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Hainan Airlines To MEX In Late 2010.  
User currently offlinepzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9417 times:

According to El Norte, top executives of HU and top officers of Hainan province revealed in Mexico that HU is due to start flying PEK-MEX in late 2010 or early 2011. Announce was made during their visit to Mexic along with Mexico's Tourism Minister.
There was no schedule mentioned nor stops (though article states it will be a direct flight).
http://www.elnorte.com/negocios/articulo/560/1118111/?grcidorigen=1

With the above, this would be the second Asian carrier stating officially their interest to begin flights to MEX soon. Recently KE established their will to fly via SEA. In fact, the bilateral agreement signed by South Korea and Mexico recently was pushed by KE.

If these two come to fruition, AM will have some more competence in Mexico-Asia (remember they fly to NRT and PVG). However, I see deep potential in these market and four destinations are only the beginning.

pZZ

[Edited 2010-05-10 20:59:30]


Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
37 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5910 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9360 times:
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Although it might be a bit excessive, there's always that possibility the both KE and HU could fly SEA-MEX. Maybe they'll fly on opposite days...equaling to an almost daily frequency.

User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6217 posts, RR: 30
Reply 2, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9080 times:
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Well. If a Chinese carrier is interested in serving MEX, it must mean that China routes to MEX have the potential to be very succesful and that they finally noticed that AM is stealing the show. Good for them and good for AM. Competition is always great.

User currently offlineBN747 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 5613 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 8864 times:

It seems to me it's now decision time for AM...

..they must now make the full fledge commitment to their current Asian destinations or get their 'lunch' eaten by these two new 'balls-to-the-wall' entrants. Meaning, AM must build on the lead in what it has started, No doubt KE is going 777s on their run and just may go 748-I down the stretch. HU will likely go A330 or kick it off with the A346s they recently acquired. AM will have to increase freqs. to their Asian markets and go all 777s and abandon the 767s on those runs. With JAL now out of MEX, AM owns the market..they need to start acting like it. Because this sounds like a clarion call to me.

BN747



"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
User currently offlinenetjetsintl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 8747 times:

Quoting pzurita1 (Thread starter):
According to El Norte, top executives of HU and top officers of Hainan province revealed in Mexico that HU is due to start flying PEK-MEX in late 2010 or early 2011. Announce was made during their visit to Mexic along with Mexico's Tourism Minister.
There was no schedule mentioned nor stops (though article states it will be a direct flight).
http://www.elnorte.com/negocios/arti...gen=1

If this does happen, it'd have to be a stop somewhere, MEX's altitude a big factor AGAIN

Quoting pzurita1 (Thread starter):
If these two come to fruition, AM will have some more competence in Mexico-Asia (remember they fly to NRT and PVG). However, I see deep potential in these market and four destinations are only the beginning.

Agree with you there... I think ICN is definetly overdue, actually I seriously though AM would make that announcement someday... As far as KE, I don't know how I feel about the SEA stop (again if it happens), wouldn't LAX, or SFO make more sense??? I know YVR is out due to the visa thing

Just checked wikipedia, it say "Hainan's MEX service starts winter 2010/2011"

cheers

[Edited 2010-05-11 04:20:01]

User currently offlineAeolus From Mexico, joined Aug 2007, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 8547 times:

Quoting netjetsintl (Reply 4):
wouldn't LAX, or SFO make more sense???

Well, I think it's got something to do with the route rights. AM and MX fly in/out MEX and UA flies SFO and used to (IIRC) fly LAX. So I think it's an overkill of the route. Volaris flies LAX from different parts of Mexico, so I don't know. There was a discussion on Snake & Eagle - Mexican Aviation Thread 3 , so you can consult there...

If I were HU, I'd send the A346 nonstop from PEK and stop in either SFO or SEA PEK-bound, but I don't know if there's the O&D traffic to make a PEK-MEX nonstop...

KE will certainly open the ICN-SEA-MEX route and we were discussing that on the thread dedicated to KE's service to MEX and on the Mexican aviation thread as well if you'd like to take a look at them.

Quoting BN747 (Reply 3):
AM will have to increase freqs. to their Asian markets and go all 777s and abandon the 767s on those runs

I agree, maybe 5x and all 777s? They recently went 3x IIRC to NRT (B762/763 with a B772 once in a while) and it's 2x/3x PVG (B772).

Quoting AR385 (Reply 2):
hey finally noticed that AM is stealing the show

Yeah, it seemed like they were working under cover.

I'm glad to see more Asian interest in Mexico. Specially after JL had to pull out of MEX. Is this all because of the "maquiladoras" up north or why is there so much Asian traffic in the recent years in Mexico (in general)?

