na From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 11557 posts, RR: 9 Posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 7826 times:
Now that AUA is being integrated into LH, its logical to speculate about Austrian´s longhaul which is an oddball with its small number of 763s and 772s. I assume these aircraft wont have a future under the new owners.
1stfl94 From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 1455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 7326 times:
I guess it will depend on LH's long haul orders, i.e. a 787 or A350 to replace some of the LH A343s could also be used to replace the AUA fleet. In the meantime as long as there is long haul flying from VIE, it doesn't make much sense to change the fleet yet.
BrianDromey From Ireland, joined Dec 2006, 4143 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 7254 times:
The AUA fleet is small, in the grand LH scheme of things, however I am pretty sure that LHT has maintenance facilities for the 767, which makes this less of an issue. I would also imagine that because the fleet is completely separate to the LH fleet the lack of commonality is not a huge issue, right now. Going forward, Im sure the LH group will have a common spec and aircraft type, although in all likelihood LH will order both the 787 and A350.
What I was thinking, is if SK becomes part of the LH group the A321s and A319s might be swapped with the AUA fleet of 737-600/700/800. I know the engines are different, but both engine types are operated by the group as a whole. This would probably be a bigger benefit for SK than AUA.
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
kaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 13242 posts, RR: 34
Reply 3, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 7189 times:
And let's not forget SN's long haul fleet. Is this actually operated by SN itself and is it included in the LH deal?
As to AUA, to stick to the thread title, I think they will hold on to their current fleet of 777s and 767s for the time being. Although the 767s are a bit long in the tooth, they have been retrofitted with PTVs and OS has a very good reputation for service.
Long term, I agree that LH is likely to make an aircraft choice - most likely the A350 - which it will order in sufficient numbers to replace the currents fleets of LH itself, LX and OS - possibly SK as well.
Ronaldo747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 440 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 7055 times:
IIRC just after the take-over LH stated that they stick with to the 777s with the possibility to purchase additional frames later on. I don't know about the 767, but they has even been retrofitted with winglets, I guess they will stay with AUA for the medium term. I guess they will be replaced with 787s. An all-A350 or -B787 fleet for all of their subsidiaries is unlikely.
na From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 11557 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days ago) and read 6189 times:
Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 2): LHT has maintenance facilities for the 767, which makes this less of an issue.
LHT in HAM services both the 767 and 777.
Quoting Ronaldo747 (Reply 4): I don't know about the 767, but they has even been retrofitted with winglets, I guess they will stay with AUA for the medium term.
That says nothing. CO retrofitted some of its 733s with winglets and retired them just a year afterwards. The OS 767 retrofit was ordered before LH took over.
As Swiss is phasing out its A332s couldnt they replace Austrians 763s perhaps?
Quoting Ronaldo747 (Reply 4): IIRC just after the take-over LH stated that they stick with to the 777s with the possibility to purchase additional frames later on.
SA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3431 posts, RR: 16
Reply 7, posted (5 years 12 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5949 times:
Quoting na (Reply 5): That says nothing. CO retrofitted some of its 733s with winglets and retired them just a year afterwards. The OS 767 retrofit was ordered before LH took over. As Swiss is phasing out its A332s couldnt they replace Austrians 763s perhaps?
Lufthansa has agreed to maintain Austrian air traffic infrastructure to the greatest possible extent, taking into consideration the needs of Vienna as a business location, as well as continuing to expand this wherever commercially viable in line with the needs of the market. Austrian Airlines will retain a presence in the intercontinental aviation sector with its own long-haul fleet, and contribute its own specific key competence to the Lufthansa Group by continuing to build upon its Focus East strategy.
In order to turn profitable ASAP, I assume that OS will retain their current Boeing long haul fleet, rather than return to an Airbus fleet (A332 and A340) which they divested not too long ago? Please correct me if I'm wrong?
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
na From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 11557 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (5 years 12 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5896 times:
The press text only means that AUA will remain as a brand and will retain a longhaul fleet of its own. It doesnt mean its present longhaul fleet though. If there´s one fact that gives the 777/767 a chance to fly for another few years its that there´s a major shake-up ahead affecting all airlines: 767/777s/A330s/A340s will be replaced largely by 787s and A350s. Its unlikely LH will order more A330s to replace those few AUa planes.
LH wont make the mistake others did and kill good brand names. I´ve spoken with LH people personally about this topic.
columba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7207 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (5 years 12 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5764 times:
Quoting MHG (Reply 6): I´d guess at least the B767-300 could be of interest for Condor.
But certainly not in the short term ...
Well Condor is interested in additional frames, they were interested in the Belair 767 for a short time. But if I recall correctly Lufthansa does not hold any shares of Condor anymore.
Quoting Ronaldo747 (Reply 4): IIRC just after the take-over LH stated that they stick with to the 777s with the possibility to purchase additional frames later on
You do recall correctly LH indeed stated that theyy stick with 777s and stated the possibilty of ordering new frames.
I don´t think it makes sense to drop the 777s and order A330s now - it makes no sense dropping an aircraft and replace it if the successor is already available. The OS 777 are in very good shape and can continue to fly for at least another 5 years even longer if they have to.
LH is in the middle of evaluating an A340-300 replacement and I think we will see a huge order as this order will also be for LX; SN and OS. Although LX has the newest A333s in LH´s fleet and they will continue to stay a little longer.
As SN and OS don´t have a huge intercontinental network I beliebe the 787-8/-9 is the right aircraft for them. LH mainline might choose the A350-900/-1000 combination for themself although I would not exclude the 787-9 per se for LH mainline.
I can see the LH/OS/SN and LX fleet looking like this:
A350-1000 (maybe, ZRH has the potential for a big hub and Swiss once had the A346 on order)
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong