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Smisek To CLE: "God Doesn't Grant You Hub Status"  
User currently offlineN766UA From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 8366 posts, RR: 23
Posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 22449 times:

http://www.cleveland.com/business/in...e_united_ceo_jeff_smisek_says.html

"Asked during a question-and-answer period about what benchmarks a hub needs in order to survive, Smisek said the key was profitability based on 'consistent' business travel demand.

'And you haven't been able to do that,' he said, 'and we've stuck by you all these years."


Frankly, I think Smisek sucks. He's single handedly ruining the best legacy carrier in the country. The least he could do at this point is give a straight answer instead of this executive double-talk. Only more evidence in favor of the "CLE is a goner" camp. Shame.


This Website Censors Me
167 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineUnitedSuperDC8 From United States of America, joined May 2008, 84 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 22404 times:

Hmm sounds to me like he gave a very direct answer! When you look at how strong the new network is...CLE isn't that important. It will have to prove it is worth the assets devoted to the hub in order to maintain the current level of service. Very good business sense. The shareholders have to love this guy!


No thanks - keep the 'Change'.....Al Gore invented two things: the internet & global warming
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15828 posts, RR: 27
Reply 2, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 22295 times:

Quoting UnitedSuperDC8 (Reply 1):
Hmm sounds to me like he gave a very direct answer!

That's what is sounds like to me. No pretending that Cleveland is here to stay or that they could hope to compete with Chicago. He just stated the way it is.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinesilentbob From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 2176 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22253 times:

Quoting N766UA (Thread starter):
Frankly, I think Smisek sucks. He's single handedly ruining the best legacy carrier in the country. The least he could do at this point is give a straight answer instead of this executive double-talk. Only more evidence in favor of the "CLE is a goner" camp. Shame.

Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean it isn't a straight answer.


User currently offlineSlcDeltaRUmd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3636 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22217 times:

I would certainly say these comments are not a good sign at all for CLE. I would have to say based on the comments that he has already made his mind up about CLE.

It seems like UA could use the "segment profitability clause" to downgrade.

When do the gate leases expire? I doubt we will see CLE crumble as quickly as STL, PIT or CVG did though. Although all those hubs including CLE had one thing in common they lost out to closer big brother of the same airline. Lets all hope CLE survives at least as a small regional hub but reading this article makes it hard to see if long term. I feel like its now a WHEN not IF with this guy running the ship.

[Edited 2010-11-11 20:03:48]

User currently offlineN766UA From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 8366 posts, RR: 23
Reply 5, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22165 times:

Quoting silentbob (Reply 3):
Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean it isn't a straight answer.

It's certainly a clear answer, but it's far from straight. You can't say you're "committed" to something only if it's making you money hand over fist. You're either committed or you aren't, and they clearly aren't, so he should quit saying they are!



This Website Censors Me
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17820 posts, RR: 46
Reply 6, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22077 times:

"The former Continental hub at Cleveland Hopkins International Airport is safe only if it makes money for the new United. "

Isn't that true for any hub, any where on earth, operated by any carrier other than Air Koryo?



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineTigerguy From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1001 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22025 times:

Quoting N766UA (Reply 6):
Quoting silentbob (Reply 3):
Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean it isn't a straight answer.

It's certainly a clear answer, but it's far from straight. You can't say you're "committed" to something only if it's making you money hand over fist. You're either committed or you aren't, and they clearly aren't, so he should quit saying they are!

Well, "committed" doesn't necessarily mean keeping it as a hub, I suppose. Perhaps a focus city status is in order if not hub status. The level of that commitment will be determined when the agreement runs out, it seems.



Flying friendly for a while, but is that a widget I see in the rear-view mirror?
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15828 posts, RR: 27
Reply 8, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22025 times:

Quoting N766UA (Reply 6):
You can't say you're "committed" to something only if it's making you money hand over fist. You're either committed or you aren't, and they clearly aren't, so he should quit saying they are!

