Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Real Airline Panic Attack Video  
User currently offlineEK156 From United Arab Emirates, joined May 2005, 765 posts, RR: 3
Posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 16916 times:

This is an extremely interesting look into an original panic attack on a plane. It seems the individual involved was shaken and scared of something. It's quite challenging for Crew when they have to handle such situations. Are they not issued any sort of sedative?

I am certain this individual has some sort of phobia that cause the panic attack. These kind of panic attacks can happen to anyone. But what usually leads to them. Please share your thoughts, they can help fellow crew members understand more about these situation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxtyisoNBaI&feature=player_embedded

I apologize if this video has been posted before or is in the wrong forum

EK 156

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineYYZRWY23 From Canada, joined Aug 2009, 561 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 16792 times:

Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
It's quite challenging for Crew when they have to handle such situations

Also potentially dangerous. You are dealing with an individual who is clearly not entirely in control, in a confined space with many others. Crew are trained to defuse situations likes this as safely as possible, and if necessary, get the plane on the ground so that the person can be removed and receive the help they need. They don't know this person, their condition, or anything, so someone having a panic attack like this can turn very dangerous, very quickly.

Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
Are they not issued any sort of sedative?

I THINK some airlines have sedatives on-board, but I would think they would need to be requested/voluntarily taken. Crew are not doctors and can't force someone to take something. They can offer, but that is the extent of it. That is why they have restraints (as visible in the video), so that they can take physical control of them, to ensure safety for the crew, the paxs, and the individual.

YYZRWY23



If you don't stand behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of them.
User currently offlinemrskyguy From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1214 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 16706 times:

My wife suffers from panic attacks, and hers are usually triggered by feelings of nasuea, etc. Flying is something she used to be terrified of, but is now on;y moderately uneasy. Granted if there's even one speedbump up there, she panics.. it's hard. You cannot reason with someone having a panic attack, because they aren't reacting with reason.. it comes from much deeper within.


"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee." -- Gunter's 2nd Law of Air
User currently offlineMarkHKG From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 960 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 16692 times:

Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
Are they not issued any sort of sedative?

Sedatives are not routinely carried on board most aircraft medical kits. In the US, they are not required by the FAA to carry sedatives in the Emergency Medical Kit, and most airlines are happy not to because of the strict Drug Enforcement Agency requirements to store and manage a controlled substance. However, you will find a handful of airlines (particularly large legacy carriers) do choose to carry some sort of sedative. For example, British Airways is somewhat well renowned for carrying an extensive medical kit for their long haul aircraft and they do indeed carry Valium
http://www.batraveltrade.com/health/.../during/Med_Kit_content_list05.pdf

Sedatives like diazepam (Valium) in the benzodiazepine class of medications are not without risk and there is a chance of hypotension (low blood pressure) and respiratory depression (slowing or stopping of breathing). In fact cases like this one do highlight in-flight deaths after a disruptive passenger gets a sedative:

http://www.bmj.com/content/318/7175/12.3.full

It's arguable if the sedative actually caused the death - some people could point to the similiarities with police involved "in custody death/restraint asphyxia/excited delerium" but most airlines are unwilling to take on the liabilities involved with carrying a sedative on board.

One medication that is routinely carried because it is FAA mandated - injectable diphenhydramine (Benadryl) - is used for allergic reactions but some physicians will note that the side effects (i.e. drowsiness...it is used as a sleep aid in some over the counter tablets) could be used as a last-ditch sedative for particularly combative patients. Certainly something only for the physician on board or on the ground in the MedLink center to consider.

I think it's best to keep airline security information sketchy - keep the bad guys guessing - but the truth is that airlines do have procedures in place to deal with disruptive passengers and it usually involves recruiting large abeled bodied passengers and a lot of grunting.

[Edited 2010-09-06 13:23:16]


Release your seat-belts and get out! Leave everything!
User currently offlineJER757 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 350 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 16311 times:

Quoting MarkHKG (Reply 3):
British Airways is somewhat well renowned for carrying an extensive medical kit

Some serious stuff in there, I am pretty certain that some qualified doctors would be uncomfortable prescribing some of these medications outside the controlled environment of a hospital.

Quoting mrskyguy (Reply 2):
MedLink center to consider.

If there is no physician on board, can MedLink authorise the crew to give such medications if they feel it is necessary? Again they would be taking huge risks prescribing these given that they are only getting second hand information radioed to them from the crew.

