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Southwest To Purchase Airtran  
User currently offlinevmcavmcg From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 44792 times:

Just saw this


Should be interesting.

304 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
User currently offlinejetfuel From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 2303 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44821 times:

Exciting. So what do they do with a fleet of 717's

Where's the passion gone out of the airline industry? The smell of jetfuel and the romance of taking a flight....
User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 13500 posts, RR: 62
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44774 times:

Wow. All I can say is ... wow.

Suddenly, Southwest now has a fleet of 717s, a new hub in Atlanta (that is fairly historic in and of itself), and an international network - albeit small, but no doubt set to grow.

Delta's day just got a bit more interesting.


User currently offlinevmcavmcg From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44759 times:

My guess is the 717 is not going to figure in the long term fleet plan. Certainly Muse Air could be a good example of what will happen.

User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 13500 posts, RR: 62
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44648 times:

It will also be interesting to see how this plays out with the dynamics in Milwaukee. Just as how Delta is now going to be facing by far the most formidable hub competitor it's ever had in Atlanta (Southwest is far stronger than AirTran has ever been, or Eastern ever was), the same is true of Midwest/Frontier/Republic in Milwaukee: they've never been up against a competitor this big/strong/well-financed in Milwaukee before.

This is going to be interesting ...

Quoting vmcavmcg (Reply 3):
My guess is the 717 is not going to figure in the long term fleet plan. Certainly Muse Air could be a good example of what will happen.

Agreed - I think they will be around only as long as it takes for Southwest to get 737s to replace them. Even still, even if only in the interim, if we could see a 717 in Southwest livery - that would be cool!

User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44653 times:

Blimey. I for one never saw this one coming.

Things are going to get interesting at ATL. I wonder how DL will react? WN the 800lb Gorilla has just landed in their back yard.

User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 16
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44609 times:

Quoting vmcavmcg (Reply 3):
My guess is the 717 is not going to figure in the long term fleet plan.

Probably not, but a fleet of 86 is not quickly replaced. Very interesting indeed. The press release mentiones that the FL fleet will be transitioned to WN c/s, but what about the interior?

User currently offlinecalpilot From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 1002 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44562 times:

500 shares of AAI, "yes"

User currently offlineSurfandSnow From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 3038 posts, RR: 30
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44518 times:

WHAT?!? I, for one, did not see this coming. This will take a.net by storm unlike anything (AA/TW, HP/US, DL/NW, UA/CO, F9/YX, etc.) we have seen yet!

Quoting jetfuel (Reply 1):
So what do they do with a fleet of 717's

Phase them out as fast as they can get 737s to replace them.

Quoting commavia (Reply 2):
Southwest now has a fleet of 717s

I wonder if we will really see any in the Canyon Blue livery, though, or if they will simply be a part of the airline a la NW DC-9-30s/-40s that DL didn't even bother repainting...

Quoting commavia (Reply 2):
a new hub in Atlanta (that is fairly historic in and of itself)

Well, WN doesn't have any "hub" per say. But yes, ATL will probably be a major station for them just like HOU, MDW, PHX, etc.

Quoting commavia (Reply 2):
an international network - albeit small, but no doubt set to grow.

A very, very interesting acquisition by WN. I am sure B6, NK, DL, and AA are all very concerned right now...

Quoting vmcavmcg (Reply 3):
Certainly Muse Air could be a good example of what will happen.

What happened with Muse Air?

Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
User currently offline71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3124 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44456 times:

What about pilot integration? Didn't that help to kill the F9 deal?

Clickable links only please!
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6883 posts, RR: 16
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44429 times:

OMG! Think about it further though.. Southwest will own BWI, MCO, FLL.. they will get a HUGE presence in MKE and get into DCA and more flights intoLGA.. they will be international and be in EVERY large airport they aren't already in..

Southwest has immediately became a airline beast!!

Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineCOalways From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 390 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44421 times:

Wow never seen this coming DL is going to be in for a MAYOR beat down with black & blues all over the fuselage.

User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44391 times:

Holy cow.

I mean HOLY COW!

I suppose this shouldn't be all that surprising. The acquisition makes sense in more ways than one. Complimentary fleet, complimentary culture, complimentary route network. Now WN will have access to DCA, ATL, international destinations, a Business class product, 717s, etc. Etc.

Holy cow is all I can say for the moment. This will be a thread to remember.  


User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 13500 posts, RR: 62
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44375 times:

Quoting SurfandSnow (Reply 8):
Well, WN doesn't have any "hub" per say.

Of course they do.

Regardless of what they are called, Midway, Baltimore, Phoenix, Las Vegas, etc. are all Southwest hubs. Now we can just add Atlanta to that list.

Quoting SurfandSnow (Reply 8):
A very, very interesting acquisition by WN. I am sure B6, NK, DL, and AA are all very concerned right now...

I don't really see the immediate threat to any of those airlines except Delta. Longer-term, if Southwest uses this as a springboard to grow internationally in general, of course all those airlines could be in the crosshairs. But in the short-run, the airline with the biggest exposure to this is obviously Delta by far (Atlanta), and Republic (Milwaukee). Beyond that, AirTran's network overlaps very little with AA, JetBlue and Spirit.

User currently onlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19612 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44382 times:

They have created: http://www.lowfaresfarther.com/

"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineSeatback From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 829 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44304 times:

I wonder if we'll see WN at DFW now. I could see them keeping what AirTran has built there.

User currently offlineCharlieNoble From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44261 times:

Quoting vmcavmcg (Thread starter):
Quoting jetfuel (Reply 1):
So what do they do with a fleet of 717's

Phase them out as fast as they can get 737s to replace them.

I wonder about this. I guess at some point the economies of having a one-type fleet outweigh the cost of replacing a relatively large number of economical frames that are already on hand...but I'm not convinced that this would be the case immediately. It's not like they're inheriting a pile of 727s.

Is there more to it than dollars and cents? Does buying a bunch of new 737s make them more profit than getting their money's worth out of the 717s?

Either way, I have nothing but fond memories of flying both AirTrain and the 717. I hope this works out well for their people...