Well, there is the slight detail that as a company, they are committed to making money. If a shareholder asks why they continue to operate an unprofitable hub, an answer of "we said we are committed to them" is going to sound really stupid.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 7):
Isn't that true for any hub, any where on earth, operated by any carrier other than Air Koryo?

Yep.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinelambertman From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2081 posts, RR: 36
Reply 9, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 22000 times:

Quoting SlcDeltaRUmd11 (Reply 5):
When do the gate leases expire? I doubt we will see CLE crumble as quickly as STL, PIT or CVG did though. Although all those hubs including CLE had one thing in common they lost out to closer big brother of the same airline. Lets all hope CLE survives at least as a small regional hub but reading this article makes it hard to see if long term. I feel like its now a WHEN not IF with this guy running the ship.

Crumble as quickly? St. Louis stuck as a hub for 9 years post-merger and would have longer if not for a fundamental shift in American's business strategy.

I feel bad for Cleveland, because I know where this ends. The only problem is that its a long song and dance, each party going back and forth about concessions and guarantees. After all of the posturing and promises are over with, United will will pack up shop and head for greener pastures. It's a tough transition, especially if you look at it from an economic standpoint.

But in any case, Smisek shouldn't be saying things like that. It's very insensitive and it serves no real purpose other than to ruin employee morale in Cleveland. Just....not a good move in my opinion.


User currently offlineIAHFLYR From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 4790 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 21945 times:

Quoting lambertman (Reply 10):
But in any case, Smisek shouldn't be saying things like that. It's very insensitive and it serves no real purpose other than to ruin employee morale in Cleveland. Just....not a good move in my opinion.



Simply put, totally the sellout guy. IMHO, he thinks he has the charisma of Gordon Bethune which he does not even enter into the parking lot of Gordon's arena.



Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
User currently offlineB595 From UK - Scotland, joined Mar 2009, 306 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 21888 times:

God does not come from on high and grant you hub status

It would be nice if he could keep his supernatural beliefs separate from his business discussions.


User currently offlineSlcDeltaRUmd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3636 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 21890 times:

Quoting lambertman (Reply 10):
Crumble as quickly? St. Louis stuck as a hub for 9 years post-merger and would have longer if not for a fundamental shift in American's business strategy.

Crumble i meant as soon as AA decided to dismantle the hub it went pretty fast. An airline cant go from full hub to spot on the map overnight. STL went pretty fast from a huge hub to a spot on AAs map.


User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3847 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 21836 times:

Quoting N766UA (Reply 6):
It's certainly a clear answer, but it's far from straight. You can't say you're "committed" to something only if it's making you money hand over fist. You're either committed or you aren't, and they clearly aren't, so he should quit saying they are!

That's as direct and true of a business statement as you're going to get. Why would you commit to something that's unprofitable in the long term or even less profitable than other viable options?


Personal feelings for this guy aside, he kept it REAL.


User currently offlineUSAirALB From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 3169 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 21812 times:

I hat Smisek...I dunno why Larry left. If Larry didnt leave UA+CO would not happen, CO would still be serving meals, and CLE will be alive and well.

Smisek is just 10000x more conservative than Larry I guess..



E135/E140/E145/E70/E75/E90/CR2/CR7/CR9/717/732/733/734/735/73G/738/739/752/753/762/772/319/320/321/333
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17820 posts, RR: 46
Reply 15, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 21783 times:

Quoting lambertman (Reply 10):
St. Louis stuck as a hub for 9 years post-merger and would have longer if not for a fundamental shift in American's business strategy.

A shift away from losing money?



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineAirport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21586 times:

Well if you ask me, that was a pretty stupid response. Sure it may be truthful, and it may be best to shed the CLE hub... I won't go there for this discussion... but to me, from a PR point of view, it was a stupid response. It only polarizes employees and diminishes morale among CLE employees, not to mention it just makes him look like a straight-up corporate douche. Maybe that's who he his, maybe not, but it's a poor choice to communicate yourself like that.

