SCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8587 posts, RR: 5 Posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 12936 times:
On 09/02/10, LAN Airlines S.A. will launch a new thrice weekly direct service between SCL and CDG. LA714 will operate SCL-MAD-CDG on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. LA715 will operate CDG-MAD-SCL on Wednesday, Friday and Sunday. LAN will utilize the A-340-300 on the route.
surfandsnow From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 2775 posts, RR: 31
Reply 4, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 12855 times:
Quoting SCL767 (Reply 3): By operating the route via MAD, LAN will be able to offer their customers rapid connections to and from LIM and GYE/UIO.
Thanks for the clarification! I was wondering why there was a need for the MAD stop, now I understand that it serves as a mini scissor hub - the airline's gateway to both Europe and South America! I see the FRA flights also stop there. Any plans to link the LIM-MAD flights to the FRA/CDG services, or for an EZE-MAD service on LAN Argentina?
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
talaier From Spain, joined May 2008, 490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 12437 times:
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 5): It will be interesting to see how LAN performs on this route with the competition of Air France and its DAILY NONSTOP flight CDG-SCL-CDG (B772ER).
Well, LAN surely has all the business pax locked in contracts on the Chilean side, so it should do well and the stopover (even though you don't get to leave the plane so it will be sold as a direct flight) will make it cheaper than AF.
And from some quick research on AF's website, the flight doesn't seem to operate daily, but 4/5x weekly?¿?
SCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8587 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 12352 times:
Quoting talaier (Reply 8): Well, LAN surely has all the business pax locked in contracts on the Chilean side, so it should do well and the stopover (even though you don't get to leave the plane so it will be sold as a direct flight) will make it cheaper than AF.
Also, cargo revenues will increase the yields generated by this direct service.
LipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11358 posts, RR: 59
Reply 13, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11811 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW FORUM MODERATOR
Quoting SCL767 (Thread starter): On 09/02/10, LAN Airlines S.A. will launch a new thrice weekly direct service between SCL and CDG. LA714 will operate SCL-MAD-CDG on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. LA715 will operate CDG-MAD-SCL on Wednesday, Friday and Sunday. LAN will utilize the A-340-300 on the route.
So they will go for a mini hub in MAD with continuing services to CDG and FRA.
Quoting C010T3 (Reply 7): Sad to know that the plans to fly to CDG through GIG have been scrapped.
It seems to be
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
The additional SCL-MAD frequencies were placed 1h 10m earlier than the daily flight and the additional MAD-SCL frequencies were placed 1h after the daily MAD-SCL departure.
They should do SCL-MAD-FRA 4 x week, SCL-MAD 3 x week and SCL-CDG-FRA 3 x week. The hit in performance for the SCL-CDG length of haul should be acceptable.
Well, it is clear that what works best for Europe-South American flights are the red-eye frequencies, which tend to be more comfortable (at least for those sitting upfront) since they allow for a good night's sleep before arriving in the early morning. IB operates it's SCL flight (codeshared with Lan) literally 15 minutes after the Lan departure: Lan is out at 23:55 and IB at 00:10 if I recall correctly. Another red-eye frequencies should work equally well, especially since theoretically those flights should come pretty full from CDG/FRA.
As to doing an SCL-CDG-FRA flight, I guess Lan has done its numbers and it just works out much better in terms of costs to operate a mini-hub at MAD, where they already have personnel, plenty of space and slots and IB to help them out should they need to re-book passengers.
Quoting PlunaCRJ (Reply 15): My thoughts exactly. They´ll have to cut frequencies on either SCL-MAD-FRA or SCL-AKL-SYD to get spare A340 time to operate the route, right?
And in the case something happens to an A340 delays will have a casacading effect through the system.
The SCL-GIG-CDG was interesting because of the fact it could be flown with 763 equipment...
LA is definitely an airline that really need the 787s as soon as possible.
Well, at least they have IB and they can re-book premium passengers into their daily flight from MAD should that happen. But yes, it seems Lan is really pushing its fleet. Is there any difference in terms of cabin layout between the A340s and the 767s?
FCKC From France, joined Nov 2004, 2348 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 11108 times:
After many years out of Paris , they are back ! Great news !
I must say i never understood why they have left the French market , after so many years to be happy with it.
I still remember the time they flew to ORY (Never went to CDG) with 707s and DC10s.
From a spotter corner , that was a very interesting airline , as every time a 707 LA landed at Orly , we always saw a new color scheme ! They had numerous color scheme versions , before getting the definitive one as wore by the DC10s.
Welcome back LA !
talaier From Spain, joined May 2008, 490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 10911 times:
Quoting PlunaCRJ (Reply 18): Why create a "mini hub" at MAD when partner IB already has a mega hub there?
For a pax bound for CDG, after stopping in MAD, there isn´t a major difference between flying the last sector to France on LAN or on an IB short haul service.
The big news here I think are not the new CDG flights, but the extra frequencies to MAD. The tag on to CDG comes as a bonus.
I don´t know the schedules of the LIM/ GYE - MAD flights... I wonder if they also allow connections to/ from FRA and CDG.
