SV777KiloAlpha From Saudi Arabia, joined Dec 2003, 266 posts, RR: 4 Reply 3, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 100804 times:
Early reports say, all on board are missing.
Dubai TV: the crash is due to technical difficulties. The crash was in unpopulated area.
RL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4351 posts, RR: 17 Reply 7, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 100455 times:
Quoting JoKeR (Reply 1): Apparently a UPS plane crashed on the outskirts of Dubai
What does UPS fly there?
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
jfklucky777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 68 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 100294 times:
Longhornmaniac From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2838 posts, RR: 51 Reply 11, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 100209 times:
Photos from database show primarily MD-11 and 747-400s.
Thoughts and prayers to all involved.
Cheers,
Cameron
Traveling around the world for 6 months. Visit my homepage to see if I'll be in your town!
b707forever From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 459 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 99769 times:
Yes, being reported as a cargo plane coming down on "Emirates Highway" in a populated area with cars on fire and loss of life per BBC. However we know early reports are often exaggerated or under reported.
qantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1222 posts, RR: 5 Reply 18, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 99394 times:
Was a UPS plane. Declared Mayday on approach 30L and then veered off course. Last radar hit showed descending through 500' doing 250kts.
If you want to be a Millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline.
We all know how patchy initial reports are, very very sad nontheless. I was just looking at the cost of a f(ATPL) course - something like this is very sobering.
qantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1222 posts, RR: 5 Reply 22, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 98925 times:
Confirmed it was a UPS aircraft. Confirmed mayday during 30L approach. Confirmed fire in the cockpit during mayday call. Unconfirmed N571UP
If you want to be a Millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline.
Fauzi From Brunei, joined Jul 2005, 187 posts, RR: 0 Reply 23, posted (1 year 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 98627 times:
Quoting Woof (Reply 19): Allegedly a UPS 747-400 declaring mayday on approach to 30L. N571UP form pprune. Hopes with crew and anyone affected on ground.
A Jumbo? That's not good. Is the crash site densely populated? There are a few reports saying the place is still under development and therefore has almost zero population. Nevertheless, not good at all
Is this the first crash in Dubai's/Emirate's modern history?
25 KFlyer: N571UP last op UPS2 on 2SEP. Is that a flight going through DXB?
26 globetraveller: There are some suggestions that the plane had just taken off. Note the link: http://gulfnews.com/news/gulf/uae/em...go-plane-crashes-in-dubai-1.677268
27 Fauzi: CNN is reporting it now. They're saying cars are on fire on the highway although it is still unconfirmed. So in this case would the traffic at DXB be
28 Centre: , those on board, and people on the ground
29 JBirdAV8r: Fauzi, I think there was a 707 that crashed last year after takeoff from DXB. If it was in fact a UPS 747, new-build, with a catastrophically raging
30 BasilFawlty: No, that one crashed near SHJ, it was an Azza Air 707.
31 CHRISBA777ER: Oh God - awful. Fingers crossed they got out but it doesnt look good. What might cause a fire in the cockpit?
32 KU747: It went down inside UAE Air Force camp which is about 1.5KM from the main highway and about 20KM from the runway. DXB is running normal as we speak.
33 globetraveller: There are some very conflicting reports about whether the plane was taking-off or landing right now. Some more news from avherald: http://www.avherald
34 MCO2BRS: Al Arabiya is reporting that the crash occurred ~20km from DXB near a UAE Army Camp http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2010/09/03/118400.html MCO 2 BRS
35 gr325: http://www.pressroom.ups.com/Press+R...ses/Statement+on+Aircraft+Incident From the UPS website
36 JBirdAV8r: Sorry, you're right. I guess it still qualifies for Fauzi though because it did crash in AN emirate. Prayers for the crew and their families, and any
37 cloudyapple: It doeen't need to be a big fire. Smoke can incapacitate the pilots very quickly.