Cheers,
Anthony/Airport


User currently offlinelambertman From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2081 posts, RR: 36
Reply 17, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21569 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 16):
A shift away from losing money?

It's common knowledge American was making money in St. Louis post 2003 cuts until the 2008 oil spikes; Arpey even acknowledged that himself. When the oil prices normalized, American had already began dismantling the "hub" because of the poor performance during the oil spikes. Even if it was going to return to its 2003-2007 level of profitability in 2009, it was too late as AA had began to implement its ORD/MIA/DFW/LAX/JFK/LGA capacity strategy and it was all over.

So no, losing money wasn't the problem. The motivation was better utilization of the aircraft in what are, quite obviously, AA's bread and butter markets.


User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17820 posts, RR: 46
Reply 18, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21386 times:

Quoting lambertman (Reply 18):

So no, losing money wasn't the problem.

I guarantee you AA would never shut down a profitable hub.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineFL787 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 1551 posts, RR: 12
Reply 19, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21356 times:

Flame away but I've been impressed with Smisek so far. He's made two things clear: UA is going to be disciplined with capacity and profits will guide decisions. Hopefully we'll be hearing about some important decisions like E+ pretty soon.


717,72S,732/3/4/5/G/8/9,744,752/3,763/4,772/3,D9S/5,M8/90,D10,319/20/21,332/3,388,CR2/7/9,EM2,ER4,E70/75/90,SF3,AR8
User currently offlinemrskyguy From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1214 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21251 times:

Quoting N766UA (Thread starter):
Frankly, I think Smisek sucks. He's single handedly ruining the best legacy carrier in the country. The least he could do at this point is give a straight answer instead of this executive double-talk. Only more evidence in favor of the "CLE is a goner" camp. Shame.

I met Smisek for the second time at the executive COA Night event last month, and he's just.. odd. His choice of wording and his clumsy nature come off arrogant and aloof. Now I don't know him well enough to understand his acumen, but the glass he sent flying at last year's event and the bizarre comment he made afterwards left the crowd unimpressed.



"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee." -- Gunter's 2nd Law of Air
User currently offlineairportugal310 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3717 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21219 times:

The supposed way some people would run a business, based on the comments, are scary! (at best)

The guy tells it the way it is...can't hate on that.



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlineMax Q From United States of America, joined May 2001, 4778 posts, RR: 19
Reply 22, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 21221 times:

Quoting N766UA (Thread starter):

Frankly, I think Smisek sucks. He's single handedly ruining the best legacy carrier in the country. The least he could do at this point is give a straight answer instead of this executive double-talk. Only more evidence in favor of the "CLE is a goner" camp. Shame.

Have to agree.Typical rhetoric from him though.



Remember he is basically an attorney. Talking out of both sides of his mouth is what he knows best.



He should have just given a straight answer. CLE will be gone as soon as they can find a way out.



I have great misgivings in his uninspired leadership and think he was a terrible choice for CEO.



The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
User currently offlinecactus742 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 240 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 21575 times:

Wow, Smisek's level of double-talk in that article is pretty amazing. He says UA/CO is committed to CLE, but with conditions. That isn't commitment!

If he wants to say that CLE only stays if it makes a certain amount of money, then fine... but stick to that.



Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive.
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15828 posts, RR: 27
Reply 24, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 21435 times:

Quoting cactus742 (Reply 25):
He says UA/CO is committed to CLE, but with conditions.