[Edited 2010-09-27 04:36:45]

User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6883 posts, RR: 16
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44212 times:

You know, as I was thinking.. I could completely see WN keeping the 717 for the "small cities" that AirTran already flies to. These aircraft will be just the small aircraft WN had always needed for these smaller markets to be able to serve them efficiently. I"m guessing by small

Dang! Just figured out WN is entering CLT too! US is gonna have to run AGAIN! (LOL).. I could see WN doing MCO, BWI, BNA, MDW, MCO, TPA, PHX, and PHL off the bat... maybe even RDU and ORF to tick US off..

However, since neither is going to go into Bankruptsy, does this mean WN will also have the Skywest contract??? what will they do with those lil RJ?

Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlinesunking737 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2112 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44089 times:

Yes!!!!!! WN leaves SY alone!!! 717 in WN colors!!!

I was channel surfing and stopped on HLN and caught the tail end of the story. I almost broke my neck turning around.

This will be interesting to say the lest.

Below is from press release...

"Based on current operations, the combined organization would have nearly 43,000 Employees and serve more than 100 million Customers annually from more than 100 different airports in the U.S. and near-international destinations. In addition, the combined carriers' all-Boeing fleet consisting of 685 active aircraft would include 401 Boeing 737-700s, 173 Boeing 737-300s, 25 Boeing 737-500s, and 86 Boeing 717s, with an average age of approximately 10 years, one of the youngest fleets in the industry. Southwest Airlines also announced, previously, that it is evaluating the opportunity to introduce the Boeing 737-800 into its domestic network to complement its current fleet, providing opportunities for longer-haul flying and service to high-demand, slot-controlled, or gate-restricted markets. This acquisition supports Southwest Airlines' evaluation of the Boeing 737-800."

[Edited 2010-09-27 04:44:18]

User currently offlineUSAirways787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 291 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44086 times:

I wonder if WN will throw us out in the street. I hope to God not.

"Pre departure walk around complete, all doors closed, ready for pushback"
User currently offlineknope2001 From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 3401 posts, RR: 34
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 44079 times:

Obviously it's incredibly early to expect public statements on details, but a few obvious points of curiosity.

(a) Business class expanded to the entire fleet or dropped?

(b) Assigned seating...with or without AirTran's fee...expanded to the entire fleet or dropped?

(d) Wifi expanded to the entire fleet or dropped?

(e) The 717 is something of an orphan airframe, but does WN benefit from having something smaller than the 137-seat 737, and if so is it the 717? Or it the 717 fleet going to be walled off into the legacy AirTran neetwork until it can be replaced by the 737, even if that means dropping some smaller markets?

(f) What of Milwaukee, considering Southwest simply does not need MKE for east-west flow like AirTran does?

(g) Will this cook the 16-departuere/day MKE feeder operation of Skywest? Or will they consider replicating this elsewhere?

(h) Will ATL see pounding growth like Denver has, and if so how soon?

(i) Southwest typically doesn't run a station with fewer than about 8 flights per day. There are around thirty AirTran cities under that tier, and unless Southwest changes their strategy, will they be dumped just like most of the smaller Morris stations?

(j) Interlining?

(k) GDS or only at southwestairlines.com?

AirTran brings a number of things to the table which Southwest doesn't do, some of which (like assigned seating) have been toyed with for years. Southewest is clearly the acquiring carrier here and is about 4x the size of AirTran, but that doesn't necessarily mean nothing of AirTran will be kept by Southwest. Most traces of Muse and Morris that were different than Southwest were phased out fairly quickly, but times have changed.

[Edited 2010-09-27 04:44:40]

[Edited 2010-09-27 04:49:03]

User currently offlinereggaebird From Jamaica, joined Nov 1999, 1176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 43948 times:

Quoting vmcavmcg (Thread starter):
Just saw this


Should be interesting.

This is really going to be interesting. I also think that the 717s go bye-bye and there will be no remnant of AirTran in the merged entity. I also wonder if Southwest will reduce the presence in Atlanta or hold the line against Delta. Watch Delta stock today for some clues. Also wondering how unions will impact this deal.

User currently offlinekeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 43981 times:

Southwest would get additional ~130 aircraft, 87 Boeing 717-200 and 54 Boeing 737-700 (65 on order).

1000 flights a day from e.g Atlanta, Orlando, Baltimore-Washington, Milwaukee, Fort Myers, Tampa, Fort Lauderdale..

User currently offlinestlgph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 43890 times:

well, looks like they'll enter South Carolina after all.  

if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
User currently offlinegdg9 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 924 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 43884 times:

I'll be the first to ask then... does this mean Southwest starts DFW? AirTran runs 12+ flights at day from DFW to ATL, BWI, MKE and MCO.