38 Fauzi: An airline pilot, Domminque Fanucci is on the phone now with CNN and said that he lives about 4 mins from DXB, and the plane was flying very low about
39 JBirdAV8r: http://www.airliners.net/profile/cloudyapple "Smoke in the cockpit" is a fairly "normal non-normal" occurrence. That something happened so fast, so pr
40 KU747: Eyewitnesses: "One of the engines was on fire". According to Al Arabiya news
41 kaitak: Spoke to a friend of mine, living in Dubai; it came down very near Silicon Oasis, a housing area used by (among others) EK crews, and very close to th
42 corey07850: "At approximately 12 p.m. EST, UPS Flight 6 from Dubai, UAE, to Cologne, DE, a 747-400 with two crewmembers on board crashed on takeoff. At this time,
43 JoKeR: UPS Statement Statement on Aircraft Incident Atlanta, September 03, 2010 A UPS cargo plane has been involved in an accident in Dubai. At approximately
44 globetraveller: UPS have confirmed that it was on take-off - not landing as many other places have reported. I guess that explains the large fireball many of the witn
45 jamies80085: airfleets says that N571UP was dilivered new in 2007, http://www.airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b747-35668.htm
46 stealth777: is it possible the aircraft departed from runway 12L/R and whatever happened on board required the crew to make an immediate return back to DXB, hence
47 71Zulu: That is what is being reported on pprune. Plane took off then declared emergency for cockpit fire then crashed on approach.
48 FatmirJusufi: Very sad news. Condolences to the families of the flight crew.
49 MadameConcorde: Rest In Peace crash victims. Have any reports filtered on what caused the crash?
50 Quokka: How dreadful. I do hope that the crew managed to survive, as reports to date are unclear. If not, my deepest sympathy and condolences to the families
51 fxramper: I'm afraid the crew have departed. Here is a pic from the local news feed. Crashed on Emirates Highway near the Dubai Creek Golf Club.
52 LHRlocal: Picture of wreckage here: http://www.dubainews.net/story/680621 RIP to all involved.
54 71Zulu: On pprune, being reported as a cockpit fire. The plane was also dumping fuel during it's short flight.
55 SEPilot: This is very bad news. There have been few 744's lost; and to lose an almost brand new one is quite disturbing. I for one will be very interested in
56 KC135TopBoom: RIP to the crew. I believe this is the first hull loose for UPS since the DC-8-71F fire in PHL a few years ago.
57 Viper911: On pprune, being reported that CCN reports that bodies of the crew were recovered.
58 tugger: Fire/heat could have burned the paint off (without melting the rest). Condolences to all who perished in this tragedy. Tugg
59 kaitak: http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&...LL_en-GB&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wl You can see Silicon Oasis in this map; six miles north i
60 Braniff722: Wow. What a awful sight that must have been to see a 747 struggle in flight. Hope the family of the crew, along with the UPS family find some peace. T
61 comorin: A salute to the heroic crew for avoiding casualties on the ground. RIP
62 Viper911: True but since that pic (the one in the article linked by LHRlocal) was actually taken on the site of Air India Express crash at Mangalore earlier th
64 MadameConcorde: One commentator on the link. Crash Saw the Plane few Mtrs dist from us....It crashed on construction site...next to global village....The plane went r
65 JBirdAV8r: That looks like a 737NG horizontal stabilizer. Probably just a stock photo.
66 dl757md: If I'm not mistaken that is the left horizontal stab not the vertical. It would be painted light gray as in the picture. JBirdAV8r sounds like he's g
67 TheFLCowboy: It was UPS6 according to UPS.com - Crashed on Takeoff with 2 on board. http://www.ups.com/pressroom/us/pres...t+on+Aircraft+Incident.syndication[Edite
68 WingedMigrator: The picture is in daylight. The crash occurred in the dark, and it is currently night time in Dubai. The first daylight pictures of the crash site ar
70 Navigator: Now speculation starts as it should. However this assumption is to say the least highly unlikely in my opinion. Something like engine failure, shift
71 flood: Some interesting info from pprune with a completely different take on the events: airbusdriver123: "Flight from Dubai to Germany Emergency with Barhai
72 rquesty: UPS confirm it was a 747-400 "at approx 12pm set UPS flight 6 from Dubai to Cologne a 747-400 with two crew members on board crashed on takeoff, at th
73 kaitak: There is now a report from a pilot, on PPRUNE: "I witnessed the whole thing on the radio while landing into AUH. After attempting a straight in approa
