enilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 6782 posts, RR: 14 Posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10350 times:
This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now.
How to read:
ABE-MDT 3>2 APR means a reduction in one roundtrip from 3 to 2 for April only
ABE-MDT 3.8>2.7 APR-JUN This is the raw format of the data which sometimes I'm too lazy to retype. It means that over a month they were averaging a little less than 4 trips per day and now it's a little less than 3 per day. So, basically they cancelled 8 flights per week or so. Airlines are doing A LOT of non-daily ops now, so these fractions are pervasive.
ABE-MDT 4>6 MAY- means an increase from 4 to 6 roundtrips starting in May and continuing
ABE-MDT 4>6 MAY-JUN, 5>6 JUL means the change is only for the stated period May to June and then a different change for July in the same route
Please take it easy on any typos, there was a lot to type...
Service already started in November. It is currently suspended because of runway equipment violations that American Eagle claims makes flying into GHB unsafe. GHB officials are working on fixing the equipment violations, but cannot commit to a date when it will be finished. Until then the GHB flights are flying into ELH and AA has a charter bus meeting passengers to bus them to GHB.
enilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 6782 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10080 times:
Quoting mah4546 (Reply 1): Service already started in November. It is currently suspended because of runway equipment violations that American Eagle claims makes flying into GHB unsafe. GHB officials are working on fixing the equipment violations, but cannot commit to a date when it will be finished. Until then the GHB flights are flying into ELH and AA has a charter bus meeting passengers to bus them to GHB.
Then I should say "SVC never resumes"...
Quoting mpdpilot (Reply 2): Just a thought but do we think these are a response to DL's new Shuttle service to ORD from LGA? These are popular business markets so they could be unrelated but just a thought.
I absolutely think that. It's no coincidence that they add a bunch of DL hubs right after that. The CLT move is interesting because US is who DL is acquiring LGA slots from. Clearly its all tied in. They didn't even cancel anything YET to fund the flying which means it came out of nowhere without a well thought out plan. e.g. quick retaliation.
Retaliatory moves as expected, though I am shocked at the frequency. Last time AA did LGA-ATL they had 5 flights of which 3 were M80s and 2 ERJs, IIRC. Will be interesting to see they type of equipment used. And for LGA-CLT/MSP, I would've expected something more along the lines of 3 flights each instead of 5 and 4, respectively.
Josh32121 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 351 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 9784 times:
Where is AA getting the slots from the operate the ATL, CLT, and MSP flights? (I.e., what are they cutting to add these new services.) I didn't think they could or would sit on slots without using them.
Second, when did AA cut ATL-LGA? I flew it back in 2006 on MQ, and I think at the time there was a mix of several MD-80 and Eagle flights each day running the route.
Cubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22178 posts, RR: 20
Reply 6, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 9760 times:
Quoting enilria (Reply 3): They didn't even cancel anything YET to fund the flying which means it came out of nowhere without a well thought out plan. e.g. quick retaliation.
They didn't have the right airplane for LGA-CLT last time and yet got reasonably good results; it makes sense to give LGA-CLT a shot with CR7s. While we can quibble about whether MSP and ATL are retaliatory, I'm relatively convinced CLT isn't.
Regarding "coming out of nowhere," remember that AA tried to retire LGA slots a couple of years ago and just kept flights to keep the slots out of LFC hands when PANYNJ wouldn't retire the slots - there's no reason to keep those loss leaders around.
Cubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22178 posts, RR: 20
Reply 16, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 8511 times:
Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 9): I see, so it's actually still a somewhat moderate response.
It is. I think there's a difference in degree between "reaction" and "retaliation."
Let's take an imaginary route AAA-BBB on which airline A flies 2 daily ERJs. Say WN comes in with 4 daily 73Gs. That will likely change the market quite a bit. Going from 2x ERJ to 3x 320 is reaction (and is probably a shrewd move). Going from 2x ERJ to 8x 763 is retaliation.
My sense is that ATL/MSP/CLT are more in the former category; they are a reaction to Delta's growth in New York in general, not to any specific move. The announcement of ORD probably affected the timing some, but even without that announcement, I suspect that AA would have been in all three markets 18-24 months from now. The arrival of 2 class CR7s - probably the best aircraft for these routes - has nothing to do with anything Delta is doing.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
Surprised they are extending all these CRJ flights into late summer/early fall with oil approaching $90.
DL is more or less continuing their summer schedule. Their schedule for August didn't really reflect a continuation of the June/July schedule. Keep in mind the complexity of completely reworking the schedule this year since it is the first time they've been able to have the post-merger schedule one one combined system with all aircraft on the same ops specs. There is a enormous amount of one-time rework going this year which leads to way more schedule changes than normal.
The 5th MKE-BOS trip, which is a traditional seasonal addition, is ending in October as it normally does. This oddity in stats which make it appear MKE-BOS is dropping from 2x to 1x is likely a result of some trips being filed under YX and some under F9.
For what it's worth, the 5th MKE-LGA nonstop, one which is about to end so the slot can be used for a 3rd DEN-LGA, now shows on the YX site to return this fall. With the upcoming and ongoing consolidation of F9/YX, I would expect various schedule changes between now and fall.
Quoting KcrwFlyer (Reply 18): Quoting planespotting (Reply 15):
Is this just expanded for summer or will this be "permanent?" Could this be a reaction to AirTran's DSM entry?
seasonal. Thats no reaction worthy of FL.
Not a tyipcal reaction, but AirTran isn't flying DSM-ATL. Might be a different reaction if they were.
WA707atMSP From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2170 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7039 times:
At the risk of restarting the "retaliation or no retaliation" argument we've had on several different threads here, I still think AA's decision to add LGA-ATL / MSP is NOT retaliation. There are a lot of people who work on Wall Street / Madison Avenue / Eighth Avenue who need to fly to MSP and ATL to meet with Coca Cola / Target / Cargill / Home Depot / etc. AA needs to have a presence on these routes in order to compete for corporate contracts in New York City, just like AA needs to have a presence on LGA - DTW.
If AA wanted to retaliate against DL, they would have added a route like MSP-LAX (which AA served briefly in the late 1980s), DTW-LAX (in 1979, AA had 3x day DC-10s on this route) or JFK-SLC, which are not as critical from a network perspective - adding these routes would have sent a clear retaliatory signal to DL.