That is probably the only type of commitment in business. And having that conditional commitment is what separates businesses from charities.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
25 nws2002 : Smisek is good at offending people, and then smirking and saying he didn't mean it. Anyone remember him calling US the ugly girl that no one wanted t
26 Rising : "Asked during a question-and-answer period about what benchmarks a hub needs in order to survive, Smisek said the key was profitability based on 'cons
27 UAL747DEN : I don't think his answer could have been more clear and direct. CLE didn't pull its weight as a CO hub and now that the UA/CO integration is starting
28 Post contains links einsteinboricua : I would rather Smisek tell the truth, no matter how harsh, up front than being told a fairytale and find out that the fairytale is actually a nightma
29 SurfandSnow : How is he ruining CO? By keeping them consistently profitable, taking deliveries of many brand new a/c and upgrading the rest of the fleet with excel
30 IAHFLYR : And where would that congestion be at IAH? Other than Terminal E ramps where the poor air-side design allows two aircraft in the alley and then all m
31 thegreatRDU : CLE is a goner.... I hope the new UA doesn't even honor the illegal agreement they signed with the local CLE politicians and start dismantling...
32 stlgph : St. Louis made money but didn't make the money American wanted it to, thanks to their purposeful slicing and dicing.
33 upcfordcruiser : Yea we should go the Pan Am route and foster failure... allow the weak to continue being weak and bleed the airline of money. Personally, I applaud th
34 IAHFLYR : While I won't disagree with you of the need to fix the CLE issue, I believe the manner in which it was addressed is completely unprofessional and not
35 Josh32121 : They already have hubs in the greener pastures...ORD, EWR, and IAD. CLE will not be a hub in 3-5 years, and if DL had the guts, CVG wouldn't have the
36 bobnwa : Seems to me his answer was very truthful and forward. Apparently, some people feel it was evasive or deceitful or something of that ilk, but I do not
37 SurfandSnow : Terminals C and E aren't exactly quiet underused places, nor is Terminal B. Assuming a CLE hub closure for the old CO, shifting all those mainline pl
38 Post contains images IAHFLYR : There actually are a few hours in the day when C/E are not totally utilized, even though it may only be 5-6 gates that is 5-6 more flights in and out
39 AAExecPlat : As a long-time Platinum on CO (since 2003), let me just say that Smisek is the WORST CEO that could have taken over from Larry. Now Larry wasn't Gordo
40 joeman : How could CLE pull it's weight as a hub when it's been screwed with substantially inconsistent levels of service both up and down outside of the basi
41 fsnuffer : Yeah, he was only pretending before DOJ approved the merger. Once his attorney doublespeak was accepted by congress and the feeble CLE city leadershi
42 MaverickM11 : Technically that's correct, but the same could be said of Independence Air--it didn't make the money its investors wanted it to. No rational airline,
43 Post contains images ocracoke : That one comment probably ruined your whole day, eh? What would be nice is for you to realize that some out there still "believe" in God, and to be m
44 enilria : Actually, no. What you'll find is that airlines will lose money for years in a hub if they are fighting another carrier and they believe winning that
45 joeljack : Continental flew OMA-CLE for about 6 months a couple a years ago (it was part of a large expansion in CLE) They dropped all the service to every expan
46 Post contains links SonomaFlyer : CLE 's advantage was its geography to compete with ORD. I'm sorry to say this but CLE is no longer a center for manufacturing. It's a city which has l
47 ckfred : Simple fact. A hub cannot survive solely on connecting traffic. It must have a fair amount of O&D traffic. AA learned this lesson with RDU and BNA
48 danfearn77 : Whether you like the guy or not surely he makes good business sence? How can he Justify operating from CLE if it doesnt make UA any money. That define
49 enilria : The message was unmistakable: The former Continental hub at Cleveland Hopkins International Airport is safe only if it makes money for the new United.
50 mayor : When did DL ever use all 10 gates on L? IIRC, they almost immediately leased out at least two of them and it wasn't that long where they actually ope