74 Zeke: That photo looks like to me it is from the Air India Express 737-800 overrun in Mangalore.
75 WrenchBender: Various reports indicate landing attempt/impact was at OMDM not OMDB as originally stated. According to WSJ can't get link to work...... WrenchBender
76 YYZRWY23: Press release from UPS: http://www.pressroom.ups.com/Press+R...ses/Statement+on+Aircraft+Incident R.I.P to the crew and all on the ground. Looking for
77 Viper911: Israeli news website Ynet is now reporting in their breaking news section that the 2 crewmen didn't make it. i hope this turns out to be wrong.
78 jayeshrulz: What!! I did not see this coming !! RIP and a big Salute to the aircrew who operated the flight! Cant believe they were with us 5 hours back!! Life Su
79 c5load: Not to make any light of this, but I'm glad it at least was not another MD-11. When I read that UPS flies MD-11s and 744s to DXB, my stomach sank thin
80 fxramper: Fire in the cockpit after take off. They declared emergency and couldn't get it back to the airport.
81 jayeshrulz: Well Yes, DXB does get the MD-11 but during March to May-August only. I think that's how it was last year when i was there.
82 skygirl1990: Yes unfortunately I do agree with you there. I think had it been another MD-11 in light of recent troubles, it could signal an early end for a fantas
83 Viper911: Some people on pprune suggested, that the UPS 747 flew up to Bahrain/Doha airspace before declaring emergency and returning back to DXB. By Grizzled:
84 c5load: I know the cause right now is anybody's guess, but what about Hazmat? Could it have been loaded the wrong way, I know I have hit those situations on
85 anshuk: RIP, crewmembers. Condolences to their families. A sad day for aviation, lets just hope it is not an inherent fault with the aircraft, but merely a ca
86 71Zulu: Being reported now on pprune that the aircraft had departed DXB earlier and was some 120 miles away when the emergency started. They requested a retur
87 KarlB737: Here is the take via Associated Press: Courtesy: Associated Press via Business Rockford UPS B744 Crashes Near Dubai Airport http://hosted.ap.org/dynam
88 Warszawa: This crash reminds me of the Valujet DC-9 crash back in the everglades. My guess is this incident probably has nothing to do with the aircraft itself,
89 BlueFlyer: Plenty of speculation, but this seems to be not quite unlike Swissair 111 where the crew wasn't aware initially of the severity of the problem and di
90 c5load: If this proves to be the cause, I bet we will see fire suppression in them very soon.
91 BlueFlyer: Lower deck has both. Main deck has fire detection only.
92 OURBOEING: Oh such a sad news. May the pilots RIP. Didn't UPS just buy the 744s a couple of years ago? I had an opportunity to take a tour of a brand new 767 abo
93 VivaGunners: This is quite shocking, indeed. RIP to all those who perished.
94 jreuschl: Is the fire suppression a feature requested by the airline (UPS) or not ever designed into the 747? RIP to the pilots, and thoughts and prayers to the
95 upsphl: N571 is the second brandnew 747. I think its only like 3 years old. Very sad new for the UPS family
