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LGA Runway Usage During Mets Games At CitiField  
User currently offlineRICBWI From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 86 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4386 times:

Hi gang,

Went to the Mets vs. Reds game this Monday at CitiField.

It appears a majority of Monday, LGA was using the "expressway visual" to Runway 31. About an hour before the game the runway configuration was switched and they started using Runway 13 for take offs. I was wondering, with calm/good weather and light winds does the ballgame influence the runway configuration. I don't think I've ever been at a game when they've landed during the game from the East.

Also, I'm not complaining, but I was surprised that the planes turned in a fashion to fly directly over the ballpark in many instances. The new park is a bit to the East of the old Shea so I don't think this happened much at Shea. Does anyone have any insights as to why the planes don't wait an extra 1,000 feet or so before starting their right turns to enter the departure flow. I realize extremely unlikely but it seems a bit inherently dangerous to have them right over the stadium.


Thanks

26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBlueFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4283 times:
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Quoting RICBWI (Thread starter):
I realize extremely unlikely but it seems a bit inherently dangerous to have them right over the stadium.

So move the stadium! Who was there first anyway?



I've got $h*t to do
User currently offlineB6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2891 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4190 times:

Quoting RICBWI (Thread starter):
I was wondering, with calm/good weather and light winds does the ballgame influence the runway configuration.

I highly doubt it. LGA has to work with EWR and JFK for the configurations, a ball game is the least of their worries.



"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
User currently offlineIAHFLYR From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 4790 posts, RR: 22
Reply 3, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4169 times:

Quoting RICBWI (Thread starter):
Does anyone have any insights as to why the planes don't wait an extra 1,000 feet or so before starting their right turns to enter the departure flow.



As eluded to in Reply 2, LGA has to work with the runway config at EWR and JFK. Also, the noise footprint for NYC I'd imagine has quite an impact as well on where airplanes turn and don't turn.

Quoting RICBWI (Thread starter):
I realize extremely unlikely but it seems a bit inherently dangerous to have them right over the stadium.



IMHO, no more dangerous than flying airplanes over subdivisions and office buildings.



Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
User currently offlineJBAirwaysFan From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1008 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 4071 times:

Shea Stadium's location and Citi Field's location shouldn't make a big difference IMO. I remember being at a Met's game at Shea and LGA was using the Expressway Visual to 31 during the actual game.


In Loving Memory of Casey Edward Falconer; May 16, 1992-May 9, 2012
User currently offlinecontrails15 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 4048 times:

The only time they change patterns into and out of LGA is when the US Open is going on at the Tennis Center. Other then that, planes fly over the stadium all the time but it was more direct when Shea was around. Many of the visiting teams would have to step out of box when they were at bat and let the plane fly over. It gets really noisy at times and extremely distracting. Its not really much of a problem anymore and I go to lots of Mets games so I'm not seeing too much of a distraction.

This link pretty much shows what your dealing with at Citi Field. So much better then Shea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6zJUSiEQaQ


And this is what your seeing when your landing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2ck5ck3hAA&feature=related

[Edited 2010-07-08 16:11:55]


Giants football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlinemtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2458 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3936 times:

Quoting IAHFLYR (Reply 3):

As eluded to in Reply 2

Or alluded to .  

That was the best part of the US Open back then was the excellence that was 737s, 727s,etc flying over the grounds.  

I wonder of the other MLB, NFL stadiums where a/c are closely visible in the nation?
At Chase Field (PHX) (and roof open), you see them on arrival every so often.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineisitsafenow From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4984 posts, RR: 23
Reply 7, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3833 times:

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 6):
That was the best part of the US Open back then was the excellence that was 737s, 727s,etc flying over the grounds.

And I thought I was the only one who remember the sound of REAL airplanes over SHEA and the US Open.
Remember watching a Mets game around 68 or 69 on TV and when a departure went overhead you could not hear the announcers over the jet roar?

The good old days of commercial aviation....gone but not forgotten.
safe   



If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
User currently offlineyvphx From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 258 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3763 times:

Chase field is such a great spotting event at a sporting event! I recall seeing BA landing on RWY 8. That was such a great sight to see. You felt as though a foul ball could be hit high enough to ingest into an engine.

User currently offlineB6A322 From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3745 times:

I think what everyone is saying here is correct, the airspace around LGA is just too complex to have a ballgame influence traffic patterns.

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 6):

I wonder of the other MLB, NFL stadiums where a/c are closely visible in the nation?

No quite an answer to your question, but I know at DAB they have special "Race Day" procedures. If you'd like a copy, I'll see if I can't dig them up.



The content I post is solely my own opinion. It is not an official statement by/of/for nor representative of any company
User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1547 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3728 times:

Quoting B6A322 (Reply 9):
No quite an answer to your question, but I know at DAB they have special "Race Day" procedures. If you'd like a copy, I'll see if I can't dig them up.

That's more or less taxi procedures for the most part. They basically turn half of the taxiways into non-controlled areas, making it somewhat unclear as to where & when to call for taxi. Even on race day, its not terrible to fly VFR in or out of DAB.

-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineB6A322 From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3714 times:

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 10):

That's more or less taxi procedures for the most part.

Well, I was only there for three weeks last summer doing Sunflight Solo. I remember reading about the race day procedures, just not what they were (the track wasn't in use while I was there). Thought I'd sound all cool. 



The content I post is solely my own opinion. It is not an official statement by/of/for nor representative of any company
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7582 posts, RR: 42
Reply 12, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3621 times:

Almost two weeks ago, I went to the Citi Field for the Mets vs. Twins game and I sat behind first base. Throughout the entire game planes flew behind the stadium just seconds before landing. It was so cool!


Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlinemtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2458 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3588 times:

Quoting B6A322 (Reply 9):
No quite an answer to your question, but I know at DAB they have special "Race Day" procedures. If you'd like a copy, I'll see if I can't dig them up.

Best races to watch. I liked sitting there and catching the tv views that showed runway, terminal etc to see if I'd ever get to see any action over there. Saw a CO 737 once, and bizjets quite a bit. And of course AF1 with Reagan in '84.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlinedeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9425 posts, RR: 14
Reply 14, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3550 times:

Quoting RICBWI (Thread starter):
I realize extremely unlikely but it seems a bit inherently dangerous to have them right over the stadium.

I was at the Braves game(you know first place Braves) on Friday the 2nd and they were sending planes right over the Ted. Right down the middle. Matter of fact a DL 757 passed over and he did a little wing wave right over the score bored.



yep.
User currently offlinespacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3629 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3496 times:

Quoting isitsafenow (Reply 7):
Remember watching a Mets game around 68 or 69 on TV and when a departure went overhead you could not hear the announcers over the jet roar?

Ha, I remember going to a JETS game at Shea Stadium when I was young and one of my dad's friends saying to me "you're supposed to watch THOSE Jets [pointing to the field], not THOSE jets [pointing to the air]". We were, I believe, in the last row of the upper deck, so there was a gap between the back wall and the roof. I must have been watching them do the beginning part of the expressway visual even back then; then I'd turn around and watch them fly down through the gap on the other side of the stadium.

Citi Field is further away from the approach? I drive by it every day (on the expressway!) and I honestly have never paid enough attention to know.



I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
User currently offlineBlueman87 From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 535 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3460 times:

like how the guy in the stadium rather focus on the plane then the game


B6 T5 JFK DL T2/3 JFK
User currently offlineB6A322 From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3390 times:

Quoting Blueman87 (Reply 16):
like how the guy in the stadium rather focus on the plane then the game

Guilty.



The content I post is solely my own opinion. It is not an official statement by/of/for nor representative of any company
User currently offlinejetstar From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1648 posts, RR: 10
Reply 18, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3222 times:
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Most of the aircraft noise at CitiField is not from aircraft landing on Runway 31, but from departures off of runway 13.

Standard departure procedures on runway 13 require a right turn after departure to a heading of 180 degrees, this puts the loudest noise footprint over the auto repair shops adjacent to CitiField and then over the old World’s Fair grounds now known as Flushing Meadows Park and away from the more populated areas adjacent to LGA.

If you click on Google Earth and look at LaGuardia Airport, you will still see Shea Stadium and the adjacent auto repair yards and the park.

Here is a link to the LaGuardia 2 departures, as you can see 3 out of the 4 departures off of runway 13 require a right turn to 180 degrees.

http://dtpp.myairplane.com/pdfs/00289LAGUARDIA_C.PDF

JetStar


User currently offlinethegman From United States of America, joined Nov 2008, 670 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3146 times:

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 6):
I wonder of the other MLB, NFL stadiums where a/c are closely visible in the nation?
At Chase Field (PHX) (and roof open), you see them on arrival every so often.

Petco Park in San Diego has some good views of the landing traffic.


User currently offlinesilentbob From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 2104 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3061 times:

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 6):
I wonder of the other MLB, NFL stadiums where a/c are closely visible in the nation?
At Chase Field (PHX) (and roof open), you see them on arrival every so often.

If there is a football game in PHL you can usually recognize the faces on the video display while landing 27R or 26, that thing is huge. You generally don't fly directly over the stadium, but it is very close and only slightly off-line.


User currently offlineRP TPA From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 852 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 3008 times:

I used to have season tickets for the Mets back in the mid 80's (game 6...Mookie Wilson's ground ball....I was there!!).
If you think it's loud now, you wouldnt believe how bad it was back then. This was before the "quieter" engines, so you had a steady stream of DC9's, B727s, and old-generation 737's. When r/w 13 was used for departures, Shea sounded like: "Lets go Mets....Lets go M RRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!""


User currently offlineus330 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 3871 posts, RR: 13
Reply 22, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2861 times:

Quoting B6A322 (Reply 9):
I think what everyone is saying here is correct, the airspace around LGA is just too complex to have a ballgame influence traffic patterns.

Disagree, just slightly--ballgames do regularly influence traffic, on special occasions. I've had a flight delayed out of LGA because of a scheduled flyover of yankee stadium.

How does the presence of tv blimps affect LGA traffic during the Open?


User currently offlinecontrails15 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2837 times:

Quoting us330 (Reply 22):
How does the presence of tv blimps affect LGA traffic during the Open?

There are blimps during ball games and I'm sure the pilot of the blimp is directed to stay put in a certain area. The only time traffic patterns are dictated is during the US Open at the Tennis Center which has been going on for years.



Giants football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlinetimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6836 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (4 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2786 times:

Quoting B6A322 (Reply 9):
I think what everyone is saying here is correct, the airspace around LGA is just too complex to have a ballgame influence traffic patterns.

Baseball/tennis has influenced LGA departures in the past-- right? And the airspace hasn't gotten more complex since?

The runway 22 departure calls for an almost immediate turn left to 070-- would that bother the Mets less than the Whitestone climb off 13?


25 jfklganyc : Traffic at LGA is not influenced by Shea (it will always be shea to me and many Mets fans!) It is quite the site. Takeoffs off 13 are the best. The da
26 BooDog : DAB is always confusing on race day, as the planes are only allowed to turn left. =)
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