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CO CDG -IAH Nonstop Service  
User currently offlineronmacIAH From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 52 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7136 times:

CO previously changed the IAH/CDG and CDG/IAH segments from 777's to 767's. Even with this change, both segments have continued as non-stops.

As of 7/31, CO.com is showing the CDG/IAH segments during the week of 12/27 no longer as non-stops with layovers at EWR. Are the loads between Christmas and New Years from CDG/IAH that low or are the changes related to an equipment issue? In making reservations several months ago, both non-stop segments appeared to be half full some 6 months out from the scheduled flight time in December.

It appears non-stop service for the CDG/IAH segments resumes in January. The IAH/CDG segment remains non-stop with no change. Service for all segments remains on the 767's.


hey, lets be careful out there
11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinedrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5192 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6776 times:

Routine holiday capacity shifts. Demand to Europe falls for the holiday season and those birds are shifted to Latin American routes which have heavy holiday VFR traffic. IAH-MEX/GUA/SJO see 767/777 usually at this time.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5873 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6577 times:

CO does this every year. It's very cool to find a 777 flying IAH to Mexico City on Christmas Day!! Apparently, no one wants to fly transatlantic on Christmas.

User currently offlinekl911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5204 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 6463 times:

Quoting ronmacIAH (Thread starter):
Are the loads between Christmas and New Years from CDG/IAH that low

Well, premium loads are very low since this route is mostly business traffic. A lot of people don't like to work between christmas and new year..  

Does AMS-IAH see the same kind of reduction?


User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1849 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6420 times:

Quoting ronmacIAH (Thread starter):
CO previously changed the IAH/CDG and CDG/IAH segments from 777's to 767's

This is very likely an effect of CO change from Skyteam to *A. CDG is a Skyteam fortress and therefore CO has lost some pax at CDG and has gained some in *A fortress airports like FRA. But it's nice they have been able to maintain the CDG-IAH flight as a non-stop one.


User currently offlineDL747400 From United States of America, joined Sep 2008, 325 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 3638 times:

Quoting goldorak (Reply 4):
This is very likely an effect of CO change from Skyteam to *A.

This is not so much a consequence of CO's shift from SkyTeam to Star as it is a statement of the power behind the DL/AF/KL/AZ transatlantic joint venture.

CO never made a true commitment to SkyTeam. They were not really willing participants and never did take full advantage of the strengths that SkyTeam brought to the table.

For now at least, the DL/AF/KL/AZ transatlantic joint venture is putting enormous pressure on Star and oneworld.


User currently offlineSHAQ From Panama, joined Jun 2007, 381 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 3247 times:

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 5):

And what about AC/CO/UA/LH ?
Can you be so blind to not see , the huge quantity of routes that CO will add to that Joint-venture

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 5):

CO never made a true commitment to SkyTeam.

and I can see why they didn't .
They were competing with a partner in one of their most important cities (NYC)

Going back to the topic .
IAH-CDG now doesn't have as much traffic as in the past because they don't have a partner in CDG.
But , you can see IAH-FRA being flown with 777



Studying hard, for flying right!
User currently offlineSchweigend From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 628 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 3141 times:

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 5):
CO never made a true commitment to SkyTeam. They were not really willing participants and never did take full advantage of the strengths that SkyTeam brought to the table.

You're right that CO wasn't an enthusiastic participant in SkyTeam - their "go it alone" attitude bit them there. They could have optimized codesharing and connections a lot better with KL and AF. A Kellner thing?

Originally there was "Wings" - NW/KL (long partners) and CO (saved from a DL takeover in 1997 by NW and partners since). This worked well, and was growing. CO even had twice daily IAH-AMS and IAH-CDG service - I think they were CO46/58 and CO 5/10 respectively, but don't quote me on that! Still, that did not represent lots of codesharing--there was heavy-duty interlining instead.

Boy are CO friendly now with LH and FRA! Between them a 744 and 772 daily. And codeshares growing.

