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CX A340 Photo:Taking Off Or Landing?  
User currently offlineGE From Singapore, joined Mar 2000, 320 posts, RR: 6
Posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2316 times:

Hello guys,
Pls take a look at the picture below. I'm a little unsure whether it's taking off or landing as the flaps don't look very clear at that angle. I'm thinking it could be taking off by looking at the engine exhausts. It most likely wouldn't be landing as it's engines would be idle (no engine exhausts) and it's a little too high a flare angle.
Then again, is that the threeshold/touchdown point I see a little behind and below the aircraft?
Please help me out on this one. Thanks in advance.


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Andrew Hunt



41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBoeing nut From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2126 times:

Hmmmm ..... tough call. The markings look like 500 ft distance markers. I was hoping they were touchdown zone markings. That would have made it easier. My quess is takeoff. The exhaust streams coming from the engines seems pretty concentrated. But that's just a quess.

My two cents!!!  Smile

Regards


User currently offlineGE From Singapore, joined Mar 2000, 320 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2093 times:

Thanks a lot for your prompt reply, Boeing nut. Please do keep the messages coming in.

User currently offlineLUFC From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2000, 80 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2080 times:

Trailing edge slats configured for take off. If it's landing it must be doing about 280mph to be still flying.

User currently offlineSim Pilot From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2073 times:

I think landing because if you look at the flaps in relation to the wing you can sort of visually tell that they are down more than 5 or 10 degrees. most planes takeoff with 5 or 10 degrees of flaps. Also if you look at the elevator it it up quite a bit for takeoff. When planes land they are going pretty slow compared to there takeoff speed so they need more control input to move the plane. Unless he is doing a really slow takeoff I think he is landing. Also the sise of the plane would require it to rotate past the 500 foot marks. Hope this long and boring message helps

User currently offlineAI744LR From Thailand, joined May 2001, 106 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2044 times:

The key here is the position of the flaps. Looks to me like they are positioned for take off and not landing.

Cheers  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlineAC_B777 From Canada, joined Aug 2000, 809 posts, RR: 13
Reply 6, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2038 times:

The flaps seem to be set for takeoff and like Boeingnut stated, the exhaust looks like it is at a higher power.
Also, the nose angle seems high for an A340 landing. I may be wrong. Just my guess.

AC_B777



In life, some days you are the bug..... some days you are the windshield!
User currently offlineLUFC From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2000, 80 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2024 times:

There's no ifs and buts about this. THIS PLANE IS TAKING OFF !!!

User currently offlineFlyordie From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 50 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 2011 times:

I agree with LUFC and everyone else who says landing! There are a few facts supporting this conclusion:
1) Flare seems too high for landing.
2) Flaps are not fully extended.
3) And I think this should settle it; If you look closely, the plane appears to be situated between two runway markers - the dual 3 line behind it and dual 2 line in front of it. This means that the plane is approaching the end of the runway and has only a little over 1,000 feet of runway remaining in front of it. Therefore, if it was landing, we would have heard about it on the news!

Hope this helps GE



User currently offlineRed Panda From Hong Kong, joined Jun 2000, 1521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1991 times:

T/O

r panda


User currently offlineGE From Singapore, joined Mar 2000, 320 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1980 times:

Man! Look at all these replies!  Big thumbs up
Thanks a lot guys for giving your professional views on this picture. From what I gather, it appears the plane is taking off.

P.S. If you strongly feel that this A340 is landing and not taking off, and have sufficient evidence to prove it, pls do email me or post in this thread.

THANKS AGAIN GUYS!!!
THIS FORUM'S THE BEST!!!!!!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlineAndyhunt From Singapore, joined Jan 2001, 1306 posts, RR: 52
Reply 11, posted (13 years 4 months 3 weeks ago) and read 1945 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

Hi All,

I guess that I am the only one to properly answer the question posed. Not because I'm an avaition expert, but because I took the photo!

The answer is.........................................LANDING!

Regards

Andrew





Full frame always beats post processing
User currently offlineCatpac From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1907 times:

definitely T/O,

User currently offlineHkgspotter1 From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1886 times:

Catpac,

Andy has just confirmed its landing. He took the photo.



User currently offlineGE From Singapore, joined Mar 2000, 320 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1876 times:

Wow, how surprising.  Wow!
Thanks, Andrew, for clearing it all up for us. It seems kinda strange to accept that from all our predictions, but we have to.