25 RL757PVD : How the hell will this get past anti-competitive muster? If you thought the DCA/LGA slot swap was anti-competitive....
26 Post contains links and images tjwgrr : Looks pretty good, IMO: Aviation-Designs.Net:Design © R P AbrahamTemplate © R P Abraham
27 fadecfault : There goes my job.......
28 einsteinboricua : WOW...just WOW... Kudos to WN. I assume Delta will be worried, especially when a LCC has entered its home turf. Guess a comment posted a while back is
29 Post contains images ChrisNH : Now watch Delta suddenly 'pay attention' to certain 'at-risk' city-pairs. I think DL will soon switch from RJs to 767-400s on the Manchester (NH) - At
30 clemsonaj : They'll also get some international destinations - something they have been reluctant to do until now (and may still be for that matter). Wonder what
31 airlineexpert : WN is not stronger in ATL than Eastern ever was. Systemwide, EA was a very strong airline. People remember its wretched last days but it was a very po
32 Seatback : Let's be clear, WN is buying AirTran for ATL, LGA, DCA, BOS. All of the other things like assigned seating, 717's, business class will all go away as
33 AVLAirlineFreq : How many AirTran markets overlap with current WN markets? How many are AirTran exclusively? And how many markets did WN drop after acquiring Morris A
34 Post contains links USAirways787 : It's already up on WN's website. http://www.lowfaresfarther.com/
35 stlgph : take the 737's, cities, routes, gates, equipment for yourself. take the 717's, spin them off into their "own" carrier under the name "AirTran" - conce
36 Kcrwflyer : I can dig it!! WN, Welcome to CRW! not sure how long that'll last though...
37 stlgph : end of next year.
38 United_fan : Did not see this coming . What about WN buying SY? Looks like ROC will finally see WN !!! Ought to be interesting. I do hope they keep ROC-TPA non-sto
39 keesje : On the fleet side : 54 Boeing 737-700s & additional 65 early 737-700 delivery positions guarantee capasity during the upcoming period of economic
40 Revelation : Geez, what does that have to do with anything these days? Yep, we know NOTHING of what WN's integration strategy will be. They could do as you say, o
41 rampart : I have to repeat what several have said before, Holy Cow! This would explain the lack of interest in Sun Country. They do now! In a big way. (Of cours
42 Post contains images SurfandSnow : I think one of two things will happen: 1) As it stands today, MKE ties up a lot of valuable LGA and DCA slots. WN will probably have to slash frequen
43 UALWN : Wow! I go out for lunch and when I return the sh*t has hit the fan. Totally unexpected. I love WN, and I hope they manage this well. Wow.
44 Post contains images AVLAirlineFreq : I was simply asking the question in response to this post, since I wasn't aware they had dropped any markets: [Edited 2010-09-27 05:26:54]
45 Kcrwflyer : I think they'll give them all a "chance" of sorts. This buyout could result in different ground handling contracts and agreements, so it could begin
46 United787 : I wonder how this will play out at MDW where they already "own" the airport... No more cheap fights from MDW to RSW since WN has never been the lowest
47 2175301 : The B717 question is an interesting one... While its easy to say that Southwest would not want another aircraft type and will get rid of them; its als
48 globalflyer : One word ... AWESOME! Welcome to the ATL WN. It has been a long time coming. It will be very interesting to see how the current FL network is integrat
49 globaldude : How many gates in ATL does AirTran have? SWA vs DL...that will be fun to watch. WOW!
50 Pe@rson : 31, according to Wikipedia (!).
51 MSYtristar : I wonder how this would affect a city like BNA, for example? Would they keep the same large connecting operation out of BNA once they have the full AT
52 airlineexpert : It is doubtful that WN will be able to make markets from ATL work that FL has not been able to... there is no basis for saying that FL can't stimulate
53 FlyPNS1 : I'm surprised this happened so soon, but not surprised it happened overall. It gets WN a lot of the things WN wants (ATL presence, DCA/LGA slots, etc.
54 USAirways787 : It is my understanding the wright amendment would prohibit WN from flying out of DFW, period, whether it be a merger or not.
55 Post contains images Renfro747 : Southwest to TYS... My dreams have come true!
56 Post contains images lightsaber : I'm stunned. This os a game changer! leases ex[ire 2014 to 2017. They'll fade from memory. I'm more stunned by WN going from zero to hubbing at ATL.
57 Dxer1974 : Wow! I was just sitting there watching the news getting up here on the Left Coast and I pinched myself to make sure I wasn't still asleep in a dream.
58 RayChuang : This may not be such a crazy idea. WN gets over 100 new or nearly-new 737-700's, and AirTran can become the focused, low-cost carrier flying exclusiv
59 474218 : Atlanta radio news (WSB) reported they hope to close shortly after the first of the year?
60 SPREE34 : Fly them. How many MD-80s did Muse Have? 15? How Many does AirTran have? 87. They aren't going anywhere for a long time.
61 skymiler : so -- what happens to AA/US/AS? Do they now get together to fight DL, WN/AirTran and CO/UA?
62 Post contains links keesje : AirTran clip about Southwest. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6DdDlPT4Uc Southwest clip aimed at AirTran http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QK9xwJqjcJ4&am
63 RL757PVD : Not sure how a smaller fleet with a higher CASM compared to a 73G is going to help fight Delta.... if anything the 717 fleet can remain for Florida-S
64 Northwest727 : I'm wondering is WN is doing the same thing they did to the ATA scraps: dump the employees, facilities, and aircraft (except for the 737's), and keep
65 Post contains links simairlinenet : http://www.lowfaresfarther.com/ And now the site is down. There wasn't much up to begin with. The way it looked was so plain, it was like Southwest is
66 evanbu : Des Moines will FINALLY get WN. It's about time...
67 jfklganyc : This is a curve ball for other LCCs. I have to wonder what the guys at B6, NK, and VX are thinking this morning. Especially JetBlue . . . their go it
68 gdg9 : No, Wright restricts flying to certain points from DAL. Southwest can fly anywhere they want today from DFW - they just choose not to. Perhaps WN wil
69 FWAERJ : Surprised no one has thought of this: Anyone want to guess, after merger closing, that FL's bag fees will go away before assigned seats and Business C
70 Post contains images PHLBOS : Simple logic: FL currently serves CLT. They (WN) will probably keep DFW until 2014. It's worth noting that it wasn't that long ago that one could boo
71 usairways85 : Does anyone think that this merger will reduce competition quite a bit. Yes WN will enter some markets that they don't currently serve but they will l
72 Mainland : If so, that would put the AirTran shareholder vote around January, but it will likely a bit later. For comparison, DL/NW held their meetings approx 5
73 Post contains images isitsafenow : Sorry Todd...I dont agree Well, I guess this is one way to get Southwest into GRR and FNT. BAG FLY FREE TO MORE PLACES THEN EVER!! What an add campai
74 Post contains images mauiman31 : these will be phased out imho. . . unfortunately. . .
75 STT757 : I think the 717s will be staying for quite a while, they are better suited for WN's shorter intra Texas hops, and the 73G is too big for some of FL's
76 iloveboeing : I have been predicting this for awhile now. This is exciting and even more thrilling that they've already got the major details worked about between t
77 SEPilot : This looks to me to be a purchase, not a merger. I cannot see SW changing anything that they would not do anyway, such as assigned seating and aircraf
78 Dxer1974 : It could mean some business for my company, ferrying these B717's to other airlines for the leasing companies in other parts of the world. I do have
79 Post contains images BHMNONREV : This makes a lot of sense, what about also running the 717 on some of the off-peak intra-Texas runs from DAL and HOU? I thought I read here at one ti
80 tistpaa727 : Quite interesting...definitely shakes things up here in ATL. For me, FL was a great alternative to DL given the option of business class upgrade. I wo
81 sldispatcher : Why is it a given that the 717's will be gone? When was the last time WN actually ever had a SINGLE aircraft type? Are the 737-500's and 737-700's com
82 Post contains images Aloha717200 : HOLY CRAP!!! I saw this and thought it was yet another "will Southwest buy X airline" thread, I can't believe it's real! Doesn't this go against South
83 enilria : Future Coke cans Only because there was another bidder. The only other potential bidder here is AA. I don't expect them to bid. DROPPED DROPPED Aren'
84 MandingoBoy : What will happen to my elite status on Air Tran. I really liked their reward program.
85 UGA777 : As an elite on Airtran, I am really hoping they keep 3 things: business class, xm radio, and wifi. I have always avoided Southwest due to the fact tha
86 airfrnt : Not all that surprising honestly. WN wanted desperately to buy F9 and get into more of a hub/international situation then what they had. That fell thr
87 Post contains links simairlinenet : Site is back up. Lots of questions answered at http://www.lowfaresfarther.com/frequently-asked-questions/
88 Ezra : Now that Southwest is gaining meaningful access to LGA, I wonder if DL and US will revisit their slot swap.
89 RL757PVD : Care to explain that logic?[Edited 2010-09-27 06:47:49]
90 EMB170 : I for one don't see WN getting rid of the 717 like everyone is saying so far for exactly this reason. FL serves many cities WN doesn't because of siz
91 LAXdude1023 : Im guessing the HQ of the company will still be in Dallas?
92 Post contains links centralma : At least now, the web site http://www.lowfaresfarther.com/ has lots of information only being speculated about here. Read the For Employees, For Inves
93 United_fan : I highly doubt they will leave ROC entirely. They (FL) are one of the largest airlines here .
94 iloveboeing : Well WN could build on the FL amenities and add XM and WiFI to every aircraft, or at least WiFi. WN aircraft have more legroom than FL's Y class, any
95 SEPilot : As I understand it, any WN pilot can fly any plane in the fleet. This is a big thing, and maintenance on a 735 and 73G is not much different either.
96 Post contains links AVLAirlineFreq : Does anyone else see the irony of using an AirTran photo featuring FL employees carrying Panera boxed lunches? http://www.lowfaresfarther.com/what-it
97 DeltaRules : Wow. It doesn't seem like that long ago that FL was telling YX "join us or we'll stomp you (in MKE)" & now it's FL being bought out by WN.
98 wjcandee : This is nsane. Goodbye Airtran. I guess Bob Fornaro got tired of running an airline. Much more exciting to be a dealmaker. They are moving to Dallas?
99 FlyPNS1 : They aren't. WN said they will keep the 717 and it will be painted in WN colors. Obviously, they won't stay in the WN fleet forever, but I could see
100 FlyIGuy : SWA doesn't currently serve RIC...only ORF
101 RL757PVD : Exclusing the Florida only small cities (CRW AVL TYS LEX) its too soon to tell what they will do about those. but the other, more established air tran
102 etops1 : HOLY @#$%^ $#iT!!!!!
103 Post contains images catiii : Regarding the 717's, listening to the analyst call Kelly said "We're going into this pleased to have the 717s." Guess that answers the question for th
104 Post contains links STT757 : WN with their quick turn arounds can get 10 flights per day from each gate, with 31 gates at their disposal WN has significant opportunity for expans
105 netjets21 : This is kind of out of the blue isn't it? Has it played out like the other mergers? or is it not technically a merger because WN is buying them out?
106 Mainland : Shareholder voting for the acquirer is only necessary if the amount of shares to be issued passes a certain threshold, I believe 10% in most instance
107 enilria : Just to muse a little more...BTW, a bigger question is "who is left to fill in these gaps". Did Allegiant just hit the lottery? There are gonna be a l
108 STT757 : From WN's website, post merger; No dual class aircraft, no bag fees, no assigned seating.
109 Post contains links FATFlyer : The website linked says they will go to WNs single class. No word on xm/wifi on the site but they keep repeating "consistent product". So either they
110 brdcessna : I think its awesome Good for them
111 Humberside : Price they have to pay for getting ATL, DCA, extra LGA etc?[Edited 2010-09-27 07:17:15]
112 enilria : Check my next post above. Wow. That's a license to print money for DL on ATL-DFW. I guess they will have 20 1-stops through places like BHM. That's a
113 RL757PVD : ROC-BUF are over an hour apart, and ROC has an MSA nearly identical in size. The fact that you throw out ROC but keep CRW and PWM kills almost all cre
114 KC135TopBoom : What will WN do with DFW? FL has a presence there and WN's hub is just down the road at DAL. I hope they keep DFW as DAL is a pain to get to from Fort
115 PPVRA : It also says they want to keep most, if not all, of AirTran's destinations. As well as keeping the 717s, and they claim the merger will actually incr
116 flymia : This is a purchase not a merger, sad to see FL go. The 717's will be gone in no time, I think flights will be cut and the hub in ATL will no longer be
117 Post contains links 2175301 : Here is Southwest's answers on the 717 - it looks like they plan on keeping them. Q: Do you plan to keep AirTran’s Boeing 717s? A: We will continue
118 GentFromAlaska : I think it is fair to say WN just put a significant dent in the wish-lish of airports who were woo-ing WN Lets not put the cart before the horse just
119 Pe@rson : Don't people read?! Adding to this, and per its FAQ: "In 2006, we entered into a binding agreement with five parties (including DFW), which restricts
120 Post contains links ImperialEagle : Awesome! Who'd a thunk it? Here's a link to the article in this mornings New York Times: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/28/business/28air.html
121 AVLAirlineFreq : Agreed. I can't see this not being approved. It will be interesting, though, to see if there are members of Congress who try to extract promises from