96 Midcon385: RIP to the pilots and prayers and thoughts for their families... Tim
97 Viper911: Afaik, 747 has lower deck detection and suppression, and main deck detection system only.
98 qantas744ER: No the 744 does not have main deck fire suppression. Part of procedure for main deck is to depressurize and descend to 25000, with the idea that lack
99 BlueFlyer: A lot of people got very lucky tonight, be it because of fate or the crew's action, it is too soon to tell, but by all accounts, the plane flew extre
100 aireuropeuk733: RIP and thoughts and prayers with the families AE733
101 ff22DXB: However Silicon Oasis area is not on the path between Bahrain/Doha airspace and DXB, its much farther and west. RIP all the crew and I certainly hope
102 flood: Same here. If reports are correct and they were forced to rely only on radio communications while essentially flying a blind approach, this could hav
104 BlueFlyer: They attempted to land at DXB but had to abort (apparently coming in too high/fast). Rather than do a 360 and try again, they headed for Minhad and f
105 Viper911: As a fellow ppruner Meekg has said, the aircraft has attempted to preform an emergency landing on 12L in DXB, but came to high and too fast.. and i'l
106 EkA380: Here is a local link with some pictures http://gulfnews.com/news/gulf/uae/em...go-plane-crashes-in-dubai-1.677268 Its a very tragic accident indeed ,
107 raggi: Sad news out of Dubai tonight indeed. Fire is the last thing you want in an aircraft. Condolences to the ones affected by this horrible crash.
108 comorin: Reminder: the cockpit on a 747F is located on the upper deck, not main deck. Not that it made a difference...
109 SLCPilot: Thinking way outside the box, and perhaps even beyond protocal for smoke evacuation, is it possible to open the cockpit hatch if the plane is depressu
110 ULMFlyer: Apparently, Fedex uses EVAS (Emergency Vision Assurance System) for exactly this type of emergency. UPS doesn't. http://www.evasworldwide.com/ If thi
111 na: Very, very sad news. This is the second crash of a 744 in 21 years of service, almost exactly 10 years fter the SQ tragedy, and all-in-all the 5th wri
112 na: What? Why? I think its far more disturbing that a very safe plane like a 744 crashed than a notoriously troublesome plane like the MD11.
113 rolfen: No fire suppression in a cargo plane???
114 71Zulu: That would make it even more sad if this is a CFIT accident and the EVAS could have prevented this disaster.
115 71Zulu: Not on the main deck of the UPS 744, no.
116 Zeke: Not sure about that, the DXB TMA boundary would be RANBI for their departure, it is only about 10 minutes from takeoff to that point. More than likel
117 airbuske: My college friends father is a UPS 744 f/o. He is currently on a 2 week trip in and out of Dubai. Pray it's not him. May those who we lost today rest
118 ltbewr: Early reports as posted here suggest a fire in the cargo area. That raises a series of questions, if something failed in the aircraft setting cargo on
119 dc863: Crash brought up memories of the Pan Am 707C crash at Boston Logan in '73 due to inflight fire.
120 n471wn: Yes only the 5th write off and only the 2nd involving fatalities--a truly remarkable record which speaks to what Boeing promised the airlines and tha
121 trex8: you don't consider the CI 744 runoff into the harbor at kai tak a crash?? there was also the QF runoff into a ditch at BKK but they repaired that so
122 KC135TopBoom: I believe it is the left side stabizer you see there, and it does appear to have fire fighting foam running down it. The vertical stabizer appears to
123 fanofjets: My thoughts are with the families of the crew and any persons on the ground involved.
124 Viscount724: It depends how you define "crash", but it's the 4th 744 hull loss involving an accident and the 5th for all reasons including the NH 744D that caught
125 Kit777: Awful news, god knows what the pilots must have been going through during the final moments. I hope the investigation finds out the cause very soon. A
126 Midcon385: The cockpit windows in the B747 do not open. Hence the escape hatch in the roof of the cockpit for emergency evacuation from the flight deck. Tim
127 Zeke: Please reread reply 74, that photo is from the last accident involving an aircraft departing Dubai, the Air India Express 737-800 http://buzzytimes.c
