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Is AC Happy With Their Embraers?  
User currently onlineBoeing744 From Canada, joined Jun 2005, 1835 posts, RR: 23
Posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 20756 times:

So I was recently looking at AC's fleet information page and I noticed that they now have more Embraer 190s than any single type of A32X. They have 45 of them, plus 15 E175s.

I was wondering how happy Air Canada has been so far with the relatively young aircraft? How do customers like them? How are they for range, reliability, performance, etc? Can the E190s reliably serve some of their longer routes like SEA-YYZ or YYJ-YYZ without weight restrictions? Does AC have any more on order?

I have flown on AC's E190s a few times already in Economy, and I am scheduled to fly one in Executive on Monday from YOW-YYC. Personally I find them nice but this will be my first time on the aircraft for a somewhat longer flight.

74 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4226 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 20492 times:

I like flying in them. They are very comfortable. Now whether AC is liking them, well....


Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineAirNovaBAe146 From Canada, joined Jun 2008, 362 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 20430 times:

Amen. I like flying on them -even more than the A320s- but what AC thinks of them is another matter.

The E175s/190s to Jazz is a subject that occasionally flares up on various Canadian aviation websites. Can't see it happening, but certainly AC is aware of the cost savings it would provide.

AN


User currently offlineC172Akula From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 20381 times:

I will always book AC if the route I am travelling on has the E190 on it, very comfortable and roomy in the economy section. That extra space is a blessing when you are travelling with an infant let me tell you, and the lavatory at the back has plenty of room inside should you need to attempt the in-flight diaper change! 

Just flew the E190 with AC on YVR-YYC and will be flying YYC-YOW-YYC at the end of May on one.


User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3024 posts, RR: 36
Reply 4, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 20318 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
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I think Ac is very happy with them. They are a good DC-9/732 replacement where the A319 didn't do so well because it's just too heavy. The EMBs can do the lighter runs cheaply and with a lower fuel burn... and the pax love them. and it's letting them return some of the more expensive a32x leases.

Moving them to Jazz is unlikely, the pilot union would go apoplectic about it, they aren't thrilled as it is about the CRA at Jazz.



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineRJLover From Canada, joined Dec 2006, 577 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 20231 times:

Can the E90 do YYJ/SEA-YYZ without restrictions? It sure can.

AC has flown YYJ-YYZ with the E90 in the past and currently flies SEA-YYZ (and shortly will fly) PDX-YYZ, daily, with the E90.

The E90 is by far my favorite aircraft in ACs fleet and always try to route myelf on one when possible. As far as the Embraers going to QK... pigs will fly in a frozen hell before that happens.



Last Flight(s): YHZ-YUL-YYC-YVR-YYJ // YYJ-YYZ-YSJ-YHZ.....Next Flight(s):
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5244 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 20115 times:

Quoting Boeing744 (Thread starter):
How do customers like them?

I loved the AC E190 on my YVR-LAX flight in J... Very Nice!


User currently offlineB6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2891 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 19875 times:

On the E190 side, lets face it, comfort-wise it is a great aircraft for customers (as long as the crew doesn't get trigger happy with the thermostat/climate control). But on the AIRLINE side, many operators are not happy due to MX costs not calming down. It's not an issue with Embraer, mostly the OEMs and lack of support from the OEMs...and the fact that there are very few options still to procure components for the aircraft from places other than the OEMs. No competition = higher prices for parts to fix planes. I cannot speak on behalf of AC since I don't work for them, but I do know they are suffering as much as we are with the aircraft.

I personally love the aircraft. It is a beautiful plane that offers some of the best comfort that a narrow-body can offer with great performance.



"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
User currently offlineAirCanadaA330 From Canada, joined Aug 2008, 294 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 19870 times:
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I read in a past issue of Airliners International magazine....the CEO was quoted as saying they are a "game changer" so yeah I think they are liking them.


Cheers;
User currently offlinepnwtraveler From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 2241 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 19151 times:

AC is definitely happy with the aircraft. The lighter weight makes them much more economical then a partially full A319. It one of the reasons AC is rumoured to be looking at the Bombardier C series to replace some of the older A319s. They will then hold out for the A320/B737 next generation replacement with the rest.