-Aeolus



Flying under the clouds above!
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7582 posts, RR: 42
Reply 6, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8432 times:

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 1):
Although it might be a bit excessive, there's always that possibility the both KE and HU could fly SEA-MEX. Maybe they'll fly on opposite days...equaling to an almost daily frequency.

How about HU flying to MEX via Europe? Maybe MXP or MUC? I don't know if this is at all possible from a regulatory point of view, and I do appreciate it is a less efficient routing than crossing the Pacific, but hey, why not discuss it?

Quoting netjetsintl (Reply 4):
As far as KE, I don't know how I feel about the SEA stop (again if it happens), wouldn't LAX, or SFO make more sense??? I know YVR is out due to the visa thing

Well, LAX is out of the question. AM and MX will lobby very hard to avoid that. MX once got rid of MH in the LAX-MEX route already. SFO is also served by both AM and MX, so I am sure they will not permit a stop at SFO. SEA however seems like a fair option (albeit a bit less disadvantageous in terms of picking up passengers)... AM tried SEA and failed, and KE's service via SEA would allow it to place its code on that flight bringing back SEA to the list of destinations offered nonstop to its MEX customers.

Quoting Aeolus (Reply 5):
KE will certainly open the ICN-SEA-MEX route and we were discussing that on the thread dedicated to KE's service to MEX and on the Mexican aviation thread as well if you'd like to take a look at them.

Has KE confirmed that this flight will be launched?



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5910 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8419 times:
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Quoting Aeolus (Reply 5):
If I were HU, I'd send the A346 nonstop from PEK and stop in either SFO or SEA PEK-bound, but I don't know if there's the O&D traffic to make a PEK-MEX nonstop...

I don't think HU has route authority to fly PEK-SFO. I think the only other US cities they have authority to fly is BOS and HNL. MEX could be an extension of their PEK-HNL service which probably will be the A346.


User currently offlineHeeseokKoo From South Korea, joined Jan 2005, 640 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8401 times:

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 6):
Has KE confirmed that this flight will be launched?

Not yet. Actually Korean government didn't distribute this route to airlines yet. It may take up to another couple of months. KE will grab it for sure, but still need to go step-by-step.


User currently offlineAeolus From Mexico, joined Aug 2007, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8391 times:

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 7):
I think the only other US cities they have authority to fly is BOS

How about a flight through BOS? That'd be interesting. Although, would that be a good idea? AM tried the route... we all know how that went on... Is there any Asian service to/from BOS?


Quoting EddieDude (Reply 6):
MUC?

Doubtful. I guess we'll be seeing MX, AM or even LH starting this route before HU does (if that ever occurs to them). It just wouldn't be profitable... I'd rather much prefer go MEX-US-PEK or even take AM's service to PVG and transit towards PEK.

-Aeolus

[Edited 2010-05-11 10:17:08]


Flying under the clouds above!
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6147 posts, RR: 23
Reply 10, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8370 times:

I would imagine the route to MEX would only warrant a A330 size a/c. This would make SEA the only viable option. If they choose SFO/LAX you get tremendous competition not only on the Mexico sector, but on the Chinese sector as well. Seattle seems like the best fit for them.


"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7582 posts, RR: 42
Reply 11, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8367 times:

Quoting HeeseokKoo (Reply 8):
Not yet. Actually Korean government didn't distribute this route to airlines yet. It may take up to another couple of months. KE will grab it for sure, but still need to go step-by-step.

Thank you. Will have to be patient then!  
Quoting Aeolus (Reply 9):
Is there any Asian service to/from BOS?

Unless I am mistaken, I think there are no non-stop flights between BOS and Asian airports at the moment.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlinedirectorguy From Egypt, joined Jul 2008, 1688 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8350 times:

Quoting Aeolus (Reply 9):
Doubtful. I guess we'll be seeing MX, AM or even LH starting this route before HU does (if that ever occurs to them). It just wouldn't be profitable... I'd rather much prefer go MEX-US-PEK or even take AM's service to PVG and transit towards PEK.

Keep in mind that everyone needs a valid US visa to transit through the US...a China-Europe-Mexico would eliminate that need.


User currently offlineAeolus From Mexico, joined Aug 2007, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8310 times:

Quoting directorguy (Reply 12):
Keep in mind that everyone needs a valid US visa to transit through the US...a China-Europe-Mexico would eliminate that need.

True, but who would want to spen over 20 hours changing planes and going literally around the world? I know the option of doing that is a reality (via BA, LH, AF, KL...) and well, I don't know about people outside the aviation world willing to travel around the globe and yet, having delays and stuff... Besides, loads of US-travellers (Mexican/Latin American Origin) tend to have in mind they need a visa... but we would need to see some percentages.

