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Britannia's 767s  
User currently offlineB777UA From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 161 posts, RR: 0
Posted (13 years 5 months 18 hours ago) and read 1094 times:

I was looking through there web site and they said that there 767-300 have a 2-4-2 configuration? I have not know the 767 to be that wide? for that kind of Config does anyone know how they do it? Most of the US airlines who Operate the 767 have a 2-3-2 config.

22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24947 posts, RR: 56
Reply 1, posted (13 years 5 months 16 hours ago) and read 992 times:

There's enough room. Just that scheduled carriers seem to have wider seats I think so looks like there isnt enough room.


When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineEnglandair From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2000, 2228 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (13 years 5 months 13 hours ago) and read 969 times:

Remember Britannia's a charter airline, so they'll cram as many seats in as possible! It's not too bad for a short flight, but I'd hate to fly Britannia longhaul- ouch!

User currently offlineParra From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (13 years 5 months 12 hours ago) and read 961 times:

I've flown on Britannia's 767s several times, the first being in 1989 to PMI from MAN when they were very new. I was a lot smaller then so the seats were fine, now I'm 6'5" they are not so great but for a 2,3 or 4 hour UK to Mediterranean flight they are fine. They are very wobbly though, every time the person in front or behind moved a fraction of an inch I'd get thrown forward or have my knees crushed.

User currently offlineDjmatthews From United Kingdom, joined Dec 1999, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (13 years 5 months 8 hours ago) and read 938 times:

I flew on a BY 767 from HUY-MCO, a whole nine and half hours of charter seats, yes the seats are very small and naorrow!

User currently offlineLMML 14/32 From Malta, joined Jan 2001, 2565 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (13 years 5 months 8 hours ago) and read 928 times:

That's the deal - you pay less and you get less. Only the operators don't tell you the last bit. You find that out on your own. But I guess even if they did tell you, you'd still go for that, then come complain here !!!

User currently offlineDemoose From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 1952 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (13 years 5 months 8 hours ago) and read 921 times:

I flew Airtours 767 and they have the same 2-4-2 config. I was sat in the middle row for 9 hours and its hell!!! Worst of all the seats are very small and rock hard and you feel very cramped not knowing where the hell you are because you can't see out of the windows. I found myself getting up all the time to look out of the window on the door just to feel less cramped and work out where the hell we were!!

DEM



Take a ride...fly across the sky
User currently offlineDC10Tony From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (13 years 5 months 8 hours ago) and read 927 times:

Hey Demoose-

Did you fly on Airtours from the Orlando-Sanford Airport (SFB) in FL? I work there and we handle Airtours and I know it's about a 9-10 hr. flight from there to the U.K.


We have a Britannia 767-300 come to our airport replacing a JMC DC-10-30, it's a charter flight for JMC which does double destinations. Yes, the seats are 2-4-2 on this aircraft.


User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24947 posts, RR: 56
Reply 8, posted (13 years 5 months 7 hours ago) and read 919 times:

A 767 can fly from HUY to MCO??? Does it need to stop in Shannon or somewhere?? I wouldnt have thought that a 767 could fly from HUY!


When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineSA365C1 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2001, 131 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (13 years 5 months 5 hours ago) and read 914 times:

I flew the AMM44D 763 from (G-OOAL/M if I remember right)GLA-SFB 2 weeks ago and I can confirm the seating arrangement is 2-4-2, as Englandair rightly points out Britannia, JMC, Air 2000 and Airtours are all charter airlines so they want as many seats as possible, but hell if you think that is crammed you should try and fly these airlines 752's now that is crammed.

I have to say to DC10Tony, I look forward to never having the privelage of flying into Sanford again, what a pit that airport is, give me MCO anyday!!, and dont tell me but you get a quick turnaround at SFB because it took 1 hour and 20 minutes from getting on stand to clearing customs and immigrations. But to be honest I understand why these airlines use SFB because it must be very cheap to operate from, Bravo Britannia for not operating from there.


User currently offlineAlle From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (13 years 5 months 5 hours ago) and read 909 times:

One of my longest nonstops was on a Britannia 767-300 ARN-NAT 11hrs, IT WAS LIKE HELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Alexander


User currently offlineDemoose From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 1952 posts, RR: 23
Reply 11, posted (13 years 5 months 5 hours ago) and read 906 times:

Hi there DC10Tony,

I did actually fly to Orlando Sanford with Airtours on one of their 767's! I found the airport alright, i see why most charters fly there because its pretty small and is pretty simple picking up the hire car as soon as u step outside. However, i was sick of the place coming home because our flight was delayed (Shock - it was Airtours!) for 3 hours and theres not much going on at Sanford-being quite a small airport.

DEM



Take a ride...fly across the sky
User currently offlineGo air canada From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (13 years 5 months 4 hours ago) and read 913 times:

oh anything is possible with britannia and I should know, i was on the famous flight with the women that had mould served to her!!!!