User currently offlineLonghauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4990 posts, RR: 42
Reply 10, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 19125 times:

Right now, the E175/190s at Air Canada have a maintenance dispatch reliability rate that is the best in the fleet. Having been here for around 5 years now, both the pilots and mechanics have a pretty good handle on the aircraft.

Last year it was reported that the seat mile cost of the E190 was about the same as the A320s. (Less than the A319 and more than the A321). This is astounding considering the size of the aircraft. As we well know, normally the smallest in the fleet is the most expensive ... per seat mile. However the low capitol cost of the aircraft when purchased, combined with a lower than "formula" rate for pilot wages helps keeps the costs down.

On the routes the E175/190s fly, they are very very rarely weight restricted. The longest present route, YYZ-SEA, can be flown with a full passenger load, full baggage, hold a PDX alternate and still have open weight for takeoff from YYZ.

The longest route the aircraft ever commercially flew for AC was YYZ-SAN. Oddly enough, it was not weight restricted, however due to the low max fuel capacity 13,100 Kgs, often it was tight. In other words it could lift more fuel, it just couldn't carry it. But this too was because of limitations placed on the aircraft by AC when it was new. Today, it would not likely be an issue.

Marketing has shown a preference for the E175/190 over the A320 series and competitors B737s, so yes it is a game changer. It can fly long thin routes, without a passenger resistence against a CRJ type cabin.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4988 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 18902 times:

I hope Longhauler chimes in on this one. I believe he drives this type for AC. Early on, their on time departure was not too good. As I remember it was to do with software issues, specifically the need for the flight crew to be meticulous in their booting up of the flight control system. If you muffed it you had to go back to the beginning, I believe and that took time.

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25338 posts, RR: 22
Reply 12, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 18902 times:

Quoting Longhauler (Reply 10):
Marketing has shown a preference for the E175/190 over the A320 series and competitors B737s, so yes it is a game changer. It can fly long thin routes, without a passenger resistence against a CRJ type cabin.

I much prefer the Embraer's 2-2 Y-class seating to anything with 3-3. The only negative on longer flights (refering to AC's configuration) is only 1 lavatory for 84 Y class passengers on the E190 (1 for 64 on the E175), compared to 1 for only 53 Y class passengers on the A319 with 2 lavatories for 106 Y class passengers. The Airbus overhead bins are also larger.


User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4695 posts, RR: 50
Reply 13, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 18675 times:

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 11):
I hope Longhauler chimes in on this one.

Looks like your wish has been granted  



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineheathrow From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2005, 979 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 17025 times:

Quoting RJLover (Reply 5):
Can the E90 do YYJ/SEA-YYZ without restrictions? It sure can.

The ER version can.

I think you answered your question with the amount of them AC has.

From a passenger perspective they're nice, 2 - 2 is such a treat in Y. All in new cabin interior, although I believe some menu items are not available on these aircraft.

If I have to fly AC, I'd deffinately want it to be on an E190.


User currently offlineAirNovaBAe146 From Canada, joined Jun 2008, 362 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 16865 times:

Quoting Longhauler (Reply 10):
combined with a lower than "formula" rate for pilot wages helps keeps the costs down.

Now that virtually all the E175/E190 pilots have been on the property 2+ years and are off the paygroup 1st and 2nd year rates, how will the CASM of the Embraer be affected? How much did AC's overall strategy for this aircraft rely on a steady influx of newbies to keep the costs low?

Thanks,

AN


User currently offlineSSTsomeday From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 1276 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 16677 times:

Quoting pnwtraveler (Reply 9):
AC is definitely happy with the aircraft. The lighter weight makes them much more economical then a partially full A319. It one of the reasons AC is rumoured to be looking at the Bombardier C series to replace some of the older A319s. They will then hold out for the A320/B737 next generation replacement with the rest.
Quoting Longhauler (Reply 10):
Marketing has shown a preference for the E175/190 over the A320 series and competitors B737s, so yes it is a game changer. It can fly long thin routes, without a passenger resistence against a CRJ type cabin.

What I'd like to know is - and understanding the advantages mentioned above: Does the an airline operating this type on longer routes not take a hit with regard to cargo capacity? These A/C cannot take the same containers nor do they have the same freight capacity or weight capability underneath as compared to mainline A/C. Whereas I understand there is an advantage on thinner routes, passenger-wise, I understood carrying cargo was becoming a larger part of airlines' income.

