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Qantas And BA 787-what Routes  
User currently offlinedeltaflyertoo From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 1661 posts, RR: 1
Posted (4 years 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 12933 times:

Anyone know what routes Qantas and BA will place their 787s on when they eventually get them? Will it be Australia to LAX or other US cities for Qantas?

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8453 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (4 years 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 12757 times:
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Quoting deltaflyertoo (Thread starter):
Will it be Australia to LAX or other US cities for Qantas?

A 787-9 will be the plane for the long talked about but yet to fly DFW to SYD route. IF the 787 has one mission at Qantas involving the USA its flights away from LAX and SFO.


User currently offlinegemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5760 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (4 years 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 12651 times:

Short answer: Who the he*l knows? I doubt they do, except in a most general way, given all the delays.
Somewhat longer answer: With QF they were brought firstly as B767 replacements & for JQ they were brought for expansion. So anywhere B767s/A330s operate is a fair guess.

JQ: 1) Replace the A332s 2) Expansion. I doubt you'll see them much in North America except MAYBE on very heavy tourist routes eg LAS. 3) Europe is much speculated about, Southern Europe mainly, FCO, ATH, etc.

QF: 1) Replace B767/A330s 2) Expansion: DFW without a doubt, unless they decide to start it with B744ER/A380 and it takes off gang busters. I could see PER-JNB under SOME circumstances. AKL-LAX, BNE-LAX, SYD/MEL-SFO/YVR all maybe. It may replace the A332 on LAX-JFK (or that maybe dropped). Apart from that I doubt any where else in North America. (ORD is much speculated about, but IMHO DFW trumps any place east of the Rockies). 3) Europe, not much, maybe CDG, but that's more a bilateral thing than an aircraft thing. Might see a Europe route via China (excluding HKG).

Any large expansion into Europe really requires the establishment of a Middle Eastern hub. QF uses SIN currently and JQ will but that is really too far for large expansion.

BA: B767 replacement

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5757 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (4 years 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 12525 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 1):
A 787-9 will be the plane for the long talked about but yet to fly DFW to SYD route. IF the 787 has one mission at Qantas involving the USA its flights away from LAX and SFO.

Everyone says this, but I'll believe it when I see it. DFW-SYD is a route that would pose a challenge for a 777-200LR. I don't think a 787-9 can do it with any reasonable payload.


User currently offlineflybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (4 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 12219 times:

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 4):
Everyone says this, but I'll believe it when I see it. DFW-SYD is a route that would pose a challenge for a 777-200LR. I don't think a 787-9 can do it with any reasonable payload.

CO was planning on inaugurating HOU - AKL with a 787-8 next year. The 787-9 will have slightly better range so would a DFW - SYD flight be that far off?



"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently offlinetayser From Australia, joined Mar 2008, 1134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 12169 times:

I could see a split of YVR with QF mainline daily on SYD-YVR, and JQ 3x weekly on MEL-YVR, similarly 2 planes doing 3x weekly SYD-LAS and 3x weekly MEL-LAS... Vegas is probably the best North American O&D destination for Jetstar (and I'm sure a lot of people would GLADLY avoid LAX to get there) - whereas having JQ on MEL-YVR is a good way to test the waters.

MEL-BKK is currently 3x weekly JQ, and it'll be interesting to see what happens to the route over time... i.e JQ boost it to daily or QF mainline takeover - it's the only missing link in the QF/BA JV Australia-London scissor hub flights from QF's two hubs. (LHR-SYD (via SIN, BKK, HKG) LHR-MEL (via SIN and HKG only). Only require 1 plane to do a daily service.

ADL-SIN maybe - either replace the currently 3x weekly 330 service with 787s and boost frequency or boost frequencies with 330s from other routes where a 787 has replaced them.

If they started MEL-SFO, QF would be the first carrier to do it non-stop.

longest possible routes for QF/JQ 787s:

MEL SFO 6826 nm
MEL LAX 6883 nm
MEL YVR 7118 nm
SYD DFW 7454 nm

shortest (almost guaranteed!) route for QF 787s:

MEL CBR 254 nm
MEL SYD 381 nm


User currently offlinekaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12563 posts, RR: 35
Reply 6, posted (4 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 12031 times:

I have an odd feeling that BA might try to change its 788 order (I believe it has six on order) for 789s, or at least take the initial ones and change them later.

