did when it there was service. And I am guessing OMA-LAX has to
75 knope2001 : Omaha-Kansas City was one of those short business hops which had a fair stream of local business traffic back in the days when airport security wasn't
76 enilria : Never except for PSA/Piedmont/USAir (Allegheny) and Southern/North Central/Hughes Airwest (ironically into Republic). So clearly there is precendent,
77 mariner : That makes sense. And I guess it would depend on how much they want to build up MCI. And to what extent do they duplicate at OMA? What happens to pot
78 knope2001 : I guess OMA-MCI service probably rests on: (a) MCI having enough well-timed service for decent OMA-MCI-XXX service (b) The value and volume of the OM
79 mariner : Thanks, Knope. I guess that ties in with SANFan's numbers in post #73. But a couple more questions. Was MCI-COS ever viable, or did it go because of
80 AirplaneBoy : I understand that. I should have clarified that Republic has a greater number of junior pilots, than there are senior pilots. One particular issue F9
81 Post contains images mariner : For airline history buffs - and lovers of irony - my interest in MCI stems from two reasons. I lived in Kansas for a year when I first moved to the US
82 enilria : Your interest in RNO is not commensurate with the average American's. As an air market it basically sucks. It's only gotten worse since the gambling
83 AirframeAS : RNO is a very, very expensive airport to fly into.
84 Post contains links mariner : Um - I guess you missed this part of the post: But - for the record - I see that RNO is getting new flights this year: http://www.rgj.com/article/201
85 UAL727NE : Man oh man I remember the flight I had on YX flying from OMA-MCI-SAT very well. I was heading to basic training for the AIr Force. I flew on a DC9-10
86 LRDC9 : That sounds fun. I wish I had tried them back then. I didn't get on until they were 717s and M82s. BTW if anybody know what do loads on the DCA route
87 knope2001 : It didn't do too badly...about 2/3 full, about 50/50 local and connecting traffic. It's tough to judge the viability of MCI routes by virtue of Midwe
88 sideflare75 : Been hearing stories of a big shin-dig at the Midwest/Frontier/Republic hgr on 4/13. I guess that is when the big surprise will be revealed complete w
89 knope2001 : Onboard loads for calendar 2009 nonstop to/from DCA 72.7% MCI 72.0% MKE 75.2% OMA The flights were scheduled as DC9-10 and then DC9-30 as you remembe
90 UAL727NE : Hey thanks Knope!! Im really excited about all this F9/YX thing. April 13th huh? I'll be flying on Lynx for the first time from SLC-OMA, stop in DEN
91 n7371f : A A320 is suppose to be delivered to Frontier right around that time. Of course Republic also has a E190 in paint right now but you're talking two we
92 Post contains images LRDC9 : You are truly a wealth of information. Thank you
93 enilria : No, I didn't miss it. I'm just saying that while I agree Tahoe is beautiful, fewer and fewer people fly there. Yes, they still have air service, but
94 Post contains images mariner : Then I am completely confused. I agree. And thanks for the info on COS. Appreciated. That makes most sense to me. But Airbus would have to be working
95 knope2001 : MKE and MCI had larger aircraft and more frequent flights than OMA. Also, Washington is among the largest Omaha markets...significantly bigger than N
96 UAL727NE : So I have a question fast. With the new combined fleet of mainline F9/YX/Republic, what's the fleet make up all consist of? A320/19/18, E190 and what
97 UAL727NE : Hey thanks again! They just use the E170 on DCA runs from OMA right? What types do they run from MCI MKE?
98 TSRA : It's funny you mentioned this - add STL (CPS) and there are people in some very interesting places that have this very idea. Using MKC is a no braine
