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Southwest 737 Priority Over American MD-80  
User currently offlineMrSkyGuy From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1214 posts, RR: 3
Posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 23166 times:

Just a week ago, I had the pleasure of experiencing something I've never seen before.. an SWA 737 using the active runway in a backtaxi while a slower-taxiing AAL MD-80 was occupying taxiway Alpha ahead.

I fly WN quite a bit, and I understand the relationship WN cultivates with local airports.. they respect the folks working the system, and often it seems that this respect is returned in spades. But this time I was witness first-hand of a rather remarkable experience of a WN 737 wishing to get airborne quickly taking priority over an American MD-80 which had pushed 3 min earlier.. even in the absence of a clear taxiway to "make the pass."

We were taxiing behind the AAL MD-80 on taxiway Alpha (runway 15 was in use for departures, as is most common), but the MD-80 was crawling.. I'm talking less than 10 knots crawling. Everyone's looking at their watches and wondering when we'd be airborne when our crew suddenly pointed the nose towards the active and used the Alpha 2 intersection to enter the active and backtaxi on runway 33 and turn her 180 at the threshold.. and depart runway 15 in a hurry. Now make no mistake, I was pleased to see this happen as I too was watching my wristwatch (meetings were tight that morning), and happy to see us depart first. A hundred reasons could have precluded such an event in the MD-80's front deck, so I waved it off until we were deplaning in Vegas to poll the crew on my exit. To my surprise, our crew had asked the tower for a clearance to backtaxi ahead of the AAL crew purely for time (expecting it to be politely denied), and they were as surprised as I was to see it approved.

Has anyone else experienced this sort of event at other airfields with Southwest (or other dominant carriers at local hub airports)?

Here's a diagram to help those not familiar with the airport and/or lingo (red = SWA, blue = AAL):

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1359/swapreference.jpg


"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee." -- Gunter's 2nd Law of Air
83 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinebeeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1750 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 23136 times:

Quoting MrSkyGuy (Thread starter):
Has anyone else experienced this sort of event at other airfields with Southwest (or other dominant carriers at local hub airports)?

Well I have experienced it . It could have been done for several reasons maybe the AA MD80 had a tech issue, the Southwest a/c had a time constraint or the AA was way ahead of schedule and had to slow down
the reasons are many but those are a few basic.


User currently offlineJetmatt777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2774 posts, RR: 33
Reply 2, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 23005 times:

This happened to me one time in GNV. (Gainesville, FL) However, we were the one's who were passed by a corporate jet who was back taxiing on the runway. It probably has more to do with pilots pushing their luck with ATC or passing a plane that is planning on holding for a few minutes for a release time than it does ATC giving preference.

First come, first serve unless first come is too slow!  



No info
User currently offlinepilotpip From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3150 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 22924 times:

Could have been a variety of reasons. The most likely:

AA waiting for a release time from ATC.
AA waiting on performance numbers over ACARS.
AA having a MX issue.

WN having a release time that was earlier.
WN bringing the tower crew lunch the prior day (joke).



DMI
User currently offlineckfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 22922 times:

This was 12 years ago, but I was on an AA F100 departing YYZ for ORD. A storm front had passed through Chicago and was heading east. The storm front extended so far north that we actually flew to TVC and then followed the eastern shore of Lake Michigan, turning out over the lake near Holland, Michigan for slotting into the ORD arrival pattern.

Anyway, while taxiing out, I noticed that we were taxiing slowly, parallel to Runway 15L-33R. The active for departures was Runway 23. But rather than make the right turn and follow several aircraft ahead of us to the end of the runway, the pilot simply taxied out onto Runway 23, I'm guessing about 1500 to 2000 feet from the end, turned to the left and started his takeoff roll.

Now, this may have had something to do with trying to get into the air before airspace closed due to weather. The ride to ORD was bumpy. The "Fasten Seat Belt" sign was lit for the whole flight. The captain apologized several times for the ride, saying that despite chaning altitudes several times, he just couldn't find any clear air.


