Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
BA Strike, Is It Just These Two Points?  
User currently offlinereadytotaxi From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2006, 3319 posts, RR: 2
Posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4697 times:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/10118559.stm

Tony Woodley, the joint head of Unite, said the two sides had reached agreement in principle on pay and other matters.

But disagreement remains over travel perks for those who went on strike and disciplinary action against some staff.

So it simply hangs on these two things, is that right?


you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinedavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7394 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4585 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

It would appear so. But the latest offer including a return of some travel concessions but with crew who took part in the strikes being demoted to a more junior level of entitlement on the proviso of no new action despite BA stating it would be withdrawn so it looks like Unite have shot themselves in the foot again. For the disciplinary measures, all BA is doing is following their policy on initimidation and in the case of Duncan Holley, have being rostered on duty before Xmas he requested time off which was denied but stiill went ahead and took the time off....can it be really be a surprise that he got the boot. CAn't remember which of the Union hierarchy was swanning around in Cuba last week.



Looking elsewhere, it seems that Unite, remarkably, are tantamount to admitting that they have lied about the impact of the strike as they are making reference to the quite large numbers who ignored the call to strike by saying that the future of the union is at stake...rememeber they claimed only 26 defied the strike!


User currently offlineLHRFlyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2010, 817 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4489 times:

It depends who in Unite you listen to.

According to this document on the CC89 branch website, the dispute is still over imposition;

http://uniteba.com/ESW/Files/Thinking_of_Working.doc


User currently offlineAIR MALTA From Malta, joined Sep 2001, 2515 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4457 times:

...and Unite is set to "guerilla" measures in its dispute with BA. It said the cabin crew can not sustain lengthy strikes that can affect their revenus. Their tactics would be to call for strikes and then call them off hitting bookings. They have also said that if the traffic is disrupted by the ash cloud, they would postpone the strike to when the traffic restarts seriously impacting the chaos recovery... This is from "Times Online" : http://business.timesonline.co.uk/to...ctors/transport/article7127708.ece

I think BA should drag Unite to court for these allegations and close them down because they are willing to financially harm the company...



Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
User currently offline1stfl94 From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 1455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4309 times:

So have BASSA just decided that they're going to try and put BA out of business? Their practically talking all out war which will only end badly for them and BA passengers.

User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13271 posts, RR: 100
Reply 5, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4035 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting 1stfl94 (Reply 4):
So have BASSA just decided that they're going to try and put BA out of business? Their practically talking all out war which will only end badly for them and BA passengers.

I hope that is not the case. If so it is a very short sighted strategy; how did it help the Pittsburgh steel workers?

I'm curious to see how this goes. To say the least, UNITE's PR is as bad as ever. This isn't the 1970's.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13271 posts, RR: 100
Reply 6, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3908 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Strike might might not matter. Ash closing LHR and LGW.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8685913.stm

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinepar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7384 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 3761 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 5):
I hope that is not the case. If so it is a very short sighted strategy; how did it help the Pittsburgh steel workers?

Well some of their predicitons about the US steel industry did come to fruition, some not all.

Quoting 1stfl94 (Reply 4):
So have BASSA just decided that they're going to try and put BA out of business? Their practically talking all out war which will only end badly for them and BA passengers.

Well for those who cannot transtion to the New Fleet contract they will be out of a job in the next couple years anyway so what do they have to loose?
BA have written them out of the company and they are trying to write themselves back in by striking rather than simply working out the rest of their days in hapiness.
Based on the last strike and the current situation, they should recognize that BA is intent on changing its workforce, if they want to make a point just leave en-masse. BA would then have to deal with the consequences, they would be able to get on with their lives with less stress, pax would know the situation, the way forward and all the uncertainty would done away with and future plans can proceed.
The on and off situation is what is frustrating most folks on both sides of the aisle, time to settle once and for all.


User currently offlinecv990coronado From South Africa, joined Nov 2007, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 3587 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting par13del

"Based on the last strike and the current situation, they should recognize that BA is intent on changing its workforce, if they want to make a point just leave en-masse. BA would then have to deal with the consequences, they would be able to get on with their lives with less stress, pax would know the situation, the way forward and all the uncertainty would done away with and future plans can proceed."

Who would employ them especially at their inflated salaries ? BA isn't going to get that lucky unfortunately.



SSC-707B727 737-741234SP757/762/3/772/WA300/10/319/2/1-342/3/6-880-DAM-VC10 TRD 111 Ju52-DC8/9/10/11-YS11-748-VCV DH4B L
User currently offlinepar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7384 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3242 times:

Quoting cv990coronado (Reply 8):
Who would employ them especially at their inflated salaries ?

Why do you assume that they would look for jobs at another airline, what BA is doing now is what the majority of airlines are doing so one would expect them to look elsewhere if BA's pay package is unacceptable.
F/A training is specific to the aviation industry, but customer support / service training has a much wider base of employment options, some even pay more than the airlines, of course the reverse is also true.


User currently offlineLHR380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 3022 times:

Injuction granted, the strikes may be off depending on if Unite contest the outcome.

User currently offlinevv701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7626 posts, RR: 17
Reply 11, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2951 times:

Quoting par13del (Reply 9):
F/A training is specific to the aviation industry, but customer support / service training has a much wider base of employment options, some even pay more than the airlines

There are two challenges here, First renumeration packages in the travel and hospitality industry rarely come anywhere near the value of the package that BA LHR based FAs currently earn. Second is the pension plan that most BA FAs are in.

