jetMARC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 571 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 25388 times:
It's obvious the plane was going to be towed into the gate. Probably wasn't connected to the tow bar properly or it failed and when the pilots released the brakes, the plane simply rolled into the tug. The pilots probably can't see it since they ramper had to walk way out infront to signal the pilots from the ground with his wands. Don't forget, the plane weighs several more tons than the tug that can handle a hard landing when the plane noseovers on touchdown.
"Sucka, I'm gonna send you out on Knuckle Airlines. Fist Class!!" ~ Mr. T
pictues From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 246 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 25138 times:
i doubt the plane was shut off since you see one ramper did run up to put the signal to stop and once he stopped and walked forward again the plane moved forward, i believe the engines weere running or the tug would have stopped the plane, also the tug's brakes would have been off and the transmission in nutral at the time or i believe the nose wheel would in fact have collapsed. since there is no sound as it was a security camera we don't know for sure but i don't see the blades of the engines which at that angle you should tell if they were stopped and engines shut down.
ps that being said I could very well be wrong of course, I wasn't there. But i also don't see anyone on the headset either which is SOP where I work when you have to tow a plane in for whatever reason.
JETnyc From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 116 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 24042 times:
If you look very close all of the engines are still on by looking at the swirl just inside the cowling. Also one of the rampers moved forward of the aircraft making motions for some one to make a move .
catiii From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 3485 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 23860 times:
I fly in and out of JFK a fair bit (admittedly though LGA is my home airport), but that doesn't look like a gate where a tow in is required. I could be wrong though. It would be interesting to see what happened.
dwcontroller From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 23741 times:
Don't want to make a huge assumption but i'm going to say pilot error here, that or who ever was in the cockpit. Doesn't delta use a repositioning crew in JFK to bring the planes from the parking pad south of Terminal 4? They may have thought the brakes were set while waiting to be towed in...when they simply weren't.
Best phrase to hear at the airport - "All standbys have been cleared and may board at this time"
mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 11386 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 23742 times:
Obviously, the interphone wasn't working between the ground and cockpit. The ramper made the signal, I believe, that the bypass pin had been insterted in the nose gear, thereby, bypassing hydraulics and steering from the nose gear. I can't for the life of me figure out why the cockpit crew would have decided to pull forward, as they knew they were going to be towed. At this stage, everything was in the hands of the ramp crew and the flight crew would just sit there until they'd been towed in.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
burnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7750 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 22979 times:
Seems to me there was mis-communication with the ramper that was supposidly signalling something. If the crew were to be towed in the engines would have been shutdown prior to this, also notice how the tow bar was not connected to the tug and was pulled out of the way it seems by the ramper or something over to the side as it was not connected to neither the tug or the aircraft. I also noticed that the ramper that was on the ground signalling something, without wands just walked away, at JFK they have the auto park systems so something was right, because its quite evident that the ground crew was not plugged into the plane and something more was going on here because if they knew they were getting pulled in the engines would have been shut down or certainly not at the point that would cause the aircraft to jump forward like that.
"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
washingtonian From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 22571 times:
Quoting catiii (Reply 13): I fly in and out of JFK a fair bit (admittedly though LGA is my home airport), but that doesn't look like a gate where a tow in is required. I could be wrong though. It would be interesting to see what happened.
It looks to me like it was a gate that required it. If I recall, when Delta operated 777s to JFK this was the same gate they used.
Does anyone know if the old Pan Am gate indicator lights are still in use?
0NEWAIR0 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 939 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 22295 times:
You can definitely see engines 1 and 2 spinning in the video, 3 is questionable.
Anywho, someone in the cockpit should ALWAYS know what is happening on the ground.... if they did know what was going on, they wouldn't have rammed the tug. Also, they're very lucky one of the 3 rampers didn't get seriously injured.
"The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams."
Spunker From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 34 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 22152 times:
Looks like the ramper way in front of the 744 is at fault. When he brought his arms/hands back down I'll bet the pilot thought all was secure and they were all hooked up so he released the brakes. The tow bar wasn't even attached when the 744 started to roll. Boeing builds em' tough.