User currently offlineswiftski From Australia, joined Dec 2006, 2701 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 22904 times:

Quoting MrSkyGuy (Thread starter):
backtaxi

Technical term is "backtrack"


User currently offlinechrisair From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 2092 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 22854 times:

Quoting ckfred (Reply 4):
Anyway, while taxiing out, I noticed that we were taxiing slowly, parallel to Runway 15L-33R. The active for departures was Runway 23. But rather than make the right turn and follow several aircraft ahead of us to the end of the runway, the pilot simply taxied out onto Runway 23, I'm guessing about 1500 to 2000 feet from the end, turned to the left and started his takeoff roll.

I've experienced this several times on Horizon's prop planes. It used to happen more frequently on the Q200, but I've had it happen recently on the Q400. We just cut in front of the big conga line in SEA and off we go. Works for me!


User currently offlineMrSkyGuy From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1214 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 22646 times:

Quoting pilotpip (Reply 3):
Could have been a variety of reasons. The most likely:

AA waiting for a release time from ATC.
AA waiting on performance numbers over ACARS.
AA having a MX issue.

WN having a release time that was earlier.
WN bringing the tower crew lunch the prior day (joke).

These ran through my head as well, but neither were the case. I watched the AAL depart right after us during the right turn climbout and confirmed with our boys up front that'd we'd simply been given priority.

Quoting swiftski (Reply 5):
Quoting MrSkyGuy (Thread starter):
backtaxi

Technical term is "backtrack"

Backtaxi is used rather frequently here in the CONUS, whether appropriately or inappropriately.  



"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee." -- Gunter's 2nd Law of Air
User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3149 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 22592 times:

"Back taxi" is indeed the appropriate official terminology in the US.


FLYi
User currently offlineatcsundevil From Germany, joined Mar 2010, 1181 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 22427 times:

Well I can tell you exactly why.

This is something I've heard from MANY conversations with controllers at PHX. WN is renowned for taxiing at warp speed, while AA is just as renowned for clogging up taxiways and being slower than molasses. AA (I believe) is like several other airlines now-a-days trying to save fuel by taxiing with only one engine running. They start the second engine while taxiing. Trying to taxi with only one engine can be part of the problem.

What you witnessed is a true tortoise vs. hare. WN pilots are notorious for wanting to get the hell outta there and get off the ground because they are motivated by revenue sharing...something few other airlines, like AA, offer to their pilots. Hence, AA pilots get paid for engines running, and that's about all that matters.



1954 1974 1990 2014 -- Los geht's!
User currently offlineAcey From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 1031 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 22411 times:

AA from BUR is going to DFW I'd imagine? Release time is also my guess. You may be dwelling on this far more than is necessary, as under normal circumstances nobody has 'priority' over anyone else.


If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
User currently offlineJPuentes From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 48 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 22398 times:

I see this all the time at DEN, a ac will just be sitting there holding short of runway and another airplane will go to the next taxiway and takeoff. I was curious at first but I see it happen really often...
another thing they do is make an aircraft hold short at the second from first taxiway and depart all the other ac on the first taxi way...



If you can't convince them, confuse them
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5893 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 21903 times:
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One cool thing I've seen at BUR, especially during the morning rush, is WN taking off from the runway that is traditionally the landing runway...heading westward, rather than the longer taxi along the crossing runway...traditionally for take-off traffic.

User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3013 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 21623 times:

I always wondered why WN planes seem to "fly" down taxiways. Seems that would cost $$ in fuel to me, but what do I know??


Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineRobINDYHP From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 84 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 21568 times:

In IND I have seen a WN aircraft enter the departure runway at an earlier spot to takeoff if someone is moving very slowly to the normal point. Luckily in IND with the long runways it can do that.

