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Allegiant - Hawaii Now 2012, Will Announce LGB-LAS  
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5844 posts, RR: 28
Posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 9614 times:

Allegiant put out a new management presentation at the Institutional Investors Day on Tuesday Nov 16. The info covers a wide range of topics.
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/da...2468/000143774910003982/ex99-1.htm
There is also an audio available from Allegiant that expands on these slides (but it is very, very long listening, I'm still working my way thru it)

A few highlights:
*Hawaii start is now a 2012 goal, just reassessed the 757 timeline in the last 30 days
***Initially they applied to put the 757 on the certificate and for ETOPS approval to be simultaneously
***G4 will now amend the application and add the type first, operate the 757s for several months then apply for ETOPS to receive it in 2012

*The 757s will now initially be based at and used temporarily for domestic flights to LAS of over 4 hours, high volume LAS routes, and track charters and international charters.

*Delivery schedule of the 757s is now:
***#1 & #2 - Already received - Goal is operating domestic starting in summer 2011
***#3 & #4 - Expected purchase dates December 2010 and January 2011 (but have a tentative short-term lease with a European airline that will use these two until summer 2012)
***#5 & #6 - Expected closing date of November 2011

*2010 Customer Demographic Survey
***Mean income over $104,000
***Mean age of 49
***86% own their home
***54% are in Professional/Managerial jobs

*Ancillary revenue sources increasing especially from 3rd party products
***Timeshare sales partnership with Wyndham will be expanded beyond LAS to other destinations
***Marketing more packages inbound to Branson/SGF
***Expanding ski resort packages from LAX/AZA/LAS/etc. (currently shows 3 resorts but I know they are also adding Bend, OR packages in the next few days out of LAS and AZA)
***Expanding vacation packages/hotels at smaller cities (reverse traffic) using some hotel chains.
***Changing the mix of hotels at destinations

*Discussing Long Beach LGB
***With only 2 slots it is too small to base aircraft, so only do short-haul routes where they can do turns at the other city or from a base city.
***LGB-SCK OK but not matching expectations
***Will cut SCK to offer LGB to LAS flights (interesting with JetBlue on the route) - announcement later this week
******LGB-LAS will be 1 daily flown 4 days per week.
******Other LGB routes will remain as current

*Cost per departure
***Las Vegas - Up 12% year over year
***Orlando - Up 39% year over year (primarily at MCO which was trending 25% higher per departure than SFB)


"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
40 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAtlwest1 From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 1046 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 9576 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
*2010 Customer Demographic Survey
***Mean income over $104,000
***Mean age of 49
***86% own their home
***54% are in Professional/Managerial jobs

Wow it interesting you wouldn't think that would be the demographic.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co. or Airt
User currently offlinerl757pvd From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4717 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 9531 times:

Quoting Atlwest1 (Reply 1):
***Mean income over $104,000

Im guessing thats "household" income....



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineEricR From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 1904 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 9481 times:

Quoting Atlwest1 (Reply 1):
Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
*2010 Customer Demographic Survey
***Mean income over $104,000
***Mean age of 49
***86% own their home
***54% are in Professional/Managerial jobs


Wow it interesting you wouldn't think that would be the demographic.

People who are wealthy (or well off) are wealthy because they know how to spend their money (ie. look for the best deals).


User currently offlineAtlwest1 From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 1046 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 9297 times:

Quoting EricR (Reply 3):
People who are wealthy (or well off) are wealthy because they know how to spend their money (ie. look for the best deals).

Yep very true



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co. or Airt
User currently onlineB6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2902 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 9240 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
Will cut SCK to offer LGB to LAS flights (interesting with JetBlue on the route)

Quite interesting indeed. It's not just B6 out of LGB either, think of all the other flights in the nearby airports in the LA area that also serve LAS too. That is a busy short-haul market for G4 to get into especially only 4 flights/week.



"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5844 posts, RR: 28
Reply 6, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 9119 times:

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 5):
Quite interesting indeed. It's not just B6 out of LGB either, think of all the other flights in the nearby airports in the LA area that also serve LAS too. That is a busy short-haul market for G4 to get into especially only 4 flights/week.

They talk about that in the audio from the presentation. They think that they can take advantage of selling packages on both ends to make it work, focusing on their existing passenger base out of LAS/LAX/LGB. They seemed especially confident about marketing it to their existing database of passengers who have already flown them to elsewhere.