128 Viscount724: That's why I excluded the NH ground fire from the actual accidents.
129 Viper911: Well the procedure is extinguish the fire by oxygen starvation, Its the picture of the 737 crash in Mangalore earlier this year, not the UPS one from
130 Braniff747SP: RIP to the crew. This crash is reminding me of the ValuJet crash, as well as Swissair 111. I'm surprised that there is no fire suppression system on t
131 PITrules: EVAS http://www.evasworldwide.com/docs/EVAS_TrainingB.mpg http://www.evasworldwide.com/ Looks like the vast majority of users are corporate flight de
132 Zeke: Not on the 744 freighter, I think most companies will try and load dangerous goods in the under floor cargo areas on the freighter where you have fir
133 affirmative: Looks like the location of the wreckage is quite close to a military airfield with more than enough runway for a visual app on a 747. In my mind it wo
134 TheSonntag: As I live only 10km from CGN, I am shocked to hear a plane destined for CGN did not make it. I took place on a guided tour of the airport some time ag
135 tdscanuck: Yes. Yes, but to reach the hatch you'd have to get out of your seat, which is a really bad idea in an emergency approach. There are very few aircraft
136 as777: The crew were ANC based. May they RIP.[Edited 2010-09-03 16:08:44]
137 aa43e: I would suppose so except the fact these folks had their hands full following the first directive of any emergency situation. Fly the Aircraft. Also,
138 jreuschl: http://memphis.bizjournals.com/memphis/stories/2009/10/05/daily16.html Looks like FX is on top of this.
139 B777LRF: Your thinking is quite wrong on that point Zeke. DGR will be loaded on the main-deck as naturally as it would on in a lower-deck. With the main-deck
140 413X3: without a cockpit door, what measures are in place to stop smoke from rising up from the main cargo deck into the cockpit?
141 n234nw: Don't freighters have a cockpit door? The pictures I have seen look like they all have doors, but I suppose these could have been conversions.
142 71Zulu: Correct. No openable window on the 747 flight deck.
143 tdscanuck: It's basically the same, although without the FE station I'm sure the ergonomics are different. You can't open the windows on a 747 flight deck...tha
144 413X3: Strange I could have sworn, at least older model -400F's had no door. My memory just sucks in my old age apparently... It says they were in the air fo
145 PITrules: UPS aircraft do not have a cockpit door.
147 PITrules: I'm no expert on the 747, but I believe that would be for the electric windshield heating used for anti-icing.[Edited 2010-09-03 17:33:49]
148 tdscanuck: Did they remove it, or never take the option? If they don't have the door, have they got the floor hatch? What PITrules said: Immediately aft of the
149 PITrules: I've only been on the 744 fleet a few times, so am not familiar with the existence/non-existence of a floor hatch, or if the door was removed vs. not
151 413X3: A floor hatch with a ladder is standard in every -400 freighter
152 N685FE: For some reason, the links on the EVAS site for the video demos won't open. Found this demo on youtube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RT5rkEvj1G4
153 KFlyer: Sorry I only went through 75% of the thread, but this doesn't seem to have been reported earlier. Bahrain Control had stated that the crew requested f
154 cpd: Pretty awful accident. RIP to the crew who did their best to try and bring the plane down safely.
155 dragon6172: Any possibility of a fire behind the instrument panel that blacked out the cockpit? Does 744 have electronic standbys? Does it have to be smoke that
156 CBPhoto: Umm...almost! The MD-11s do have a cockpit door, they just don't use them, or keep them open! This is from my jumpseating experience! Well...their is
157 JBirdAV8r: Pretty sure the newer-build 744F has an electronic standby instrument--but it should run on its own emergency battery power independent of the aircra
158 DashTrash: Doesn't matter if there is too much smoke in the cockpit to see. This absolutely sickens me.
159 MSN007: Yes I hear a lot of smoke in the cockpit but what exactly causes such an event? Do the instruments over heat?
