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OAG Changes 11/5/2010:AA/CO/UA/DL/NK/WN/ZK  
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 11531 times:

This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now.

How to read:
Flights are daily except as noted "/wk" which means per week.
ABE-MDT 2>10/WK means a reduction from 2 daily flights to 10 flights per week which is about 1.5 flights
ABE-MDT 3>2 APR means a reduction in one roundtrip from 3 to 2 for April only
ABE-MDT 3.8>2.7 APR-JUN This is the raw format of the data which sometimes I'm too lazy to retype. It means that over a month they were averaging a little less than 4 trips per day and now it's a little less than 3 per day. So, basically they cancelled 8 flights per week or so. Airlines are doing A LOT of non-daily ops now, so these fractions are pervasive.
ABE-MDT 4>6 MAY- means an increase from 4 to 6 roundtrips starting in May and continuing
ABE-MDT 4>6 MAY-JUN, 5>6 JUL means the change is only for the stated period May to June and then a different change for July in the same route

AA
DFW-GIG 0>3/WK APR- (SVC prev ended)
DFW-GRR 2>3 FEB-
DFW-VER 0>1 FEB-
LAX-ABQ 0>3 APR-
LAX-BOI 0>2 APR-
LAX-ELP 0>2 APR-
LAX-IAH 0>3 APR-
LAX-OKC 0>1 APR-
LAX-PHX 0>4 APR-
LAX-SLC 0>3 APR-
LAX-SMF 0>4 APR-
LAX-TUS 0>3 APR-
ORD-YYZ 9>8 APR-

AC
SNA-YYZ 1>0 MAY- (no longer resumes)

B6
ANC-LGB 0>1 MAY-
LGB-OAK 3>4 MAY-

BW
JFK-GND 0>2/WK MAR- (SVC prev ended)

JM
JFK-GND 2/WK>0 FEB-

CO
CLE-SFO 2>1 MAY-
CLE-CVG 3>16/WK FEB-
EWR-ORD 10>6 JAN-FEB; 7>6 MAR-
EWR-PLS 0>1 FEB-
EWR-RTB 1/WK>0 MAR-APR (Now only Feb)
GUM-NRT 3>4 FEB-MAR
IAH-HOB 2>0 FEB (Delayed till March)

UA
ORD-LIT 3>4 FEB-
LAX-OGG 3>2 JAN-APR

DL
ATL-FLO 3>0 JAN- (Closed station)
ATL-HHH 4>0 MAR- (No longer resumes)
ATL-KIN 1/WK>0 FEB- (Appears station is closed)
ATL-LYH 2>0 JAN- (Closed station)
ATL-POP 1/WK>0 APR- (Appears closed station)
DTW-YXU 3>0 JAN- (Closed station)
MSP-DCA 7>6 APR
SLC-FAI 1>0 JUN- (FAI-MSP SVC only left)

KL
MIA-AMS 0>4/WK MAR-

NK
DFW-LAS 0>2 MAY-
FLL-CRW 0>3/WK MAR-
FLL-DFW 0>2 MAY-
FLL-IAG 0>3/WK FEB-
FLL-LBE 0>4/WK FEB-
FLL-PBG 0>4/WK JAN-
MYR-CRW 0>3/WK MAY-
MYR-DCA 0>1 MAY-
MYR-IAG 0>3/WK MAY-
MYR-LBE 0>4/WK MAY-
MYR-PBG 0>4/WK MAY-

WN
EWR-MDW 0>6 MAR-
EWR-STL 0>2 MAR-

ZK
FEB- FOR ALL
BFF-ISN 1.0>0.0
DDC-MCI 1.0>0.0
DEN-GCK 3.6>4.3
DEN-GDV 0.0>0.7
GCC-GDV 1.7>1.0
GCC-ISN 0.0>0.3
GCK-DEN 3.6>4.3
GDV-GCC 1.7>1.0
GDV-ISN 0.0>0.7
ISN-BFF 1.0>0.0
ISN-DEN 0.0>1.0
JLN-MCI 2.7>0.0
MCI-DDC 1.0>0.0
MCI-JLN 2.7>0.0

72 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinemtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2456 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 11425 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Wow, Anchorage-Long Beach on jetBlue. Nice addition. I wouldn't have thought of B6 looking at ANC service.


