Quote: Despite lower fares, passengers consistently rank discount airlines higher in quality and service than better-known traditional carriers, a USA TODAY analysis of government and consumer survey data since 2004 shows.
The analysis — of Transportation Department consumer complaints, the Airline Quality Rating system of professors at Wichita State and Purdue universities, and consumer surveys of Zagat Survey and J.D. Power and Associates — finds that discounters JetBlue, Southwest and Frontier rate among the top airlines.
Of course, a lot of things have happened since 2004. We then get to the meat of the issue for the legacies: they're obviously trying to improve their image, but how long will it take them? I don't hold the legacies that much lower than the others, but I've always been sort of an oddball.
By the way, kudos to F9...there's nothing better than a plane that smells like cookies!
ikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21041 posts, RR: 60 Reply 1, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 5162 times:
A lot has happened, as you say. This includes B6 rarely having the lowest fare...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
flyerboy1990 From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 172 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 5093 times:
B6 really does seem to be an great carrier. Too bad they are not in Ohio as I would love to try them out. Maybe sometime in the future?
Anyway, I remember when they started up and hearing how they have TVs for EVERY seat! I thought it was the best thing since sliced bread. Also, their blue chips were unique along with the overall good service.
EricR From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 1498 posts, RR: 1 Reply 4, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 5086 times:
From customer service standpoint only, the results are no different in the airline industry as in many other industries. Based on customer service, large organizations / companies generally rank lower. However, larger companies generally offer more services that attract more customers.
IMO, one has to look at this data and compare the larger carriers against the larger carriers and smaller carriers against the smaller carriers.
What I find impressive is that WN ranks very high and has a very large network. If B6's network was as large as WN's network, would they still be ranked #1? IMO , I do not think they would.
loggat From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 660 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 4901 times:
This is weird because I just got a company email that said we were (F9) 18/18 (read: dead last) in customer complaints per the DOT at 28/100,000 enplanements. This is either for a completely different time period or someone messed up their analysis.
There are 3 types of people in this world, those that can count, and those that can't.
StuckInCA From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1785 posts, RR: 1 Reply 6, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 4885 times:
Was Virgin America included in the survey? I've flown lots of Southwest, Alaska, Jetblue and Virgin America this year. VX is far and away the best given their far superior IFE and essentially pristine aircraft. Jetblue is about even with Alaska, maybe a shade above. Southwest is next... IFE would help. I'll add that Delta did me no wrong this year.
mastyc From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 144 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 4730 times:
Quoting loggat (Reply 5): This is weird because I just got a company email that said we were (F9) 18/18 (read: dead last) in customer complaints per the DOT at 28/100,000 enplanements. This is either for a completely different time period or someone messed up their analysis.
Maverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 4779 posts, RR: 6 Reply 8, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4578 times:
This report, like 99% of USA Today's aviation reports, is complete and utter rubbish. They're using data from 2005 (before the DL/NW and US/HP mergers, the latter not even acknowledged in the rankings board) to once again slam the legacies and pet their darling JetBlue on the back.
Take a look at this year's Air Travel Consumer Reports. Both UA and US either tied or beat out WN and B6 for on-time performance and missed bags almost every month.
spacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3277 posts, RR: 14 Reply 10, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 4012 times:
Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 8): Both UA and US either tied or beat out WN and B6 for on-time performance and missed bags almost every month.
Neither of which is a reason why I would fly one airline over another, nor I suspect would most others. These are things that I think most people would chalk up to chance or blame the airport or other factors for. I haven't had a lost bag in many years, so even if one airline is a bit better than another, I'm still going to consider it a pretty negligible thing. As far as delays, they're rarely in the control of the airline.
I'll say that I just flew JFK-PDX and my choice basically came down to US vs. B6. I ended up paying more for B6 because here was the choice:
US: Fly out at a reasonable hour, but make one stop, a total 10 hour flight, 31" seat pitch, no seatback IFE
B6: Fly out very late, but it's non-stop, 5-6 hours total, 34" seat pitch minimum, DirecTV at my seat
It was a no-brainer for me just for the non-stop flight and the seat pitch. I might have chosen to save a little money and done without the DirecTV on US, but I'm 6'4" and I cannot do 31" seat pitch for 10 hours. And JetBlue gave me no reason to regret my decision.