The video is certainly worrying, but assuming the passenger/patient in question remains 'under control' (i.e. effectively restrained), I believe the safest course of action would be to try and calm him using non pharmaceutical methods and getting the aircraft on the ground ASAP. Although that's easier said than done if you're half way over the pacific... As with any 'pre-hospital' medicine, there is a balance of risk when administering potentially dangerous medications to patients. Quite simply saying "just sedate him" wouldn't always cut it when considering the risks.



Gale force fog... don't you love it?
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4824 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 16212 times:

That's pretty freaky...
Feel sorry for the passenger's which had to deal with this passenger... I must say the gentleman seated beside him are pretty calm and collected...

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offline4holer From United States of America, joined Feb 2002, 2994 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 16102 times:

I know it makes me both an insensitive lout and an airliner geek, but my thought was: " I wonder if a tazer would interfere with the cockpit instruments"...
Not a bad question, actually.



Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
User currently offlineMarkHKG From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 960 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 16076 times:

Quoting JER757 (Reply 4):
I am pretty certain that some qualified doctors would be uncomfortable prescribing some of these medications outside the controlled environment of a hospital.

Indeed! I was pretty taken aback by the digoxin, nalbuphine and injectable penicillin when I first saw the list...

Quoting JER757 (Reply 4):
If there is no physician on board, can MedLink authorise the crew to give such medications if they feel it is necessary?

It's a good question but I can't really speak for any of the ground companies (i.e. Medlink, StatMD, Mayo) since ultimately you have the ground physician making the call. I have read SOPs for some carriers that will allow the F/A to give certain basic meds (i.e. aspirin, nitro) once approved by the ground doc but don't specifically talk about the injectables (i.e. Epi-Pen). Having said that, a remarkable number of F/As in the US have some sort of healthcare or public safety background so it's not unheard of having either a fellow passenger or cabin crewmember that is a nurse or paramedic, which would assist in providing accurate information to the ground and doing things like starting an IV, getting meds drawn up or watching for side effects.



Release your seat-belts and get out! Leave everything!
User currently offlineYXwatcherMKE From United States of America, joined May 2007, 963 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 16069 times:

I know that a person having a panic attack can be a handful and dangerous too. I know I worked as a EMT/Paramedic for a very long time and caring for this type of patient is difficult at best and if your not trained to care for one it is even worse but to be on an airplane at 35,000 feet over the mid-Atlantic is not easy. I know, I had to take care of such a situation while returning to ATL from JBL on SA. We were 8 hours away from the closest airport when a lady could no longer hold it inside of herself and the cabin crew was calling for a doctor on the intercom system. After the third call I answered the call telling the F/A that I was not a Doctor but a paramedic, she said thank God grabbed my hand and said come with me. I found a mid-40's woman having a full blown panic attack and knew for sure that the plane was shrinking and would soon fall out of the sky. Then on top of that she thought she was having a heart attack too. It took nearly two hours to get her to calm herself down even with loading her with medications. I was very impressed with the medical equipment and supply of medications that they had on-board the plane it was as well equipped as any paramedic unit or Emergency Department code cart would and then some. But, If I was not as well trained to handle the situation and have the knowledge of the construction an a/c to talked to the woman down it could have been a real bad scene and a very long flight for the other passengers.

[Edited 2010-09-06 18:31:33]


I miss the 60's & 70's when you felt like a guest on the plane not cattle like today
User currently offlineEK156 From United Arab Emirates, joined May 2005, 765 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 15412 times:

Can a Panic Attack warrant a diversion? And if so, is this classified as a medical emergency?

User currently offlineEmirates2005 From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 238 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 14964 times:

Quoting EK156 (Reply 9):
Can a Panic Attack warrant a diversion? And if so, is this classified as a medical emergency?

Most certainly. It all depends on the type of attack the passenger is going through. If it jeopardizes the safety of any of the passengers and/or the entire flight the pilot may choose to divert and seek medical help for the passenger.



A310, A332, B732, B738, B742, B743, B773, B77W, DC-10, ATR42, TU-134, TU-154, IL-62, MI-8, E190, A320, C172
User currently offlineDoona From Sweden, joined Feb 2005, 3764 posts, RR: 13
Reply 11, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 14868 times:

Quoting MarkHKG (Reply 3):
it usually involves recruiting large abeled bodied passengers and a lot of grunting.