I paid for the 360 upgrade and they run out of seats, i was stuck in the back row and had enough leg room for an ant and im a pretty small legged person, not a giant.

BY cant even get a plane to stay on the runway without it breaking into three pieces(manchester) or falling off the runway!!!!!

Britannia are the worst chartered airline in britain and being owned by thompson group says it all, by the way ive flown with jmc, airtours(once bitten twcie shy), sabre, monarch and air 2000.

go air canada and may brittania go under

neil


User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24947 posts, RR: 56
Reply 13, posted (13 years 5 months 3 hours ago) and read 892 times:

The BY 757 that split into 3 was at Gerona.
But I wouldnt wish them to go under.



When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineBy738 From Tonga, joined Sep 2000, 2364 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (13 years 5 months 3 hours ago) and read 889 times:

I have flown on Britannia 767's many times. I recently flew to JFK on an American Airlines A300-600 and it was far worse than any BY 767 flight. The way the Airbus A300 cabins narrows so much toward the rear. It was very uncomfortable. The point on Britannia is that you get what you pay for. If you don't like it then pay for something better. The charter airlines are all of an equal nature in some ways or another.

User currently offlineDC10Tony From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (13 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 872 times:

Demoose-

Glad you liked the airport. I go to UCF and work there for the summers. It's a GREAT job in between semesters. SFB is pretty good I think, it's only busy on Thursday, Friday and Saturday and the tourists can get their car and get to their hotel, etc. Airtours is infamous for being late huh? In the summer of '00 I was scheduled from 9:30pm-1am for a simple tek-stop, (Airtours 767-300 G-DIMB) and the plane couldn't spool up properly for takeoff (actuator) and took off at 11am the next day. I got a lot of overtime thanks to that plane but Airtours had to shuttle the passengers to hotels and provide other services while the plane was grounded. If you're ever there this summer I'm always in the Jetway taking strollers, wheelchairs and checking out the girls when you're all boarding.


User currently offlineDC10Tony From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (13 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 874 times:

SA365C1-


Ha! You think our airport is a pit? Well it sort of is, I can see where you're coming from, Oralndo's a palace compared to it. I'm not trying to be arrogant, it's a summer job for me while I'm in college and I've never seen so many incompetent boobs working on the ramp in my life! Yes SFB is cheap to operate from, we charge $50 to land, MCO charges over $100 I think.


User currently offlineBDRules From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2000, 1501 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (13 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 867 times:

i have flown Britannia and Airtours 763's to Australia. 2 hours walking around Bahrain and Changi with AIH and Sharjah and Changi with BY. the rest of the time which equaled 24 hours sat in a pitch not quite big enough for a dwarf didnt really help me as im 6'4 and was crunched over. so i spent 2 hrs up on the flight deck.

regards BDRules  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlineBY757 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 45 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 845 times:

Can I please point out, that BY is one of the best charter airline in the UK, and owned by the Thomson group say it all? How come they have the least complaints of any other tour company? Airtours is officially the worst, worst punctuality (CAA survey) largest amount of complaints (watchdog survey) I think it was something like 34% of all complaints where to Airtours, with only 6% to Thomson.
I will never fly or Go on an Airtours Holiday again due to some stuff that happened on holiday, such as no water or electricity in the apartment. The list goes on.

and Can I also please point out that on the 767, Britannia actually has more seat pitch than Airtours, and much nicer seats which are thicker that AIH’s. So she got mould in her food? that’s not BY’s fault, its the food company. That could happen to any airline.

Then add that BY had the best punctuality over MON, AIH, jmc and AMM last year and wins awards every year, sometimes swapping with AMM on what rewards it receives speaks for itself doesn't it?

Can I also point out that the plane that actually crashed at Manchester sometime ago was Airtours, due to lack of maintenance a crack formed around the gear and it collapsed on landing.
The BY that crashed at Gerona did because of the weather conditions and all the airports in the area were already shut. It "aqua pained" nothing to do with pilot error. Can I remind you that very similar weather conditions caused that Qantas 747 to run of the runway- supposedly the world’s safest airline!

You look around BY is at, or very near, the top, and Airtours is at the bottom, it's been proved. Just because you have had a bad experience with them.

Britannia has been going since 1962, so they must be doing something right, and turned a profit almost every year it has existed, unlike Airtours!

BY757


User currently offlineCrosswind From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 2600 posts, RR: 58
Reply 19, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 836 times:
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Have to largely agree that Britannia are one of the UK's best "leisure" airlines. Along with Air 2000 and Virgin Sun, they appear to be the only airlines that have made any real effort to improve service standards for holdiay passengers, as evidenced by the annual battle between Air 2000 and Britannia for the Travel Weekly and TTG awards - this year Air 2000 won both, last year it was one each, the year before Britannia won both - you get the picture...