I think B6 is still pretty unique in that they've figured out what they can cut and what they can't in order to give people the experience they want (and will pay for). Don't cut legroom. Don't cut IFE. Don't cut snacks and drinks. Fly non-stop to the destinations people want. In other words, don't cut anything that's part of the actual experience of flying.
I'll drag my own checked bag onto the belt for them, I'll pay $6 for a meal if I want it (though their "meals" honestly were a disappointment), I'll even pay extra for feature movies (or just not watch them). But there are certain things I *have to* have, and JetBlue seems to have figured out what all of those things are for a large number of people (not just me) and actually enhanced them. I even paid $50 for one of their "more legroom" seats on the way back and I kept thinking "this is what I've been asking for all along!" Basically a first-class seat pitch without any of the other junk that I don't feel like paying for. All I want is legroom, good IFE and to not go hungry. That's what B6 is good at.
Also, their f/a's are pretty nice, Steven Slater notwithstanding.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
Maverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 4779 posts, RR: 6 Reply 11, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3961 times:
Quoting spacecadet (Reply 10): Neither of which is a reason why I would fly one airline over another
Of course, and let me clarify that's not necessarily the point I was trying to make. Everyone has their preferences and needs, and everyone has their own experiences.
But the article wasn't using anecdotal stories about service or quality: they were using government-supplied data and consumer reports to rank the airlines.
Even if nearly every single consumer report put B6 and WN ahead of the legacies in rankings (which not all of them do), the fact that the ATCR ranks two legacies either equal to or superior to them over the past year should at least put those legacies in the middle of the pack, not dead last as they have done.
You would be incorrect. In nearly every single survey ever done, the #1 factor most people use when deciding flights is price. Frankly, most people simply can't afford to be picky about what kind of IFE or legroom they can get.
Elevated From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 288 posts, RR: 1 Reply 12, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3872 times:
Quoting StuckInCA (Reply 6): Was Virgin America included in the survey? I've flown lots of Southwest, Alaska, Jetblue and Virgin America this year. VX is far and away the best given their far superior IFE and essentially pristine aircraft. Jetblue is about even with Alaska, maybe a shade above. Southwest is next... IFE would help. I'll add that Delta
did me no wrong this year.
asteriskceo From United States of America, joined May 2004, 412 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days ago) and read 3271 times:
Quoting StuckInCA (Reply 6): Was Virgin America included in the survey? I've flown lots of Southwest, Alaska, Jetblue and Virgin America this year. VX is far and away the best given their far superior IFE and essentially pristine aircraft. Jetblue is about even with Alaska, maybe a shade above. Southwest is next... IFE would help. I'll add that Delta did me no wrong this year.
Couldn't agree more.
And what is with B6 winning best cabin ambiance? To be honest, I think their cabin is pretty dull and unappealing. Was VX even considered for this APEX award?
Maverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 4779 posts, RR: 6 Reply 14, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 3096 times:
Quoting StuckInCA (Reply 6): Was Virgin America included in the survey?
To classify them as "mid-size" is stretching it. Only 30 airplanes and only 3 out of 15 destinations don't touch the Atlantic or Pacific. That eliminates them as a choice for the vast majority of travelers.
spacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3277 posts, RR: 14 Reply 15, posted (2 years 9 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2746 times:
Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 11): You would be incorrect. In nearly every single survey ever done, the #1 factor most people use when deciding flights is price.
Huh? How does that make me incorrect?
You said US and UA beat B6 for on-time performance and not losing bags. I basically said "who cares?" I wasn't replying to anything about price.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
flyingcat From United States of America, joined May 2007, 510 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (2 years 9 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 2670 times:
I never give these survey too much credence as the survey pool can be easily skewed. Chose a route were LCCs like VX and B6 run and they are a close call. Pick a legacy route and DL has been stepping up the game with CO catching up.
Many of these awards are given solely due to the fact that an airline has bent over backwards and given free tickets and upgrades to key people essentially buying awards.