122 71Zulu : Because WN already has an aircraft, the 737 and the 717 has nearly the same fuel burn with less seats. Sure. This is an acquisition not a merger. Yea
123 airlineexpert : The merger website says: Q: Will you close any AirTran destinations/facilities? Where will the corporate headquarters be located? A: We are interested
124 Post contains links and images peanuts : This will sharpen the legacies, especially DL. Actually, I think the New UA should feel very threatened. They still don't have anything meaningful in
125 CFBFrame : I don't see why there has to be a "take no prisoners" approach for WN over FL. Seems that many think this means a death blow, and I think it's WN's mo
126 SEPilot : Merging pilot lists is always one of the stickiest points in any merger/acquisition. Since seniority is so important in a pilot's career, just adding
127 PHLBOS : A further death-blow to ABE, post-merger, is WN entering EWR. According to a couple other posters (see below), WN is not contractually allowed to ope
128 Humberside : The thread is getting posts added that quick that by the time you have read the latest posts and typed a response, a load more posts have been made[E
129 MikeE07 : Whoa! I just got out the doctors office due to a 6mm kidney stone, and when I read this, I almost passed that sucker! Could this mean that Southwest c
130 Post contains images isitsafenow : FNT stays because the flights in and out of FNT are full and have been for YEARS. They turn a dollar there and in business you do not walk away from
131 flyabr : Any chance WN might use the 717 to open up markets like FSD/FAR for feed into MDW/DEN?
132 N328KF : Funny that WN will now hold the intellectual property and operating certificates behind both FL and TZ, two airlines that were often confused.
133 FlyPNS1 : How? LCC's still own a tiny fraction of the total number of slots. And it's likely at least one or two of the slot pairs at DCA will have to be given
134 point2point : Nice overlooked pearl in this deal, since all the hoopla is with ATL. Aren't there going to regulatory concerns with this? WN is the purchaser. If FL
135 enilria : BUF and ROC are 60 miles apart. Show me an example in the existing WN network two stations are that close (excluding mega-cities like LAX/CHI/WAS/NYC
136 Cubsrule : Notwithstanding what they say, I suspect we'll see the 717s wind up at Air Baltimore (not necessarily the name of it), with a hub at BWI and focus ci
137 FlyPNS1 : Why would it be politically difficult? You do realize the only flights FL has from CRW are to MCO and it's not even flown daily. WN's strategy is cha
138 ALTF4 : Wow, crazy news! I'm not expert on markets and city pairs, so I won't say anything about that. From a passenger point of view though, I will miss Airt
139 MikeE07 : By the way, how would this effect Southwest's decision to come to South Carolina in (GSP and CHS)? Will this give them more potential destinations to
140 kingcavalier : Can someone find the history on this? I was living in the Metroplex when the deal was negotiated. I believe WN could operate at DFW but for every gat
141 FlyPNS1 : Except BWI/MCO/TPA are not slot restricted, so your hypothesis fails. I agree that ATL is the big prize, but I don't think WN will have to shrink to
142 UGA777 : Delta, here I come. I am elite on Airtran and probably their biggest supporter. I fly 40 flights a year at least. I love the business class upgrades,
143 etops1 : All I can say is "HOLY F'n CRAP!!!" This is HUGE news. I think you might see a huge push for AA and US to make a deal because of all this .
144 RL757PVD : BOS/MHT/PVD and to a lesser extent BDL. There is very little leakage from ROC to BUF Prior to the DL/NW merger, FL as briefly the # 1 carrier at ROC
145 smoot4208 : That's laughable...WN won't have anything more than what FL currently has with the exception of a handful more flights. There simply isn't room This
146 Cubsrule : What other evidence do we have about what the government will do with BWI? What do you think they'll do? Do you think the Obama administration would
147 casinterest : Wow, Just wow. In all these years, it has been rumored, and finally it happens. A whole lot of airlines are going to be scambling if this deal goes th
148 Super80 : So I am guessing WN will be flying international after the deal closes with FL??
149 FlyPNS1 : There's nothing to do. The combined FL/WN will have just under 70% marketshare at BWI. CO/UA have that much marketshare at EWR (which is slot-control
150 peanuts : Well, I was not only implying a new dynamics from DOJ/DOT's perspective. It may be even more beneficial for both US and DL to sit around the table ag
151 swacle : In response to the 717's, keep in mind that only 12, IIRC, of FL's ATL gates are large enough for 73G's. The rest are 717 only. I am not sure if 733/7
152 kingcavalier : AAI stock is up over 59% or $2.71 a share. Where was my insider trader information when I needed it?
153 mrskyguy : Its amazing.. originally it easy to root for the underdog as WN was growing. Now with this merger WN is going to add 138 of AirTran's aircraft to its
154 junction : Exactly. This is not good news at all for a lot of business travelers used to these types of loyalty perks. Airtran is a full service LCC. Quite the
155 irelayer : No way. This is kind of shocking. Was AirTran even in trouble? Was Southwest even looking to buy another airline? I guess Southwest+AirTran makes a lo
156 kingcavalier : Couldn't they repaint the gate lines and lose a gate or two? I'm feeling this as well. ATL will be great for WN but be careful what you wish for. Eve
157 DiamondFlyer : May well be time to get started on serious planning of the 6th runway, especially if WN is able to get the utilization up to those levels. -DiamondFl
158 cschleic : ....but they still won't be flying to CVG.
159 adam42185 : WOOOOOWWWWIIIEEEEEE This is going to be interesting to see happen! What catches my attention is what will happen at BOS, it being my home airport. Wil
160 ERJ170 : WN has been a legacy for many, many, many years.. I think some people consider a legacy an airline with a huge fleet AND international service.. I do
161 TVNWZ : Couple of reasons. the East/West hub was needed for airTran expansion. It won't be needed for WN's operations. also, MKE relies on the Skywest RJ fle
162 EXMEMWIDGET : With this merger/purchase, along with the CO/UA merger and the recent DL/NW merger, what does this mean for AA? With no suitable dance partner left, w
163 Cubsrule : ...and UA/CO gave up everything UA had at EWR. You're FL/WN will not have to do anything they wouldn't otherwise do at BWI simply because BWI isn't s
164 Coronado : I think that with WN's pilots recent approval of 738 operations, I still think we may see an earlier rather than later move by WN for SY and instantly
165 ChrisNH : Portland, Maine (PWM) needs to show strength all year-round...not just during the summer period between Memorial Day & Labor Day. If Airtran has p
166 Humberside : Airtran left EWR a bit ago in a slot swap with CO If they were contractually obliged to leave Pensacola, I would have thought it would have been stat
167 AVLAirlineFreq : If I recall correctly, isn't PNS just outside the perimeter established by WN's agreement with ECP?