51 cloud4000 : CLE was the smallest of CO hubs prior to the merger anyway! So that UA/CO will de-hub at CLE should be no big surprise to anyone. Perhaps a LCC will m
52 flyguy89 : A question: Drama aside, how important is the CO hub to Cleveland? I say this because it doesn't seem like the CLE hub ever massively grew, daily flig
53 mayor : What year did DL give up on DFW?
54 joeman : Swiped from a CLE local forum about same: According to the FAA's most recent (2009) CATS data, CLE's cost per emplaned passenger is $15 cheaper than
55 mogandoCI : At least he's super direct to spell out CLE's imminent death, as opposed to DL pretending that CVG and MEM still has a future (and wasting money on th
56 Iflewrepublic : To answer Mayor's question, Delta closed the DFW hub in 2005. Delta Connection eclipsed Delta mainline in number of flight offerings in 2001.
57 mayor : Thanks.......DL@DFW was another case of a carrier giving up on a hub because of being beaten by another carrier (AA).
58 mkirch72 : I am a native Clevelander and would love nothing more than to see the hub at CLE be long-term. However, you are all forgetting that you are dealing wi
59 mogandoCI : What CO status are you ? i'm only CO Gold (equiv to any 50K status), and i routinely get upgrades to LAX, SFO, and LAS (3 of the more popular destina
60 Goblin211 : unfortunately, the airline busineess is still a business and as we all should know executives take this to an extreme even at the price of a good airp
61 msp747 : I think they officially pulled the plug in February 2005, but I remember flying through in early November 2004 and it was already a ghost town. I thi
62 enilria : It's important because of CAK. CAK has virtually all the LCC service except WN which has to decide which airport to keep. Either CLE or CAK will be h
63 GQfluffy : CVG took five years to "crumble" as you so put it. CLE will take about the same amount of time regardless of leases. DL still has leases on all of Te
64 SESGDL : We all see how well that worked... They'd have to start with a profitable hub first. This follows a strategy that I have been clueless about regardin
65 Post contains images EricR : I'm surprised by all the Smisek criticizers out there. He has done a great job of leading CO, so I'm not sure why so many are criticizing him for his
66 Post contains images enilria : This is happening much faster than CVG. DL never said anything as blunt as what Smisek just said. DL never even admitted CVG is no longer a hub. I th
67 YULWinterSkies : These simply aren't things to be said by a company exec, whether these are true or not. There is no doubt that the future of CLE hub is, at the best,
68 joeman : and the LCC's will dominate domestic travel by far, more conveniently as well, with less reliance on squeezing travellers through their transfer poin
69 Post contains links joeman : nearly everyone has, read posts to article on http://www.cleveland.com/business/in...e_united_ceo_jeff_smisek_says.html Indeed, they just want to mov
70 joeman : CO's model concerning EWR, IAH, and CLE for years now...
71 greenair727 : aaexecplat--you should write a letter to each of the board members stating what you did in your post. Hopefully, Smisek could be removed before the ai
72 Post contains links deltacto : http://www.departedflights.com/DLDFWhub.html 01 December 2004 DL operated 154 flights (44 Mainline, 110 DL Connection) 01 February 2005 DL operated ju
73 dz09 : Don't make him to be the guy who made Continental what it is today. He's only been running it for a short time and he's running it to the ground. CO
74 manfredj : A good marriage between employees and management is key to the success of a company. This is the ONLY way to run an airline. Then and only then will
75 N766UA : The manner in which he did it! You take an RJ laden hub that you've been giving peanuts for years, a place where your employees bust their asses ever
76 Northwest727 : I hate to say it, but I am part of that camp. UA left CLE some 25 years ago give or take, and they'll do it again. I will say, and always will say, m
77 joeman : UMM, why? Just to be nice? All these years yet? A complete crock...Please do what you have to break that ridiculously flimsy contract conceived as a
78 SlcDeltaRUmd11 : Hey i dont want CLE to go. We have lost too many hubs recently but i cant really think of any reason why United has to keep it. They can route all of
79 IAHFLYR : Home Run!!!! As a OnePass Elite since 2000 and Platinum since 2003, as others have replied in this thread, Sellout smisek is going to lose a bunch of
