Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Air France 447 Crash - New Investigation By Nova  
User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3287 posts, RR: 6
Posted (4 years 3 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 28043 times:

"On June 1, 2009, Flight AF447, an Air France Airbus A330 flying from Rio de Janeiro to Paris, disappeared over the Atlantic Ocean with the loss of all 228 lives. How could a state-of-the-art airliner with elaborate electronic safety and navigation features and a faultless safety record simply fall out of the sky? NOVA assembles a team of seasoned pilots, engineers, and safety experts to examine the evidence that emerged in the weeks following this horrific disaster. What led Flight 447's crew to fly straight into a towering thunderstorm? With expert testimony, satellite weather images, and messages transmitted by the doomed plane's computer system, NOVA pieces together the fatal chain of events..."

This PBS (U.S. Public Broadcasting Service) investigative program will initially air it's finding on October 26, 2010. A preview of the program is available online at: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/crash-flight-447.html


"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinespacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3667 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (4 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 27846 times:

Tangentially related, but judging by the preview I would be very surprised if that episode was not produced by a lot of the same people behind National Geographic's "Seconds from Disaster", which all but disappeared a year or so ago (they still show repeats, but no longer promote the show or seem to be filming new ones). The style is exactly the same, down to the narration, narrator, editing and look of the show. (I imagine all that'll be missing is the trademark countdown to "seconds from disaster".)

If that's the case, then it should be pretty interesting... though I doubt it'll tell anybody here anything they didn't already know. I used to watch Seconds from Disaster just because of the interviews with real people involved and also because they always presented a nicely cohesive summary of what happened. Of course in this case, some of that will be based on speculation, but it'll at least be informed speculation and I think we know from the official reports at least a basic rundown of events.



I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
User currently offlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8625 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (4 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 27787 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

The link won't allow me to look at the preview due to 'rights restrictions' , but the still picture in the link looks very similar to the opening moments of this documentary from several months ago

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERHttqikXBU

I am wondering if it is the same documentary just changed to have an American narrator rather than a British one ? or is it genuinely a new documentary ?



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlinefca767 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2006, 1786 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 25358 times:

Quoting spacecadet (Reply 1):
Tangentially related, but judging by the preview I would be very surprised if that episode was not produced by a lot of the same people behind National Geographic's "Seconds from Disaster", which all but disappeared a year or so ago (they still show repeats, but no longer promote the show or seem to be filming new ones). The style is exactly the same, down to the narration, narrator, editing and look of the show. (I imagine all that'll be missing is the trademark countdown to "seconds from disaster".)

I really hope it's not the same as these "Air Crash Investigations" Programs...They make me feel actually sick just watching them.

They Sensationalise every pilots action, they don't use a real cockpit sim, just alot of things, the words and descriptions of what is happening. Compared to the real NTSB Reports etc. I just really dont like the way they show it...


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13195 posts, RR: 15
Reply 4, posted (4 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 24877 times:

This is one of the most mysterous air crashes in modern history and worthy of a serious program that makes reasoned speculation as to what happened. Yes, sometimes these programs can be somewhat senationalized, but in the end they provide important and desirable attention to try to help figure out what went wrong to reduce the risks of another loss of an a/c under similar circumstances.

User currently offlineNumero4 From Canada, joined Feb 2010, 260 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 21851 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 4):
This is one of the most mysterous air crashes in modern history

Definitely. I can't think of anything that comes close in terms of mysteriousness.

I am with spacecadet on this one. If it is presented with the same format as "Seconds from Disaster", then I'm looking forward to it.



CYQB
User currently offlineasteriskceo From United States of America, joined May 2004, 489 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 21287 times:

Quoting fca767 (Reply 3):
I really hope it's not the same as these "Air Crash Investigations" Programs...They make me feel actually sick just watching them.

They Sensationalise every pilots action, they don't use a real cockpit sim, just alot of things, the words and descriptions of what is happening. Compared to the real NTSB Reports etc. I just really dont like the way they show it...