160 Gulfstream650: PLEASE - This is not the time to start posting information on new technologies or to start speculating (as always on A.net). WE DON'T KNOW WHAT ACTUAL
161 RmvB4Flight: Very sad indeed. RIP to all involved. On a slightly related note, do they have handheld fire extinguishers in cockpits just in case something like thi
162 Pbb152: Practice what you preach my friend. You say we shouldn't speculate, but you seem assured that the crew were "sacrificing themselves rather than those
163 BMI727: That's what investigators are charged with finding out. Right now, there are plenty of possibilities. The fire itself may not have even been in the c
164 cpd: I think there are. But in this case, probably of little use if you can't see what you are doing. It's unclear at this point where the smoke/fire came
165 CBPhoto: Well...not to be hypocritical, but you are speculating that this is a 747-400 problem, and not specific to this particular flight! While I am too tha
166 F9Animal: Very very sad news. The crew did amazing work to avoid a populated area. Probably a cargo fire, and that is very sad. Too bad they were too high and f
167 Gulfstream650: Well I understand your point of course. Considering the fact that (from reports from airline pilots) if they were flying at 500AGL they would have be
168 AR385: AV Herald excerpt: "Pilots on frequency of Bahrain Center reported, that the airplane had been enroute overhead the Arabian Gulf about 120nm westnort
169 spacecadet: Every time there's an accident somebody feels compelled to say this. This is a discussion forum. It is intended to be an exchange of ideas. If you're
170 atlturbine: This is honestly ridiculous speculation and a complete over reaction to the accident. With a 2 person crew that presumably never left the flight deck
171 CBPhoto: Mmm...a bit of a knee jerk reaction! UPS should evaluate the situation accordingly, but no need to ground the fleet just hours after the accident! Th
172 IndianicWorld: If its an emergency landing, why not try to land at the new airport near Jebel Ali? It is not surrpounded by houses afterall.
173 BlueFlyer: At the risk of being insensitive, I'd want to ask whether a crew that was apparently dealing with smoke so thick they couldn't read their own instrum
174 BMI727: I would sincerely hope that isn't the case, as previous experience (notably SR111) shows that smoke or fire in an aircraft is always a serious proble
175 FX1816: So with the history of the 744 showing really no kind of past incidents UPS should ground the fleet of 744's??? I mean look at all of the "problems"
176 AR385: Chill. Ridiculous speculation? No. Sorry. Just the speculation that happens on this site and this forum for which we are all entitled too. I paid my
177 CBPhoto: Well..knowing what we know now, landing at the nearest airport would have been a good choice, no matter if it was suitable or not for a 747. However,
178 morvious: Thank you! I fully agree. There is nothing wrong with speculation unless it is not clear that someone is. It gives you great info on how things can g
179 peanuts: I want to know something: If, big if, some of the speculation on here holds true, I would be pretty upset at my union leaders and employer. You mean
180 BMI727: It is the way the industry works because it is, after all, a business. All these safety features cost money, and in financial terms, the cost of a cr
181 fca767: Cargo Pilots seem to be the ones risking their lives with not being able to know what's in every package. Either the company does what Passenger Airpo
182 FX1816: No one even knows yet if it was a package that caused this to happen, a bit premature. FX1816
183 gr325: I could not quite agree with that. Every pilot should have NOTOC on board, which is the law. He should be able to figure out what kind of dangerous g
184 AirTran737: Even with the NOTOC most people don't know what the hell they are looking at. Even a basic understanding of knowing how to read the ERG Code would he
185 atcsundevil: I understand you are entitled to your opinion, but here is my two cents, so take it for what it's worth. Aimlessly searching around a 20+ year old co
186 Navigator: Well now I see it the other way... Do we really want problems with the 747-400 also? No matter what type it is always bad
187 Maverick623: Not just freighters, any type of airplane. And I don't blame them one bit: there's a reason it's called HAZMAT. I once had to tell a hesitant captain
188 vlada: Is it wrong to assume that, if you have an in-flight emergency on your plane, the first thing you should do is to try and land it on the first availa
189 SXDFC: This website is home to the ANTSB = Airliners Net Transportation Safety Board. They've been solving all aviation disasters since 1998. RIP to the cre
190 atcsundevil: Not to mention the tires in the forward hold along with the unsecured and active generators, as well as having no fire suppression or cockpit fire al
191 mandala499: Others have asked, "why not go to the nearest strip of concrete?" 120NM from DXB would put them at about 100NM from DOH... both are suitable. With HI
192 Viper911: Has anyone found any daylight pictures of the site of the accident? i've searched everywhere and i can't find any..