80 JCS17 : What do CLE, STL, CVG, and PIT have in common? They've been losing white-collar jobs for the past thirty years to the East Coast, West, and the Sunbel
81 flyguy89 : Not Cincinnati and, more recently, Pittsburgh. Cincinnati has a very robust corporate sector and the Cincy metro area has been growing for the past 1
82 jetdeltamsy : Respectfully, you are wrong. STL had not been a viable hub for ANY airline since before the OZARK/TWA merger. The St Louis region simply could not pr
83 SlcDeltaRUmd11 : More than this they all had a same airline hub close by. Based on these examples MEM could be next at 332 miles away from the world largest hub. CLT
84 Post contains images joeman : Then D.C. can thank God compared to the talents of many of it's public sector base.
85 lambertman : What am I supposed to do? Tell the American Airlines CEO that he is wrong? I mean? At 180 flights a day, it was making money, and it did for an exten
86 vgnatl747 : Sorry, but I disagree with you. The new UA is committed to CLE and any other hub or station that has the necessary demand, and meets that demand with
87 AAExecPlat : I have no idea what actual routes you fly, but I fly largely in and out of EWR to IAH and AUS. And I buy cheap fares (T, W, and the occasional U or G
88 B595 : Yup, you're right. I was so upset I wrote a whole sentence about it. Business is about rational decision making, not faith. As an investor, I want to
89 UAL747DEN : There are so many things wrong with this statement I will just say NO! You think that things are happy over at WN between management and employees? W
90 joeman : OK
91 EricR : Sounds like he is very passionate about his airline, specifically his UA tulip. Unfortunately, the tulip will be a distant memory in a couple years.
92 Tigerguy : You kinda left out the rest of his statement before and after that little part...hooray for quoting out of context! Tulips notwithstanding, UA is app
93 usa330300 : I love having the hub in CLE, but Smisek was very direct. If it doesn't make money why would any business leader continue status quo? It isn't good bu
94 mogandoCI : mine are mostly the lower buckets (WESTNL), and only up to H once out of necessity. i fly out of EWR, and mostly to SFO/LAS with the occasional LAX.
95 DeltAirlines : As a CO Plat, I'm honestly shocked that you as a Gold are running around 50% on EWR-West Coast on mostly WESTNL fares. Are you mostly flying at off-p
96 N766UA : More like A to C with a 5 hour delay at B, and for many, many prices (depending on how crappy I want my flight to be.)
97 SESGDL : Really? Tell that to Ozark and TW like you mentioned, or even AA, all of whom hubbed there for nearly 30 years. STL's O&D before its dehubbing wa
98 dz09 : Who is talking about emotions here. We're talking about common sense. How is killing a perfectly fine company like Continental a good business decisi
99 United1 : My question for you is why...as a customer you haven't seen any changes (outside of some gate moves and hearing Rhapsody on the safety video) that ar
100 Post contains images SESGDL : Business 101 will tell you differently, emotions play a huge role in operating any business because business is run by people, for people, not machin
101 SESGDL : Smisek, is that you? But on a serious note, no one knows what this merger will hold, both positively and negatively. You're being just as speculative
102 dz09 : Ok here are the changes i've seen so far: 1- This summer was the first time in at least 10 years I could not use my miles to take my family to our ye
103 United1 : That is more likely the result of loads being very high this year then anything to do with the merger....which hadn't occurred even this summer...als
104 joeman : You kinda left out the rest of his statement before and after that little part...hooray for quoting out of context! [/quote] OK: here's the before and
105 Squid : I would say that the article and Smisek's comments were rather straight forward, the CLE hub has to hold their own against EWR and ORD or else face di
106 N766UA : I disagree. A lack of caring for your customers and your employees will absolutely put you out of business one day. You have to find a middle ground.
107 BMI727 : They wouldn't. And I like that Smisek has the balls to say so.
108 N766UA : Does anyone actually have the numbers? Is CLE losing money? And, if so, is CO doing everything it can to maximize their potential there? It seems to
