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Southwest Having Growing Pains In STL  
User currently offlineLambertMan From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2070 posts, RR: 36
Posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 16142 times:

I've been going in and out of STL for business recently and there have been some excessive growing pains with the new flight add-ons. Our plane had to sit on the tarmac for 50 minutes after it landed...thats right, 50. You could tell that the whole WN crew was embarrassed about it. There were 5 planes sitting and waiting for a gate with us!

I de-planed and asked the CSR about the problems and she said the new flights are creating gate utilization issues in late afternoon and in the mornings. From what I gather gate E-2 will be re-opened or gate E-22 will be added back on if there is space.

I was under the impression that E-22 couldn't have a gate added back?

115 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineatrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5692 posts, RR: 52
Reply 1, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 16127 times:

I just flew STL-OMA on WN myself tonight and our plane came from MCO and had to wait 1 hour and 15 minutes for a gate to open up.

So my STL-OMA thus became delayed too. 5 planes were also waiting for a gate to open up too.

E-2 I was told cannot be opened due to winglet space. E-22 makes a lot more sense.

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlinechrisair From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 2072 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 16001 times:

Kind of ironic...they don't have enough gate space....and that airport has, what, two or three unused concourses?

When I was through STL in the winter, everything was full, but we didn't have to wait for gate space to open up.


User currently offlineBHMNONREV From Australia, joined Aug 2003, 1368 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 15798 times:

Quoting atrude777 (Reply 1):
E-2 I was told cannot be opened due to winglet space. E-22 makes a lot more sense.

I could never understand why the gate at E-2 was installed in the first place, with it being boxed in so badly as shown in the Google image below, taken before the gates were removed.
STL E


Question I have, does WN have any sort of agreement to be able to use the three high "E" gates on the west dog leg leading to "D"? I know those are the international gates, but I would think they don't have a lot of usage..


User currently offlineEWRandMDW From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 410 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 15472 times:

Quoting LambertMan (Thread starter):
I de-planed and asked the CSR about the problems and she said the new flights are creating gate utilization issues in late afternoon and in the mornings.

I've flown WN into STL only a couple of times, and frankly I'm confused! Didn't WN offer nearly 100 departures from STL maybe 7-8 years ago? Did they have gate utilization issues then? Have they moved to a different concourse and simply miscalculated their future needs, which are now being painfully felt?


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22734 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 15329 times:

Quoting EWRandMDW (Reply 4):
Did they have gate utilization issues then?

They had three or four more gates then (at least 2, 22, and 24 and I feel like there was one more).

Quoting LambertMan (Thread starter):
I de-planed and asked the CSR about the problems and she said the new flights are creating gate utilization issues in late afternoon and in the mornings.

At least some of the issues have also been related to something that seems to be a WN-specific or WN/STL-specific issue: for whatever reason, they won't push aircraft that won't be departing relatively soon off the gate and have them hold elsewhere. With relatively little slack in the schedule, a couple of 60 or 90 minute delays are enough to really wreck their operation.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4646 posts, RR: 11
Reply 6, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 15156 times:

I wonder if this is because WN has started leaning more towards having "banks"... before WN would just have a constant stream of flights, but WN has been coordinating more flights for connections lately which could require more gates at the same time. When I was there about a year and a half ago, the far western portion of their concourse wasnt even used at all, probably 3-4 gates worth.


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6075 posts, RR: 29
Reply 7, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 15157 times:
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Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 3):
I know those are the international gates, but I would think they don't have a lot of usage..

I don't think they are used at all. D is closed isn't it. The only regular scheduled international flight is from YYZ, on AC Jazz, and that comes and goes on A.

Quoting chrisair (Reply 2):
Kind of ironic...they don't have enough gate space....and that airport has, what, two or three unused concourses?