193 affirmative: This is exactly what I was thinking, and there are a few other concrete strips available before DXB. If they were 120nm from DXB they were probably c
194 klwright69: I was just driving through Dubai the other day and saw a UPS 747 taking off in the evening hours, wow who would have known. I even thought I hope an a
195 jreuschl: http://gulfnews.com/pictures/news/in...go-plane-crashes-in-dubai-1.677380 Here is one daylight picture.. Also, in the 2nd, looks like some damage was
196 ltbewr: For many of us here, as well as airlines/cargo carriers, insurers, regulators, aircraft makers and some in the general public, we are deeply concerne
197 sankaps: While we do not know what caused the fire, the accident is actually eerily similar to Swissair 111. There too there was fire / smoke in the cockpit a
198 747classic: We don't know what has caused this accident and a lot of questions remain to be answered. Possible options, that could have caused this crash : - a ma
199 Viper911: Wow, on the first picture, it looks that the aircraft crashed on top of some building, all those beams and bars, and the rooftop part on the left sid
200 UALWN: You could ask the same question about AF/KL (or BA) vs. LH. Lufthansa has EVAS, the others don't. Astonishing, you said?
201 Kaiarahi: UPS actually said no such thing. What they have said is: "UPS can confirm that Flight 6, a 747-400, TOOK OFF FROM DUBAI AT APPROXIMATELY 1500 ZULU, b
202 vlada: In the captions of these pictures it says that the plane "...crashes shortly after take-off". Yet, as I gather from the posts here, the plane was 120
203 PanHAM: Crews are informed about DGR items on board. Integrators, and UPS is one of them, usually screen all of their cargo. zthis is standard proicedure and
204 traindoc: Link to pictures. Nothing left but rubble and ash! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...ame-takeoff.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
205 corey07850: Actually they did. If you read the UPS Press Releases after the accident first happened they stated it occured on take off. Obviously it has been rev
206 71Zulu: Crash site on Google Maps http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UT...h&z=15&iwloc=00048f5ee1751c843582e
207 ltbewr: Looking at the daytime pictures, the a/c seemed to crash into a gully, basicly disingrating, only a small part of the tail structure intact, showing m
208 Viper911: It's not exactly at that point, the actual crash site is norther of what you linked it's between the building complex with the red rooftops and white
209 upsphl: Every UPS pilot gets a NOTOC if they have HAZMAT or DRYICE and they have to sign off on it saying that got it from the load supervisor. Now the pilot
210 413X3: Which basically means more oxygen coming down to fuel the fire, right? What a horrible situation, I still feel sick the more I learn about this tragi
211 klwright69: Good points. However I am not certain this aircraft was at cruising altitude, SwissAir 111 definitely was, and quite far from their originating city.
212 kaitak: There is definitely a similarity with the SR 111 crash, leaving aside the fact that we don't yet know the source of the smoke. However, one poster on
213 413X3: It was about 120-200 miles away from DXB when they declared the emergency.
214 aa61hvy: Well the accessible DG (hazmat is for ground transport DG for air) is within reach of the pilots. The accessible DG is the highly flammable type thin
215 413X3: Why wouldn't they be in the lower cargo hold with fire suppression?
216 Daysleeper: Hmm, I wasn't aware Acid suffered with delusions, has it tried therapy? Perhaps it just feels a little out of balance in life and requires a good str
218 CMB56: Standard procedure for smoke or fire on a freight aircraft is the opposite as that for passengers. #1 depressurize the aircraft and stay high, 20K+ to
219 AustrianZRH: What's the rate of descent they can manage in an emergency, 3000 fpm, 5000 fpm? Maybe those 100 nm out was what they needed anyway to get the plane t
221 comorin: Some uninformed speculation on my part: - It's improbable that freight should ignite within minutes of takeoff; all the freight 'feels' is cabin altit
222 WingedMigrator: The daytime photos of the crash site give a pretty accurate indication of which way it came in. This map shows the debris field, a good 500 meters lon
