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SQ Confirms SIN-BCN-GRU To Start March 2011  
User currently onlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8544 posts, RR: 13
Posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 13149 times:
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http://www.relax.com.sg/relax/news/4...st_South_American_destination.html

... SINGAPORE Airlines will have its first South American destination in March 2011 when it launches flights to the Brazilian city of Sao Paulo.

Details of the thrice-weekly service between Singapore and Sao Paulo - which will fly via Spain's Barcelona - will be released later, the carrier said on Thursday.....


Has been rumoured for a while but as far as I am aware this is first confirmation from SQ

The same article also says that they will keep 4 times weekly SIN-MXP-BCN and have 3 times weekly SIN-MXP terminating flights .


Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineHB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4498 posts, RR: 72
Reply 1, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 13095 times:

It will be interesting to see how SQ will schedule these flights. I can't think of any schedule that would make it possible to serve BCN daily with 3 SIN BCN GRU roundtrips and 4 SIN MXP BCN roundtrips without creating some overlap in at least one direction.

If all flights were to leave SIN around midnight, then this would lead to a daylight BCN GRU sector, with the aircraft returning to BCN the following day, which is exactly when the next's day's inbound SIN sector would also be arriving, hence creating an overlap of 2 simultaneous BCN SIN flights, while on other days there would not be any BCN SIN flight.


User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12917 times:

The headline is on their website, but the link to the actual news story is dead. I still think the routing is quite strange, but I guess SQ know a thing or two about how to run an airline.

User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32620 posts, RR: 72
Reply 3, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12866 times:

It will be interesting to see how it competes against Iberia. Iberia is planning to launch BCN-GRU/MEX/MIA next year.


a.
User currently offlinePA515 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2007, 870 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12797 times:

Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 2):
The headline is on their website, but the link to the actual news story is dead. I still think the routing is quite strange, but I guess SQ know a thing or two about how to run an airline.

It's the European equivalent of their SIN-SYD-LAX ambitions. Not likely to be many SIN-GRU pax. SQ is not infallible, they have made expensive mistakes with some of their investments. I hope they get run out of town.

PA515


User currently offlineKFly From Australia, joined May 2004, 194 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12719 times:

Quoting PA515 (Reply 4):
I hope they get run out of town.

What an odd thing to say. Why would you hope for something like that? They're an airline, which is in the business of transporting people and freight from one destination to another. So why do you care if most of the passengers are flying BCN-GRU-BCN rather than SIN-BRU-SIN pax?

The governments of the respective countries have obviously given their approvals, so I don't understand why is it so objectionable for SQ to make use of these rights.



Fly! My Pretties
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4868 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12719 times:

Quoting PA515 (Reply 4):
I hope they get run out of town.

And why make such a statement...?

SQ is a world class carrier and I certainly wish SQ all the best on their new route...

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3682 posts, RR: 19
Reply 7, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12703 times:

I really hope that SQ doesn't not become victim of the capacity reduction at GRU. Because of all runway, taxiway and apron renovations that will be done next year, Infraero has announced that something between 25% and 50% of the flights at GRU will be slashed from March until December. Priority for slot allocation will be based on the IATA Summer 2010 flight records.

User currently offlineycp81 From Singapore, joined Jun 2006, 410 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12685 times:

Looks like the scheduling department is gonna have a big headache..., One possibility is if they timed the SIN-BCN-GRU flight as a morning departure from SIN. But a morning departure would not be too favorable to business pax as a whole day would be wasted. Another possibility is to have 2x flights on certain days departing from BCN - SIN, but probably 1 morning and 1 evening flight.


My past and future travels - http://www.ba97.com/ba97/calendar/report.asp?handle=ycp81
User currently offlineDocPepz From Singapore, joined May 2001, 1969 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12649 times:

It reminds me of SIN-DME-IAH. Everyone thought it would fail, but it's now a daily service with ridiculous prices for F and J, and they're filling th cabin up front too, with pretty strong loads. The initial performance for DME-IAH was dismal, with loads regularly at 30% or less.

I think SQ got the rights for BCN-GRU cos no other airline was serving that route. As such they could convince the Spanish and Brazilian governments that they were opening up a new link, and all the arguments for increased tourists etc etc etc.

For SYD-LAX, it was already served by 3 airlines, and Virgin Blue indicated they wanted to start it. As such, it was very evident that SQ was going to cherrypick a very profitable route without bringing much tangible benefits in terms of tourist arrivals, stimulating demand etc. Anyway, since SQ harped and harped bout how great SYD-LAX is, DL and Virgin America have entered that route and made it unprofitable for everyone. So just as well SQ didn't start that route, and they recently indicated that they wouldn't be interested in starting that route anymore, even if they were given the rights.