User currently offlineJBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4489 posts, RR: 21
Reply 15, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 21185 times:

Quoting swiftski (Reply 5):
Quoting MrSkyGuy (Thread starter):
backtaxi

Technical term is "backtrack"

Not here  

[Edited 2010-05-03 07:50:34]


I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
User currently offlineN9801F From Samoa, joined Apr 2004, 332 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 20892 times:

In years past, I've sometimes observed aircraft taxiing extremely slowly when pilot contract negotiations were going poorly.

User currently offlinegordomatic From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 93 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 20699 times:

Is there any reason they couldn't use taxiway Bravo instead of the active?


We have clearance, Clarence. Roger, Roger. What's our vector, Victor?
User currently offlineMrSkyGuy From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1214 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 20322 times:

Quoting Acey (Reply 10):
Release time is also my guess. You may be dwelling on this far more than is necessary, as under normal circumstances nobody has 'priority' over anyone else.

Dwelling? No. Last time I checked, this was a forum for enthusiasts. I happen to work in the industry and found this occurrence remarkable considering the location, events, and later debrief from the crew. SWA received priority over the AAL MD-80, as I've noted twice.

Quoting N9801F (Reply 16):
In years past, I've sometimes observed aircraft taxiing extremely slowly when pilot contract negotiations were going poorly.

In Nance's book "Flying Colors", he details a situation at Dallas (when Braniff and AAL were slugging it out) where an AAL 727 had just landed and was not responding to ATC's calls to vacate the runway quickly..as if comms weren't working. To make matters worse, the 727 was moving.....very.....slowly. At the very last second, the 727 rapidly exited, yelped a half-hearted apology to "ATC and the Braniff behind them", and the controller immediately cleared the Braniff DC-8 to land. Nance was a pilot with Braniff at the time, and something tells me he may have been aboard this very jet.. who knows. AAL definitely went out of their way to mix it up for Braniff in their later years when Putnam and Crandall.

Quoting gordomatic (Reply 17):
Is there any reason they couldn't use taxiway Bravo instead of the active?

Bravo's not very wide, and I think there are building clearance issues. I've only ever seen GA and Bizjet traffic use Bravo.



"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee." -- Gunter's 2nd Law of Air
User currently offlineckfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 19716 times:

Several years ago, I was on an AA MD-80 departing LAS for ORD. We wound up sitting on the AA maintenance pad for 2 hours because of a ground stop at ORD. When the captain was updating the passengers, he said that ATC wanted us in the air at 12:10 PT.

Sure enough, we started an engine shortly before noon, then taxiied out past at least 10 airplanes waiting to depart on 25R, and started our take-off roll at 12:08.

I've also been at ATL plenty of times, departing for ORD on UA, AA, and DL, and we wind up pulling out of line and letting a few aircraft pass, because ATC had the plane slotted to take off at a specific time.

As for the fast taxiing of WN planes, here's a story that a friend of mine who flies for AA tells a lot.

This was in the early 90s, when my friend was a 727 F/O. He was departig IAH, when a WN 737 tried to pass on his port side. The captain asked the tower if he was supposed to be ahead or behind the Southwest jet. The controller told the Southwest captain in no uncertain terms to taxi behind the American 727, and he told the captain to pass it along to his fellow pilots that the next Southwest plane that tried to pass while taxiing at IAH would get written up.


User currently offlineMrSkyGuy From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1214 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 19470 times:

Quoting ckfred (Reply 19):
This was in the early 90s, when my friend was a 727 F/O. He was departig IAH, when a WN 737 tried to pass on his port side. The captain asked the tower if he was supposed to be ahead or behind the Southwest jet. The controller told the Southwest captain in no uncertain terms to taxi behind the American 727, and he told the captain to pass it along to his fellow pilots that the next Southwest plane that tried to pass while taxiing at IAH would get written up.

Great story! Now SWA's back at Hobby and getting no complaints there.