223 F9Animal: I think the CVR will give some good indications on what happened. Have they recovered them yet?
225 jc2354: Thank you for bringing this up. I have always felt that the 744F was just too much airplane for only 2 people. If it was a main level fire, with a fi
226 CBPhoto: Well..yes it is wrong. Just because you have an in flight emergency, does not mean you are going to land a 747 on a 3000 ft piece of concrete! You wi
227 CMB56: The vertical speed scale on most aircraft only goes to +/-6000. That doesn't mean you can't come down faster. The airframe is limited by airspeed not
228 jreuschl: http://gulfnews.com/news/gulf/uae/em...plane-s-black-boxes-found-1.677428 Black boxes have been found.
229 ULMFlyer: These FAA docs show how terribly complicated it can be to fight an in-flight fire. Some excerpts: Source: http://www.fire.tc.faa.gov/pdf/2009highlight
230 YVRLTN: They are scanned by a portable scanner manually. Would it not seem more likely the instruments were not actually working as a direct result of the fi
231 vlada: Well, I didn't have 3000 ft in mind, and there were some significantly longer airstrips around there, as we were informed by other posters. Anyway, I
232 tdscanuck: Yes. Although not technically airtight, the door seal is pretty good on most designs and is an effective smoke barrier. Smoke in the flight deck is t
233 Barney Captain: AFTER they flew around in circles dumping fuel - big difference. It appears that by all accounts, from the initial mayday call to the tragic end was
234 lightsaber: First, My condolences to the families of the crew. I really Thank you for the map. 1. That isn't very far. 2. DXB would have *everything* to handle a
235 EMBQA: .....and all that does no good if the shipper does not declare honestly what they are shipping.
236 fxra: Deepest condolences to the family of the crew. It's a bit weird knowing that I've jumpseated that tail, and there's a strong chance I've spoken too on
237 guillermo: First of all, may the victims rest in peace. Secondly, I can hardly believe that we are thinking about short circuits or however electrical related fi
238 Zeke: That is true, however in the context I was referring to items that would benefit from having fire extinguishing capabilities. Yes some CAOs do need c
239 Zeke: It is not possible. While you would need to have the aircraft depressurised and packs off to remove the pressure form the inside, it is impossible to
240 tdscanuck: It's not a problem of quality, it's a problem of density and design requirements. Aircraft, by necessity, run a lot closer to their design margins th
241 FX1816: Bingo!!! I had that problem one time when I was working with DHL, a shipper out of City of Industry, CA, shipped a box that weighed 75 and was full o
242 lightsaber: We ship HAZMAT all the time. However, we not only do industry labeling, but our internal requirements (which meet industry standards) are far more st
243 sankaps: Actually the SR 111 pilots initially requested a return to Boston and briefly starting heading to it, before changing their minds (partly at the prom
244 Viscount724: The NTSB was unable to determine the cause of that fire, and was unable to find any evidence of faulty repairs following the earlier rear pressure bu
245 ER757: I was thinking that depression was caused by the impact of the aircraft. I've never been to that area, maybe someone familiar with it could say if th
247 kaitak: What happened to the aircraft in these cases? I recall that there was a Malaysia A330 a few years back, on which Mercury leaked ... and the aircraft
248 FX1816: I guess not too much. N702AX was still in service when I was laid off back in 2008 although I believe it and the other aircraft were both out of serv
249 jreuschl: I assume the flight data recorders would record where a fire alarm was triggered in the aircraft? (assuming one was triggered)
250 MCO2BRS: Very sad indeed, it appears the F/O was a Central Florida resident, he left behind a 4 year old daughter. The captain was from Louisville, KY. http://
251 NZ1: Due to the number of posts, please continue the discussion here UPS 747-400 Crash In Dubai - Part 2 (by NZ1 Sep 4 2010 in Civil Aviation) Thanks NZ1
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