How does AC and others reconcile this when they put gloried commuters on intercontinental routes? Is there no significant freight traffic between secondary centers such as San Diego/Seattle - Toronto? And if their isn't, the introduction of A/C on these thinner routes would PREVENT significant freight traffic from growing between such points.

Perhaps this is why we see these A/C on secondary routes, but we don't see them used on primary routes such as YYZ/LAX, even to attract market share using frequency, because the freight capability on those major routes would be diminished?



I come in peace
User currently offlineLonghauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4990 posts, RR: 42
Reply 17, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 16361 times:

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 11):
I hope Longhauler chimes in on this one. I believe he drives this type for AC.

I used to. When they were delivered, AC was offering a "no penalty downbid" to the E175/190s to get some experience on the aircraft type. So I left the A320 to fly Brasil's finest. However, I am presently flying what has always been, and may always be my favourite type .. the B767.

Quoting AirNovaBAe146 (Reply 15):
Now that virtually all the E175/E190 pilots have been on the property 2+ years and are off the paygroup 1st and 2nd year rates, how will the CASM of the Embraer be affected?

It actually doesn't make that big a difference, as the pay increase for F/Os from year 2 to year 3 is about $25,000 a year. (There are variations, but roughly $50,000 in year 2 to 75,000 in year 3). Or about $27 an hour. During that hour, an E190 would generate 48,360 seat miles. Or a cost increase of 0.0005 per seat mile.)

Quoting SSTsomeday (Reply 16):
Is there no significant freight traffic between secondary centers such as San Diego/Seattle - Toronto?

Freight isn't as concerned about a non-stop flight as are passengers. If there was a significant amount of freight traffic on say YYZ-SEA, it could be routed through YVR, or placed on a code share partner out of ORD. SAN-YYZ is presently being flown by an A319.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlinetommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 16343 times:

The E190s have incredible range for AC. They fly EWR-YYC daily which is a 5 hour flight at least.


"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlinecayman From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 905 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 14330 times:

The Embarsers do not have much over water capability right? I've always thought that AC could realy expand YYZ to Carribean, central america dn northern s America id these a/c could do it. Take GCM for example; I thinkn they are 4 or jaybe 5x weekoy withn a 319/320/321dependig on se4ason but wouond;t a daily frequency in a E175 or even 190 work well for them if they have th range? More frequency you would think they could build some transit traffic to Europe/Asia and western N America but that is harder with nion daily flights.

I assume they can't make YYZ CCS in the E Jets but that too is a shame I thinkn they could build some connecting traffic with beter timed flights and daily. I think yhey are still only 5 or maybe 5x weekly to CCS.

But I assume the E175 or E190 are not suited for kuch over watre flights like into Caribbean or nothern S America? Though doesn't AC use the 190 on YYZ SJU?


User currently offlinebakersdozen From Canada, joined Nov 2006, 336 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 14058 times:

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 18):
I used to. When they were delivered, AC was offering a "no penalty downbid" to the E175/190s to get some experience on the aircraft type. So I left the A320 to fly Brasil's finest. However, I am presently flying what has always been, and may always be my favourite type .. the B767.

Not to get too far off topic here but why is the 767 your favourite? Greater choice of longhaul destinations... or something special about the plane? I'm a fan of it too as it has been one of the most frequent and familiar sights after being away working in some 2nd/3rd "world" country for a couple of weeks and start to long for the trip home to Canada.

[Edited 2010-04-29 21:46:47]

User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 14052 times:

Quoting Boeing744 (Thread starter):
Does AC have any more on order?

I believe we received our last (a 190) sometime last year.

Quoting cayman (Reply 19):
But I assume the E175 or E190 are not suited for kuch over watre flights like into Caribbean or nothern S America? Though doesn't AC use the 190 on YYZ SJU?

I know we use it on YYZ-HAV. We have no direct YYZ-SJU flight

Above the wing, the family of Embraer jets are quite nice. I've flown a few flights on them, and they're quite comfortable aircraft.

Below the wing, however.. I'd love to meet the engineers who designed this thing and ask them how many rampers they talked to. It is not a friendly aircraft work in.



Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlineCentre From Canada, joined Mar 2010, 490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 13841 times:

Love the 2-2 layout in Economy... Did a number of runs on them, mostly TPA-YYZ in the low season and did YYZ-YYC last September ( No ovens, so no hot food provided in the long flights).
They are a very nice ride as long as there is no turbulence, had the worst turbulence experience in my life flying out of Tampa on an E190.