Indeed. The gentlemen in this video look like they're doing a good job. Calm and collected, constantly trying to comfort this poor guy, while still keeping their hands on him to make sure he doesn't run off. Kudos to them.

Now, I've never had a real panic attack (I've had a couple anxiety attacks, sure, but they've manifested themselves as nausea, stomach pains and vertigo. Sorta goes along with my slightly introvert nature in these matters, I'd rather keep it all in and faint rather than make a sound...).

Still, I can't help but think that if I would ever experience what this poor man is going through, I'd prefer to have to decently sized Americans there to try to keep me calm.

As a side note, do airlines offer any form of compensation/reward/benefit to passengers who assist in these types of situations?

Cheers
Mats



Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.
User currently offlineMarkHKG From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 960 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 14698 times:

Quoting Doona (Reply 11):
As a side note, do airlines offer any form of compensation/reward/benefit to passengers who assist in these types of situations?

Depends on the carriers but usually only with medical assistance, not with dealing disruptive passengers. Some carriers may have a formal policy by giving the passenger a "mail in" card to get some extra mileage points, whereas others will provide no compensation. (Being a Good Samaritan, after all, is "volunteering" your services without compensation, per state Good Samaritan Laws).

However, even if no special compensation is given, cabin crewmembers are generally very thankful for the extra hand and may try to thank you in their own way...like handing you extra food or a beverage, sometimes on their own dime. I recall a rather interesting trip report that someone posted after helping move a passenger who had passed away on the flight, and it seems to me the cabin crew tried their best to thank the passenger .

NW LAX-MSP-LHR And Back - Inflight Mortality! (by LHRBFSTrident Apr 18 2008 in Trip Reports)



Release your seat-belts and get out! Leave everything!
User currently offlinenqyguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 13693 times:

Quoting 4holer (Reply 6):
" I wonder if a tazer would interfere with the cockpit instruments"...


Why? He's having a panic attack, and the passengers have him under control.. I should hope he isn't tazered just because he has a medical condition!


User currently offlineUshermittwoch From Germany, joined Jan 2004, 2963 posts, RR: 16
Reply 14, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 13436 times:

Ever since I had a severe neck injury stemming from a car accident, I have had instances where my neck muscles tense up and make me feel very uncomfortable.
This has, sadly, happen on two flights I have taken recently and I must say that the F/As knew right away that something wasn't right.

One flight was AMS-YYC and it started somewhere over Greenland. The F/A came to me to see what was wrong. I told her about my condition, at least the physical side, and she provided me with an ice bag, extra attention and was very comforting.

The second occasion was on a fligth from DUS to PRG on OK. And there the same thing happened and the F/A cleared the row, so I have room to lie down, gave me some water and even sat next to me to make me feel more comfortable, since she saw that I was clearly nervous.

This condition is really bothering me, not only because I have to fly a lot for a living but also because it ruins the whole flight experience which I love and have loved every since I was a little boy. I wish I would find a way to get this sorted out. I can deal with the pain but not the negative mental effects it has on me. So if anybody has any advice, I'd be very appreciative.  

But to say it once again, both F/As have been AMAZING. I was really surprised to how attentative they were and what good peripheral vision they had for a passenger in distress.



Where have all the tri-jets gone...
User currently offlineAT From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 992 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 11078 times:

While I understand that the original poster's intent was to educate, not to ridicule, and I also think that anything happening in an aircraft cabin is fair game for youtube, I still think it is disrespectful to the passenger to post such a video online. It would be different if the guy was misbehaving, but I am not sure he would appreciate his panic attack being broadcast online for all to see, as I am would the rest of us. An alternative would be to post it with a black box over his face so that no identifying information is visible.

But it seems the incident was well handled overall. I hope they made him lie down to relax.


User currently offlineacmeaviator From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 2 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 10615 times:

I have Panic Disorder and can tell you from experience that what this man is going through is as close to a living h@ll that there is. I have only suffered a few extreme panic attacks - and all I can say is that I was literally out of my mind. Those who speak of using tasers are idiots - you are already dealing with someone whose body has dumped every bit of its epinephrine and adrenaline into its bloodstream and whose mind is convinced that each breath is its last. Sedatives are a good idea, but in my experience they are useless until the bodies own hormones are flushed down to "normal" levels. Kudos to those who came to this mans aid - I hope he is able to overcome this incident and continue his life.