99 FutureFO : We run all E170's DCA-MKE-MCI-OME. DCA-DEN is A320.
100 boydatageek : Remember, Warren Buffett did ads for Midwest even when he was heavily invested in USAir. -- He did this especially due to the OMA service. I remember
101 bjorn14 : That depends on what kind of deal you made...some airlines give some kind of seniority for previous service. Usually if they are desperate for certai
102 RJNUT : As an aside, I wonder if there might be a market from MKC (downtown Kansas City) for 9-passenger flights to places like Des Moines, Omaha, LIttle Rock
103 bjorn14 : I've read alot of belly aching about WN and F9 fighting it out in DEN but people seem to forget they also have a major LCC competitor in MKE too, FL a
104 Post contains images enilria : What airline does that? I've never heard of that before. It might happen if you have a company like AMR that owns both Eagle and AA, but that's only
105 knope2001 : That is currently accurate, but for 2009 (the period where I listed load factors) there were more 99-seat E190 and 717's into DCA, primarily from MKE
106 timf : I just noticed that Delta's SkyMiles partner chart now shows their relationship with Midwest Miles will terminate on June 7, so they will not be affil
107 Post contains links kingcavalier : I don't think it will make a big difference, but a lot of Frontier employees and supporters rallied in downtown Denver yesterday to try and pursuade R
108 KDEN : Are you still in favor of a badger on one of F9's tails? This seems like a great opportunity if Republic wanted to keep the F9 name/brand/livery.
109 bjorn14 : I don't know of any current one, but I do know some small regionals in the Midwest did in the mid-80's. Sorry if I mislead anyone.
110 knope2001 : That's definitely a blow. You have to wonder what the story is. Did Delta flat-out want out? Could they not come to an agreement? Did Republic negoti
111 TVNWZ : And it means that I will be connecting a lot more on Delta than taking YX non-stops. I was really getting used to the convienance of non-stops with t
112 Post contains images mariner : It may be something very simple - such as the contract with the new CCP - but I can't see how. So - I wonder if it is a clue about future alliances?
113 SANFan : Pardon my ignorance here but why would DL see a problem with a DEN-hub simply because it is sort of near its SLC hub? There are 2 pretty hefty mounta
114 Post contains images rampart : ATL to both CVG and MEM are closer than DEN is to SLC, and those are within one airline. -Rampart
115 yx302 : BB at the last company meeting did state that Delta saw DEN as a competing hub to SLC. Because of that Delta is unwilling to allow the codeshare to ac
116 mariner : The point may be - as yx302 shows in post #115 - that Delta sees it that way. From the git-go Delta has been prepared to help BB - they gave their 40
117 Airport : Another thing to consider is that while geographically there is a lot that seperates DEN and SLC, they serve the same purpose for the respective airl
118 enilria : I agree with Mariner. DL has shown extreme aggressiveness toward Frontier with regard to fare sales, Mexico expansion, and on overlapping routes. I w
119 Post contains images CBERFlyer : That is probably the best post I've seen on here in months... I haven't laughed that hard in ages! I love it, and bow to your wisdom and humor.
120 AirframeAS : Just so that we don't get too carried away here, keep in mind that DL does not have a hub in DEN. So why DL is bitchin' and moaning about DEN competi
121 PlanesNTrains : They certainly have their own O&D components, but they serve similar roles for the respective carriers. XXX-SLC-YYY or XXX-DEN-YYY compete for th
122 mariner : It doesn't matter what is "true." It is what Delta wants to do in this instance. As Enilria correctly says, Delta has an aversion to the LCC's. Airtr
123 AirframeAS : Roles are similar, I agree with that. But DEN and SLC are two totally different animals, and about 500+ miles apart separated by two different mounta
124 boydatageek : The main value is for those business travelers that do BOTH domestic and International Travel. THs way they can have one program to add both types of
125 OzarkD9S : I could see a deal with FL, no merger though, at least not in the near future. The brand choice for F9/YX/RAH is soon and I don't think they would mu
126 sideflare75 : Yeah I was thinking the same thing. The 190 will be out of paint tomorrow and needs to go back to Pitt before it shows up in MKE, on Monday or Tuesda
127 Airport : I can agree with this. I at least don't think a codeshare would be a bad idea for F9/Republic to pursue. Or even, what would be hugely fascinating to
128 YXwatcherMkE : I don't see this happening. There are a fair number of mamagement people that are still at RAH/YX that lived through the attempted hostal take over b
129 mke717spotter : Whatever they come up with, I have a feeling I'm not going to like it.
130 AirframeAS : Where are you guys sending the 190's for paint at? AMA? NWA did the same thing before it became DL. The speculation is killing some people, eh?