"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineRamblinMan From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 1138 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 11365 times:

Seems CO is severely cutting EWR-ORD and UA isn't picking up the slack. Or will these flights be replaced by UA metal eventually?

User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16861 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11127 times:

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 2):
Seems CO is severely cutting EWR-ORD and UA isn't picking up the slack. Or will these flights be replaced by UA metal eventually?

CO.com for March shows 15 daily (CO/UA combined) EWR-ORD

2 ERJ-170, 7 A319, 3 737-500, 3 737-800,



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineFL787 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 1540 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11125 times:

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 2):
Seems CO is severely cutting EWR-ORD and UA isn't picking up the slack. Or will these flights be replaced by UA metal eventually?

UA/CO had/have to give up 18 slot pairs to WN. Flights had to be cut somewhere and cutting where you overlap makes the most sense.



717,72S,732/3/4/5/G/8/9,744,752/3,763/4,772/3,D9S/5,M8/90,D10,319/20/21,332/3,388,CR2/7/9,EM2,ER4,E70/75/90,SF3,AR8
User currently offlinediverdave From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 331 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11080 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
SLC-FAI 1>0 JUN- (FAI-MSP SVC only left)

Interesting, I thought this route was profitable. I guess FAI-MSP will stay at 2x daily in season.

Thanks for posting!

David


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 10963 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
LAX-ELP 0>2 APR-

Isn't this actually an American Eagle flight?

Interesting that AA would choose to duke it out with WN in a market that they have been out of since the early 1980's  



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineSlcDeltaRUmd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3442 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 10929 times:

Quoting diverdave (Reply 5):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
SLC-FAI 1>0 JUN- (FAI-MSP SVC only left)

Interesting, I thought this route was profitable.

I think that a major factor was Frontier being on DEN-FAI they fought for the same connecting passengers. Fares were really low at parts of the summer by both carriers on the routes. Its so far away who knows with delta it might come back


User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 10823 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA
DFW-GIG 0>3/WK APR- (SVC prev ended)

That's great news! The service is no longer seasonal even before it begins!


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 10480 times:

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 1):
Wow, Anchorage-Long Beach on jetBlue. Nice addition. I wouldn't have thought of B6 looking at ANC service.

I had heard they were snooping around ANC, but I figured it was from SEA.

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 2):
Seems CO is severely cutting EWR-ORD and UA isn't picking up the slack. Or will these flights be replaced by UA metal eventually?

I would expect a lot of what goes on to be syncing issues. We saw that with DL/NW where one schedule was filed one week and the other carrier filed the balancing service a week later.

Quoting diverdave (Reply 5):
Thanks for posting!

 
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 6):

Isn't this actually an American Eagle flight?

American Eagle sells tickets under the AA code. They do not sell tickets under their own two letter code. I hope that clarifies for you.

Quoting SlcDeltaRUmd11 (Reply 7):
I think that a major factor was Frontier being on DEN-FAI they fought for the same connecting passengers.

That is likely true, but it is rare to see DL run from an LCC.


User currently offlineknope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2896 posts, RR: 30
Reply 10, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 10334 times:

Thanks as always for posting this each week!

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):

ZK
MCI-DDC 1.0>0.0
MCI-JLN 2.7>0.0

That marks the end of Great Lakes in Kansas City, and with STL already gone and MKE ending as soon as a replacement starts, Great Lakes continues to pull back west. Perhaps concentrating their assets in fewer places will help them run a better operation. It's been dismal at MKE -- looks like they canceled about 15% of their flights in September.

The end of ZK at MCI marks the first time in more than 50 years that western Kansas is cut off from Kansas City. (I suppose the MCI-Salina SeaPort flights are sort of an exception, though they don't even operate out of the terminal.)