I think it's probably fair to say that they'll be operated on current 763 routes: DXB, TLV, LCA, although I guess it depends on whether BA will have them in different configs for short/long haul routes, as with the current 763s.

I could also see them being used on routes where they have significant J (and Y+) demand, but not so much Y Class; this would mainly be to airports which are very expensive to operate to - HND for example.


User currently offlinejetfuel From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 2227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (4 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 11991 times:

CNS-LAX has also been allegedly promised


Where's the passion gone out of the airline industry? The smell of jetfuel and the romance of taking a flight....
User currently offlineDecromin From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2008, 80 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 11988 times:

Quoting tayser (Reply 6):
shortest (almost guaranteed!) route for QF 787s:

MEL CBR 254 nm
MEL SYD 381 nm

I've often wondered what the +ive/-ive arguments for these short hop, fast turnaround flights using new metal over running the old into the ground (as it were ... eek!). Would a 787 be substantially more cost efficient to run over these legs than a old, paid-for 767?


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4987 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (4 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 11948 times:

Quoting deltaflyertoo (Thread starter):
Anyone know what routes Qantas and BA will place their 787s on when they eventually get them? Will it be Australia to LAX or other US cities for Qantas?

QF, well, let's wait and see... The 1st 8-9 B787's will join the JQ fleet for expansion into europe and asia and in return QF will receive EBA,EBB,EBC,EBD,EBE,EBF,EBJ and allow the retirement of the aging B763 fleet...

My wild guess would be one retired for each A332 joining the QF fleet?

As for which routes the B787's will operate once they come online @ QF my money would be on routes such as SYD-EZE, SYD-HNL, SYD-JNB...? I will not touch the subject of QF commencing SYD-DFW... We cross that bridge when it happens!

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineJQflightie From Australia, joined Mar 2009, 1001 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (4 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 11948 times:

QF will be replacing their 767's with them first. And there has been a longtime rumour that SYD-DFW will start.
JQ will use them to get better efficency then the 332's to europe, i dont ever re-call JQ being interested in mainland USA.



Next Trip: PER-DPS-KUL-BKK-HKT-CNX-BKK-SIN-PER
User currently offlinegemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5760 posts, RR: 6
Reply 11, posted (4 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 11916 times:

Quoting Decromin (Reply 9):
Would a 787 be substantially more cost efficient to run over these legs than a old, paid-for 767?

Maybe/maybe not, but you also have to factor yield into the equation and keeping yield up and DJ at bay is also important

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineYVR1968 From Australia, joined Feb 2004, 704 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 11911 times:

Quoting tayser (Reply 6):
I could see a split of YVR with QF mainline daily on SYD-YVR, and JQ 3x weekly on MEL-YVR

That would be a dream for me! But I won't hold my breath...

Although I am more of a loyal * Alliance flier.. I would give QF a shot if they ever started non-stop Australia-Vancouver.

I would hope it would not be JQ though as they are the only airline in Australia I avoid (kind of a last resort thing - even though I am a QF shareholder!)

Until then I will keep flying AC or NZ via AKL.


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4987 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (4 years 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 11829 times:

Quoting YVR1968 (Reply 13):
I would give QF a shot if they ever started non-stop Australia-Vancouver.

I believe QF operate seasonal services to Vancouver via SFO?

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineYVR1968 From Australia, joined Feb 2004, 704 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 11774 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 14):
Quoting YVR1968 (Reply 13):
I would give QF a shot if they ever started non-stop Australia-Vancouver.

I believe QF operate seasonal services to Vancouver via SFO?

EK413
QF has come and gone from YVR a few times. The most recent "attempt" was a seasonal add on 3 times a week from SFO on the SYD-SFO route. But this last attempt did not last long. Currently QF does not serve YVR.

I do think they should give it another shot (but this time non-stop). I think the 744s are just a bit too big though AC seems to be doing fine on this route. The last 2 return trips I have made in the last few months (in J) had only 4 empty seats on one of the SYD-YVR flights. The other SYD-YVR was 100% and both YVR-SYD flights were 100%. I was actually pleasantly surprised. I know that does not mean much as that is not an indication a route is performing well. But it is what I would call a positive observation.

[Edited 2010-11-22 22:54:48]

[Edited 2010-11-22 22:56:03]

User currently offlineStickShaker From Australia, joined Sep 2004, 758 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (4 years 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 11301 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 9):
As for which routes the B787's will operate once they come online @ QF my money would be on routes such as SYD-EZE, SYD-HNL, SYD-JNB...? I will not touch the subject of QF commencing SYD-DFW... We cross that bridge when it happens!