Just about. I don't think D is used at all (maybe only part of it is closed), C is half empty and B only has FL. I only use A at STL these days and haven't been to the other side of the airport since TW dissapeared.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3010 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 15143 times:

Quoting EWRandMDW (Reply 4):
I've flown WN into STL only a couple of times, and frankly I'm confused! Didn't WN offer nearly 100 departures from STL maybe 7-8 years ago? Did they have gate utilization issues then?

That was the first thing that sprang to my mind as well. Wonder why they'd have reduced the number of gates the past few years if there were plans to ramp up later?



Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22734 posts, RR: 20
Reply 9, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 15034 times:

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 8):
Wonder why they'd have reduced the number of gates the past few years if there were plans to ramp up later?

Until AA dehubbed, I don't know that there were plans to ramp up.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineBHMNONREV From Australia, joined Aug 2003, 1368 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 14811 times:

Quoting falstaff (Reply 7):
Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 3):
I know those are the international gates, but I would think they don't have a lot of usage..

I don't think they are used at all. D is closed isn't it. The only regular scheduled international flight is from YYZ, on AC Jazz, and that comes and goes on A.

I don't believe there are any scheduled services, but they still run charters thru there for Punta Cana, Montego Bay and Cancun. Not sure of the frequency though. And yes, I believe D is either closed or scheduled to be closed, Frontier is moving to C IIRC.


User currently offlinestl1326 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 496 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 14805 times:

Quoting LambertMan (Thread starter):
I was under the impression that E-22 couldn't have a gate added back?

I believe they can still install jet bridges at gates E22 and E24 if needed. I think a lot of people believe gates can not be install at there due to the new baggage facility, but here is a photo that clearly shows the jet bridges with the new baggage facility before Southwest removed them.

http://www.burnsmcd.com/portal/page/...e%20Handling%20System%20Automation


User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3010 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 14601 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 9):
Until AA dehubbed, I don't know that there were plans to ramp up.

I was just going on the assumption that WN would logically plan growth over time for its stations in the larger metro areas.



Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 13, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 14605 times:

Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 10):
but they still run charters thru there for Punta Cana, Montego Bay and Cancun.

   USA 3000 and Frontier in the winter use them along with a few other charters.

Quoting falstaff (Reply 7):
I don't think D is used at all (maybe only part of it is closed),

I think it is closed, so having WN move even temporarily to some unoccupied space in the main terminal would be very impractical.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22734 posts, RR: 20
Reply 14, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 14585 times:

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 12):
I was just going on the assumption that WN would logically plan growth over time for its stations in the larger metro areas.

I don't know that that's a valid assumption, though. Similarly sized and located stations like MCI and BNA haven't shown growth over time in the past 5 or 10 years.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6075 posts, RR: 29
Reply 15, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 14447 times:
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Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 10):
I don't believe there are any scheduled services

I just checked the AC website and they have two flights a day in either direction between YYZ and STL.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 13):
I think it is closed, so having WN move even temporarily to some unoccupied space in the main terminal would be very impractical.

The "East Terminal" and D were connected so I don't think using a few gates at the end of D would be all that big of deal.
There is plenty of room at STL.
STL 1985



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineBHMNONREV From Australia, joined Aug 2003, 1368 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 14400 times:

Quoting falstaff (Reply 15):
Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 10):
I don't believe there are any scheduled services

I just checked the AC website and they have two flights a day in either direction between YYZ and STL.

Sorry, I meant scheduled services thru E. I believe AC pre-clears in YYZ..


User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6075 posts, RR: 29
Reply 17, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 14276 times:
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Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 16):
I believe AC pre-clears in YYZ

That is true.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 18, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 14027 times:

Quoting falstaff (Reply 15):
The "East Terminal" and D were connected so I don't think using a few gates at the end of D would be all that big of deal.

Those gates would need to have jetways installed I think. Only the first few gates in D (the Frontier gates) have jetways if I remember correctly. Using those would necessitate reopening the entire concourse, lest you be forced to reclear security when connecting. Even if they did that it would be a long walk.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22734 posts, RR: 20
Reply 19, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 13980 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 18):
Those gates would need to have jetways installed I think.