Possible Schedules could be as such:

Depart SIN 0130, Arrive BCN 0830 +1
Depart BCN 1000 Arrive GRU 1600

Depart GRU 2100 Arrive BCN 1200
Depart BCN 1320 Arrive SIN 0730

Can a 10am departure get connecting feed from Spanair's Spanish and European network? If it departs SIN any later, it will get uncomfortably late for the ex SIN folks. I would guess 0200 would be the max, just like SIN-DME.


User currently offlineycp81 From Singapore, joined Jun 2006, 410 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 12574 times:

Quoting DocPepz (Reply 9):
Depart GRU 2100 Arrive BCN 1200
Depart BCN 1320 Arrive SIN 0730

Then we will have 2 SQ flights departing within 2 hrs from BCN - SIN and no flights on other day. Not very wise..



My past and future travels - http://www.ba97.com/ba97/calendar/report.asp?handle=ycp81
User currently onlineUALWN From Andorra, joined Jun 2009, 2756 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 12289 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 3):
Iberia is planning to launch BCN-GRU/MEX/MIA next year.

Do you have a source? This has been rumored for months but, as far as I know, there is no confirmation. In any case, if I have to choose between IB and SQ.... well, the choice is pretty obvious, isn't it?

Quoting PA515 (Reply 4):
It's the European equivalent of their SIN-SYD-LAX ambitions.

SQ was just granted 5th freedom rights from BCN to GRU, so it is not like SIN-SYD-LAX, but more like their now very successful SIN-DME-IAH. It will happen.



AT7/111/146/Avro/CRJ/CR9/EMB/ERJ/E75/F50/100/L15/DC9/D10/M8X/717/727/737/747/757/767/777/AB6/310/319/320/321/330/340/380
User currently offlineincitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4002 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 12205 times:

Quoting DocPepz (Reply 9):
Depart GRU 2100 Arrive BCN 1200

It will be a surprise if Brazil lets them use terminal space at GRU at 9 pm. A really big surprise....

My expectation is a 1 am arrival and a 3 am departure.


User currently offlineXA744 From Mexico, joined Mar 2004, 734 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 10689 times:

[quote=MAH4546,reply=3]It will be interesting to see how it competes against Iberia. Iberia is planning to launch BCN-GRU/MEX/MIA next year.

Yeah, but what really seems to be, even more interesting, is how SQ would be developing a feasible biz plan for the SIN-GRU vv long haul sectors.

Best regards



No matter how you fly...just never get your wings clipped !
User currently offlineairlineexpert From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days ago) and read 10514 times:

Quoting incitatus (Reply 12):


It will be a surprise if Brazil lets them use terminal space at GRU at 9 pm. A really big surprise....

My expectation is a 1 am arrival and a 3 am departure.

agreed.... EK departs later at night as well... their arrival is right before the peak evening activity.

SIN may do well in Brazil but EK and even some of the European and US gateways will clearly have an advantage in being able to serve Asia via DXB with a single connection vs. a stop and a connection.


User currently offlinetrinxat From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days ago) and read 10359 times:

I love to hear this and is indeed great news for BCN, after all the problems they have had building an intercontinental network on the last years. I will have a glass of wine to celebrate (or two)

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 3):
It will be interesting to see how it competes against Iberia.

Well to me it is pretty clear: it will not

The word competition implies comparable offerings. This is not the case by far

IB has inferior cabin, seats, inflight service.... and let's not even look at J or F

Quoting UALWN (Reply 11):
I have to choose between IB and SQ.... well, the choice is pretty obvious, isn't it?

I think I'd only fly IB when SQ is fully booked and I can't bump anyone using my gold card...  
Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 1):
It will be interesting to see how SQ will schedule these flights

Would it make sense for them to base an airplane in BCN?


User currently onlineairbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8229 posts, RR: 10
Reply 16, posted (3 years 10 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 10123 times:

Quoting DocPepz (Reply 9):
Can a 10am departure get connecting feed from Spanair's Spanish and European network?

Spanair's European network is so miniscule it's not at all relevant. This flight will have 2 O&D sectores: SIN-Spain and Spain-GRU. They can use Spanair's feed within Spain for this. And if both SQ flights are on the ground at BCN at the same time that's even better because it would allow passengers to fly MXP-BCN-GRU and back, all on SQ.