I think AM's Asian flights through TIJ are a success because that way all those people you mentioned, not having a visa, can travel without restrictions. But I'd still go with a BOS/SEA service...

-Aeolus



Flying under the clouds above!
User currently offlineolli From Mexico, joined Mar 2001, 341 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 8181 times:

Quoting Aeolus (Reply 13):

I think AM's Asian flights through TIJ are a success because that way all those people you mentioned, not having a visa, can travel without restrictions. But I'd still go with a BOS/SEA service...

What about SAN, is there weight restrictions due to runway lenght?

Regards,


User currently offlinenetjetsintl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 8102 times:

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 6):
Well, LAX is out of the question. AM and MX will lobby very hard to avoid that. MX once got rid of MH in the LAX-MEX route already. SFO is also served by both AM and MX,

You make a good point, but I'd like to think this isn't the 80s and 90s anymore.... Calderon wants better economic ties with China, he's made that very clear. If Hainan proposes PEK-LAX-MEX or PEK-SFO-MEX, and Aeromexico & Mexicana object to it, I'm sure calderon will tell them to go jump in a lake somewhere...and I hope he does

Quoting as739x (Reply 10):
I would imagine the route to MEX would only warrant a A330 size a/c. This would make SEA the only viable option. If they choose SFO/LAX you get tremendous competition not only on the Mexico sector, but on the Chinese sector as well. Seattle seems like the best fit for them.

Yes sir, i don't see Hainan sending the 767 on this route... maybe SEA does make more sence than LAX and SFO due to less competition


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6217 posts, RR: 30
Reply 16, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 8050 times:
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Quoting netjetsintl (Reply 15):
You make a good point, but I'd like to think this isn't the 80s and 90s anymore.... Calderon wants better economic ties with China, he's made that very clear. If Hainan proposes PEK-LAX-MEX or PEK-SFO-MEX, and Aeromexico & Mexicana object to it, I'm sure calderon will tell them to go jump in a lake somewhere...and I hope he does

You are kidding right? It´s been a long while since Calderón made any reasonable, logical decision.

Quoting netjetsintl (Reply 15):
Yes sir, i don't see Hainan sending the 767 on this route... maybe SEA does make more sence than LAX and SFO due to less competition

if Hainan has the equipment, I don´t see why they can´t do it nonstop.


User currently offlinenetjetsintl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 8009 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 16):
if Hainan has the equipment, I don´t see why they can´t do it nonstop.

Hainan's long range fleet consist of 767s, A330s and A340-600s ( and orders for the 787 I think)....

the problem would be MEX's high altitude... Hainan can probably do PEK-MEX non-stop with the A340-600, but MEX-PEK might be a problem. i don't know the performance characterisitcs of the A340-600


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7582 posts, RR: 42
Reply 18, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 7890 times:

Quoting netjetsintl (Reply 15):
Calderon wants better economic ties with China, he's made that very clear. If Hainan proposes PEK-LAX-MEX or PEK-SFO-MEX, and Aeromexico & Mexicana object to it, I'm sure calderon will tell them to go jump in a lake somewhere...and I hope he does

LoL. I am all for competition and I wish there were 5th freedom rights flights ex-Mexico. But I seriously doubt we will ever see, under our current aeronautical legislation and current bilateral agreement with the U.S., flights such as Mexico-LAX/SFO/JFK/IAH/etc.-XXX with traffic rights. I am sure HU is not contemplating any airport in the U.S. currently served by Mexican carriers as an intermediate stop if its ambition is to be granted fifth freedom rights.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineFyano773 From Mexico, joined Mar 2004, 784 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 7665 times:

Though HU's entrance to MEX is great news, I always thought that PEK would be started by a Mexican carrier, first: MX.

Quoting pzurita1 (Thread starter):
If these two come to fruition, AM will have some more competence in Mexico-Asia (remember they fly to NRT and PVG). However, I see deep potential in these market and four destinations are only the beginning.

Additionally, China Eastern, based in PVG is joining Skyteam, taking full advantange of this partnership:

Quote:

When formalised, China Eastern will be the second Chinese carrier in the alliance after Guangzhou-based China Southern Airlines. It is uncertain if Star Alliance member Shanghai Airlines, which China Eastern bought this year, will also join SkyTeam as well.

Adding China Eastern gives SkyTeam customers access to the entire Chinese market, says the alliance.

