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Flybe Pursuing Purchases & European Expansion  
User currently onlinebmibaby737 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1803 posts, RR: 9
Posted (3 years 11 months 2 days ago) and read 8811 times:

Flybe Pursuing Purchases for next phase of growth

Well it sounds like Flybe is heading into yet another exciting chapter as the UK’s biggest domestic carrier said it’s in talks over two more purchases.

The successful airline took over BA Connect from British Airways PLC in 2007, which helped it double its passenger totals and add 50 routes to its network. According to the airline, these latest acquisitions being considered are “digestible” rather than “transformational”.

“We’ve got two projects running with regard to acquisitions,” Jim French said, without disclosing a likely value for the transactions. “We’re looking for regional purchases. I’d describe them as bridgeheads into Europe. We see the next phase of development for Flybe very much to be in continental Europe.”

While purchasing BA Connect made Flybe Europe’s largest regional carrier by passenger numbers, all of the airlines routes currently are to or from the UK, or entirely domestic. The next phase of its expansion will see the airline establishing bases overseas, at which it shall build networks.

So with Flybe’s recent Air France codesharing agreements and its success and recent focus on France, could Airlinair be a target for the Exeter based airline? Rumours are circulating of a Cityjet takeover, but with the VLM integration having only just taken place, and its own large focus on the UK could it be that much of a gain, particularly with its strong foothold at London City Airport?

Further regional airlines of Europe include Air Nostrum, Brit Air, Finncomm Airlines, Portugalia and FlyBaboo all of which could help the airline put its foot further into the respective countries.


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In related news, Embraer has gained in share prices these past few weeks as traders speculate the news from Flybe will mean an ever increasing order book for its E-Jet family.

Sources include http://www.bloomberg.com/

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineshamrock321 From Ireland, joined May 2008, 1596 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 8668 times:

Dont TAP own Portugalia now? How about Aer Arann?

User currently offlineIcarus75 From France, joined Oct 2003, 796 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 8660 times:

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
Further regional airlines of Europe include Air Nostrum, Brit Air, Finncomm Airlines, Portugalia and FlyBaboo all of which could help the airline put its foot further into the respective countries.

As Brit Air is doing a lot of flighs on behalf of AF, I doubt that it can be bought by FlyBe.



Flying is amazing!
User currently offlineplanesailing From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 816 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 8617 times:

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
Rumours are circulating of a Cityjet takeover, but with the VLM integration having only just taken place, and its own large focus on the UK could it be that much of a gain, particularly with its strong foothold at London City Airport?

Aren't Cityjet owned by Air France?

Quoting shamrock321 (Reply 1):
How about Aer Arann?

They are in bankruptcy protection and there were rumours when that happened that Flybe could be interested.

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
According to the airline, these latest acquisitions being considered are “digestible” rather than “transformational”.

Does this include the airlines existing fleets, therefore either a Q400 or ERJ operator.


User currently offlineSR4ever From Luxembourg, joined Mar 2010, 800 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 8491 times:

Quoting Icarus75 (Reply 2):
As Brit Air is doing a lot of flighs on behalf of AF, I doubt that it can be bought by FlyBe.

Unless AF itself acquires BE. In the past, until British European became Flybe, AF and BE would work a lot together, especially on London-French Regions and Paris-Jersey.

Expect a tough battle between AF and BA to take over BE, if there is an opportunity.

Perhaps we could see further euro-wide consolidation of regional airlines around AF-KLM, namely the merger of:

- WA

- WX/VG

- YS
- DB
- A5
- T7
- XK

- XM
- CT

- F7 (unless LX gets it)


User currently onlineqm001 From Portugal, joined Mar 2004, 281 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 8491 times:

Portugalia is wholly owned by TAP. So unless they go for TP, that will not happen.


I wish there was still a flying boat service on the African Lakes!
User currently offlineairbuseric From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 4267 posts, RR: 51
Reply 6, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 8411 times:

On my recent FlyBaboo flight, the crew was worried about their future since there were rumours that Cityjet/AF will takeover FlyBaboo. No talks about FlyBE.


"The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going"
User currently offlinedavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7370 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 8206 times:
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Quoting planesailing (Reply 3):
Quoting shamrock321 (Reply 1):
How about Aer Arann?

They are in bankruptcy protection and there were rumours when that happened that Flybe could be interested.

They aren't in the 14 interested parties I believe.


User currently offlineSR4ever From Luxembourg, joined Mar 2010, 800 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 8029 times:

Quoting airbuseric (Reply 6):
On my recent FlyBaboo flight, the crew was worried about their future since there were rumours that Cityjet/AF will takeover FlyBaboo.