109 BMI727 : I bet Smisek does. Well, would you rather have a hub that you have to fight to keep profitable at all, or just beef up other hubs that are already pr
110 N766UA : Clearly I'd rather not have to put forth any effort whatsoever anywhere.
111 MaverickM11 : I think that's the view of the cities of STL/PIT/CVG/BNA/CMH etc, and that is why they no longer have hubs.
112 LouieP2186 : I was hired on in CLE in 2008 when this happened (before almost being furloughed in 2009 and was forced to transfer to TUL). Jumping from XJT to CO.
113 Post contains images LouieP2186 : As a employee of so said airline I fully agree. The government is paying for this route which is why we are running it. The government feels that ser
114 fun2fly : Jeff is a sharped tongued lawyer, not and eloquent or motivating speaker. My take is that the board kept Tilton around, well, just in case. He's a tra
115 Post contains images UAL777UK : WHAT! People have killed for a less of a comment! FWIW I am over the moon that these two great airlines have merged. I just wish we could fast forwar
116 United1 : Every CEO is out to make money...thats including Gordo when he was running the show. UA has not taken over COs flight ops yet so if CO is not holding
117 Post contains images IAHFLYR : Was this the last flight of the day from IAH to EWR? If not and other flighs or connections had seats CO has been in the practice for some time of ge
118 Post contains links Gordomatic : Are you referring to to the Essential Air Service program? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_Air_Service http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington
119 mayor : It's not the company so much but the pressure that the DOT puts on the airlines to be on time. DL has run into the same problem and it seems to have
120 manfredj : No one is disputing Gordon's thirst to make a profit for Continental, but I think no one can doubt he managed to do it while keeping his empoyees hap
121 N766UA : Well yeah, of course, they're a business! But the point is you can be customer friendly AND make a profit. And they aren't disguising anything- they
122 United1 : I don't disagree...that being said I don't think anyone has given Smisek a chance to do that at UA yet. I would be careful about saying that the adve
123 Post contains links manfredj : Maybe it's tied to the airline, but not for all the right reasons. Sad story for this lady, and she knows a lot about the airline industry: http://le
124 rampart : Doesn't your comment now demonstrate that happy customers are the way to make money? Seems like a sound strategy, no disguise at all. -Rampart
125 boilerla : Easy. They're foreign airlines with no domestic operations in the US. If you had said "Delta, American and USAirways" then it'd be a different story,
126 xms3200 : Personally, I think Jeff Smisek was being honest. Granted, it sounded harsh, but CLE get a lot of needless air time on this forum because there are a
127 N766UA : Wow.
128 jfk777 : Its sounds like many of the Cleveland employees have been there a long time, wouldn't they have seniority at other United hubs ? Shouldn't the "new"
129 United1 : The Internet is riddled with one sided negative stories about every airline and company for that matter...United certainly is not the only company to
130 catiii : Any number of reasons in addition to that. For example, they get favorable financing terms from the Export-Import Bank through a flood of official ex
131 LouieP2186 : Indeed I am. And to who made the comment about CLE workers getting hired on right out of high school and making to much money.....what is the problem
132 BMI727 : That's all well and good, but if the hub isn't making any money, Continental won't have a choice.
133 LouieP2186 : I agree if it's not making money than do something about it but what he said wasn't right. Our economy sucks so lets hope that something good happens
134 BMI727 : I don't think so. It would be much much worse for Smisek to blow smoke at them and say it's all good when it might not be. Straight shooters are a ra
135 LouieP2186 : I agree they are rare but CLE is classified as a "HUB" in the CO network. If they are not making money lets try and solve the problem and if it can't
136 United1 : I think thats exactly what Smisek said in a round about way...We have to make CLE work and were going to be working with you to make that happen howe
137 LouieP2186 : Yeah. I'm not saying to sugar coat it but don't say "God doesn't grant you hub status" when you call them a hub on your website....in the Continental