I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
User currently offlineAcey From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 1037 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 13320 times:

Nice for the pax flying the AC; wasn't exceptionally nice for the AC pilots flying them at first but it's better now; wasn't great for AC execs at first but it's better now; and not nice at all for the guys working these planes and it never will be.

That's the general idea.



If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
User currently offlineBAW716 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2028 posts, RR: 27
Reply 24, posted (4 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 13003 times:

AC has been operating the E190LR on YYZ-SEA for some time now and the reports are very encouraging. At only around 100 pax, AC is enjoying very high load factors and high customer satisfaction and since the E190 is about as fast as the Airbus, the flight times are not that much longer.

No surprise that AC has more of them...the economics (once the bugs were worked out of them) are really good and the passengers love it. It gives AC the capacity to grow a market before adding a larger aircraft like a A319 or A320 or adding additional flights with the smaller jet.

Smart move once again by our Canadian friends.

baw716



David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
25 Longhauler : At AC, they are equipped with life jackets, but not life rafts. There is not a lot of extra cabin space on the aircraft, so the only place for rafts
26 RP TPA : Since low season in Tampa is the summer, and the flight departs Tampa around 3pm, I can pretty much guess that you experienced the afternoon thunders
27 jetMARC : At jetBlue, in addition to lifevests, our E190s have three liferafts onboard. Two stowed in a compartment behind the G2 galley and one in the last rig
28 Post contains images YYZRWY23 : I think they are absolutely fantastic! I have only flown on an AC E175 once on the YYZ-DCA sector, but I have flown RP E170's to CLT twice. I have ne
29 YULWinterSkies : I only flew it once, and that was NW not AC. Became one of my favorite aircraft to fly on right away. Yes it's small, but small jets are cool sometim
30 Post contains images Longhauler : That's interesting. The ones behind the G2 Galley, are they in the overhead bin too, or do they replace the seat pair there? The one in the last righ
31 thenoflyzone : Does that mean B6 has ETOPS120 on the E190? Thenoflyzone[Edited 2010-04-30 08:52:33]
32 VC10er : I love an E170 through the E190. Last Sunday I flew from JFK on a UA E170 to IAD to get the UA 767 to London. That leg was a CRJ200 or EMB145. Often d
33 Post contains images Boeing744 : I love the 767 too, as a passenger. It is definitely my favourite aircraft in AC's fleet. I've been on the 77L and 333 with AC as well but I prefer t
34 Viscount724 : Why subject yourselt to so much inconvenience (increased risk of delays, lost baggage, misconnections etc.) not to mention several hours longer trave
35 RP TPA : IIRC, the original order for for 45 aircraft, plus options for 45 more. I'm not sure if that's been ammended. With AC deferring the 787's for a few y
36 Viscount724 : How far west do AC's E175s go? Are they ever seen in places like YYC/YEG/YVR?
37 RJLover : Not in normal ops. I have seen the E75 in YYC twice. Once when it was ferried in for maintence after going AOG in YXE. The second was on a scheduled
38 Post contains images YYZRWY23 : The farthest west I can find in th database is YXE and DFW. Correct. It is usually the 190's out west. That's what I could find. YYZRWY23
39 cayman : Did the San Juan service get chopped? I know AC used to fly there, I am guessing seasonally but I often saw 319s on groun and YYZ on daprture board.
40 Post contains images Centre : Not to divert the off the thread, but that was the scariest experience I have ever had with turbulence....It was few years ago, I believe in August..
41 VC10er : Good question! First I'm nuts. Second I do so many flights to Asia i want to get to GS asap. I prefer UA over AA, CO as they have no flat seats yet.
42 Longhauler : AC does not normally fly the E175 west of YYC/YEG due to single engine performance across the Rockies, and possible route restrictions. While you may
43 CRJ900 : How does that differ from the E190 and Jazz CRJ705 (which I assume cross the Rockies)? The CRJ705 and E175 both use the CF34-8 engine...
44 Boeing744 : That's a shame... I have always wondered why AC didn't use the E175 on YYC-YYJ. That route seems to always be packed on the current (4x?) CRJs when I