Air 2000 and Britannia have both been very innovative in introducing new products and services for the holiday maker. Air 2000 were the first to have IFE on every aircraft, Britannia followed shortly afterwards but their IFE was free, both airlines frequently review and update their services, Britannia's Royal Service probably marks the first time in recent years they offerd higher levels of service than most of the competition, together with phasing out the 737-200. Air 2000 are now offering a short-haul "Premium" Cabin on their A321s with improved services and more comfortable seating at a scheduled Business Class pitch. Britannia will likely follow this move before too long.

Yes, seating is high density to allow the companies to offer very low fares, but there is a growing realisation that many passengers will pay a premium for higher levels of comfort and service. Air 2000 announced their B767s would have a 2-class layout in early 1998, by the time they were delivered Airtours, Britannia and Monarch had all announced similar services...

Airtours have had some "firsts" too, but the general standard of their service isn't the highest, I believe they are the only UK airline to charge for IFE on long-haul flights... Plus the DC-10s don't help the image.

JMC are all hype, and I believe Monarch can't offer the services they would like because not being part of a major tour group, they have to keep their costs low to remain competitive on the open market - however, having been around for 30 years as an independent deserves a lot of credit! Excel appears to be another company based on hype, aside from the leather seats I don't see any service improvements they have brought into the market, but I have no personal experience of them (yet)

Punctuality is another common complaint, this appears to have been adressed this year. Air 2000, Airtours, Britannia and JMC are all now utilising their own aircraft as a backup to cover delays, in contrast to sourcing aircraft on the wet lease market in previous years. Air 2000 and Britannia each have a 757 and 767 on permanent standby, while JMC and Airtours each utilise a DC-10. Have to wait for the next set of punctuality stats to see if this works - obvously it won't help if there is widespread disruption, like a Spanish ATC strike or Caribbean hurricaines...

Plus it's worth noting that UK leisure airlines fleets are some of the most modern in the world, and their safety record, outstanding.

Stands down from soap box...

Thankyou...


User currently offlineDjmatthews From United Kingdom, joined Dec 1999, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 815 times:

GKirk... yes we flew from HUY-SFB (not MCO sorry), and we did have to refuel in Shannon! BY operated 2 Florida flights in the Summer '97 season. Unfortunatly, this route never caught on!

User currently offlineNG737PSR From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2001, 305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 799 times:

Crosswind "Excel seems to be another airline built on hype, apart from the leather seats I do not see any improvements they have brought into the market, but I have no personal experience of them (yet)"

What Excel has to offer.

Well for a start Excel are offering at present a very punctual, if not early programme of flights so far, check teletext on a regular basis to see evidence, at present they are more reliable than the rest.

Excel operate the most modern charter fleet in the country with all of the B737-800s being less than 3yrs old. Ok the B767-200s leased in from Air Atlanta for the summer in Excel's own colours are 12 years old thereabouts, but it still gives them a younger fleet than the rest of the British IT carriers.

All of the B737-800s feature video screens that drop down from above the passengers heads - so no neck craning there to look at tv monitors suspended above the aisle except 767s inherited ex BY/Air Europa. Excel show feature films on all of flights of 3hrs plus which change monthly - Britannia doesn't.

Excel offer a choice of Broadsheet and Tabloid newspapers, plus childrens comics such as 'Beano' and 'Dandy' plus funboxes with puzzles etc and for adults upmarket magazines.

Excel's in-flight catering is superior to all of the other charter airlines at present in their standard Economy cabins and they offer a choice of menus on all flights of 3hrs plus, and the meal presentation is superior to the other airlines.

They offer a niche service for some of the smaller and more upmarket tour operators such as Mark Warner, Sunvil and Citalia, and unlike Britannia, Air 2000, Airtours etc they don't brainwash their customers on board into buying Thomson, First Choice, Airtours products etc if you have booked a seat with another tour operator.

But most importantly they have a bunch of really friendly and dedicated cabin crew which smile and make a refreshing change from the sour-faced, self absorbed, complacent crews which can sometimes be found on other carriers.

All in all I think they are already starting to offer a few things more than the other British IT carriers, so not all hype after all and not just the leather seats, and yes I have flown with them - I recommend you giving them a try.


User currently offlineCrosswind From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 2600 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 790 times:
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Thanks for that insight, and I'm well aware you must have flown Excel more than a few times!

The Excel Airways website is pretty vague about any service improvements other than leather seats and the "on time is the only time" committment - which is why I drew the conclusion about the hype. Similar to the situation with JMC last year where both the airline and the holiday company made some sketchy claims about setting new standards, but didn't, and both attracted a high number of compalints as a result.

From the sounds of it from the details you provided, Excel does offer a very high product standard, particularly in terms of catering. I'm sure to give Excel a try the next time the opportunity arises...


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