User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3323 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (3 years 10 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 8984 times:

Depart SIN 930, Arrive BCN 1730
Depart BCN 1900 Arrive GRU 01:00

Depart GRU 02:30 Arrive BCN 17:30
Depart BCN 1920 Arrive SIN 1530

In terms of focussing on Asia Pacific connections to/from BCN via SIN, wouldn't the above schedule work just as well?

Connections to BCN via SIN (arrival times into SIN):
KIX SQ 615 05:30
BNE SQ 246 05:40
MEL SQ 218 05:45
PVG SQ 825 05:50
AKL SQ 282 06:35
PEK SQ 801 06:40
HND SQ 633 06:55
PER SQ 216 07:15


Connections from BCN via Sin (departure times from SIN)

16:30 DPS SQ 946 772
16:30 SUB MI 226 319
16:35 REP MI 618 320
16:55 PEK SQ 810 772
17:00 MNL SQ 918 772
17:00 KUL SQ 116 333
17:20 CGK SQ 962 773
17:25 PVG SQ 836 772
17:40 SGN SQ 186 772
17:50 HKG SQ 2 77W
17:55 KCH MI 378 319
18:35 LGK MI 368 319
18:35 HKT MI 758 320
18:40 BKK SQ 978 772
18:40 CGK SQ 966 773
18:50 DPS SQ 948 772
19:00 PEN MI 358 319
19:20 MES MI 238 320
19:35 PER SQ 215 333
19:45 CHC SQ 297 772
20:35 SYD SQ 221 388
21:00 MEL SQ 227 388
21:15 BNE SQ 235 333
21:15 AKL SQ 285 77W
21:50 HND SQ 636 77W
23:45 MEL SQ 237 772
23:50 ADL SQ 279 333
23:50 ICN SQ 602 333
23:55 NRT SQ 638 388


User currently offlineDocPepz From Singapore, joined May 2001, 1969 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (3 years 10 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 8470 times:

Would a 0100 arrival into GRU be that appealing though?


Depart SIN 1430 Arrive BCN 2130
Depart BCN 2300 Arrive GRU 0500

Then the plane stays on the ground the whole day and returns in the evening. Could SIA still do that with 1 77W?

No - Cos the aircraft Departs SIN Day 1, Arrives GRU Day 2, Departs GRU Day 2 (Night) Arrives BCN Day 3 Afternoon and Arrives SIN Day 4 Early morning

Where will SQ get the 77W from? I suspect they'd take 1 out from HND. Why SIA wants to effectively double their Tokyo capacity overnight is really mind boggling!


User currently offlineHB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4498 posts, RR: 72
Reply 19, posted (3 years 10 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 8067 times:

Quoting DocPepz (Reply 18):
Could SIA still do that with 1 77W?
Quoting DocPepz (Reply 18):
Where will SQ get the 77W from?

Given that, on the days the GRU service will operate, the MXP service will continue to exist albeit as a terminator service, the additional capacity to be found in the SQ system will be for 3 weekly SIN BCN GRU rotations. Even in the best case scenario of minimum ground times at both BCN and GRU, that will be a tough squeeze to be accomplished with just one aircraft, so, as the B77W fleet is very well used, I presume there will be some shifting around of capacity to free up this space. I suspect that some medium haul B77W routes will be taken over by the refurbished B773s.


User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3323 posts, RR: 20
Reply 20, posted (3 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 7162 times:

Quoting DocPepz (Reply 18):
Would a 0100 arrival into GRU be that appealing though?

It depends which sector they are focussed on.
I would have thought that SQ would want some level of conenctivity onto the SINB-BCN sector, in which case it should depart 2300-0100 or 0800-1000 for connections from Australia and the region.

I can't comment on the make up of BCN-GRU traffic, slot issues at GRU or connection at GRU or BCN.


User currently offlinedowntown273 From Spain, joined Aug 2005, 296 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (3 years 10 months 16 hours ago) and read 7072 times:

Quoting DocPepz (Reply 9):
Can a 10am departure get connecting feed from Spanair's Spanish and European network?

Not really. A 10 AM departure would allow for the last connecting flight to arrive around 9:15 AM.
Now, if the departure from BCN was to be just 1 hour later, the situation is a bit different.