45 whiteguy : Last summer or 2 summers ago the operated an E175 on the second red eye flight from YYC-YYZ. Not sure how long it lasted.
46 VC10er : Which RJ seats more passengers? The E190 or the largest CRJ? What is the model number of the largest CRJ? Thanks!
47 RJLover : In the Air Canada (Jazz) fleet, the E90 seats 9J/84Y while the CRJ-705 (actually a CRJ-900) seats 10J/65Y. AFAIK, in current service the longest (lar
48 Viscount724 : Most carriers have fewer seats, but based on Bombardier and Embraer data, maximum all-Y class seating at the highest density is as follows: E170 - 80
49 Post contains images beechnut : I've flown on the 763 to/from Europe (in Y), and to/from Korea, in J. One of my all-time favorite aircraft from a passenger POV. And I think it just
50 EMBQA : Not that I'm aware of. jetBlue flies with 3 life rafts, 4 Door slides that can be used as rafts... plus 120+/- life vests
51 VC10er : I know an Embraer can fly for sometime over water like the US mainland to parts of South America. I recall Embraer showing range circles on their webs
52 Longhauler : The E190 has a much larger wing, with larger engines. Generally, performance of the E190 is better than the E175. CRJ705 is totally different airfram
53 jetMARC : Sorry it took me awhile to reply... I'm not sure what etops our E190s are rated for... The rafts hold 36 pax with an overload capacity of 54. Rafts ar
54 WildcatYXU : I don't want to sound like a smartass, but wasn't it Lockheed Lodestar rather than Loadstar?
55 Longhauler : Gosh, right you are! It's a bad day one doesn't learn something.
56 yyz717 : SJU is a winter route only (2x weekly from YYZ, and weekly from YUL). Primarily feeding cruise ships. 321/320. JetBlue operates the E190 to BDA (not
57 multimark : I agree that the 190 is a nice aircraft, but as someone mentioned, the one lav in Y is not a good set-up. Often there are line-ups on longer flights a
58 NASBWI : I will add to that to say that the longest over-water route B6's E90s have operated (not sure if they still fly the route) was JFK-SDQ. Nah, the 2 be
59 VC10er : How many E170 to E195's are on order? I know EMB stopped making the E145's except for any Legacy orders.
60 Longhauler : This in my opinion is a large issue with the aircraft. The number of lavs in a single cabin aircraft is fine, like with jetBlue, but with a premium c
61 laca773 : Isn't the E90/95 have greater height over a 737? They truly are beautiful birds and perform well for the airlines who have them. My only complaint is
62 BrianDromey : US Airways have done this, they introduced the E190 to their mainline fleet about 5 years back. All of those E190s are now being sold to Republic Air
63 YTZ : Does anybody here think it's feasible that AC might consider giving up the E175/190s for a Cseries fleet? I have always thought that CSeries would wor
64 pnwtraveler : The rumour mill has AC waiting for the A320/737 next generation for full scale replacement of the larger of the series and to fill the gap between sm
65 multimark : Assuming, of course, that AC is in a financial position to finance new a/c. They must have heaved a sigh of relief when the 787 was delayed. And ther
66 Longhauler : Oh I wouldn't worry about that. One thing is certain, Canada will always have Air Canada. The government and AC, are both too far up each other's APU
67 yyz717 : Just like Switzerland would always have a Swissair, Belgium a SABENA, Jamaica an Air Jamaica, Greece an Olympic. Right? AC is not profitable (let alo
68 Longhauler : I wont argue this, as transport in Europe is quite different economically than transport in North America. Air Canada shutting down in Canada, would
69 pilotpip : I don't know what weights AC's 175s are certified at but I can tell you at my airline we had some problems with the early 170s that were originally fl
70 SSTsomeday : Is that still the case with AC being privatized? Wouldn't Westjet be dragging them both into court all the time for unfair business practices? In wha
71 yyz717 : Don't you get tired of yours? When? The last 80-100 quarterly results would suggest otherwise. Great. Add to this list relinquishing ALL internationa
72 Longhauler : I agree. I agree with this as well. It has always been my opinion that were the Cseries a viable replacement for the A320/B737, then it would actuall
73 sunrisevalley : do these pilots go back on the types they were flying prior to this training pending delivery of the new type ? Do I assume 787's will replace 767's
74 AirNovaBAe146 : Jazz is a virtual airline, no different than the numerous Express or Connection contract carriers that exist in the US. They rely on the fat margins
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