User currently offlineNumero4 From Canada, joined Feb 2010, 260 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 8896 times:

Quoting acmeaviator (Reply 16):
I have Panic Disorder and can tell you from experience that what this man is going through is as close to a living h@ll that there is. I have only suffered a few extreme panic attacks - and all I can say is that I was literally out of my mind.

I have anxiety attacks once in a while and have had a few full-blown panic attacks in the past. I can relate to what you're living. It is hell on earth: being certain you're having a heart attack, knowing (not believing... KNOWING) you're going to die in the next few minutes... not fun at all.

Quoting EK156 (Reply 9):
Can a Panic Attack warrant a diversion? And if so, is this classified as a medical emergency?

As it is considered a recognized health condition, I certainly hope the flight crews know it is a medical condition that needs immediate attention. The person experiencing a panic attack believes his life is in great danger, and sometimes assume they have nothing to lose. We all know how someone with nothing to lose can be dangerous: adrenaline makes you much stronger/dangerous than you normally are.

I haven't read all of the replies above, but I am reassured that a lot of people realize you can't just "calm down" when having an anxiety or worse a panic attack.

On a side note, I was traveling with my family on American Airlines a few years back and a passenger was having a very serious allergic reaction. As my father is an ER doctor, he responded to the PA call for a doctor on board. He told me their medical kit was quite complete and I remember him mentioning they had a few Ativan tablets (Lorazepam, a benzodiazepine as mentioned earlier).



CYQB
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7687 posts, RR: 21
Reply 18, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 8270 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
I apologize if this video has been posted before

Well, you said it. Posted ages ago, and the status of the video on youtube should tell you that - it's not like it was posted last week.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7384 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 7908 times:

At one level, Panic Attacks are a form of the Self Defence mechanism which has kept the species going for the last millenia.

I have no reservations about saying that I get nervous on planes, clearly this man's experience goes well beyond that.

IMO the suggestion about Tazering is daft and could easily create bigger issues.

I am unsure that would have happened if he had become aware that he was being filmed.


User currently offlinedeltadart106 From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 32 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 7305 times:

Am i the only one who thinks that maybe putting that video online wasn't the best idea? I'm sure if I was the man in the video, i wouldn't want it to be on YouTube for literally anyone to see. the only exception I can see is if the guy filming asked the guy who panicked if it was ok, but who would ever agree to that? I'm sure that man would be angry if he ever finds this video...

[Edited 2010-09-07 12:53:47]

Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
The Coming U.S Airline Crashes. YT Video posted Wed Jul 4 2007 04:24:19 by Ebs757
Is Crystal Airways A Real Airline Or Not? posted Mon Sep 17 2001 13:15:07 by Air Orange
ATW: A Real Airline? posted Sat Jun 23 2001 06:29:49 by Flyin' Guppy
GA Aircraft With Real World Airline Schemes? posted Tue Jan 5 2010 08:33:47 by Mirrodie
Amazing Video. The A300 Was/is A Real Tank! posted Sat Dec 19 2009 08:55:52 by EA772LR
Airline Names In Movies-fictional Or Real? posted Thu Dec 10 2009 06:07:13 by C5LOAD
The Real Value Of Airline Websites posted Sat Aug 8 2009 21:26:44 by Cush
Airline Disaster Movies On IFE (Video) posted Thu Dec 4 2008 17:24:26 by Gulfstream650
Real Life Airline Simulator posted Wed Jun 4 2008 09:53:41 by MetJetCEO
Short Video Of North America's #1 Airline AC posted Mon Apr 7 2008 00:35:02 by Aircanada014
ATW: A Real Airline? posted Sat Jun 23 2001 06:29:49 by Flyin' Guppy
A Virtual Airline, A Real Crash posted Fri Feb 7 2014 07:03:56 by max999
Hellas Airlines - Is This A Real Startup Airline? posted Thu Nov 1 2012 11:11:18 by gilesdavies
Is This Real? Helicopter Crash Video posted Mon Oct 29 2012 03:01:07 by AF1624
Video Of FA Playing In Cockpit: Which Airline? posted Fri Jun 1 2012 15:31:04 by questions
GA Aircraft With Real World Airline Schemes? posted Tue Jan 5 2010 08:33:47 by Mirrodie