131 enilria : I hate to just drop in with a question, BUT is there any specific date in April for the brand announcement? If not, is there any indication as to an u
132 EnviroTO : I can see either a code share or frequent flyer tie in with CO and US, but not AA. MKE is too close to AA's ORD hub. An AirTran merger would work too
133 Post contains images Airport : I believe the date is April 13th. Cheers! Anthony/Airport
134 Post contains images boydatageek : It hasn't stopped AA from having a FFP program tie (and American Eagle code share) with YX in in the past. ... And now with Midwest's acquisition of
135 sunking737 : Since when did Midwest buy Frontier ???? REPUBLIC bought out Midwest...then RJet bought FRONTIER !!!
136 Post contains images AirframeAS : Ehhh..... wha?!
137 MCI10 : When did Midwest acquire Frontier. That is really big news to me.
138 YXwatcherMkE : [quote=MCI10,reply=137]And now with Midwest's acquisition of Frontier Wow I think your facts are a bit off the mark man! RJET purchased YX in June/Jul
139 Atlwest1 : I could definitely see this. This is something i have been thinking for a while could happen. You would have a very very young fleet planes of differ
140 Post contains images UAL727NE : I think he was joking because he had the whole duck thing going on after it. Anyway's it's been a slow weekend on this thread. I'm stuck all day in Ch
141 MUWarriors : I think it's a relatively large loss, at least in the MKE market. NW had a long history here and there are a lot of SkyMiles members as a result who
142 YXwatcherMkE : I could possible see STL with the loss of AA's hub op's. But it could be to the detriment of MCI or possible OMA future growth also If RJET want to m
143 Post contains images UAL727NE : Yea I was thinking of down the road aways. That's why I said slow build up, But I would like to see hubbing at MCI and OMA first though. IF that woul
144 Post contains images mariner : I believe BB has said that they have access to more aircraft in the fall - if they want them. At a guess, more US E190's perhaps, and there are A320'
145 bjorn14 : Ah, DL announced that the YX agreement will end June 7th as reported earlier.
146 YXwatcherMkE : What do you mean by "a big tick from me"? Any idea how many A320's would be available to RAH? I agree with you on DEN, What are your thoughts on expa
147 mariner : Ah - I did not know that. I thought it was just the FF agreement was ending. Um - it gets a big cheer from me? As many as they want, probably. There'
148 mke717spotter : The international building at MKE is separate from the main terminal which would make it pretty inconvenient for any connecting passengers. However,
149 kingcavalier : I've been in MKE a few times in the past couple of months and noticed the IAB is just a short sidewalk away from the main (only) terminal. I wouldn't
150 sideflare75 : GLH. Greenville, MS. Newest one flew to MKE this afternoon and is flying revenue tomorrow so I guess it will be no big surprise in hiding. And no I h
151 mke717spotter : Yes, they are charter flights through Funjet Vacations. They also have flights during the week, but it peaks with three flights on Saturdays.
152 Atlwest1 : For connections it would be inconvient. You would have to walk to the main terminal up the escalator and back through security and be cleared again.
153 mariner : It's the same at many airports - it can happen at LAX, for example. Presumably, it works for Airtran at MKE? I've found their authorities for ATL-CUN
154 FL787 : FL doesn't have MKE-CUN authority right now. Perhaps he was thinking of the SY filing that never really materialized. As you say though, authority wo
155 Post contains images YXwatcherMkE : Some of the reasons why F9 MKE-CUN had such up and down Loads was the fact that they hardly advertised the route and there is a strong Charter/Funjet
156 mariner : I'm trying to work out who does have the authorities MKE-CUN but Regulations.gov is playing funny buggers with me - again. Delta/Northwest had one at
157 FL787 : Yes, they've been flying MKE-CUN on saturdays Dec-Apr for a few years I think.
158 boydatageek : I would suggest that Mark Travel (the Milwaukee based parent of Funjet) would not be very supportive. Funjet (and Apple) can be very tough customer.
159 YXwatcherMkE : Does that lock out RAH then?
160 FL787 : Nobody is locked out. Up to three carriers could fly MKE-CUN. Only one is actually flying the route, DL. I don't know who else now has the other 2 sp
161 mariner : I don't think anyone does. Frontier formally relinquished theirs, as did USA3000. I don't know if Sun Country has formally relinquished yet, but they
162 enilria : ...and UA is flying the route for Sun Country. Bizarre...