If you count D as everything that isn't on the E "line," there are 6 jetways or so on D.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinemtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2433 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 13562 times:
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Quoting falstaff (Reply 7):
I don't think they are used at all. D is closed isn't it

The E gates in the 30s are used by AeroMexico, USA 3000, charter trips, as well as Air Choice One's services. When I was there last month enroute to MWA, I saw USA3000 and AM MD80 at the gates and ACO Caravan as well.

F9 has already relocated to C gates, and only Cape Air was on D gates, and soon moving to C side as well.

Sad seeing to ghost town that STL has become.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlinepilotpip From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3148 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 13197 times:

There are no Jetbridges on D. Those were removed about 5 years ago. As stated ATS leases the E gates by customs. USA 3000 and a couple others to scheduled service out of there so they are not an option.

The D gates are completely closed off from where frontier used to park down to the international gates. My understanding is that the eventual plan is to close B as well and consolidate everything into C.

Oh, and it's not the "East" terminal anymore. Apparently airport officials decided it's going to be Terminal 1 and 2. Dumb.



DMI
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22734 posts, RR: 20
Reply 22, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 13175 times:

Quoting pilotpip (Reply 21):
Oh, and it's not the "East" terminal anymore. Apparently airport officials decided it's going to be Terminal 1 and 2. Dumb.

Agree with your sentiment, though the new signage that came along with the terminal name changes is actually a vast improvement.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 23, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 13140 times:

Quoting pilotpip (Reply 21):
Oh, and it's not the "East" terminal anymore. Apparently airport officials decided it's going to be Terminal 1 and 2. Dumb.

On the surface that would seem so, but it would be equally silly to refer to the Main Terminal, as it isn't really main anymore. Maybe they should have gone to calling it the Main Terminal and the West Terminal. That way they only have to buy one set of new signs.   



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinemtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2433 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 12647 times:
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How about the Busy Terminal and the Dead Terminal lol. It is a shame that when I saw 1 MQ and 3 AA MD80s and an AA 757 at the gates simultaneously ,to think 'This is the busy time' lol.