Separately, I suspect that AirTran's drop of MKE-DFW eff January must not have hit the OAG files yet.


User currently offlinegreenair727 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 564 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10216 times:

Quote:
CO
CLE-SFO 2>1 MAY-

A hub-to-hub DECREASE? And just before summer?


User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3814 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10100 times:

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 10):
It's been dismal at MKE -- looks like they canceled about 15% of their flights in September.

Is that all? I'm sure Colgan has them beat on CRW-DCA.


User currently offlinedrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5174 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10101 times:

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 11):
A hub-to-hub DECREASE? And just before summer?

I don't think UA/CO is finished with the aircraft deployments - I think the 319/320 fleet has yet to be allocated. There are a lot of seemingly strange unanswered schedule changes - SFO-CLE decrease, ORD-LAS down to 3 flights a day, and all 319/320s leaving UA mainline at IAH.



Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7138 posts, RR: 13
Reply 14, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 10043 times:

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 10):
It's been dismal at MKE -- looks like they canceled about 15% of their flights in September.

Wow, that is awful. Nearly as bad as when YV flew for F9!  
Quoting knope2001 (Reply 10):
I suspect that AirTran's drop of MKE-DFW eff January must not have hit the OAG files yet.

I didn't even know about that. I suspect major changes at FL with WN subtlety influencing decisions.

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 11):
A hub-to-hub DECREASE? And just before summer?
Quoting drerx7 (Reply 13):
I don't think UA/CO is finished with the aircraft deployments

And they pulled down CLE-CVG before it started. Not a good sign for CLE.


User currently offlineCBPhoto From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1552 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (3 years 10 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 9968 times:

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 10):
That marks the end of Great Lakes in Kansas City, and with STL already gone and MKE ending as soon as a replacement starts, Great Lakes continues to pull back west. Perhaps concentrating their assets in fewer places will help them run a better operation.

Yup...finally we pull out of MCI, 7 months after we were told we would! A bit sad to see MCI go, just a few years ago, MCI would have no less then 6 ZK 1900s by 7AM, and now their will be nothing! Good luck to Kansas and their EAS flights!

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 10):
It's been dismal at MKE -- looks like they canceled about 15% of their flights in September.

haha...that does not surprise me at all. That is what happens when you fly 1900s with 40K + cycles on them and then isolate them from the entire system. Not quite sure what management was thinking on that one. I can say though, we could really use that 1900 back in the Denver system to give us some equipment slack!



ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
User currently offlinecle757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 9106 times:

Quoting CBPhoto (Reply 15):
And they pulled down CLE-CVG before it started. Not a good sign for CLE.

I dont see any pull down of CLE-CVG, people just love to mess with CLE.



Cleveland the best location in the Nation
User currently offlinequiet1 From Thailand, joined Apr 2010, 353 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 9095 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 14):
And they pulled down CLE-CVG before it started. Not a good sign for CLE.

??? The OP shows it going from 3/wk to 16/wk starting in FEB. Is it being pulled down later?


User currently offlinesteex From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 1645 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (3 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 9062 times:

Quoting quiet1 (Reply 17):
??? The OP shows it going from 3/wk to 16/wk starting in FEB. Is it being pulled down later?

That's a pull down from 3 daily to 16/wk, so a net loss of 5 weekly frequencies - now shown as closer to 2 daily flights rather than 3 daily flights.


User currently offlineWeb From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 427 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 9016 times:

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 10):
MKE ending as soon as a replacement starts

I may have missed this, but who is replacing ZK in MKE?



Next flight: GRR-ORD-PDX-SEA-ORD-GRR
User currently offlinecle757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 9016 times:

It operates 2 per day on Tues/Wed ,1 per day on Sat, and 3 per day Mon/Thu/Fri


Cleveland the best location in the Nation
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6126 posts, RR: 23
Reply 21, posted (3 years 10 months 16 hours ago) and read 8661 times:

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 11):

Were far out. I imagine that will change back to a second daily or possibly UA side picking up the second flight. But your right, the summer season warrants 2 daily CLE-SFO.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineCBPhoto From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1552 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (3 years 10 months 15 hours ago) and read 8475 times:

Quoting cle757 (Reply 16):
I dont see any pull down of CLE-CVG, people just love to mess with CLE

Thats odd, because I did not even mention the CLE-CVG route in my post! must have been an A-net hiccup!



ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
User currently offlineizbtmnhd From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 266 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (3 years 10 months 15 hours ago) and read 8420 times:

Considering there are 0 CLE-CVG flts. currently on UA, it's much more of an increase than a decrease.

As for the hub-to-hub stuff, EWR-ORD is pulled down as well.

Still feels like making something out of nothing.

When the real cuts come, I have a feeling you'll know it.


User currently offlineChopChop767 From Italy, joined Aug 2010, 226 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (3 years 10 months 15 hours ago) and read 8329 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):

I guess they've found a better allocation for the equipment, but sad to see the 'Newark 57' no longer being used on ord to ewr. I used to fly between Chicago and Newark quite often and it always seemed like united's dirtiest, oldest, most run down 757 was used on the route. It became a running joke. 'Ohh the Newark 57'. Oh well. Fifteen daily roundtrips is certainly a lot.

Thanks for the update.



this year: nap, lgw, fra, dub, fco, add, jib, muc, iad, sea, dca, bos, cdg, ist, bah, prg, ord, hsv, cmn
25 mogandoCI : UA/CO's hub-to-hub need to be aligned and optimized... too many competing frequencies at overlapping times Combined, UA/CO has 16 number of NONSTOP f
26 cle757 : CLE-SFO operates two per day usually June-Sept and during holidays, the rest of the time its 1 per day. I expect they will operate at least two per da
27 28L28L : Has DL's SLC-FAI always been seasonal, or has it ever operated throughout the year? Cheers.
28 Post contains images diverdave : Ah, thank you. I guess the critters ran off the widget. David
29 TOMMY767 : I wouldn't put too much thought into March yet as that will likely change anyway.... According to UA.com in Jan/Feb, EWR-ORD still gets 2x 757, EWR-D
30 knope2001 : DFW-MKE disappeared effective 1/3/11 just the other day. Probably hasn't hit OAG yet. We all know that DFW will have to end as soon as WN completes t
31 knope2001 : Not yet chosen. Great Lakes has not rebid because they were only interested if it was ESC/IMT/MBL/IWD, and DL* got fhe first two. Charter Air and Sov
32 flyinryan99 : I was actually told they received it over the summer. This is why they have been able to bid on more and more EAS flights. The reason why they aren't
33 yellowtail : DL has really struggled to get a foot hold in KIN.....where the VFR market is king and requires alot of on the ground attention unlike the tourism bu
34 Post contains images enilria : Steex is correct, please refer to the "how to read" section above when you are confused. What kind of schedule mess is that? Ridiculous. As you know,
35 MAH4546 : How are they supposed to make it work? Something like 85% of the market is going to MIA, FLL and NYC. Heck, KIN-DAM is a larger local market than KIN
36 HPAEAA : maybe UA will pick up the slack with their metal?
37 GlobalCabotage : ORD-EWR is going hourly on UA/CO. No need to have a flight at 7:00am and 7:05 am when you can do 6am to 9pm hourly. Not to mention ORD-LGA is hourly +
38 izbtmnhd : Again, there's no existing service right now. So even if they pulled back roughly "1/2" of a daily flight...it's still 2 "1/2" more daily flights tha
39 MaverickM11 : From ATL? No way.
40 SurfandSnow : It's amazing how this obscure route worked out.. and this popular one didn't. You just never really know until you try! I'm sure this is just the beg
41 GlobalCabotage : If the AirTran merger with Southwest happens, AirTran will have to leave DFW. Not sure why they would be adding BWI only to cut. Given how fast DL/NW
42 enilria : That's true of a ton of markets DL flies. That's not unique to KIN. ATL is the largest hub in the world. See above. They fly from other places, but D
43 MAH4546 : DL has flown both JFK-KIN and JFK-POP to no success.
44 enilria : This is not intended as an attack of B6, but why shouldn't DL be able to do as well as B6 in JFK? It's not even a low fare market. The yields are dec
45 Schweigend : The AA changes struck me more than any of the others you mentioned this week. I'm glad and reassured to see AA moving agressively to counter or pre-e