163 mke717spotter : There's probably little, or no connecting passengers on these flights. As stated above, FL charters these flights through Funjet Vacations, and I'm n
164 mariner : I still can't see it as a problem. There are airports all around the world where pax have to change terminals from International to Domestic. SYD, fo
165 AirframeAS : Yep, you are correct on both parts. Remember, I worked the induction of 203 when we got it. A frustrating aircraft it was... at first.... Thanks for
166 sunking737 : [quote=enilria,reply=162]...and UA is flying the route for Sun Country. Bizarre... Didn't we go through this already Dude. UA is doing SY ground handl
167 yx302 : Dont know if this gives a clue to where Republic is heading, but the new E190 is sitting by the hangar. Its all white with blue engines and blue tail.
168 sunking737 : IIRC its is the Republic Airways paint job. This could be the base paint job for the "NEW AIRLINE" name. Just a few decals and you have a new paint jo
169 ERJ : Any chance you can get a picture for us?
170 Atlwest1 : If someone wanted to fly on the MKE-Mexico FL flights and weren't in MKE they would have to buy the flight in and out of MKE separately as even FL em
171 Post contains links and images kingcavalier : They have generic E170's. Maybe they want to have a generic E190? IMO all of the a/c should've been painted generic Euro white until they decided on
172 kingcavalier : Yes you do. You have to clear customs and exit out on the baggage claim level. You then have to go back through security to fly out on your connectin
173 Post contains images F9FA37 : LOL!! I work for F9 and that would be awesome! You are a marketing genius! I would hire you.
174 AirframeAS : Yes, they are. And they are not cheap at all. King is right. SEA has the same set-up at the South Satellite, too.
175 Post contains links and images MUWarriors : I'll bet you it is, because if you look closely at this picture: View Large View MediumPhoto © Thomas P. McManus you can see the "Operated by Republ
176 Post contains images sideflare75 : It doesn't have any stripes on it or a name across the top of the fuselage. It is just all white so if it was to stay a generic 190 why not put a name
177 Post contains images mariner : I don't know how they could avoid it. Once they leave customs, they have left the secure area. It happens at every airport I know. In some places, it
178 yx302 : Thats correct, its not the same as the generic paint job. Only similarity is circle of stars. To me it looks like the base of a Frontier paint job. I
179 Atlwest1 : Then I guess ATL is techinally the only major airport that you dont leave the secured area you just go through baggage recheck and then security agai
180 Post contains images yx302 : Heres a pic!
181 mariner : I don't know about ATL, but it happens at MCI. At MCI, the secure areas are limited to four or five gates. Southwest warns their pax, on their websit
182 mke717spotter : Sad, it just won't be the same not seeing the YX name/colors around MKE anymore.
183 USPIT10L : To me it just looks like they're waiting to paint something on the actual fuselage. What, I'm not sure of. Otherwise, it's just a standard RW paintsc
184 FRNT787 : Im thinking this is just placeholder paint for the aircraft to get it into service before the branding is announced. Even if Republic is the name cho
185 n7371f : Agreed. The current Republic scheme is beyond boring and I have no clue what the circle of stars is suppose to represent. And you'd think if the inte
186 MostlyAir : I talked to Greg this afternoon,one of the founders of Shuttle America, and he said that the circle of stars is the original corporate logo of Shuttl
187 F9Animal : I think everyone is jumping too fast, and getting upset too quickly over a paint job. For all we know at this time, the only thing that needs to be a
188 FRNT787 : I agree completely. I dont think the RAH house scheme looks bad at all. On the C-Series order announcement, it looked great on that aircraft. I just
189 YXwatcherMkE : It is only 14 days and and about 14 hours until we know for sure, until then It is only a guessing game!!!
190 YXwatcherMkE : Is there any chance that RAH would bring either or both of the E175/195 into the F9/YX operations? I would like to see them in the branded fleet.
191 F9Animal : To be honest, I see RAH going solo eventually. They are obviously building something to survive as a single operator in the long term future. Contrac
192 kingcavalier : Anything is possible. They have the E175 at Shuttle America, but they would have to acquire the E195. I doubt they would get the E195. It doesn't see
193 FRNT787 : BB has said he would prefer the E175 to the E170 for branded flights. They have 50 something options with Embraer for new ones if the price is right.