It's true but I think there are two important factors, the first being that if you are going to have the 340 sitting on the tarmac in Barajas for a full day, you might as well move it around Europe and with 5th freedom rights you can actually profit from those extra seats being sold and the second implying that for premium customers it's always better to keep the long haul product rather than sticking them into the intra-European "business class" which it's only real bonus- the lounges- aren't going to be used that much anyways since they would be on a connecting flight shortly afterwards.
As to your last point, IB has several (around the 4/5x tag) daily flights- with recently increased frequencies- into FRA, MUC, ORY (IB doesn't serve CDG) , FCO, MXP/LIN as well as other European destinations.
Air Comet's default has a lot to do with this new flight, I agree, but Lan's presence in Europe from SCL is rather limited and bound to increase as global demand picks up.
It will be interesting to see how the 787 changes LAN's presence in Europe, although bear in mind the mini-hub is an extremely cost-effective way for LAN to funnel passengers in Europe.
incitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 3957 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10729 times:
Quoting talaier (Reply 16): it just works out much better in terms of costs to operate a mini-hub at MAD,
I just cringe at the idea of calling LA's operation at MAD a "mini-hub". Hubs are either large scale operations or operations with lots of connecting opportunities. The addition of SCL-MAD-CDG creates zero LA-to-LA connecting opportunities at MAD.
Quoting talaier (Reply 16): where they already have personnel, plenty of space and slots and IB to help them out should they need to re-book passengers
You are omitting the potential of LA offering SCL-CDG nonstop. With AF doing it daily or close to daily, LA's nonstop presence in the market would attract a lot more passengers than a MAD stop.
: LA operates a one-stop flight in JFK on its services to Toronto (SCL-JFK-YYZ) even though AC offers a nonstop between SCL and YYZ, at high season on
: Actually, lan.com offers just 10 minutes difference between LA704 and LA714 when departing Santiago, and also 10 minutes later LA715 vs LA705 when de
: LA operated SCL-MAD 9x weekly last Christmas season when Air Comet entered BK. That is correct. The A343s will operate SCL-AKL-SYD daily, SCL-MAD-FRA
: LA has its code on a sizeable number of IB flights to European destinations (when you walk from the gates LAN uses in Terminal 4S there's actually- o
: Me too. May be the concept returns with another market. Now that JJ will cover the FRA gap, still missing Italy for example. In my view, considering
: I guess they rely on AA and QF for Asian connections at the moment. Is this correct?
: LAN's pax have many choices to Asia via JFK and LAX with other oneworld carriers. LAN uses AA, CX JAL etc. Also, LAN code-shares on KE's daily LAX-IC
: Why did LA choose CDG over LHR as its third destination in Europe? LA will face stiff competition from AF on flights to CDG, whereas it would have fac
: Plus the daily flight to SYD and all the connections Qantas can offer from there to pretty much anywhere in South East Asia. LHR could well provide c
: None of this justifies flying both SCL-MAD-CDG and SCL-MAD-FRA almost at the same time. The only reasonable justification is that LA feels they need
: IMO, LA will fly into LHR in due course. BA does not operate LHR-BEY, LHR-DAM, LHR-THR, LHR-TUN, etc. and doesn't even operate into Morocco. LH dropp
: I agree with you, SCL-MAD needs more capacity. But I think that even if they could send an 343 to CDG they wouldn't do so directly and funnel it thro
: No - they dropped it, but now LX flies to SCL operating a tag from GRU.
: No , it went a while back , it was replaced for a while by an LX-operated tag to SCL ( although , IIRC , it was from GRU rather than EZE but still co
: LX dropped ZRH-GIG-SCL last year and doesn't operate into SCL.
: LH operates nonstop EZE-FRA with 744 (6 per week).
: You're right - its gone. Although it was through GRU not GIG.
: Yes, it was via GRU, not GIG. LX097 operated its last flight out of SCL on 3/29/09.
: As mentioned more on AA, QF and KE. Not so good considering it demand 3 stops to reach Asia (LIM, LAX and ICN). Agree, that's why i believe LHR would
: LAN is the best and the worst thing for SCL these days. A great airline so why would Chileans fly something else but LAN (specially when the alternati
: Very doubtful about the AA 777s, since they have ATI with LA and most of the premium traffic on the route prefers flying them. IAD I believe is still
: LAN is by far the BEST thing at SCL, period! LAN will continue to expand at SCL and AA will most likely not use the B772 on the MIA-SCL route in the
: Exactly my toughts, and although I LOVE LAN, I think after flying QF and BA, LA is not that better, although it has by far the best IFE I've flown wi
: I don't really see much of your logic here. Sure, SCL doesn't have the variety that other South American airports like EZE, GRU, CCS, and to a lesser
: I hope that LA will inaugurate SCL-LIM-IAD soon after it takes delivery of the 787s. If LA starts this route, IAD will have direct flights to most ma
: Yes, for sure! Just look next door to Argentina. No strong carrier, a bad airport setup (EZE+AEP), and to top it off, a horrible government.
: LA has been good for the aviation sector in SCL and Chile generally, not to mention the job market there. However, its dominance at SCL overall and i
: Has LA considered making some or all of its flights to FRA nonstop? Presumably, there is suffiecient O&D traffic between SCL and FRA. Do its 343s
: The A340-300 can't make it fully loaded, by about 100-200 miles. But even if the aircraft could make it, FRA is not high-density enough for a 250-300