"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
25 atrude777 : When I flew out, I saw they had added an Air Tran sign to one of the jetbridges at the Main Terminal on the C20 side I think? I'll have to go look whe
26 ramprat74 : Was concourse D built when the other concourses were built at Lambert? Or was it added on later when Ozark expanded? From the aerial shots, it look li
27 Cubsrule : Maybe I'm being dumb, but why couldn't WN use those gates between, say, 10 AM and 6 PM when they sit empty?
28 western727 : Sorry for going OT but why is this the norm for US-Canada flights? My wife being a YVR native has caused me to observe this on all of my/our YVR flig
29 OzarkD9S : It was built for Ozark in the early/mid 80's. Can't recall what year it opened, kinda think 83/4.
30 LambertMan : I think we're just getting back to around 87 flights a day now. Back then St. Louis was really a connection point for WN, now its mainly just O&D
31 falstaff : Wasn't the International section built for TW? I recall seing a plaque down there that said something about the TWA international terminal. I haven't
32 LambertMan : I faintly remember the same thing. Lambert at this point is almost a little eery. Long, dark, abandoned corridors with a lot of remnants of years pas
33 Cubsrule : Yeah - maybe with the exception of B, every concourse has or until pretty recently had a different vibe. A is the nondescript collection of legacies
34 PSU.DTW.SCE : Yep. It was in 2006 I think when I last was in there. I think then you could walk all the way from E through D down to the other terminal through all
35 atrude777 : 83 to be specific, but it could grow, but they NEED more gates. I had to sit for 30 minutes again waiting for a gate to open up. We had five planes w
36 steex : Correct, C-20 and C-22 don't exist. C-18 and C-24 are consecutive gates on the left side of the concourse as you walk toward the end.
37 Post contains images BHMNONREV : The dreaded purple carpets on the walls which ran the length of the D Concourse..lol I think Griggs should have asked for his money back. Absolutely
38 PITrules : I wouldn't say it was "redundant", as it was used by the non-TWA international arrivals. These consisted of vacation charters and MAC troop movements
39 Post contains images BHMNONREV : What is the current usage of the former Connection gates on the southside of C?? I would think that is some pretty valuable gate space right now, is
40 atrude777 : Nope, All ODD numbered gates are no longer in use at C except the one used by Frontier, C-25. Alex
41 chrisair : There's still TWA stuff in the D gates? Aside from the red carpet on the wall, I didn't notice anything when I walked to the D/E area in January. I'd
42 GSPSPOT : Why would it be so hard for WN to get more gates at an airport with so many available ones (unless I've missed something big above)??
43 BHMNONREV : Not difficult at all, if they wanted to extend their operation to the east side of Concourse D. But as stated earlier, once the two gates are added t
44 atrude777 : None that I am aware of. I fly almost once a week on Cape Air into/out of D and have to walk through the beginning of D and do not see any TWA stuff.
45 falstaff : I remember those. I used to see them parked over by A all the time. I guess they would unload on D and then move over to A to load? I never saw an NW
46 steex : I believe that is correct, though I think the gate numbering may have been changed a bit since then (particularly as the odd numbers previously would
47 jmy007 : This is a bit confusing. TWA international gates where only at the end of "C". This section was built around the same time as the "D" concourse. The
48 TVNWZ : When D debuted with those carpets it was a great look for that time! Very modern, hip, now!!
49 stl1326 : It looks like AirTran offically moved to the c concourse today. Lambert's website is saying they will be operating at gates C18 and C24 which fits wit
50 CIDflyer : D was shut down in November 2003 when AA scaled the hub back from 400 to 200 daily flights an consolidated everything into B & C. AA later gave u
51 LambertMan : Before it was closed I gave it a pretty good look and you could find assorted TW/OZ stuff. I remember one door leading down to the ramp a worker went
52 steex : At the moment, there are no plans to demolish the buildings. Demolition costs money too, so it's more cost efficient to disuse them than to raze them
53 BHMNONREV : My old brain aint what it used to be, but what I do remember is that Lambert wanted to ditch the mobile lounge concept and build international gates.
54 Post contains images SANFan : I'm a bit confused about this discussion of WN gates at STL. It looks to me like WN has 8 exclusive gates (E-4 thru E-18) at Lambert, right? With high
55 Cubsrule : 9, actually (4 through 20) There are certainly WN stations - including your home - with very high utilization (and probably more of those stations fo