168 justplanenutz : What can the govt. do at BWI? Nothing. They could re-allocated the DCA frequencies, but since WN is a new entrant DCA that's not really helpful. BWI
169 FATFlyer : It does raise questions about how resources may be reallocated over the next couple of years. If I remember right, CVG and FAT are now the 2 largest
170 RL757PVD : PWM is in the middle of the road in terms of small air tran cities. There is a market there that is unique to PWM and FL/B6 have shown that. WN will
171 joeljack : My guess would be several smaller cities go away from ATL that are easily served by other close southwest cities (ie CAE, DAY, Ashville, Huntsville e
172 Post contains images peanuts : Besides WN's stock price, over 5% gains are noted today at US, B6 and AS..... I think AA is gonna have to dig into its savings a bit, soon... Don't ru
173 Post contains images mayor : Maybe we're all jumping the gun a little bit, here, in thinking that the DOT is going to give it the ok. After all, the two largest LFCs, merging? Isn
174 mrskyguy : The water is a little murkier than before, but the DOT doesn't restrict competition and for the most part this merger would simply make SWA more comp
175 Cubsrule : The same thing they did to UA/US at DCA/IAD: find an investor willing to take some airplanes and open a hub. Airlines don't have a right to merge. Th
176 FlyPNS1 : It makes perfect sense. The big problem the Obama administration has is with carriers monopolizing slot controlled airports which allows them to bloc
177 ChrisNH : I think this deal sails through any potential antitrust hurdles because JetBlue is doing well. Lacking that, it might be in jeopardy. Delta certainly
178 MAH4546 : Southwest's core business model is built on operating stations that can handle a good dozen or so flights, with few exceptions, mainly in Texas statio
179 ChrisNH : If Portland is strong outside of the seasonal Memorial Day-Labor Day time-frame, they may remain on the list. I just don't know how much of a fall-of
180 casinterest : I forgot about that, but i was kind of already gearing in that Southwest was getting slots there from Continental. I found a reference that referred
181 stburke : I can only speculate like the rest but I don't see WN backing down in MKE. They didn't blink after the RP/F9 deal and if anything have they've bolste
182 pnwtraveler : I don't think the keeping of the 717 is a shocker really, because what is the market for 717's given the small number of airlines flying them. As a ma
183 RL757PVD : Their core business model also avoided airports like BOS PHL LGA and EWR I think we will see WN come up with a system that allows for stations with 5
184 flyawa : WN to CUN and the Caribbean !!!
185 drerx7 : I just skimmed the FAQ - what happens to international ops? If they continue, I could see Southwest approaching Dallas and Houston about potential FIS
186 KPHXFlyer : Is this what Airtran currently has on order? RE: the 717s staying in: isn't the 737-500 comparable in performance and size to the 717-200? Granted WN
187 justplanenutz : At BWI? Unless the govt. is gonna print money for a new entrant at BWI, this will never happen. Lot's of reasons for the Potomac Air scenario at DCA
188 QUIET737 : I don't think the Airtran employees have much to worry about. Integrations will probably end up in arbitration and finish with something similar to DL
189 Post contains images Revelation : Seems many are missing this point... I bet many are wondering the same, despite what is being said today... It actually may open more opportunities f
190 PHLBOS : IIRC, that agreement ended quite a while (months) ago. How old are WN's 735s? Passenger capacity-wise, those are the closest in size to the 717.
191 seb146 : I can not speak to CVG but I don't think WN would do FAT. I live about two hours drive from SMF, OAK, and SFO. Possibly, the powers that be at WN thi
192 Revelation : The real decision point will be 2-3 years from now as the lease will expire 4 to 7 years from now. Till then WN is stuck with them. After then, they
193 airlineexpert : The impact of WN acquiring FL will likely be largest in the increased access WN can provide from the east coast - where FL is stronger - to the west w
194 mayor : Disdain? Shall we compare how many small communties that DL flies to compared to WN? WN's business model is built around NOT flying to smaller commun
195 ABQopsHP : CRP is called their Boutique stations, since all they have are 5 departures a day during the week, and weekends are reduced schedules. Also all flight
196 stburke : Correct, it ended July 16th this year.
197 Boeing1970 : Yeah. Because Southwest will have a presence at TAL but the hub AirTran hub is toast. No way Southwest retains all fo that. Or not. This plane instan
198 tsugambler : Re: the 717s, is this really a possibility? I mean, AA definitely needs a 100-seat aircraft, but does anyone think they'd be interested in utilizing
199 reality : Southwest has 122 seats on its 737-500s. So, not much difference. Southwest uses 32" pitch compared to AirTran's 30" , so maybe WN would configure th
200 USAirways787 : Our 717's are younger than their 500's. I am stationed in DFW, so our station is automatically out. From what I am hearing they are moving us employe
201 PHLBOS : With this going through, it looks like the ultimate loser of the 3-way LFC BOS-BWI battle (as I predicted when this battle started) is FL.[Edited 2010
202 vatveng : I wonder, though, if Southwest might take advantage of AirTran's brand-new facilities at Newport News? Per the airports' websites terminal maps, Sout
203 NWA330nut : Thanks WN! Can't wait to do some international on the old FL routes! I liked flying on FL but I think it was good that they were taken over by WN.
204 Post contains images calibansa333 : he he now that's a dream my friend
205 F9Animal : I always thought that this would become a target of WN. It will certainly boost their route map. I have a feeling that the Air Tran 717's are going to
206 acjflyer : USAirways787- I work for Southwest and all of the emails we have received from our corporate office indicate that no jobs will be lost. As you said th
207 okie : The real question is with FL on a different operating certificate will that allow WN more gates at DAL? Will WN keep FL presence at DFW just to thumb
208 Post contains links klkla : A lot has been spoken about Delta losing customers to SW but what about the other way around? I'm sure a lot of AirTran frequent flyers feel the same
209 Boeing1970 : 1. The 717 at 117 seats is 32" pitch. 2. The WN 737-500 is $2,961 per block hour the FL 717-200 is $2,724 per block hour.
210 American 767 : If AA really wanted the 717, they would have kept those inherited from the merger with TWA in the early 2000s. But they chose not to keep them for fl
211 Post contains links FATFlyer : I would agree that has been WNs prior model. But this deal also will include a lot of data about operating at less frequencies at smaller cities. Wha
212 enilria : The problem is that they are going to be seeking competitive approval from the govt and Rockefeller is very powerful. If he has any brains he will ge
213 RL757PVD : Despite the mention in the PR, BOS doesnt gain anything at all really.... BWI they lose 9x FL; CAK is probably a goner, PHF is probably a goner, MKE
214 Post contains images mayor : I really doubt that I'll be doing any beat downs on anybody. Having said that, I don't think ANYONE is going to beat down DL.
215 RL757PVD : Fine, use, PBI and FLL Suggesting ROC is out when CRW is in, is extremely laughable, suggesting ROC is out in general is still laugable.
216 ckfred : Some questions to ponder: First, it will be interesting to see how fares change, if at all, to Florida, since Southwest and Air Tran were the main LCC
217 okie : How about STL and DEN while not a hubs are you predicting a pull down? Okie
218 Post contains links Revelation : As above, they are leased, so they can't be sold, and chances are they must be kept till the end of the leases in 2014-2017, unless WN wants to park
219 tsugambler : I was under the impression that the primary reason AA did not keep TWA's 717s was because of the prohibitive cost of the terms of the lease... I'm su
220 cytz_pilot : Noooooobody expects the AirTran acquisition!!![Edited 2010-09-27 10:02:38]
221 1337Delta764 : I really hope the new WN doesn't start an ATL-ABQ route, as it could lead to DL eventually pulling out of ABQ.
222 Post contains links planeguy727 : Q: Will you charge a Change Fee? A: As you know, Southwest does not charge change fees. AirTran charges a $75 for any changes made after purchase. Upo
223 Post contains images Aviacsa737 : Excellent! This means more service options with a superior quality airline, and more options to fly without having to pay ASININE and unreasonable bag
224 Post contains links FATFlyer : Already answered above "The only AirTran airport we know we will not continue to operate at is Dallas Ft. Worth International (DFW). In 2006, we ente
225 2175301 : If these numbers are correct then the 717 is the cheaper plane to operate: 737-500 @ $2961 pre block hour = $24.27 per seat block hour 717-200 @ $272
226 MPDPilot : I think everyone is making a bigger deal out of the issues Delta faces with this deal. Look at evey other Delta hub that WN serves. WN isn't destoying
227 Post contains links and images PHLBOS : Another update: Once this merger goes through, it's Bye-Bye Baggage Fees. http://www.boston.com/business/artic..._for_14b/?p1=Well_MostPop_Emailed3 Ex
228 Post contains images DocLightning : In other news, Richard Anderson was seen taking a load of underwear to the cleaners... This puts DL in a spot of bother, doesn't it?
229 Post contains links Revelation : Yes, in the late 90s TWA leased 717s and A318s at the same time, which many of us thought was asinine. The theory was to use the 717s on short thin r
230 william : Expect ATL to loose some flights. 31 gates will be more than enough. Airtran used ATL as a connection point, SWA does not need to, thats what Nashvill
231 jlbmedia : A few questions: With Southwest getting slots at DCA with this merger, will this have an impact on the attempted slot swap between Delta And USAirway
232 EMB170 : Actually if you are a Gold or higher Skymiles branded AMEX card holder, they already do. You don't even have to be a DL elite; you just have to hold
233 Revelation : I can believe that list is inaccurate. Does anyone have a more accurate source?
234 Coronado : As soon as WN takes control of Air Tran, i.e. even well before joint operating certificate, they will have to shut down operations at DFW. To me this
235 enilria : OK, that's much better. Just remind me again, is ROC = MIA in the example or is BUF = MIA since FLL and PBI are clearly secondary airports to MIA. I
236 USAirways787 : Thats word on the street. DFW is closing ASAP, I say again to those who keep asking. DFW IS GOING.
237 FlyPNS1 : RIC is almost 100 miles from ORF. PHF is only about 30 miles from ORF. Big difference. He's not really. For example, Oberstar thinks he's powerful an
238 rampart : No, and yes. Or does this mean that connecting at BNA will diminished, now that they have a more favorable market in ATL? I was thinking that as well
239 sldispatcher : I'm sure that will be the mantra from many..but unless they cut lots of routes or conjure several jets out of thin blue air, the 717's will stay.
240 RL757PVD : Neither is Billings Montana.... people fill airplanes, not georgraphy, and a million plus people is a lot of people in a market There is a less than
241 PHLBOS : I posted similar in the most-recent WN Baggage commercial thread, when one looks at DL's hubs (and I'm not counting focus cities or International Gat
242 Post contains links FATFlyer : What WN is currently saying is: "Q: Do you plan to keep AirTran’s Boeing 717s? A: We will continue to operate the Boeing 717, which we intend to tr
243 Boeing1970 : Southwest isn't going to keep that large of an operation at Atlanta. Not a chance. This is a good day for Delta.
244 smoot4208 : I think besides benefiting WN, the legacies stand to win the most here. Especially on the east coast (DL and US). Their main competitor was FL on the
245 Post contains images foxbravo : Hehehe, nicely done.
246 777STL : Uh, TW never had A318s, read your own link. They may have leased them or had LOIs out for them - but they never took delivery.
247 Post contains images mayor : Drama queen. Well all know that you wish the airlines were nationalized, just so they can charge less for a ticket than what it takes to operate that
248 Post contains images The777Man : The 735s are getting old and I think WN may add more 717s to replace the small subfleet of 735s. Perhaps Frontier could eventually get back their FL
249 longhaulheavy : My guess is that Southwest will capture passener traffic from north Chicago and send it to MKE, stealing pax from their Midway operations. Most Chica
250 N471wn : You mean like OAK and SFO being 8 miles apart.......trust me that proximity in populated areas works just fine for SWA
251 RL757PVD : ATL will remain a large operation but it will function very differently the BMI's and ICT's and dozens of Florida's will go away, but routes to place
252 Post contains images regupilot : And there goes our AA replacement flights! I am liking this map!
253 Revelation : Right, that's what they are currently saying. What is also true is that AirTran leases those AC and so WN will have a decision to make in a few years
254 The777Man : "This is a good day fo Delta" ????!!! funniest thing I read in a long time. DL will soon have the strongest US airline with a hub at their home airpo
255 TOMMY767 : Well.... Looks like MCO, BWI, and FLL just got OWNED.... A very interesting transaction. I like it.
256 FlyPNS1 : Why not? They have similar or larger operations at places like MDW/BWI/LAS. Why not ATL? ATL is a huge O+D market, plus it's strategically located fo
257 FATFlyer : Exactly. While there are a lot of parts to this deal, the value of the AirTran data cannot be underestimated. The information analysis will keep numb
258 Boeing1970 : Southwest isn't going to keep that hub, it'll get cut in half.
259 Post contains images AirMailer : Wow. About time! As a resident of Atlanta I've seen this as the only logical conclusion for over half-a-decade. Just wondered when WN would be ready t