If so, perhaps LX would be well-advised to go for a purchase of F7...


User currently offlineTimboflier215 From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 1334 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 7976 times:

I always thought BE would buy bmi regional and/or bmi baby, but nothing ever came of that. Will be interesting to see how their European expansion goes, I guess they have to find somewhere to put all those E-Jets....

User currently offlineIBA346 From France, joined Jan 2010, 29 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 7786 times:

What about Sun Air (EZ) ? Its the BA franchise operating mainly out of Bilund.

After absorbing BA Connect and the Logonair franchise, BE seem well placed to absorb another bit of BA!. EZ closed some routes recently (Paris, Gdansk) so they may be in need of help.


User currently offlinevv701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7458 posts, RR: 17
Reply 11, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 7565 times:

Quoting SR4ever (Reply 4):
Unless AF itself acquires BE. In the past, until British European became Flybe, AF and BE would work a lot together, especially on London-French Regions and Paris-Jersey.

Thia could only happen with the agreement of the Walker Trust who own 69 per cent of flybe. A further 15 per cent is owned by BA while the remaining equity is owned by employees of the airline.


User currently onlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19202 posts, RR: 52
Reply 12, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6430 times:

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
“We’re looking for regional purchases. I’d describe them as bridgeheads into Europe. We see the next phase of development for Flybe very much to be in continental Europe.” I added the emphasis.
Quoting shamrock321 (Reply 1):
How about Aer Arann?

Since when is Ireland in "continental Europe"?



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlinesam1987 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 946 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6342 times:

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
Air Nostrum, Brit Air, Finncomm Airlines, Portugalia and FlyBaboo

Which of these are not currently part of a larger flag carrier?



Next flights: LGW-LBA-LGW, LHR-SIN-SYD, SYD-BKK-LHR, LGW-GRO, GRO-CIA, CIA-MAD, MAD-LGW
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11638 posts, RR: 60
Reply 14, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6246 times:

Well Finncomm has essentially just been bought by Finnair, BritAir is owned by Air France, Air Nostrum is privately owned but well outside of BE's league for anything other than a merger and Portugalia is owned by TAP which potentially just leaves Baboo.

I think they had better be careful with European expansion. Too much room to get it all wrong, because whilst in the UK there is comparatively little alternate competition on domestic routes, in Europe you have multiple HSR networks to contend with. On intra EU flights expansion may find them coming up against EasyJet and Ryanair etc... which is a battle they are unlikely to win.


Dan  

[Edited 2010-09-24 02:14:27]


...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlinesam1987 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 946 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6236 times:

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 14):
which potentially just leaves Baboo.

I guess Baboo is the most likely bet then. They also have Dash 8s so the fleet would fit nicely.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 14):
On intra EU flights expansion may find them coming up against EasyJet and Ryanair etc... which is a battle they are unlikely to win.

Flybe have a history of resurrecting former easyJet and Ryanair routes where the A319 or 737 turns out to be too large for the market. There's no reason why they couldn't do this in Europe.



Next flights: LGW-LBA-LGW, LHR-SIN-SYD, SYD-BKK-LHR, LGW-GRO, GRO-CIA, CIA-MAD, MAD-LGW
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11638 posts, RR: 60
Reply 16, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6199 times:

Quoting sam1987 (Reply 15):
Flybe have a history of resurrecting former easyJet and Ryanair routes where the A319 or 737 turns out to be too large for the market. There's no reason why they couldn't do this in Europe.

I wasn't aware of there being that many, a couple perhaps, but certainly not a history? I know recently they have launched a fanfair of replacement flights as FR pulls out of BHD, but I don't honestly see that working. Most people only used FR because they were the cheapest and happened to fly into City, now they will move to the next cheapest and I have my doubts that this will be BE.



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlineusdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 960 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5929 times:

Flybe...Baboo...BMI Baby... Who invented the names for these airlines? They sound like child-safe products that can't be swallowed!

User currently offlineSR4ever From Luxembourg, joined Mar 2010, 800 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5907 times:

Quoting vv701 (Reply 11):
Thia could only happen with the agreement of the Walker Trust who own 69 per cent of flybe.

Well, if AF-KLM brings enough cash on the table, I am pretty sure an agreement can be made.

From a Competition Law point of view, BE going for AF-KLM and Skyteam would raise fewer issues than if it was acquired by BA and joined OW, in my view.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 14):
in Europe you have multiple HSR networks to contend with

Agreed, but notwithstanding HSR, there remain quite many untested opporunities.


User currently offlinenqyguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 5796 times:

Quoting usdcaguy (Reply 17):
Flybe...Baboo...BMI Baby

Flybe used to be called British European.. so basically FlyBritishEuropean is shorted to FlyBE.