The plan is to sell SoCal travellers the air/hotel in Vegas from LGB and out of LAS sell Southern California getaways for the desert residents. They don't expect to compete for the person who wants frequency or miles or etc., simply the passengers who want the vacation getaway all in one package at a low price and already know the company.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3847 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 9082 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
***Orlando - Up 39% year over year (primarily at MCO which was trending 25% higher per departure than SFB)

Hahaha! what were they thinking?


Quoting rl757pvd (Reply 2):
Quoting Atlwest1 (Reply 1):
***Mean income over $104,000

Im guessing thats "household" income....

I'm thinking "per block"

[Edited 2010-11-17 13:53:32]

User currently offlinebravogolf From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 9058 times:

FATFlyer

Do you know what engines are those 757s?


User currently onlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3830 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 8997 times:

Quoting bravogolf (Reply 8):
Do you know what engines are those 757s?

They're all ex-Britannia/Thomsonfly birds with Rolls-Royce RB211 engines.



"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5844 posts, RR: 28
Reply 10, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 8970 times:

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 7):
Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
***Orlando - Up 39% year over year (primarily at MCO which was trending 25% higher per departure than SFB)

Hahaha! what were they thinking?

They thought they could charge passengers more for MCO. The reality is that the small city passengers were not willing to pay more for MCO instead of SFB, price was more important than a few miles.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlinemtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2485 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 8683 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Speaking of ski resorts, I hope they utilize servce onto TWF for Sun Valley budget skiers. Hoping for LAX-TWF 2x/week. Although, SV not known as budget friendly resort lol.
Glad to see return of LAS-LGB flights too.

Just looked on their site under ski destinations. For Idaho, they list Jackson Hole Resort. Not mentioning it is in Wyoming, although flights are into IDA,I am assuming.

[Edited 2010-11-17 17:18:29]


"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlinebravogolf From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8624 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 9):
They're all ex-Britannia/Thomsonfly birds with Rolls-Royce RB211 engines.

E4 or E4B?


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5844 posts, RR: 28
Reply 13, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 8472 times:

I believe they are E4.


"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineUSXguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1041 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 8454 times:

I mentioned this to a friend in mgt @ G4 a few months ago. Their Knoxville ops could really be pushed a bit with Pigeon Forge/Dollywood just 40 minutes away. It just seems like the G4 model to be pushing attraction tickets/white water rafting-tubing/concert tickets while inflight going to TYS  


xx
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5844 posts, RR: 28
Reply 15, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 8371 times:

They are looking for lots of new things to sell, for example Allegiant has a cruise booking link on the website.

It seems to help if the local visitor/tourism bureau takes the lead on working with Allegiant at the smaller cities, that seems to be what is happening in Central Oregon.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineflybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 7690 times:

I suppose Hawaii in 2012 for Allegiant means that AS has a year's head start with the Bellingham - Honolulu flight.


"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently offline93Sierra From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 420 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7485 times:

Good to hear! Will G4 use the 757 at IWA/AZA at all? Reason asking is the recent terminal expansion...?


http://www.azcentral.com/community/m...-gateway-airport-terminal1109.html


User currently offlineHAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2572 posts, RR: 53
Reply 18, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7359 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
*Hawaii start is now a 2012 goal, just reassessed the 757 timeline in the last 30 days
***Initially they applied to put the 757 on the certificate and for ETOPS approval to be simultaneously
***G4 will now amend the application and add the type first, operate the 757s for several months then apply for ETOPS to receive it in 2012


I'm too much of a gentleman to say 'I told you so' but... (bite tongue, bite tongue)

I have nothing against G4 competing in the Hawaii market. More traffic to the islands is better for everyone. But their bold statements about their startup schedule (and those by G4 boosters here on A.net) were really done without complete knowledge of ETOPS rules and the time it takes to get certified. When they announced their 757 purchase and intention to fly to Hawaii I merely mentioned that it didn't sound like there were allowing enough time and money to get certified. I was promptly branded a 'protectionist Hawaiian employee who hates Allegiant and is merely scared of their imminent domination of the trans-Pacific routes'. Really? All I was doing was pointing out that their proposed timeline was way off from what reality had shown from other airlines who'd done the same thing. This announcement should have been expected. Now they'll have the time to do it right, get the aircraft training and proving done, and be ready for the real challenge of competing from the mainland to Hawaii.

HAL



One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26150 posts, RR: 50
Reply 19, posted (4 years 1 month 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7332 times:

Can't say I am surprised about SCK-LGB. I saw some of the loads and it certainly was not the typical G4 90% LF market especially after Labor day.