194 mke717spotter : Well of course YX is going to be less known outside of MKE, MCI, and OMA. You're telling me F9 isn't less known outside of DEN?[Edited 2010-03-29 23:
195 F9Animal : Actually, F9 has done a little better in terms of advertising outside of DEN. For example in SEA, I used to see commercials all the time. And in LAS
196 Post contains images boydatageek : In the East Coast Business Markets, and with Corporate travel managers, YX's brand is most likely better. Also, with Northwest Brand having been reti
197 ERJ170 : I agree. put the Midwest "M" beside the name near the cockpit, put the animals on the tail, keep the blue/gold scheme, and have "Midwest" across the
198 kingcavalier : The animal tails will not go with any color other than white. I know that's my opinoin, but there is a reason the tails pop like they do. I could not
199 MUWarriors : I think what we're really seeing is the regional nature of both these airlines. F9 is only really known on the West Coast, YX is really only known in
200 n7371f : Midwest isn't "known" among the East Coast. Come on! Now if you're along the East Coast and you actually happen to fly to Milwaukee, yes - or just may
201 PlanesNTrains : I'm not a business traveler so I don't have that awareness, but from a personal standpoint I can think of two people that I know who have actually ev
202 MKENut : Midwest actually advertised on TV in the NYC and Boston markets pre 9/11. So to put out a blanket statement like yours is rather comical.
203 MUWarriors : It's no more comical than to say Frontier is "known" in L.A. Very few people in L.A. will use F9 as much more than a flight to DEN with maybe some co
204 PlanesNTrains : Well, I have no clue what they're going to do for sure, so I don't want to imply that I think Republic will be the new name. However, I can see why i
205 knope2001 : For what it's worth, MIdwest's corporate sales team is traditionally high in rank, regard, and proliferation within the industry. Midwest had (and may
206 MUWarriors : I don't either, and I didn't mean to imply that you somehow would agree with my random thoughts, so I apologize if I did. I also don't know if Republ
207 PlanesNTrains : Oh, no problem - I just wanted to clarify. Looking forward to April 13th. -Dave
208 USPIT10L : I've never seen any Heinz people, and I work in PIT. Most of the biz traffic has either switched to FL permenantly, is flying both by price, or stopp
209 knope2001 : I'm with you on that. Unless they have a way to clearly unite the brands which keeps both names but gets rid of the "I bought a Frontier ticket but I
210 n7371f : Who said that?
211 Post contains images mariner : But you have to be impressed by the amount of media attention it is getting - publicity. Free. LOL. If I were Republic, I would probably do that, too
212 surfandsnow : Lest we not forget the size of each party - F9 was MUCH larger than YX, especially at the time of the latter's demise (retirement of the 717s). Keepi
213 mariner : I don't think that is a very good reason for making a branding decision. A brand should be about what is best for the new - different - corporate ent
214 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : I think this pretty much sums up the realities well. Perception is a big mountain to climb when there's change. I'll say it again - great summation.
215 TVNWZ : That's me on both counts!
216 rampart : As if this hasn't happened before. US + Piedmont. HP + US. AA + TW. AA + Reno. DL + NW. NW + Republic. CO + TI. Some complaining is inevitable. Live
217 knope2001 : What's very different is that in these examples, there was an acquiring company whose brand was essentially unaltered and unharmed. (That's not how N
218 n7371f : We've speculated on the why of Delta dumping it's frequent flier and code-share agreement with Midwest. Here is the word from Delta itself, posted on
219 AirframeAS : Well, that makes more sense now. With the acquistion of NW and Republic gaining F9/YX it does make sense. The dropping of this codeshare does not hur
220 MKENut : I don't think Delta is all that interested in MKE... not like NWA was. Delta is only going to continue to serve MKE to their existing hubs. Midwest/R
221 Post contains links beryllium : ... and here is the article on that subject: http://industry.bnet.com/travel/1000...rlines-brand-cuts-ties-with-delta/ As the article mentions, the F
222 Post contains images beryllium : ... several threads ago, there was a talk about possible entrance of RAH into SkyTeam allaince. I guess, the termination of this FF agreement clearly
223 mariner : I think it is more than that - I think it is a big plus, a cleaning out of the past. If ti had continued, Delta would have had to embrace the Frontie
224 beryllium : Big plus... for YX?... Or for DL? DL seems to be the initiator. (YX is still silent).
225 Post contains images AirframeAS : For all involved. DL, F9 and RW. Whats wrong with that?
226 beryllium : Anybody said there is something wrong?