BMI Baby was an ofshoot of BMI, I guess they wanted to to keep the familiar branding but differentiate the product. Baby is supposed to hint at cheap fares, or the airline with 'Tiny Fares' as they like to say.


User currently offlineAirGabon From Switzerland, joined Dec 2003, 880 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 5768 times:

Quoting airbuseric (Reply 6):
On my recent FlyBaboo flight, the crew was worried about their future since there were rumours that Cityjet/AF will takeover FlyBaboo. No talks about FlyBE.

FlyBaboo is in very bad financial situation (30 mln loss) and will ground 2 aircraft next winter. As far as I understand, as they have strong links with AF, they are part of FlyingBlue and code-share with AF, AZ, RO... a takeover by Cityjet/AF would be a serious possibility. Also heard about FlyBe


User currently offlinevv701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7458 posts, RR: 17
Reply 21, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5221 times:

Quoting SR4ever (Reply 18):
Well, if AF-KLM brings enough cash on the table, I am pretty sure an agreement can be made.

This would depend on the wording of the agreement when BA made their investment in BE. There may be no restriction on Walker Group selling out their shares or to whom they sell them. But there is more likely to be some restriction in the agreement. It may give BA a first option on the purchase of the Walker Group's interest. Or there may be a time restriction or even a total restriction on a sale to another airline. It is even possible although less likely that BA has a veto on such a sale.

Quoting SR4ever (Reply 18):
From a Competition Law point of view, BE going for AF-KLM and Skyteam would raise fewer issues than if it was acquired by BA and joined OW, in my view.

I am only aware of one route operated by both IAG (BA/IB) and BE. It is LGW-JER. So I do not see competition law being relevant to such a takeover. There is, of course, much greater route duplication between AF/KL and BE. As an example both operate services between CDG and BHX, EDI, MAN and SOU. And there are other routes like AMS-SOU that both operate. So the competition issues would be much greater if AF/KL tried to buy BE. However I would have doubted that they would be a show stopper.


User currently offlinejoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5172 times:

What about Augsburg Airways: fully owned by a private capital company (Aton GmbH). Flying Q400s and E195s for LH regional, so it would be a nice fleet match as a bonus. More so, as it is owned by a private capital fund, which might be willing to sell it for the right price (they also sold Cirrus last year, and they once owned 25% of dba which they sold to AB), and it's not too big.

User currently offlineHumberside From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2005, 4918 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (3 years 11 months 1 day ago) and read 4825 times:

Quoting IBA346 (Reply 10):
EZ closed some routes recently (Paris, Gdansk) so they may be in need of help.

They've also started Billind-BMA and BMA-HEL

They would probably be a very bad fit for Flybe since they currently fly Dornier 328's. Big capacity jump to a Dash 8 Q400

Quoting vv701 (Reply 21):
As an example both operate services between CDG and BHX, EDI, MAN and SOU.
BE ditched EDI-CDG not long after they took over BA Connect. AF are giving up SOU-ORY with the start of the BE codeshare (AF moved SOU service from CDG a while ago, and BE are moving their SOU-Paris service from CDG to ORY with the start of the codeshare, leaving CDG-SOU unserved)

[Edited 2010-09-24 08:59:38]


Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1837 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (3 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4354 times:

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
Brit Air

Brit Air is 100% owned by AF ==> no way

Quoting bmibaby737 (Thread starter):
So with Flybe’s recent Air France codesharing agreements and its success and recent focus on France, could Airlinair be a target for the Exeter based airline?

Brit Air (so AF at the end) owned a big stake in Airlinair (about 20% I think), so technically, yes, BE could take a part but it seems unlikely to me


25 joost : True, but after FlyBE took over BA Connect, they got a whole fleet of ERJ-145s. They flew them for a while, and replaced them with bigger Q400s and E
26 Humberside : Though there is a even bigger difference between a D328 and a Q400 than from a ERJ-145 to a Q400 BRU/DUS would be hard to make work on a double weekd
27 Post contains links GSTBA : It was just under three weeks ago that rumours surfaced that AF where considering starting a budget operation http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-
28 Post contains images bmibaby737 : This is what I personally believe! Flybe will purchase some of these carriers, modernise the fleet and operate them in Air France colours.
29 sam1987 : Trouble is... Flybe will want to keep their own low cost brand. I don't see them flying in AF colours.
30 PlymSpotter : That would be fun with the French unions... they don't like change. I can't see the point either in changing ATRs for Dashes, there comes a point wher
31 shamrock604 : Why? What would be the point? Why would AF lose the profits that these carriers are perfectly capable of making? Not only does AF gain the revenue fr
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