"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee." -- Gunter's 2nd Law of Air
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6551 posts, RR: 51
Reply 21, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 19420 times:

I'm pretty certain that the AA crews do their weight and balance numbers while they are taxiing to the runway...at least that's what I was told when I was working at the airport. This would explain the slow taxi times.

User currently offline727forever From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 793 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 19314 times:

Quoting swiftski (Reply 5):
Technical term is "backtrack"

"Backtrack" is an ICAO term used worldwide for the most part. However, in the U.S. the term "Back Taxi" is correct.

Quoting MrSkyGuy (Reply 18):
In Nance's book "Flying Colors", he details a situation at Dallas (when Braniff and AAL were slugging it out) where an AAL 727 had just landed and was not responding to ATC's calls to vacate the runway quickly..as if comms weren't working. To make matters worse, the 727 was moving.....very.....slowly. At the very last second, the 727 rapidly exited, yelped a half-hearted apology to "ATC and the Braniff behind them", and the controller immediately cleared the Braniff DC-8 to land. Nance was a pilot with Braniff at the time, and something tells me he may have been aboard this very jet.. who knows. AAL definitely went out of their way to mix it up for Braniff in their later years when Putnam and Crandall.

While I don't doubt that there was some Tom Foolery going on in this instance, during the landing roll out I often don't answer ATC calls either. The reason is with heavy reverse the noise levels are quite high and sometimes I don't hear them. Also, I am just a little busy at this point and the runway belongs to me until I am safely slowed and clear. I do my darnest to get down, slowed, and clear expediently. Nothing ATC says will change that. Once I am safely slowed I'll answer and comply with whatever he/she wants.

As for WN jumping ahead, this situation is just one more example. There could have been an ATC flow restriction, but more than likely it was just WN jumping ahead again. If the AA is poking along I say let WN pass, but what really gets under my girdle is when the other airplane is hustling out to the runway and local ATC still gives WN the free pass to go first delaying the other airplane.

727forever



727forever
User currently offlineBoeing1970 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 19314 times:

Quoting swiftski (Reply 5):
Technical term is "backtrack"

In the US it's back taxi.


User currently offlinedivemaster08 From Cayman Islands, joined Jul 2008, 334 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (4 years 3 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 18937 times:

It could be a couple of things happening here.

Firstly you dont know what speed the AA has "filed" for. So he could be operating at a low cost index so he may be just flying slow today due to op reasons. So in ATC we wouldnt want to burden ourselves with letting the slow (and possibly lower altitude) go first to then have the faster (and possibly climbing higher) sit and wait and then make more work for ourselves. So the DEP and TWR controller would of been co-ordinating for their departures, and its possible, that the controllers know that SW dont mess about and the DEP controller would of said to his TWR to give him priority. There is nothing worse for you to have the slow guy depart and then have to put more workload on yourself and also restrict the faster guy behind. So they would of probably asked SW if he is ready for departure and told him to backtrack the runway and cleared to takeoff.

Again as other people may of stated, their may be restriction in departure/arrival slots for the AA who was heading up to DFW which is indeed a busy airport. I have had a AA MIA-ORD flight pushback just ontime and then the pilot came on during the taxi to say that we are a bit early for our slot into ORD and they are trying to see if we can get an earlier one but it would be a 10 min delay here at least. So we sat about and 6 mins later the pilot came on and told us we had got a release and off we went.
Now for this situation it could also be the opposite, SW has to make its slot into Vegas and so got priority to get airborne first otherwise they may be sitting about waiting for another time and when you fly for an airline like SW, sitting on the ground waiting about isnt helpful (especially how they have quick turn arounds).