56 atrude777 : 9 gates, they are using E-20 as well Again 9 gates. All WN. I looked on swalife, and I see we have 3 arrivals all scheduled at 8:20pm, this was about
57 surfandsnow : IIRC, they didn't add *that* many flights - maybe 10 total? Given the large size of their operation already, there shouldn't be "growing pains" at al
58 atrude777 : When you consider that WN utilizes on average 10 flights a gate, and WN has been using the same gates E4-E20, an addition of 10 flights is "a lot" fo
59 Cubsrule : I think that's right. Here's a breakdown of all 83 weekday departures by time, in 3 hour blocks. This should make pretty clear, I think, why the even
60 chrisair : Out of curiosity, why did they get rid of those two gates in the first place?
61 TVNWZ : Hummm. Looks like a hub to me.
62 Post contains links mrstl : Southwest arranges flights for connections primarily at Phoenix, Baltimore, Las Vegas, St Louis, Denver and Chicago. source: http://www.dallasnews.co
63 atrude777 : At the time WN dropped to 63 daily flights after 9/11 happened. WN didn't need those two "Extra" gates so they sold them back to STL to make more mon
64 Cubsrule : With only 5 flights between 1050 and 1255, though, there's a lot of room to recover right after that.
65 san88 : This new schedule we are currently on is very difficult to work with when flights are delayed. Also our new STL/ SAN nonstop has been LATE inbound and
66 SANFan : (BTW, thanks Cubbie for doing the turn shedule; I was going to do it myself this evening...) OK, let's assign gates to the evening block of flights:
67 LambertMan : You may not get it and I certainly don't either, but I use STL-BWI frequently. The gate problems do exist and I don't know why. In fact, of the three
68 atrude777 : We ARE aware it is a situation/problem unique to STL alone. I was a CSA for WN in STL (on a leave now) and we never had this problem when I worked th
69 Cubsrule : The why almost has to be that they won't push planes that don't have a departure slot, doesn't it? I can think of no other sensible explanation (and
70 stl1326 : I was just looking at Lambert's website and it is showing Southwest having 17 planes arriving between 7pm and 8pm. I can see why Southwest is having
71 atrude777 : Gate Issues, it came inbound from MCO, arrived on time, due in at gate E-8, waiting for the HOU flight to leave the gate, Flight 496. Looking at Gate
72 ramprat74 : OT. How many jetway gates did TWA have on the B concourse? I know they removed the jetways when TW Express moved in.
73 SANFan : Please understand that I'm not calling anyone out on this, I just can't figure it out. The schedule that Cubbie posted (in Reply #59) shows a totally
74 swacle : A lot of the issues with STL are caused by Southwest's new "ICO" operations. ICO is "Intentional Connect Opprotunity", or in terminology understood by
75 Cubsrule : Let's monkey with another variable. Here's what this schedule looks like with arrival times, assuming all 30 minute turns (for the sake of ease, but
76 atrude777 : SANFan- I am trying to think logically too because you are right, 83 flights to 9 gates, should not be a problem for WN, they are the master at gate u
77 PSU.DTW.SCE : Keep in mind it isn't just delay....it can be early arrivals too. Throw in some favorable winds, particularly from flights coming in from the west and
78 SANFan : Absolutely. With WN, early arrivals are just as detrimental to gate utilization as late ones! And most of those legacy flights spend more than :25 on
79 steex : This has definitely been a fascinating thread! Cubsrule beat me (and it appears others) to the punch on posting key schedule elements, but for any of
80 stlgph : i believe it was 2 jetways.
81 swabrian : i know I am a bit late on this but I checked directly with the Director responsible for the STL Station. She tells me: There were several flights held
82 Cubsrule : Unfortunately, this problem predates the current schedule. It has been going on for about 6 months.
83 Post contains links and images mariner : I hate to say what about me - LOL - but I posted about Southwest's ICO's - Intentional Connection Opportunities - at least at DEN - more than six mon
84 TVNWZ : First hubs...err...ICO's. Then minimizing the situation. Southwest truely becoming a heritage airline!
85 Post contains images SANFan : How could I forget something that you said, Mariner? SHAME on me! Well, all I can say here is perhaps WN's new tag line should be, "Hubs 'R Us". And
86 LambertMan : Yeah, there were several flights held out on 5/23. We're aware of that. I've seen it twice in three weeks. It doesn't take a genius to make the conne
87 Post contains images mariner : LOL. Seriously, I'm confused about the present issue. I get the impression from the thread that one or two (?) spare gates are available. Presumably,