I highly disagree. I don't care for "Seconds From Disaster" because it dumbs down the events for a more general audience. But I find "Air Crash Investigation"/"Mayday" to be very fair and realistic.


User currently offlinebravogolf From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 21085 times:

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 2):
I am wondering if it is the same documentary just changed to have an American narrator rather than a British one ? or is it genuinely a new documentary ?

Nova in the US, is as you stated, a repeat if the Britsh show Horizon.


User currently offlinepylon101 From Russia, joined Feb 2008, 1609 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 20360 times:

So "Seconds From Disaster" was abandonded by National Geographic?
Now I understand why "Discovery" uses those good documentaries and parts of them.
Why did they do so?
They sold the idea to another cable?
Quite a disappointing news.


User currently offlineasteriskceo From United States of America, joined May 2004, 489 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 17880 times:

So this is just the Horizon episode ported over to Nova?

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 8):

Not sure why. I thought the show did quite well in the ratings. Though I never understood why anyone would think having a narrator scream at you for nearly an hour would be fun..


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13195 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 16683 times:

I would note that some programs of the USA's PBS network, of which Nova series programs are presented by, are often co-produced by PBS and BBC or other European sources. PBS then get exclusive rights to show the programs first in the USA and gives enough fo the needed investment and technical input to create such programs to the desirable qualities.

User currently offlinePlainplane From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 849 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 16571 times:

Seconds From Disaster and Air Emergency are a couple of my favorite documentary series, and immediately I could recognize the narrator's voice and a couple catch phrases from Seconds.

In fact, Seconds From Disaster was produced by Darlow Smithson Productions, and according to the production credits on the PBS NOVA link, it is the very same company who is producing this documentary too.

A side note, one thing I've noticed is that even though new Air Crash Investigation/Air Emergency episodes are still being produced, National Geographic Channel doesn't air them at all in the US. I have not seen one episode from seasons 6 and 7 on TV, I've had to find them on YouTube to watch them.

EDIT: Official link for the AF447 show on Darlow Smithson Productions' website:
http://www.darlowsmithson.com/Productions/Videos/2010/Air%20France.aspx

They're also working on a new 90 minute Concorde show by the looks of it.

[Edited 2010-09-19 11:36:33]

User currently offlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8625 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 16354 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting bravogolf (Reply 7):
Nova in the US, is as you stated, a repeat if the Britsh show Horizon.

If it is the same one then I have to say that I found it very interesting , well thought out and not at all sensationalist , the demonstration of super-cooled liquid water was absolutely amazing . I very much like the fact that they built their case for what may have happened , but still at the end emphasised that although what they proposed fit all the known facts they acknowledged that without the recorders it still remains a theory . There did not seem to be any ridiculous claims to "know" what happened , and when they showed crew scenes in the cockpit they did not make up dialogue , the only actual talking in those scenes was from the ATC recordings , everything else was silent with a narration explaining what they thought may have happened rather than putting words into their mouths .



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlinepylon101 From Russia, joined Feb 2008, 1609 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 15908 times:

Let's try to figure if NatGeo air those documentaries outside US.
On Monday - tomorrow - they will give us (here in Russia, and in Europe) highly advertised "Air Crash Investigation: Pilot or Airplane?"
It's about A-320 AF crash many years ago. Or at least that visual stuff was given in ads.
Have anybody watched this on other cable/sat channels?


User currently offlinefca767 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2006, 1786 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 15461 times:

Quoting asteriskceo (Reply 6):
I highly disagree. I don't care for "Seconds From Disaster" because it dumbs down the events for a more general audience. But I find "Air Crash Investigation"/"Mayday" to be very fair and realistic.

I'm not sure which one it is that I didn't like but there is one...I am not able to view this video so it is possibly a really good production team.