Spanair/Star Alliance flights and arrival times to BCN:
(^ means codeshare)

JK 5701 7:50 PMI Palma Mallorca
JK 6501 8:05 BIO Bilbao
JK 9524^ 8:30 GVA Geneva
JK 9250^ 8:30 BRU Brussels
JK 6691 8:30 AGP Malaga
JK 446 8:45 MAD Madrid
JK 8838^ 8:50 MXP Milan
JK 9508^ 9:00 ZRH Zurich
JK 9951^ 9:05 MXP Milan
JK 450 9:15 MAD Madrid
JK 5703 9:20 PMI Palma Mallorca
JK 6725 9:20 VLC Valencia
JK 6711 9:45 ALC Alicante
JK 8828^ 9:50 FRA Frankfurt
JK 38 9:55 CPH Copenhagen
JK 414 10:10 MAD Madrid
JK 9432^ 10:15 LIS Lisbon


User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2866 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (3 years 10 months 16 hours ago) and read 7047 times:
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When I read this I dropped to my knees and thanked god! I live in NYC and RIO, but I have a multi year project in Singapore! The other project is in Geneva! I feel like I did the route planning  Star Alliance is truly unbelieveable. All my miles on UA, but with TAM, SWISS and now Singapore my life of flying has just been so much easier. If I survive all that airplane food 

GRU MUST do something fast or use GIG as an entry point to Brazil.

How exciting if they could build a Star Alliance Terminal at GRU:
TAM, UNITED, AIR CANADA, LUFTHANSA,SWISS, SINGAPORE, SOUTH AFRICA and TAP!

What a wonderful thing for Brazil!?!



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlineojas From India, joined Mar 2008, 2963 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (3 years 10 months 14 hours ago) and read 6958 times:

Singapore – Barcelona – Sao Paulo 3 weekly 777-300ER

SQ068 SIN0135 – 0915BCN1025 – 1635GRU 77W 146
SQ067 GRU2200 – 1335+1BCN1445+1 – 0935+2SIN 77W 146

Singapore – Milan Malpensa – Barcelona Service operates 4 weekly, where Barcelona will be kept as Daily flight

SQ378 SIN2315 – 0600+1MXP0700+1 – 0835+1BCN 77W x146
SQ377 BCN0955 – 1135MXP1245 – 0650+1SIN 77W x257

Singapore – Milan Malpensa 3 weekly terminator service, where Milan Malpensa also kept as Daily flight

SQ368 SIN0135 – 0820MXP 77W 146
SQ367 MXP1100 – 0505+1SIN 77W 146

Source: http://airlineroute.net/2010/10/03/sq-grumxpbcn-s11/



A lion does not concern himself with the opinions of the sheep
User currently offlineDocPepz From Singapore, joined May 2001, 1969 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (3 years 10 months 14 hours ago) and read 6900 times:

If SQ67 left an hour earlier at least the BCN-SIN pax can connect to Australia. With a 0935 arrival, none of the pax will connect to Perth Brisbane Melbourne or Sydney. Or BCN-Australia pax can only fly 4 times a week basically.

25 UALWN : If I'm reading this correctly, then BCN will indeed see daily BCN-SIN service, but not really daily SIN-BCN. On Sunday, for instance, SIN-MXP-BCN lea
26 Post contains images airbazar : The 2 important ones are there: 2x MAD, 2xMXP. All others are a bonus So much for the argument that GRU lacks premium time slots. When a new airlines
27 HB-IWC : As already discussed before in this thread, there is no way of combining the SIN BCN GRU and SIN MXP GRU schedules without creating this overlap, and
28 AF086 : I can see SQ flying SIN-BCN-GRU - 4x weekly and SIN-BCN-GIG - 3x weekly with all the legs with JJ's codeshare and the BCN-GRU/GIG with JK's codeshare
29 UALWN : Well, starting in March 2011, BCN-based fliers will be able to fly to SIN 7 days a week (3 days non-stop, 4 days stopping at MXP), but they will only
30 C010T3 : Considering the fact that GRU's capacity for S11 will be declared in 3 days, that makes us all wonder how slots were allocated if the process hasn't
31 airbazar : That's a possibility although I suspect SIN-BCN-GRU will go to 5x weekly before too long. Indeed, however I doubt SQ would be selling tickets if not
32 incitatus : Have they requested a slot?
33 airbazar : The article states: The Star Alliance member is now accepting reservation at time this post goes to press (Monday Afternoon 04OCT10 Singapore time, s
34 incitatus : The latest available loads for IAH-DME are still not great. 61%, 54% and 61% for Jan/Feb/Mar 2010. I did a fare comparison between BA and SQ for IAH-
35 Post contains images airbazar : I would expect this route to be predominantly business rater than leisure which would explain the low LF. If the front of the plane is full while the
36 incitatus : SIA has very competitive fares to destinations in SE Asia from Houston, sometimes the lowest. Houston has a large immigrant contingent from Saigon an
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