My dream, is to fly, over the rainbow, so high!
25 FiestaFlight : Not to get too off topic, but I sort or remember some VERY high speed taxis on Texas International DC-9s (at DFW of course) It seemed like we were doi
26 pilotpip : Single engine taxi has nothing to do with the speed of the taxi. Add a little thrust, plane goes faster. AA always taxis slow. Usually with two engin
27 TXAGKUWAIT : Not sure if this has been addressed, or if (in fact) that this is still the case..... Southwest's pilot contract has Captain/FO being paid based upon
28 MrSkyGuy : Advantage Southwest, IMO.
29 dfambro : About a week ago I was on a UA flight out of BOS, taxiing to 22R for takeoff, and listening to channel 9. ATC asked our crew if they had their "weight
30 MSYtristar : Like I said earlier, I believe AA does the W&B calculations while taxiing.
31 rfields5421 : I saw pretty much the opposite at BDL once a couple years ago. Our AA B-738 was three hours late arriving at BDL due to two sets of thunderstorms acro
32 RB211TriStar : I'm not familiar with this book. What is the author's full name? I'd like to grab a copy if I can find one. Sounds interesting.
33 Post contains links MrSkyGuy : Sorry, I messed up the name (a sign of my impending age). John Nance (famous in these circles for his aviation fiction--I'm more impressed with Splas
34 AndyinPIT : Man if I had a nickel...I ask UA this everytime they are going out, if there's someone behind them. Half the time ground will ask if they are ready,
35 Post contains images KELPkid : Not in the USA
36 Post contains images indolikaa : My preferred spotting arena being the Terminal 4 parking garage at PHX, I would argue otherwise. Having read the OP's observations, some of the memor
37 Post contains images KELPkid : I was going to point this out myself...probably a result of where their flight department places emphasis during training an ops, rather than extendi
38 flyingbronco05 : This is nothing new. At ORD, AA S80's are routinely passed by the RJ's. I don't think the RJ's are taxing fast, it's just AA S80's taxi sooooooo slow.
39 dl767captain : Ya they really seem to move, it probably has more to do with turn around time with so many flights. I honestly like how fast they move compared to ma
40 Post contains images RB211TriStar : Haha... no problem. Thanks a ton! Looking forward to some new (old) print for my travels.
41 Fleet Service : I guess there isn't much respect cultivated at LGA because I've seen WN in the glorious LGA Conga Line many a time. Even seen them waiting for a gate
42 ua777222 : Exactly. You will normally see WN fly down the taxiway when there is about to be a rush either at their destination or prior to departure. WN is a ve
43 MrSkyGuy : WN's LGA service is still new. That will take time. WN's service at BUR isn't new. Right you are. I've witnessed this first hand at LAX, with a WN 73
44 ArcrftLvr : As others have said, in the US we use the term 'backtaxi.' I surmise that in the time it took the WN plane to backtaxi and takeoff the AA plane could
45 indolikaa : I'm almost positive I've seen those happen at PHX, too. The way they smoothly banked right slightly, held for a bit, and then banked left made me won
46 Fleet Service : Why not? Probably because we're not talking about one person driving their personal vehicle like an arsehole. "Aircraft calling Mayday stand by pleas
47 n318ea : At the old Hartsfield after the first South runway was built. We used to call it "Delta inner" and "Eastern outer" runways. It seemed EAL was always t
48 GSPSPOT : However, I thought pilots taxiing didn't as much as sneeze without instructions/permission from ground controllers...(?)
49 737tanker : Actually there is some incentive, and it has been in the contract since at least 1994, it is called over fly pay. In the old contract there was a for
50 DAL7e7 : I think he means departing from the different taxiway/runway intersections.. On topic: I was on final at BHM last semester and saw a WN 737 do an int
51 71Zulu : They do that a lot at MSY too. Normal landing runways would be 10 and 19 with departures on 19 (long taxi). They will often ask for a 28 departure. T
52 indolikaa : I've seen plenty of private pilots do just that. My experience has been commercial pilots take their responsibilities a little more seriously. Haven'
53 atcsundevil : Well of course the plane will go faster with more thrust, I get that. My point was that it seems to me that it's more company policy than anything. W