138 Post contains images unmlobo : I don't mean to harp on you but someone could take that as an offensive statement, calling people of faith "not rational". I won't take it that way t
139 KGRB : At the risk of being off-topic, there's something that I want to point out. I've read a few posters who've alluded to the fact that "DL is de-hubbing
140 B595 : I'm glad you didn't take it that way, because that was not my point. This is not a question of the validity of one's personal beliefs or faith. It's
141 Squid : It's possible that the city or governing board over CLE realizes that they are a less vital hub to CO as well as less vital as a hub to any airline t
142 manfredj : Funny, many United States Presidents have openly looked to God in their decisions when it comes to our defense, political and financial decisions. I'
143 nyc2theworld : I don't think he meant it as hy Eh, thousands of people have died "in the name of God" over the years. Hhis/Her/Its track record is mixed at best.
144 mayor : Unless I'm mistaken, Smisek directed this comment to the CLE business community and not the employees working at the hub. Just my perception.
145 Owleye : A very straight answer, I like that. But what has God to do with it? That annoys me. He is just a simple human being like you and me, just Jeff Smisek
146 mayor : And millions have died, not in the name of God, over the years. What's your point?
147 nyc2theworld : Point being basing a business decision on your faith yields mixed results and is more a matter of luck if it is successful.
148 777STL : I would disagree. It took over two years post acquisition before AA finally made meaningful cuts in 2003 and AA's STL operation was still quite notew
149 Slider : Problem is...Jeff thinks he's Gordon but can't carry it off so his delivery sounds far more flippant and arrogant than the homespun Gordon in many wa
150 flyguy89 : hmmmm...some one hasn't been paying attention to the OAG update threads. In any case I agree with your basic point, I've noticed some of the replies
151 EricR : And who do you propose run the airline? Heaven forbid the unions, FA's, pilots, mechanics, gate agents take over the asylum. No need. Front line empl
152 FWAERJ : Amen. And some of the flights cut from CLE weren't even half full. Toward the end, FWA-CLE, which was one of the routes cut in the CLE hub cutbacks,
153 TOMMY767 : I've been gradually reading this thread for the last 5 days or so and haven't been able to comment because I've been working on set and reading off my
154 mayor : Yeah, that worked out REAL well for UA before, didn't it? All those of you that are so fired up about him bringing religion into this, think of it th
155 LouieP2186 : Did I say I was unfairly treated? Nope, and I am a front line employee....so go ask around. As a "Front Line Employee" you don't think I understand t
156 EricR : I didn't say YOU were treated unfairly, I said: unless YOU represent ALL front line employees which you do not. Based on your comment - no - otherwis
157 hiflyer : ok...waded thru this and have waded thru the UA/CO talk for over two years. 1 Kellner was not Bethune 2 Smiz is not Kellner and was not Bethune 3 The
158 LouieP2186 : I do, cause you have fill the plane and if that means you have to cut the price than so be it but I guess I can't throw my opinion out. Most of the f
159 joeljack : Correct but many flights were 100% sold out well in advance of the flight. I remember looking a month out and all 3 flights that day from OMA-CLE wer
160 EricR : Fair point. Duly noted! Eric
161 mogandoCI : no one *needs* a reliever hub - once in a blue moon, when the main hub is dead, the reliever hub works. 95% of the other days, they're just competing
162 SHUPirate1 : Off the top of my head, DAL.
163 TSS : How quickly did DFW go from full hub to spot on the map once Delta made the decision to de-hub there? Exactly.
164 mayor : As I recall, it didn't seem to take very long at all. One minute DFW had all those RJ flights and the next they were operating out of SLC, instead.
165 flybhx764 : He knows what he is doing, He will do well
166 LAXdude1023 : Yes. DAL, MFE, LBB, and AMA. Add DFW/IAH to that. They are only 220 miles apart, yet both have huge hubs for their respective airlines.
167 joeman : Very possible, especially after years of hub dismantling rumors. The last of the major infrastructure improvements was probably the additional runway
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