I'm not sure if QF would/could do a southern trans-polar route such as SYD-EZE with a twin - even a state of the art twin. Very few alternates down there and I'm not sure what the EROPs compliance situation is. Likewise for SYD-JNB.
Other than that, anything is possible. The aviation environment has changed so much since QF placed their original 787 order.


Regards,
StickShaker

[Edited 2010-11-23 04:57:01]

[Edited 2010-11-23 04:58:02]

User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 16, posted (4 years 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 11274 times:

BA i think you'd see them to places like YYC, PHL, CLT, DTW, EWR, NAS, DXB, AUH, BAH etc.

Shorthaul we'll see them on ARN, TLV, CAI, LCA, IST, ATH etc.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineeljonno From Australia, joined Sep 2008, 172 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 20 hours ago) and read 10167 times:

Quoting tayser (Reply 5):

ADL-SIN maybe - either replace the currently 3x weekly 330 service with 787s and boost frequency or boost frequencies with 330s from other routes where a 787 has replaced them.

It would be great to see this route go daily. The loads always seem pretty full on SQ.


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7757 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (4 years 20 hours ago) and read 10074 times:

DFW-SYD would probably be first on QF's list for the 787.

As for BA, could a 787 do PER-LHR?



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineRTFM From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 434 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 20 hours ago) and read 10049 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 16):
Shorthaul we'll see them on ARN, TLV, CAI, LCA, IST, ATH etc.

CAI and TLV are normally considered L/H for BA (in terms of a/c type and cabin config). I'd be surprised if any of BA's 787s are configured for or operate short-haul.... I thought they were all for L/H (and would stick by that unless anyone knows better).


User currently offlinedeltaflyertoo From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 1661 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (4 years 19 hours ago) and read 9259 times:

Thanks for the responses, okay I have another question. Based on some of these replies its been suggested that the 787 MAY replace 767s. Now capacity this is apple to apples but performance-its apples to oranges. With what a 787 costs and its so called marketed ability, are we REALLy going to see BA 787s just doing trans Atlantic or "Long haul" europe? Will the US airlines that get these really be flying them domestically (ATL to LAX?). Won't there be a compromise on fuel efficiency?

User currently offlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 5136 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (4 years 15 hours ago) and read 7796 times:

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 18):
DFW-SYD would probably be first on QF's list for the 787.

GC mapper suggests that some fly round will be necessary on this route to meet an EDTO 180-min diversion.


User currently offlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 5136 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (4 years 15 hours ago) and read 7774 times:

Quoting StickShaker (Reply 15):
I'm not sure if QF would/could do a southern trans-polar route such as SYD-EZE with a twin - even a state of the art twin.

CASA didn't give VA any breaks on the SYB-JNB route . So far as I can tell they were held pretty close to to 180-min . The 77W engine/airframe combination has some years of in service experience. The 787 is going be a very "young"engine airframe combination . I find it hard to beleive that CASA will give it any breaks!


User currently offlinetayser From Australia, joined Mar 2008, 1134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (4 years 15 hours ago) and read 7765 times:

VA never flew SYD-JNB.

User currently offlineClassicLover From Ireland, joined Mar 2004, 4652 posts, RR: 23
Reply 24, posted (4 years 15 hours ago) and read 7765 times:

Quoting YVR1968 (Reply 14):
QF has come and gone from YVR a few times. The most recent "attempt" was a seasonal add on 3 times a week from SFO on the SYD-SFO route. But this last attempt did not last long. Currently QF does not serve YVR.

You used the word "seasonal" and then said "this attempt didn't last long" - isn't that the definition of seasonal?   It was announced specifically as a route for the ski season between x date and y date, so I hardly see why you say that this "attempt" didn't last long when it was there for a specific time period and speciflc reason  



I do quite enjoy a spot of flying - more so when it's not in Economy!
25 yvr1968 : ^ Actually, to clarify, the last "attempt" was for both the peak northern summer and the peak of northern ski season. This route, as was indicated by
26 gemuser : Ok, Ok that is true, but you know he meant MEL-JNB and the statement is still true CASA did not appear to give one minute on ETDO180 min for the rout
27 Post contains links tayser : http://www.theage.com.au/travel/trav...g-on-the-wings-20101203-18jd8.html summary: - 747 and 767 models are being used increasingly beyond the time QF
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