For the 757, and ETOPS, for the life of me I can't figure out why they did not bite the bullet and fast-track by piggy backing off an established program. Does not have to be a major carrier, but could be someone like Omni, Ryan or North American.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinetjwgrr From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 2505 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (4 years 1 month 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 6409 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
*The 757s will now initially be based at and used temporarily for domestic flights to LAS of over 4 hours, high volume LAS routes, and track charters and international charters.

Hoping to see the 75' here in GRR...... but perhaps not since we're an a/c and crew base- what goes out, comes back. I doubt G4 would temporarily base the 75' here. My understanding is GRR based crews are home every night.



Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
User currently offlineB727LVR From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 630 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (4 years 1 month 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6278 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 19):
for the life of me I can't figure out why they did not bite the bullet and fast-track by piggy backing off an established program.

From my understanding, since this is the first time they will have operated 757's the FAA, is making them go through the full procedures. Sucks, but you can't exactly tell the FAA NO. And I wouldnt be surprised if they did use other models to make their own.



I'm like a kid in a candy store when it comes to planes!
User currently offlinewwtraveler99 From United States of America, joined Sep 2008, 296 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (4 years 1 month 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6190 times:

Quoting HAL (Reply 18):
ETOPS rules and the time it takes to get certified.
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 19):
For the 757, and ETOPS, for the life of me I can't figure out why they did not bite the bullet and fast-track by piggy backing off an established program. Does not have to be a major carrier, but could be someone like Omni, Ryan or North American.

How long does this process take? I am interested to know how long it would take piggybacking and starting from scratch. Lets assume in both cases the airline already has an aircraft capable of flying the ETOPS route, just need to be certified.

Thanks

WW


User currently offlineCitrusCritter From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1131 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (4 years 1 month 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6153 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
Marketing more packages inbound to Branson/SGF

Does anyone under age 70 go to Branson anymore? I feel like I read previously that FL is struggling to BKG; haven't seen anything on F9, but my opinion is that Branson is one of those destinations that just doesn't appeal to most of the population. Is there any data to contradict that? Are hotel booking still high in Branson? What are the show offerings like now versus years past?


User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (4 years 1 month 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 6067 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):

*2010 Customer Demographic Survey
***Mean income over $104,000
***Mean age of 49
***86% own their home
***54% are in Professional/Managerial jobs

if this is the demographic of a LCC with no first class seats, older aircraft, flying primarily to tourist destinations like Vegas, Orlando and south Florida, one must imagine what kind of passengers are carried on UA and AA and EK!

but then, "mean" income is a poor measure since income distribution is skewed with a loooong tail to the high side, so the better measure is median income. (e.g. for the US, mean HH income is ~$61K but median is only ~$44K)


25 icebird757 : You would think that this would be an easier for them but I guess they want to do it themselves.
26 mattdell : Awesome. I won't be living in Hawaii in 2012.
27 hatbutton : And more time for WN to figure out where they want to fly to the islands from once they get their -800s...
28 LAXintl : For a good example of an airline that used ETOPS piggy back approach look to Hawaiian which used the Delta Airline program when it received its 767 fl
29 HAL : That's a good example, however there are big differences that would affect how Allegiant could do it. HA had years of international, oceanic & lo
30 JBirdAV8r : Gatlinburg/Pigeon Forge is kinda like the I-Drive of Orlando, without WDW/Universal/SeaWorld around. Obviously, almost all Gatlinburg visitors drive.
31 GSPSPOT : With the things that are happening in the economy and prices for basic commodities, I surely hope people can afford to go to Hawaii (even on Allegiant
32 LAXintl : But my point is regardless of prior experience one can piggy-back off an established program for the right price. This is how new airlines like Eos w
33 HAL : Yes, you are absolutely right. I guess I was just looking at this from a pragmatic perspective. Allegiant is well known for pinching pennies until Li
34 wedgetail737 : Weren't you also dubbed as an AS-hater too? LOL!
35 icebird757 : I believe that B6 will not sit idle on this LGB-LAS announcement. I would be surprised if they do.
36 DesertAir : Might Stockton see some 757 Hawaii actio? Once oe twice a week? That would sent valley travel agencies and tour operators into a frinzy of activity! I
37 icebird757 : It's official, LGB-LAS service starts 12/15
38 wedgetail737 : I think Stockton will get Hawaii flights before BLI.
39 LAXintl : The published LAS-LGB schedules are: Mon LAS-LGB 0700-0805 LGB-LAS 0845-0950 Thu LAS-LGB 1825-1930 LGB-LAS 2020-2125 Fri/Sun LAS-LGB 1755-1900 LGB-LAS
40 LAXintl : Well Allegiant is kicking off its LGB-LAS experiment with one-way fare of $14.99+tax.
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