User currently offlinespacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3667 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 12760 times:

Quoting Plainplane (Reply 11):
In fact, Seconds From Disaster was produced by Darlow Smithson Productions, and according to the production credits on the PBS NOVA link, it is the very same company who is producing this documentary too.

A-ha - thanks for confirming.

Quoting asteriskceo (Reply 6):
I don't care for "Seconds From Disaster" because it dumbs down the events for a more general audience. But I find "Air Crash Investigation"/"Mayday" to be very fair and realistic.

I actually don't think either one of them really dumbs things down, although Seconds from Disaster can sound a little dramatic at times (a combination of the writing for the narration and the narrator himself, which is the same guy that does all the theatrical movie previews in the US these days). But I think there's a difference between that and "dumbing down". For example, this was not an aviation episode (not many of them are) but when they did the German ICE crash, they went into some pretty specific detail about how the "tire" on the wheel came off and how the defect was missed during inspections. Then they talked about all the new inspection methods that have been instituted since that accident. I mean, railroad wheel inspection methods are not generally a subject for a "mass audience", but they spent about 5 minutes out of an hour-long show talking about it.

Also, like I said they always get a lot of the original people involved to tell their stories, and often it's the only time I get to see that.

"Air Crash Investigation", which is called "Air Emergency" in the US, is no better or worse overall I think, but sometimes the actors who play the pilots go way over the top. (Not always, though; the Alaska 161 actors were really good, for one example.) And I usually like that they use the actual CVR transcripts for the dialogue, although this can sometimes make things sound pretty stilted and weird if it's a translated CVR, because they'll use the official translation that usually hasn't been cleaned up to sound natural. (They're only concerned about the technical terms and tone of voice.)

Also I don't like the newer narrator on "Air Emergency", who puts me to sleep. The guy they had originally was better. "Air Crash Investigation" has its own narrator; they re-record for the US audience (or vice versa... or maybe they do both versions simultaneously).

Anyway, I'm looking forward to this NOVA episode now that I know it really is basically what I thought it was, which is a new "Seconds from Disaster".



I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
User currently offlineokie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 3188 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 12482 times:

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 13):
On Monday - tomorrow - they will give us (here in Russia, and in Europe) highly advertised "Air Crash Investigation: Pilot or Airplane?"
It's about A-320 AF crash many years ago. Or at least that visual stuff was given in ads.
Have anybody watched this on other cable/sat channels


Sounds like a rehash of some old footage: I think the catch line was "pilot or computer" Still always a good watch.

Quoting Plainplane (Reply 11):
They're also working on a new 90 minute Concorde show by the looks of it.


Probably to coincide with the "official rulings" of the French court system due in November I believe.

Quoting Plainplane (Reply 11):
A side note, one thing I've noticed is that even though new Air Crash Investigation/Air Emergency episodes are still being produced, National Geographic Channel doesn't air them at all in the US. I have not seen one episode from seasons 6 and 7 on TV, I've had to find them on YouTube to watch them


Geez, the way PBS, Discovery, History, Nat Geo keep repackaging programs you end up seeing a lot of the same stuff with different names to fill up cable time with all the channels these days.

The Air New Zealand A-320 acceptance flight that crashed into the sea accident report was released this week.
Short version: 2 of the AOA sensors had water pushed past the seals with high pressure washer cleaning the aircraft. The water froze inside the AOA sensors during the flight. The 2 bad AOA sensors frozen in one position out voted the one good one as being faulty. The plane crashed doing acceptance maneuvers to test the viability of the aircraft passing back to Air New Zealand from XL Germany.

Okie


User currently offlinealwaysontherun From Netherlands Antilles, joined Jan 2010, 464 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 11969 times:

I have posted this a few times but I think both web pages are great and both persons can do with the support from more enthusiasts making use of their great sites:

For free downloads of Air crash Investigations (Seconds from Disasters) and other type of documentaries……..

http://aci.110mb.com/
Rumour from Cineflix: 27 new episodes will be aired!!