BTW Andrew, GREAT PHOTO!!!  Big thumbs up


User currently offlineCatpac From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1872 times:

sorry the reply must have been submitted at the same time cause I certainly haven't seen Andy's post....but quite frankly when I see a larger jet land whether its a 767/330/340/747 whatever, their flaps are in most cases almost perpendicular to it's wings i.e. large flap setting (30-40 degrees)

My apology,


User currently offlineGE From Singapore, joined Mar 2000, 320 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1872 times:

Yeah, it seemed rather strange to me too. This photo really looked like the A340 was taking-off.
Maybe the angle of the plane made it hard to judge the degree of flap accurately?


User currently offlineMax Q From United States of America, joined May 2001, 4660 posts, RR: 19
Reply 17, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1860 times:

LUFC, TRAILING EDGE SLATS ?


The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
User currently offlineCatpac From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1860 times:

Here guys, look at this take-off, it "seems" like the same flap setting



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © PixAir



See ya
Mike


User currently offlineCatpac From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1858 times:

Maybe the Changi landing was a really light one, hence a smaller flap angle was used,...or like GE says, it was just an angle that was hard to judge the flap settings...


User currently offlineAloha 737-200 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1853 times:

It is absolutely take-off. Look at the flap postion, it;s in the 10-15 degree range, and the angle of the aircraft as well.

5-15 degree flap settings are used for takeoff, while when an aircraft is flaring for touchdown flaps are usually at full.

As far as the angle of the aircraft's pitch-
At the pitch the aircraft is at, it would have to be doing a great deal of speed in order to not have a hard landing. At that flap setting, she'd settle onto the runway quite hard, especially at low (150-170 kts) landing speeds. I'd say she's taking off.

But I could be wrong.  Smile

Aloha 737-200!!  Wink/being sarcastic



User currently offlineSpaceman From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 534 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1836 times:

This plane is taking off and flying away falks. If it is landing the thrust reversers would have been applied. The plane should have 2 reverser engaged if it's landing!

User currently offlineSingapore 777 From Australia, joined May 1999, 1015 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1839 times:

I have seen A340s taking off with flap settings closer to landing ones. They probably needs lots of flaps to get off the ground.

User currently offlineCYKA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1829 times:

As Andrew confirmed the plane is landing. If you dont belive him look at the runway, it is obvious the aircraft is just past the touchdown markers(two large white squares).

User currently offlineHkgspotter1 From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (13 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1832 times:

Spaceman, Its landing OK. You put the reverser's out on landing not in the air. well most of the time !!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

25 CX flyboy : On the 744 we take off using Flaps20. We sometimes land using Flaps25. There is not a lot of difference, especially not in a photo.
26 SIA_B777 : no offense but why are you still arguing if the photographer has said it was a landing?
27 CX flyboy : huh? I'm not! There are people who still do not believe, citing the flaps as evidence. I'm just saying there might not be a lot of difference in TO an
28 Post contains images Bruce : Hi Folks, My opinion is Landing. Look at the wheels bogeys. I have seen a million planes land and see the wheels in that wierd position with the rearw
29 ILOVEPLANES! : I know it is landing but... if that A340 was taking off the bogies would still tilt, thye do not only tilt on landing.
30 KAZ : If you enlarge the picture you will see that the flap settings are at about 30 degrees. The small picture gives you the impression that they are confi
31 Andyhunt : Suppose I better post it up again. The A340 is landing. I took the photo! I don't know what else to say! I guess the easiest would be to check the CX
32 Post contains links and images GE : Hi again guys, Firstly, thanks a lot for keeping this topic alive. It's really great that so much can be commented about this photo. Perhaps some peop
33 Airbus Lover : i m neutral....hehe but if it is landing, it is fine to flare at that angle when there is strong wind ahead or the weight and various causes.
34 Beefmoney : I believe hes landing because (I may be wrong) it looks like the VASI lights are just to the left of the plane indicating hes at the near end of the r
35 SIA_B777 : Andy that is a very nice photo. What camera did you use?
36 Andyhunt : Fuji S1 Pro. Digital SLR. Andrew
37 Post contains images A330-243 : That A340 is taking off. Yes, its definetly on takeoff. HA HA HA !!! Just kidding. Reading this thread made me laugh. I guess no one thought the perso
38 Post contains images GE : Keep the photos coming in, Andrew!
39 Andyhunt : I'm trying but the upload queue is getting fairly long these days! Johan's site is getting popular. Andrew
40 Crosswind : Just to reiterate some of what's already been said; If you thought the plane was taking-off, look to the left of it... You can see the VASIs that give
41 Skystar : I don't know how anybody can look at the flaps on the A340 and say that it is a takeoff. They are quite clearly fully deployed - you look at the angle
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