227 AirframeAS : No one said it was wrong. I am asking YOU what is wrong with DL canceling the codeshare, or in your words "DL seems to be the initiator."?? You sound
228 mariner : That's the point - it isn't just "YX" anymore. Why do people have such trouble with that concept? And I don't know what plus would there be here for
229 Post contains images beryllium : You are asking "What' wrong...?". Here is my answer: "There is nothing wrong with DL cancelling the codeshare. It is up to DL to decide whether it wa
230 Post contains images AirframeAS : Good. I did not claim it benefits RAH. I said....... Please don't half quote me, beryllium. Otherwise, you're putting words in my mouth. Maybe the wa
231 mariner : If I could think of a way how, I'd maybe a agree with you. Fairly obviously, one reason why Delta embraced Republic's purchase of Midwest was that it
232 beryllium : You did. You said: To say that it is "a big plus for all involved" is the same as to say "it benefits RAH"... without any half-quoting.
233 Post contains images AirframeAS : I don't know why we are arguing about this like 3 year olds, but you did say "RAH" only. THAT, sir, is half quoting me.
234 beryllium : Is it such a puzzle? Codeshare could boost YX traffic in MKE, and therefore steal some traffic from FL over there. Does DL want FL to get any additio
235 FRNT787 : The contract they signed for RAH to operate an ASA says they have to. RAH has done nothing to violate said contract (as far as we know). DL is in the
236 Post contains images mariner : What is interesting to me is that - once again - BB signaled this, twice, in CAPA articles: About four months ago he said he had to choose between Del
237 beryllium : I said "for RAH"... and you said "for all involved". "All involved" includes RAH too, doesn't it? I am the one who started this exciting conversation
238 Post contains images beryllium : Are you serious? You are saying FL will partner with RAH? And specifically about MKE, it is OO (SkyWest), not RAH, who seems to be in the candidates
239 AirframeAS : I included DL. I guess you missed that. Not my problem. You seem to have trouble reading my posts and I don't know why. It makes sense that DL and RA
240 beryllium : I have no trouble reading your posts. I saw you included DL. But, the thread is about RAH, right? And I said that this cancellation of FF agreement i
241 FRNT787 : They already have a marketing agreement with the F9 part of RAH. BB does not want individual relationships with different airlines at different hubs.
242 FRNT787 : Mariner gave some good reasons why. I guess they required repeating.
243 mariner : It's a very interesting question. BB has said he is committed to code shares and/or alliances. Specifically, he mentioned for north/south west coast
244 Post contains images Airport : Stop right there... I'm going to propose a new law, sort of like Godwin's Law ("As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison
245 beryllium : They (FL) have agreement with F9 just like YX had (i.e. will have until 07-Jun) agreement with DL. It all comes from the old times, when YX and F9 we
246 Post contains images mariner : I hope so. Clean out all the past, I say. It doesn't seem very sensible to have the Frontier/Airtran agreement just hanging there, neither one thing
247 UAL727NE : Do you think that maybe VX? IDK i'm just asking. Would an alliance with VX be any good? VX could big pax into LAX,SFO then connect onto F9/YX flights
248 Post contains images beryllium : I remember talks on the previous threads about how good this agreement is, and how beneficial, and why wouldn't FL and F9 go for a full-blown codesha
249 n7371f : It's not that easy. I believe it was in a separate post, where I laid out the legal specifics for Delta (or Republic) to get out of the contract flyi
250 Post contains images beryllium : North-south west coast sounds more like AS than VX... That one I actually could imagine... After all, who is a "codeshare whore" out there?...
251 mariner : There's no reason to flame you, in the context it's a perfectly reasonable question. I don't know enough about Virgin America to know the answer. It
252 Post contains images beryllium : Contracts, I believe, should contain clear wording on such things as early termination, and its consequences. If those contracts do not foresee (and
253 UAL727NE : OMG!!! LOL sorry for some reason I was thinking of someone that has hubs there. Sorry for the brain fart lol. But personally I think it would be cool
254 sunking737 : The main problem here is WAY TOO many topics going on under this topic heading. No wonder people have trouble following whats being said. It almost wa
255 n7371f : I completely agree...It is very difficult to follow all of this, as several times I have posted something and been quickly reminded it was already me
256 Post contains links and images mariner : A very, very rich code share whore. If that's a way Republic wants to go, you'll hear no complaints from me. Anyhoo, we're at 250 posts again (alread
257 sunking737 : I see Mariner has started # 8 already, see you over there...
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