260 hohd : This one is big. Southwest will now become the largest domestic carrier in the US. This goes against their slow and steady philosophy. This could be a
261 TSS : What percentage or actual number of FL's 86 717's are leased versus owned outright? I was under the impression that FL owned most of their 717's, but
262 MPDPilot : add more? how they aren't in production at most they might be able to get the 25 that went to click but unlikely. Yeah but look at MSP and DTW, WN is
263 Post contains images Aviacsa737 : Please quote where i said or implied this. Having lived in SLC for a while, i know that WN isn't always the cheapest. However they are often cheaper
264 ptcflyer : PTCFLYER's 2 Cents Worth of Observations: I see Southwest dehubbing Atlanta to a degree and making it look like their other large markets. I would red
265 Continental : So when I fly Air Tran to MCO in December, will I be flying on WN?
266 Cubsrule : Sure - but would they make money against a 300 flight a day WN operation? FL seems pretty happy with what they can do against 180 daily WN flights. N
267 rampart : Seen Denver recently? Insta-hub. Just add Canyon Blue, and shake. Jusk kidding, I don't know one way or another. Maybe WN uses BNA and draws down ATL
268 STT757 : AS, B6, US. I disagree, I see growth potential for WN in ATL. There are current WN cities that FL currently does not serve from ATL: Louisville, Nash
269 FlyIGuy : Where are the Hawaiian and Qantas Link birds in this ??? BWI and MCO yes, but I think NK would have something to say about FLL !
270 Post contains images Atlwest1 : Its actually 33 gates. They could grow the gate count by just shifting the international ATL originating flights to E that would fre up the space on
271 Quadagon : Very Exiting! I cant imagine that Delta and every other legacy carrier is very exited. However I see a few problems... 1) Southwests costs are higher
272 FlyPNS1 : That's not the government's problem. They aren't in the business of making sure airlines can make a profit in a competitors hub. Can anyone make mone
273 American 767 : Yes, I should have mentioned STL also since WN has quite a large network there (now even more traffic than AA), but I'm not sure about DEN. I think t
274 STT757 : Folks please read the WN fact page first: 717s staying, DFW closing, no Dual class, FL bag fees dropped, most if not all FL destinations kept.
275 AirMailer : Totally mis-typed that thanks to all the excitement. Accidentally combined 2 thoughts. FL 73Gs fly over the water to Aruba and they have winglets acc
276 Quadagon : Haha! I forgot to add in my other post. Airtran serves many smaller cities without other LCC's and even Legacy's in some cases. (Aka FL has monopolys
277 Post contains links HermansCVR580 : Now this could and most likely is just all talk only to kill the fire but according to this article on jsonline it stats Kelly saying that they want t
278 Post contains links Avconsultant : You are Spot On PNS1 as usual. This is a huge coup for SW not only for the hub for the IT infrastructure and the smaller sub-fleet SWA has been evalu
279 Post contains links and images FATFlyer : That bears repeating again. Plus, once again here is the link to the FAQs about the transaction including what WN has to say about all of the things
280 smoot4208 : While I wish you well in the corporate world or whatever type of job you are interviewing for, It is a relief to know that the legacy carrier turned
281 UALWN : DL will have a stronger competitor in its backyard, while UA/CO will have a stronger competitor in a region far from its core markets. Who should fee
282 bobnwa : I believe that few if any of FL's 717 are owned outright, which is the same situation with their 737's.
283 smoot4208 : The DOT/DOJ included BWI in the 2000 US/UA merger. They stated that a presence in IAD/BWI/DCA would be too grate. While I think BWI is irrelevant in
284 Post contains links enilria : Again, I'm not arguing they will fly to PHF or RIC. I think both are questionable, but FL is not a major player at RIC like they are in PHF. They may
285 Cubsrule : In the past 2-3 years, how much has BNA shrunk? It's not more than a handful of flights (or less than 5 percent). I'll make this point with respect t
286 Avconsultant : The economy and industry was a completely different animal back in 2000 compared to today.
287 UALWN : See: Isn't it already?
288 RL757PVD : WN previously said they eventually would Serving both hadnt been ruled out, and thus the special language in the agreement CHA is not even relotely c
289 FlyPNS1 : True, but you are clinging to the past. WN's model HAS to change if they want to keep growing. If they stay only in some markets and refuse to fly to
290 ikramerica : Sorry if this is repeated, but 717 is a good way for WN to retire the 735s. WN can upgrade some 717 routes to the 737 that they feel can warrant it u
291 Cubsrule : The analysis has always been about both overall concentraiton and change in concentration. While the overall concentraion at IAH or CLE is larger, th
292 william : Everyone are reading too much into 717 statement. While I do believe SWA will keep them around for the next couple of years,I do not believe the 717 w
293 ChrisNH : Right. There was a 'legend' that Southwest only went into the 'secondary cities.' That was exacerbated when they went into Providence and then Manche
294 ikramerica : You don't just get rid of a fleet of 80+ aircraft because they are no longer made anymore. And with that number, there are economies of scale in keep
295 2175301 : What you are missing is that Southwest has routes where a 117 seat plane is a much better fit than 137 seats - and the 717 buys them at least a decad
296 wjcandee : Hey. Gang. They are buying slots. They are taking out a competitor. That's it. Nothing more. Airtran's product is history. No biz class. No assigned s
297 FlyPNS1 : I've never said that was the only factor, but the ability for new entrants to have access is important. In fact, one problem with a Pepsi/Coke merger
298 isitsafenow : Oh I don't know....airlines been doing it for years..... NW and their three gadzillion inherited and bought-used DC9's AA and DL with the MD-80 They
299 KBGRbillT : This will hurt the pax numbers @ MHT if they continue going into PWM as FL does. Everyone in Maine would no longer have to go to MHT to utilize WN. Ye
300 mrskyguy : It sounds to me like Southwest is going to be more interested in looking closer at boutique cities once the merger is consummates and WN has control
301 GSPSPOT : Did a quick scan of this thread, and didn't immediately see my magic 3-letter code mentioned, so.... Would this be a good or bad portent for the annou
302 Atlwest1 : If thats what you believe then really there is no need for this "merger" that was initiated by FL itself. If thats all thats happening then whats the
303 washingtonian : Wowza. I wonder what routes WN will operate from DCA. I imagine they will keep DCA-ATL and perhaps add DCA-MDW for now.
304 Post contains links acidradio : Wow we are at 300 posts already in this thread! Since it is getting so large and takes a long time for some of our members with lower-bandwidth connec
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