"China Southern already covers China through its hubs in Guangzhou and Beijing. Together with China Eastern and its hub in Shanghai, SkyTeam will be able to offer services out of the three major Chinese markets," it adds

China Eastern's cooperation with Delta Air Lines and Aeromexico would give the alliance greater access in the trans-Pacific and Latin American markets, says SkyTeam. Growth to and from Europe will be come through cooperation with Aeroflot, Air France-KLM, Alitalia, and CSA Czech Airlines.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...stern-decides-to-join-skyteam.html

So yes, there is a tremendous potential in the Mexico-China market...

Fyano


User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5910 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (4 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7492 times:
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Quoting EddieDude (Reply 18):
LoL. I am all for competition and I wish there were 5th freedom rights flights ex-Mexico. But I seriously doubt we will ever see, under our current aeronautical legislation and current bilateral agreement with the U.S., flights such as Mexico-LAX/SFO/JFK/IAH/etc.-XXX with traffic rights. I am sure HU is not contemplating any airport in the U.S. currently served by Mexican carriers as an intermediate stop if its ambition is to be granted fifth freedom rights.

SEA is not served by any Mexican carriers at the moment. AM left SEA a few months ago...leaving no nonstop service to MEX. KE has expressed interest in ICN-SEA-MEX and I would imagine the flight would operate between 3X and 4X weekly. HU's only US gateway for the time-being is SEA. They could fly the SEA-MEX route on opposite days of KE. I believe HU received regulatory authority to fly PEK-HNL. They could consider extending that to MEX. I don't think any service exists between Hawaii and Mexico. Is there a market there? Who knows.

KE would benefit the most out of the SEA-MEX since they have a codeshare agreement with AS/QX.


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7582 posts, RR: 42
Reply 21, posted (4 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7365 times:

Quoting Fyano773 (Reply 19):
Additionally, China Eastern, based in PVG is joining Skyteam, taking full advantange of this partnership:

...

So yes, there is a tremendous potential in the Mexico-China market...

I agree. MU can codeshare on MEX-TIJ-PVG-TIJ-MEX and a number of AM's flights ex-MEX, and AM can codeshare on MU's most important domestic and Asian flights ex-PVG. This is certainly a great opportunity for the two carriers.

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):
SEA is not served by any Mexican carriers at the moment. AM left SEA a few months ago...leaving no nonstop service to MEX.

That is correct. The lack of success of AM at MEX-SEA (including the intermediate SJD¿? stop towards the end of the life of the route) has been amply discussed here.

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):
KE has expressed interest in ICN-SEA-MEX and I would imagine the flight would operate between 3X and 4X weekly.

I agree. I don't see any more than 3 or 4 weekly flights at first. The market needs to be developed step by step.

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):
HU's only US gateway for the time-being is SEA. They could fly the SEA-MEX route on opposite days of KE.

KE and HU flying SEA-MEX (for a total of 7 weekly flights) would probably be too much. The market does not exist. The SEA stop is required due to range limitations and can work as a revenue enhancement of the flight. However, the SEA-MEX-SEA segments cannot be expected to be the money-maker segments. 7x weekly MEX-SEA service nonstop on widebodies (say 77Es and A332s) would be overkill.

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):
HU received regulatory authority to fly PEK-HNL. They could consider extending that to MEX. I don't think any service exists between Hawaii and Mexico. Is there a market there? Who knows.

They could consider doing that, but they won't see many Mexicans disembarking and embarking at HNL. The market is way too thin and demand is better served via LAX.

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):
KE would benefit the most out of the SEA-MEX since they have a codeshare agreement with AS/QX.

Plus, KE would definitely codeshare with AM if they launch ICN-SEA-MEX. After all, they belong to the same alliance and AM would certainly provide some passengers per flight.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5910 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (4 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7272 times:
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Quoting EddieDude (Reply 21):
I agree. I don't see any more than 3 or 4 weekly flights at first. The market needs to be developed step by step.

KE only flies ICN-SEA 4X per week. I think it increases to 5X weekly during the summer.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 21):
KE and HU flying SEA-MEX (for a total of 7 weekly flights) would probably be too much. The market does not exist. The SEA stop is required due to range limitations and can work as a revenue enhancement of the flight. However, the SEA-MEX-SEA segments cannot be expected to be the money-maker segments. 7x weekly MEX-SEA service nonstop on widebodies (say 77Es and A332s) would be overkill.

I agree with you there. It might just be a matter of who gets there first. But HU has a very limited choice for stopovers, unless they are able to secure another US West Coast destination. We'll just have to wait and see. Maybe KE will fly larger equipment through SEA if the MEX service becomes a reality.