Everyone has their favorite as I'm sure someone out there is an NK superfan.
Maverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 4779 posts, RR: 6 Reply 18, posted (2 years 9 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2629 times:
I'm sorry, I misread your post. Disregard it, I agree with you!
Quoting flyingcat (Reply 16):
Everyone has their favorite as I'm sure someone out there is an NK superfan.
There was a poster on here not too long ago that tried claiming NK was the best and most profitable airline. I can understand having a personal favorite, but it was pretty bad.
ah414211 From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 207 posts, RR: 0 Reply 19, posted (2 years 9 months 4 days ago) and read 2386 times:
Quoting StuckInCA (Reply 6): VX is far and away the best given their far superior IFE
This pretty much confirms my suspicions....I've long thought that all you have to do is throw a TV in the seat back and people don't care about anything else that happens. Having flown over 900 flights on US Air carriers I can easily say that the worst customer service I have ever had was on jetBlue, so I am continually amazed how they rate so highly in these surveys....Guess the key is the IFE. I will say that inflight jetBlue has been a good experience, but on the ground, customer service has been absolutely terrible!
StuckInCA From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1785 posts, RR: 1 Reply 20, posted (2 years 9 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2299 times:
Quoting ah414211 (Reply 19): This pretty much confirms my suspicions....I've long thought that all you have to do is throw a TV in the seat back and people don't care about anything else that happens
That's almost fair based on what I wrote, but not exactly what I meant to communicate. I was really just being short. VX has had great customer service for me. Great website, great service on board. Friendlier than B6, AS, DL.
I just don't have the energy to type much more. I think it's fair to say this if most things are even then great IFE is a nice perk. It's not enough to make up for lackluster service or some other negative, but other than a rather sparse route map, VX doesn't seem to haven any negatives right now (for me).
I'll add to that that on the west coast, B6 doesn't exactly have an impressive route map either
tharanga From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1792 posts, RR: 1 Reply 21, posted (2 years 9 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2269 times:
Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 18): There was a poster on here not too long ago that tried claiming NK was the best and most profitable airline. I can understand having a personal favorite, but it was pretty bad.
Best.. I can't imagine ever flying it.
But it is, or has been, most profitable, has it not?
Maverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 4779 posts, RR: 6 Reply 22, posted (2 years 9 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2199 times:
Quoting ah414211 (Reply 19): Having flown over 900 flights on US Air carriers I can easily say that the worst customer service I have ever had was on jetBlue
A completely subjective opinion, which is why I don't really care for the DOT officially monitoring customer complaints. The largest spread I've seen is somewhere around 40 complaints.... and that could be due to just one flight. Most times it's within 10 complaints.
But I digress: The one time I flew on B6, it was the same experience I got from US, FL, and CO (the airlines I've flown recently). The only difference was the TV screen, and that really had nothing to do with how I was treated customer service wise.
Quoting tharanga (Reply 21):
But it is, or has been, most profitable, has it not?
No. Even when every single legacy was bleeding money, NK was still behind WN, AS, and FL in profits. One could argue plane-for-plane they were more profitable, but that's not a fair comparison.
tharanga From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1792 posts, RR: 1 Reply 23, posted (2 years 9 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2193 times:
Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 22): No. Even when every single legacy was bleeding money, NK was still behind WN, AS, and FL in profits. One could argue plane-for-plane they were more profitable, but that's not a fair comparison.
The best way of doing it is to compare profit margins, profit/revenue. I'm not sure whether you are doing that, or not.
rameshksm From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 81 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (2 years 9 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2178 times:
Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 22): The one time I flew on B6, it was the same experience I got from US, FL, and CO
You could say that again. I have found that if you set aside a sense of entitlement, customer service actually seems to be fairly decent. Sometimes, it even transpires that the reps go out of their way to be helpful.
USAirways787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 290 posts, RR: 1 Reply 25, posted (2 years 9 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1888 times:
I am extremely surprised that even we at FL were left out of the survey, considering our load factor was 88%. Anyone know why?
US
"Pre departure walk around complete, all doors closed, ready for pushback"
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