Yet that is not the the level service that SkyTeam brought a year or two ago (go easy on me--the following is approximate, based on my memory only. I work outside at IAH, and notice the changing flights every day):

AF - CDG-IAH - 772 - DAILY
AF - CDG-IAH - 330 - 5/wk

KL - AMS-IAH - 74M - DAILY
KL - AMS-IAH - 763 - 5/wk

LH - FRA-IAH - 340 - DAILY

CO - IAH-CDG - 772 - DAILY
CO - IAH-CDG - 772 - 5/wk
CO - IAH-AMS - 764 - DAILY
CO - IAH-AMS - 762 - 5/wk


This has now become:

AF - CDG-IAH - 773 - DAILY

KL - AMS-IAH - 74M - DAILY
KL - AMS-IAH - 73G-BBJ - 5/wk

LH - FRA-IAH - 744 - DAILY

CO - IAH-CDG - 764 - DAILY
CO - IAH-AMS - 764 - DAILY
CO - IAH-FRA - 772 - DAILY

Quoting SHAQ (Reply 6):
and I can see why they didn't .
They were competing with a partner in one of their most important cities (NYC)

It's true that DL's coming into the mix and competing in NYC soured the whole deal for CO and SkyTeam--

Quoting SHAQ (Reply 6):
Going back to the topic .
IAH-CDG now doesn't have as much traffic as in the past because they don't have a partner in CDG.
But , you can see IAH-FRA being flown with 777

     

Fondly,
Scottie


User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5873 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 3045 times:

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 5):
This is not so much a consequence of CO's shift from SkyTeam to Star as it is a statement of the power behind the DL/AF/KL/AZ transatlantic joint venture.

You couldn't be further away from reality there, I'm afraid. That 777 is needed elsewhere.
Your reliable premium pax between IAH and AMS are taking PrivatAir, with the rest mixed between KL and CO. The 777 needs to be utilized at Frankfurt- it's a Star hub.

How you managed to tie a single flight's equipment choice to Delta's dominance of the known universe is a bit beyond me.


User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2435 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2891 times:

Quoting Schweigend (Reply 7):
IAH-CDG service - I think they were CO46/58 and CO 5/10 respectively,
Quoting Schweigend (Reply 7):
CO - IAH-CDG - 772 - DAILY
CO - IAH-CDG - 772 - 5/wk

I don't believe CO ever ran 2x 772s on IAH-CDG at any point. CO5 has been LGW/LHR-IAH for the entire SkyTeam era. In fact, I can't ever recall CO operating more than 1x CDG-IAH flight. EWR-CDG was 3x/day in summer 2009, though (764, 752, 752).

Incidentally, CO went to the 764 on IAH-CDG while it was still in SkyTeam.


User currently offlineCOflyerBOS From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 308 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 2757 times:

CODC10 is correct. CO never offered a 2nd 777 to CDG. The flight has always been a single daily flight. Additionally, the 764 was placed on the route well before CO exited SkyTeam. The change had more to do with 777s needed on new routes out of EWR (Indian/China) than traffic flow. The only airline to make changes on IAH-CDG since CO left SkyTeam has been AF. Their 5 times a week flight on a 330 has disappeared. I'd love to say that that was a product of the CO dominance at IAH, but the most likely case is that the economy sucks on both sides of the Pond.

Additionally, European changes during the Christmas season at IAH is NOTHING new. It happens every year because IAH is largely a business market and biz travel falls off the map. As other posters have pointed out, those widebodies get utilized to Mexico and Central/South America during that time to service the VFR market.


User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (4 years 2 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2690 times:

how do u put in 100% into something that treats you as a second class citizen from Day 1 ?

SkyTeam dragged down CO. It's filled with 3rd tier carriers like KL (oh hello, still using overhead TVs??), AF (10 abreast slave-ship on 77W), NW (how new can you keep a DC-9?), China Southern (speaks for itself), Alitalia (bankrupt for all practical purposes), and the list goes on......

Compare that with StarAlliance where you have SQ, TG, Asiana, ANA, Swiss, TAM, AC, and *very soon*, QR

Then compare that with DL/NW/KL/AF getting into a 4-way orgy to ensure everyone else on both sides of the Atlantic is royally screwed.

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 5):
CO never made a true commitment to SkyTeam. They were not really willing participants and never did take full advantage of the strengths that SkyTeam brought to the table.


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