I was extremely fortuneate. I worked for a company that had an even better final salary pension plan than those that most BA FAs are in. By the time I reached the age of 35 I knew that if I did not change my employment then, I never would. I would be almost pleasantly 'trapped' by the pension plan.

I did not change. But when I was 52 my employer sold the part of the company I worked in to another corporation. I held on until I was 54 before I was made redundant. It was not a good situation. Finding another good job at that age was not a real goer. So I retired and took my pension. I had worked just 32 years for the company. And at the age of 54 I had the potential to draw a pension based on my final salary and with modest protection against inflation for, say, another 32 years. And now I am well over 40 per cent of the way to achieving that.

Today onlly around 7 per cent of UK employees in the private sector are in a final salary pension scheme and this will include many BA FAs. Further many of those 7 per cent are in schemes that are now closed to new employees. So it is not just their current renumeration package that BA FAs will be considering. They will also be thinking about the package they will get from the BA Pension Scheme when they retire. And both of these will be more than difficult if not impossible to match anywhere in the travel and hospitality industry.


User currently offlineGlom From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2820 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2846 times:

Quoting LHR380 (Reply 10):
Injuction granted, the strikes may be off depending on if Unite contest the outcome.

Unite are the dumbest union in the history of organised labour. That's the second time this has happened in three ballots.


User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2231 times:

Whilst I don't fly BA and avoid them when I can I really hope they can get this mess settled ASAP. FWIW I stand behind BA on this one and fail to understand why the Union in this day and age does not recognise the economic reality of the cut BA wants to make. Sure they are tough and there has to be some give and take but striking.......errr no!
We all know they are going to try another ballot and will maybe they will succeed in getting strikes through next time but do they not understand, people are now avoiding BA like the plague and may never come back, eating into the bottom line even more and thus creating a bigger arguement for BA to make those cuts.
I only hope the new government can step in and mediate as well......something has to give and it sure as hell at this stage wont be WW and BA.

Good luck with that one!


User currently offlinepar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7384 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2185 times:

Quoting LHR380 (Reply 10):
Injuction granted, the strikes may be off depending on if Unite contest the outcome.

Did we expect any different?

Quoting vv701 (Reply 11):
There are two challenges here, First renumeration packages in the travel and hospitality industry rarely come anywhere near the value of the package that BA LHR based FAs currently earn. Second is the pension plan that most BA FAs are in.

Question on the New Fleet being offered by BA, will those on the old contract be allowed to stay around until they reach retirement age and will cost of living increases continue to be given?
If those are not there I can't see many actually staying with BA to the bitter end, they will know up front that they are in a loosing situation.

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 16):
FWIW I stand behind BA on this one and fail to understand why the Union in this day and age does not recognise the economic reality of the cut BA wants to make. Sure they are tough and there has to be some give and take but striking.......errr no!

Question as it relates to cost cutting, in some of the earlier threads it was mentioned that existing staff cannot transfer to the new Fleet Contract even if it involves a pay cut, what is the cost saving measure of that requirement if true?


User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7700 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1884 times:

Given the ongoing trench warfare, I query who would take a punt on BA.

I take no pleasure in this at all.


User currently offlinetcxdegsy From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2006, 518 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1808 times:

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 3):
...and Unite is set to "guerilla" measures in its dispute with BA. It said the cabin crew can not sustain lengthy strikes that can affect their revenus. Their tactics would be to call for strikes and then call them off hitting bookings. They have also said that if the traffic is disrupted by the ash cloud, they would postpone the strike to when the traffic restarts seriously impacting the chaos recovery... This is from "Times Online" :
Quoting 1stfl94 (Reply 4):
So have BASSA just decided that they're going to try and put BA out of business? Their practically talking all out war which will only end badly for them and BA passengers.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was of the understanding that a Union's purpose and ultimate remit, was to protect the interests of Employees who are members of said Union.

Surely these tactics are in direct conflict and breach of their remit, and thefeore they are not an effective Union in terms of their Legal Obligations. Could BA not take legal action to disband this Union, or bar them from representing their employees? Would there not be a case to put "to tender", alternative Union representation who have a tenable position for staff to become members of??



next flights: BA1441 0566 0581 1446 EDI-LHR-MXP-LHR-EDI
User currently offlineLHR380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 1585 times:

Tomorrow we hear if Unites appeal works or not.

I hope to dear god they fail.

Passengers have had enough problems these past few months  


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
FlyBE Takeover Of BA Connect - Is It Going Ahead? posted Thu Feb 8 2007 12:52:22 by GayrugbyMAN
Is It The Attitude At IAD Or Is It Just United? posted Fri Jul 22 2005 14:08:13 by Hamad
Flight Time And DST Is It Just Me Or…? posted Thu Apr 15 2004 22:03:45 by Joakims
Is This Dirty Or Is It Just My Eyes? posted Fri Oct 11 2002 04:29:51 by BR715-A1-30
Is It Just Me, Or Am I Missing Something? posted Thu Jan 10 2002 04:40:51 by PatM04
Is It Just Me....... posted Sat Oct 13 2001 22:49:35 by Apollo13
Is It Just Me? Or TWA Has A Problem Every Week posted Fri Aug 10 2001 20:02:22 by Defunctairline
Is It Just Me That Is Facinated By Overflights? posted Mon Jul 2 2001 22:43:49 by LGW
Is It Just Me... posted Fri Mar 23 2001 05:11:59 by WEAPON
What Is It About These Freakin' Airliners? posted Tue Nov 14 2000 19:13:12 by G-SPOT