88 LambertMan : When the terminal was built there were 12 WN gates. That was when they were at their peak of 90 flights. Then when WN started experiencing big-time d
89 BMI727 : I suppose that they could use the international gates when they are open, but the major problem would be that there is no longer an airside link betw
90 atrude777 : To add to what LambertMan said, I'll be repeating things.. There are two Doors, E22 and E-24, but as LambertMan said, there are no actual jet bridges
91 unmlobo : Problems compound when there are delays in the evening for reasons other than what Cubsrule mentioned. Often times WN will hold the final departure o
92 mariner : Call me old fashioned - I am. Call me a Luddite - I can be - but I'll take stairs over a jetbridge if it is the difference between being stuck on the
93 LambertMan : And on that note I find it hard to believe that we won't see at least one carrier step up and make a few additions. I mean, what are your options? So
94 PC12Fan : I'll have to check my sources, but before the new ATC tower was built, the whole concourse had jetways at one time. I want to say seven, but I know i
95 Post contains images atrude777 : We got United for STL-SFO so that was nice, I would like to see an upgrade to 757 or something for STL-SFO, maybe a return of mainline STL-DEN, for U
96 Post contains images mariner : Certainly, they seem to be developing an affection for cities in the middle and certainly STL has been mentioned, several times, along with places li
97 LambertMan : Sadly enough, I never even thought about that. Man that wouldn't be a half bad idea. WN needs to do whats right though. If that involves adding anoth
98 Cubsrule : To be clear, though, the international gates do have an airside link to WN's gates.
99 LambertMan : I certainly hope that Daniel Shurz wasn't in charge of the old route planning department. The rest of that airline got it so right, but that area got
100 mariner : Daniel Shurz is new, from Air Canada. Well, fairly new, he joined a few months before the acquisition. William Swelbar of MIT calls him a "wunderkind
101 BMI727 : I don't think so, especially not STL. There are probably other places with better facilities, a stronger local market, and less competition than St.
102 BHMNONREV : Which is exactly the point I was trying to make earlier in the thread. During these evening "surges" when gate space is non-existent the three intern
103 SANFan : Ummm, please explain. Exactly why does STL "need" more options? There are many airports in this country where WN carries 1/3 or more of the O&D t
104 stlgph : back in 'the day' i believe there was more. there was certainly 'evidence' there was more. but back in the latter part of the 90's, etc., i believe i
105 BHMNONREV : Back in '77 or '78 when the second floor was added to the concourses they placed six jetway gates, IIRC. But as stated earlier when TWE started using
106 LambertMan : I'm not sure what exactly your talking about. You say that they fly 19 routes and 13 are unique and the passengers are thrilled to have so many optio
107 BMI727 : I think that they have just about all the options that the market can support. STL fought well above their weight for many years, and now people aren
108 LambertMan : I'm pretty well aware that the TW hub was a complete and total aberration. More or less a reflection of the times when airlines thought it would be a
109 BMI727 : Sure, but for now it is in American's best interest to not provide that choice and just funnel passengers through Chicago. No, the same people who we
110 LambertMan : I made that point earlier. It makes sense to do that. Please don't mince Cedar Rapids with Boston or a major business market. St. Louis needs more op
111 BMI727 : But service to places like Cedar Rapids is what is gone. STL still has service to the major business markets. They don't have the frequency they used
112 stl1326 : There seems to be a lot of Southwest delays in STL today. I was wondering if anyone knows if these delays are weather related in other cities or a cau
113 MoMan : The people of STL wined and complained about TWA for years and voted for Southwest with their dollars. Now they have no options, and no one to blame b
114 Atrude777 : Was mostly Weather, every single midwest city seemed to be under a SAM (Station Advisory Message). I think that's part of the issue, on a good day th
115 unmlobo : I developed a gate utilization flow for WN at STL with their current flight schedule and most of the time they could easily get by with just 8 gates (
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Thank You AA Pilots For Saving AA 1400 In STL.... posted Wed Oct 10 2007 07:30:31 by AA777ER
DL 417 JFK-LAS Stops In STL posted Wed Aug 15 2007 05:24:16 by UPS757
Airtran Adding A Gate In STL? posted Thu Jun 14 2007 03:21:36 by Stl1326
Southwest 1Q Results Are In! posted Fri Apr 20 2007 04:08:25 by OOer