An incredible database of plane crashes:

http://www.planecrashinfo.com/

Cheers,

###"I´m always on the Run"###



"Failure is not an option, it comes standard in any Windows product" - an anonymous MAC owner.
User currently offlinesoon7x7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 10690 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 4):
This is one of the most mysterous air crashes in modern history and worthy of a serious program that makes reasoned speculation as to what happened. Yes, sometimes these programs can be somewhat senationalized, but in the end they provide important and desirable attention to try to help figure out what went wrong to reduce the risks of another loss of an a/c under similar circumstances.

I agree...the A332 is now a widely utilized contemporary airframe, along with all its complexities...should be understood,...while the #447 may have been an isolated incident...it was a most unusual one at that and in the absence of causes and answers...the potential for a repeat event does exist.


User currently offlineTheCol From Canada, joined Jan 2007, 2039 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 10044 times:

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 13):
Have anybody watched this on other cable/sat channels?

"Mayday" is the original name. It's a popular Canadian show that has been re-produced in the US, Europe, and Australia. The original episodes are very well done, and many airlines incorporate them into their training material. From what I've seen of the re-produced versions, it looks like they've been re-cut and sensationalized.

Quoting fca767 (Reply 3):

Try watching the original episodes. I personally think their really well done.



No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
User currently offlinehamster From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 203 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (4 years 3 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 9797 times:

Were the wings near the the nose or tail? If not, perhaps they snapped off due to rough weather. Though these planes were tougher than that.

User currently offlinespacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3667 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (4 years 3 months 21 hours ago) and read 8544 times:

Quoting hamster (Reply 20):
Were the wings near the the nose or tail? If not, perhaps they snapped off due to rough weather.

The airplane crashed in one piece.



I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3287 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (4 years 2 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 7721 times:

Quoting hamster (Reply 20):
Were the wings near the the nose or tail? If not, perhaps they snapped off due to rough weather. Though these planes were tougher than that.

The prevalent theory is that the a/c stalled, and basically belly flopped into the Atlantic (with a force of 36 times the force of gravity) after the examination of the debris and victim's bodies



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Air France Toronto Crash-National Geographic Video posted Sat Apr 28 2007 22:02:40 by LHStarAlliance
Air France Concorde Crash Documentary posted Sat Jan 13 2007 03:38:23 by DeC
All Systems Ok On Air France A340 Crash posted Wed Nov 16 2005 18:56:38 by WINGS
Air France To Accept First A380 By October 2007 posted Sat Jul 23 2005 19:36:18 by Udo
Delta And Air France Working For A New First Class posted Tue Oct 24 2000 00:21:27 by L'espace18
Air France Launches Its New Inflight Product. posted Tue Oct 17 2000 15:24:19 by AF-A319
Is There Still An Air France Concorde In New York? posted Wed Aug 16 2000 22:04:39 by G-BEAK
Air France/FBW Crash (1988?) posted Tue Jan 25 2000 19:34:00 by Steve23
Will Air France-owned Commuters Get New Colours? posted Tue Mar 23 2010 03:44:20 by mozart
The Last Four Minutes Of Air France Flight 447 # 2 posted Sun Mar 14 2010 21:31:46 by SA7700
Air France B777 With New Livery posted Thu Mar 26 2009 17:59:05 by AeroplaneFreak
Air France Toronto Crash-National Geographic Video posted Sat Apr 28 2007 22:02:40 by LHStarAlliance
Air France Concorde Crash Documentary posted Sat Jan 13 2007 03:38:23 by DeC
All Systems Ok On Air France A340 Crash posted Wed Nov 16 2005 18:56:38 by WINGS
Air France To Accept First A380 By October 2007 posted Sat Jul 23 2005 19:36:18 by Udo
Delta And Air France Working For A New First Class posted Tue Oct 24 2000 00:21:27 by L'espace18