54 MrSkyGuy : Careful with the image you are projecting there, bud.. you are making it almost sounds as if the SWA crews are reckless for faster taxiing than the A
55 atcsundevil : Oh no, that's not what I'm saying at all. WN, aside from some maintenance issues recently, has a damn good safety record. I know a few retired senior
56 ua777222 : They don't. But WN pilots know the operations of the airports they serve like the back of their hands. ATC will let them do what they want, knowing t
57 Alias1024 : Sidesteps are very common on the south side at PHX switching from 25L to 25R (probably landing east as well, but the airport seems to always be in a
58 atcsundevil : It's rare that a sidestep instruction is given at PHX, but it does happen...particularly when controllers try to cut things a little too close for th
59 MrSkyGuy : What in sam blazes are you talking about? How does that have any bearing in this thread? Nobody's talking about SWA getting infinite priority.. that'
60 ArcrftLvr : I know...I was just joking... Typically before noon, at PHX 7L/R and 8 are in use. Then at around noon, the airport is turned around, in which case 2
61 MrSkyGuy : I've been in the pattern when PHX "turned the boat".. it's quite fun to watch from the air.
62 Alias1024 : I usually get the sidestep when things are quiet for departures in the late evening. That's when I go there most often, and probably why I seem to si
63 dsuairptman : Interesting as the AA S80 flights I have taken seemed to have a standard taxi time compared to others. That being said how do S80 crews get the prefor
64 mrskyguy : Can you be more specific?
65 dsuairptman : All WN aircraft are equiped with a electronic device that can be pulled out and quickly calculate take off preformance numbers. It is a fairly small
66 MLD9S : Gee....I wonder if ONE more person could let us all know that in the United States "back taxi" is an appropriate term/phrase? Come on...just ONE more
67 727forever : Hey, by the way, I'm not sure if you knew but.... Relax, the flames were warranted for that one. 727forever
68 ua777222 : Yes....... (Have you not read the posts before yours??)
69 PITrules : No, not really.. His profile states flight training in Australia (different ATC terminology); I'm sure his "correction" was well intentioned.. even i
70 atcsundevil : Oh okay I see what you mean. When traffic is light it usually varies from controller to controller, I think. As I'm sure you know, the official flow
71 indolikaa : You sure don't ask for much. That's like asking people to do a forum search before posting. When you talk about accurate takeoff and landing informat
72 MrSkyGuy : Oh certainly. An early rotation can cause the angle of attack of the aircraft to largely cease increases in speed, gluing it to the runway. Or it cou
73 AAR90 : Correct for the most part --there are always some % people who are PO'd at management all the time and think they are "making a statement" by moving
74 swiftski : Thanks. My Jepps say back-track, I apologise to all the offended ones for presuming that another ICAO country would use the same phraseology. I'll al
75 Post contains images lightsaber : I've found this thread very interesting with the insights to different airline procedures (weight/balance, etc.) Thank you. I wondered that myself. At
76 barney captain : Lets try and put that to bed once and for all - we get paid scheduled or actual, whichever is greater - and it's been that way for nearly 2 decades.
77 Maverick623 : For good reason: NW255, DL1141, JK5022, and RI91.
78 MrSkyGuy : ..and I was eternally grateful for the expedite! Getting somewhere early allows me to pace myself a bit through the terminal to the car rental, and t
79 atcsundevil : Yeah that's what I was getting at, and it seems to be a good reason for the slower than average taxi speeds. I have noticed that the super 80s taxi s
80 Alias1024 : Oops! I bet there were some choice words being exchanged on both sides of the radio after that. I assume that's for instrument approaches, or is ther
81 swiftski : I can't speak for PHX, but again, Australia is as follows in terms of parralel visual. US may or may not be the same. I'm sure US airline guys can co
82 MrSkyGuy : I've noticed that as well, and always wondered what the holdup was with AAL's -80 taxi speeds.
83 BMI727 : This is a bit tangential, but this seems like an appropriate place to ask. Are taxi speeds up a bit across the board because of the increased use of c
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