46 MAH4546 : It's not a resumption. The service was not going to operate during April and May, but now will. Five of the routes - ELP, TUS, ABQ, IAH, OKC - are si
47 Schweigend : This new-found AA toughness in LA may also work at ORD. UA and AA at ORD don't want to kill each other -- they just want to bump chests, like strong m
48 wwtraveler99 : If the service is to start in the spring Mar/Apr then it may never happen. WN expects the deal to close by Mar 1, 2011. So they announce service that
49 MaverickM11 : You'd think they could at least undercut AA at JFK, but their inability to make most ethnic Caribbean ex JFK work is only matched by the nonexistence
50 yellowtail : But one would think that DL would be able to at least draw scraps of passengers from DTW, MSP, JAX, MCI, FRA, SEA etc every day to make at least a CR
51 ScottB : Because there's really little cost to keeping it in the schedule for now. The number of rebookings that might be required even two months out for a s
52 Cubsrule : I always wondered about that. When MCI, STL and MKE were at their peak, it seemed like it might have been economical to do some maintenance somewhere
53 bobnwa : What exactly did AA and CO do, to court the locals in BZE, that DL was not doing?
54 SESGDL : DL was able to fill flights to KIN just fine, it was yields that were likely the problem. DL could always undercut AA on MIA-KIN and have some passen
55 yellowtail : CTO/GSAs, advertising, offering buy 20 get one free tickets to business, going after gov't travel contracts, etc etc This is being changed as we spea
56 enilria : What's amazing to me is that these planes were moved directly from SJU. In SJU they dominated the market and now they are going into WW3 in LAX with
57 mariner : So what do they do about the Skywest flying? They have to give 120 days notice - or pay them out, I guess. mariner
58 bobnwa : What in your opinion is Delta failing to due to gain the ethnic market In NYC Florida and LAX. Are you referring only to flights to the Caribbean?
59 realsim : Both things are unrelated because all the new flights from LAX are in ERJ or CRJ equipment, while in SJU only ATR are flown, so the 2/3 aircraft that
60 ScottB : Except that the ERJ's & CR7's operating the new LAX flights didn't exactly appear from thin air; they came from other hubs like MIA and DFW. The
61 MAH4546 : No, actually the CR7s did/will appear from thin air, since there are 13 CRJ-700s that are being delivered between now and June, in addition to the ni
62 Cubsrule : I think it's working for them, so they'll keep it around as long as they can (WN probably doesn't mind it either, as long as it's making money for FL
63 mariner : I'm simply interested in the process. Skywest can't fly for Southwest (pilots contract) and Airtran has to give them 120 days notice to end the deal.
64 FL787 : I don't think it's going to be much of a problem. I would guess that the OO flying will go away at the end of the summer schedule assuming that the d
65 Cubsrule : They'll have more than 120 days between approval (by all relevant parties) and a single certificate, so I expect that they'll give OO notice upon app
66 enilria : I think they will give OO notice the day they legally control FL. The issue is that you don't sell tickets outside the USA the same way you sell tick
67 Cubsrule : I think we are saying the same thing in slightly different ways.
68 LAXdude1023 : Most of it came from ORD, not MIA or DFW.
69 bobnwa : Thanks, good explanation. What percentage of tickets on these flights are sold in the US vs MX/DR/Jamaica/Brazil etc.?
70 enilria : That's fair. BTW, keep in mind that credit cards are very hard to get in those places. That's hard for us to imagine since I could cover my kitchen w
71 MAH4546 : I don't believe it is coming much from Chicago either. A lot of it is coming from the drastic reduction in Eagle point-to-point flying, which will be
72 C010T3 : Considering that it was AA's first route to Brazil, it is not obscure at all. It's a shame that it is not being started on December 14th, which would
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