User currently offlineAM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1779 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (4 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 7222 times:

Quoting Fyano773 (Reply 19):
Additionally, China Eastern, based in PVG is joining Skyteam, taking full advantange of this partnership:

Exactly.

Quoting Aeolus (Reply 9):
I'd rather much prefer go MEX-US-PEK or even take AM's service to PVG and transit towards PEK.

I'd personally go for the second, especially considering China Eastern. Connecting in the US is anything but pleasant these days. Those security filters and questioning if you happen to have anything that smells like an homonym in the no-fly list deserve to be bypassed.


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7582 posts, RR: 42
Reply 24, posted (4 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 7099 times:

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 22):
KE only flies ICN-SEA 4X per week. I think it increases to 5X weekly during the summer.

I mean I do not see the SEA-MEX extension more than 3 or 4 times per week initially. It'd be a bit like what JL did when it flew to MEX: daily to YVR and only twice weekly tag-on to MEX.

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 22):
I agree with you there. It might just be a matter of who gets there first. But HU has a very limited choice for stopovers, unless they are able to secure another US West Coast destination. We'll just have to wait and see. Maybe KE will fly larger equipment through SEA if the MEX service becomes a reality.

How about PDX? I think it has the same or slightly less potential for success than SEA and definitely more than HNL. MX dropped MEX-PDX and GDL-PDX, so it would appear to be "available".

About the plane size, I don't know what to say. I think we can assume that since the current ICN-SEA is done with 77Es, the eventual ICN-SEA-MEX would be done with 77Es too, right? Now, suppose the route does really well... then what? Would it make sense for KE to add one or maybe 2 weekly frequencies (on the tag-on to MEX) using the same aircraft, or would KE choose to stick to its original 3 or 4 weekly frequencies and increase the airplane size, say, to 744? Or maybe downsize to A332 and increase frequencies? Hmmm, lots of possibilities.

Anyway, let's wait and see if this route is effectively launched, if SEA is effectively the stopover and if the 77E is maintained in the route. I will then buy a plane ticket to help with the loads hehe.  
Quoting AM744 (Reply 23):
I'd personally go for the second, especially considering China Eastern. Connecting in the US is anything but pleasant these days. Those security filters and questioning if you happen to have anything that smells like an homonym in the no-fly list deserve to be bypassed.

I agree. If MU can provide PVG-PEK connections that go well with AM's schedules at PVG, I am sure we will see several passengers per flight doing PEK-PVG-TIJ-MEX or MEX-TIJ-PVG-PEK with AM and MU. The negative side of this is that AM is only flying 2x weekly to PVG, so this is very inconvenient for business travelers who demand flexibility. In this case, AM would not be a good option and this type of passengers would need to find other options... problem is the two most efficient ones (U.S. and Canada) are no longer attractive due to the visa requirements.... Hopefully AM will get another 77E and add more frequencies to PVG and NRT!



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
25 wedgetail737 : KE nor HU has route authority to PDX. I think the route authority documentation for KE specifically called out ICN-SEA-MEX. I think it has a good cha
26 EddieDude : I mean how about PDX for HU? It is clear to me that the KE would fly via SEA. At this point in time, I don't think HU has officially chosen a stopove
27 wedgetail737 : You are correct...HU hasn't announced an intermediate destination. PDX probably would work, but HU doesn't have route authority for PEK-PDX. I don't
28 AR385 : I´m not very familiar with bilaterals, so bear with me. Will KE and HU get 5th freedom rights on the SEA-MEX route? Are both interested in them? If b
29 EddieDude : I agree with you. It will be very interesting to see what HU chooses as its intermediate stop and if it can get traffic rights between MEX and such s
30 AM744 : What about a triangular flight AM-style? I see no good in any stop over without 5th freedom rights. Maybe an eastbound technical stop at TIJ is the w
31 Aeolus : Would AM allow such thing to happen?
32 EddieDude : Good point. Number 1, AM is not the Mexican government and the Mexican government is not AM. Second, why would AM care if it is just for refueling? A
33 wedgetail737 : There is another thread on this forum that talks about KE's ICN-SEA-MEX and that KE will have 5th freedom rights on the SEA-MEX route.
34 olli : That's right! Best Regards,
35 AR385 : In an ideal world that will be true. But I can´t remember a situation when AM / MX have had an issue and the government hasn´t ruled in their favor
36 XA744 : Thank you for bringing it up. Now I can clearly see why you are on my RUL ! ... Would be great, whenever I stop by Monterrey, to hook up for a few "
37 AR385 : 129 leaves Seattle at 9:05 p.m. arrives Beijing at 11:40 p.m. (next day) Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday starts June 4, 2010 128 leaves
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