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Avianca Taking Ex MX's A318s  
User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 6
Posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8182 times:

Flightglobal reports that GECAS has re-leased 10 A318s that operated with Mexicana until recently to Avianca.

The report adds that AV phase out its 15 F100s next year in favour of the A318s as well as new deliveries of A319s and A320s.
Interestingly, Oceanair (or Avianca Colombia) woul keep its F100s for an additional 2 or 3 years.
The group of airlines will still continue to consider a new geeration of regional jet (Sukhoi, CS Sierie, MRJ) but does not expect to acquire any of these in the next couple of years.
It is also interesting to note that Taca has ruled out ordering any aditional E190s.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-ex-mexicana-a318s-to-avianca.html

56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineN471wn From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1583 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8205 times:
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And this makes the scrapping of the 6 nearly new A-318 frames (formerly operated by Frontier) all the more wasteful.

User currently offlineN809FR From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 182 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8143 times:

Quoting N471wn (Reply 1):
And this makes the scrapping of the 6 nearly new A-318 frames (formerly operated by Frontier) all the more wasteful.

I would be willing to bet it was a lot cheaper for AV to lease A318's for an airline that isn't paying the lease anymore rather than one just looking to shrink the fleet. That said, unless we get some solid numbers it may indeed prove that the scrapping of the F9 A318's was very wasteful.


User currently offlinelaca773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4056 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8105 times:
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I'm glad they found home for these birds. It will allow AV to open some long, thin markets to the U.S. and else where, that need an a/c smaller than the A319 and at the same time, has the range to do so.

User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4395 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8053 times:

Quoting laca773 (Reply 3):
I'm glad they found home for these birds. It will allow AV to open some long, thin markets to the U.S. and else where, that need an a/c smaller than the A319 and at the same time, has the range to do so.

That would be great, except that these birds will be very busy doing domestic flights. They should try and take F9s A318s for those long-thin routes.

I wonder if they will be fitting them with PTVs?

So I guess the rumour has been clarified. Good for AV. Most of those F100 will apparently be going to Brazil where they are desperately needed for expansion.


User currently offlineviajero From Mexico, joined Aug 2008, 134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7716 times:
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Thank god they found a new home!!! I flew all 10 of those frames, in some cases multiple times, over the years. Long live -UBQ through -UBZ!! I look forward to flying them again soon in Avianca colors.

User currently offlineEMB170 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 649 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 7341 times:

So, towards the end of March, I'm currently booked on an AV F-100 on BOG-CUR and back...do I have a chance at getting the new A318 instead?


Can passenger jets fly as fast as my feet do? Let's find out...
User currently offline777jaah From Colombia, joined Jan 2006, 1403 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 7148 times:

Great news for AV.

I saw yesterday an ad on El Tiempo were AV was looking for technicians certified for ATR-72.....will that mean the F50s are being replaced by the ATR?? It said perons interested should be willing to live in Panama......



777jaah



Next flights: AV BOG-ADZ-BOG, AV-UA BOG-IAD-ORD-IAD-BOG, BOG-FLL-BOG, LA BOG-MIA-BOG J
User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7082 times:

Quoting 777jaah (Reply 7):
I saw yesterday an ad on El Tiempo were AV was looking for technicians certified for ATR-72.....will that mean the F50s are being replaced by the ATR?? It said perons interested should be willing to live in Panama......

Now, this is very puzzling. Not that AV might want to have ATRs -which would be nice-, but how come the post would be based in Panamá?

Might it have anything to do with Aeroperlas, a subsidiary of TACA based at PAC (Marcos A. Gelabert airport, Panamá's "domestic" airport) that has a couple of ATR 42s?
Or will AV-TA indeed order ATR-72s (to replace AV's F50s and TA ATR-42s), and will their mx base be somewhere in Panama?

Interesting indeed.


User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9941 posts, RR: 15
Reply 9, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 6984 times:

Good news so we will be seeing the AV A318 flying to Curacao next year!!! Awesome!!! I think I saw a ex-MX A318 parked in MIA when I was there twice last week.

A388


User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4584 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 6680 times:

Quoting Summa767 (Thread starter):
Oceanair (or Avianca Colombia)

Avianca Brasil.




.

Quoting Summa767 (Thread starter):
It is also interesting to note that Taca has ruled out ordering any aditional E190s.

I've heard in some non-official sources from Central America that TACA is not totally happy with the E90 experience, based on their cargo constraints.


Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineairliner777 From United States of America, joined May 2000, 494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 6462 times:

Quoting A388 (Reply 9):
Good news so we will be seeing the AV A318 flying to Curacao next year!!! Awesome!!! I think I saw a ex-MX A318 parked in MIA when I was there twice last week.

Hello A388. Most ex-MX A318's and some A319's are parked at the AAR ramp @ MIA.

Rgrds,
Airliner777


User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4395 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6346 times:

Quoting 777jaah (Reply 7):
I saw yesterday an ad on El Tiempo were AV was looking for technicians certified for ATR-72.....will that mean the F50s are being replaced by the ATR?? It said perons interested should be willing to live in Panama......

It was an advertising published by TACA for technicians to work on their ATR-42 fleet in Panama City. Doesn't indicate anything.


User currently onlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6294 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6310 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 10):
I've heard in some non-official sources from Central America that TACA is not totally happy with the E90 experience, based on their cargo constraints

I have heard this too....and that they originally wanted the E190 to open up some routes to the USA....even reopen MSY.....but with the bag heavy Cent. Americans, they are running into problems.

Thusly the E190 is beign assigned as much as it can to business routes....like SAL-BZE



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinebreiz From France, joined Mar 2005, 1917 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6292 times:

Quoting 777jaah (Reply 7):
Great news for AV.

Even greater news for GECAS which got these A318s back.


User currently offlinedanimarroquin From Colombia, joined Jan 2005, 450 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6222 times:

good for AV to get the A318 , the only one in the fleet left would be the A321 to get by AV . maybe the A321 would be good for the domestic triangle between BOG , CLO and MDE . possible BAQ too since there is good traffic between this cities .

User currently offlinecolumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7088 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6201 times:

I remember the threads when AV ordered their first Airbus aircraft everybody was surprised to see them order Airbus planes. Now they will take the least popular Airbus aircraft ever in their fleet, who would have thought about that 5 years ago.

Great news for all involved - especially for the A318s that otherwise would have been turned into soda cans.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offline777jaah From Colombia, joined Jan 2006, 1403 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6180 times:

Quoting columba (Reply 16):
I remember the threads when AV ordered their first Airbus aircraft everybody was surprised to see them order Airbus

I was one of them....I always Boeing almost had the order in their bag, but as it turns out, AV is more than happy with their bus fleet. As a pax, the fleet is a real improvement for Y pax with their AVOD and improved seats, compared to the MD83. On their J class, I had to say for short domestic routes, is fine, but using the A319 on red eyes such as JFk is a real pain in the @ss.......

I'm glad AV is expanding and preparing to put a fight and defend their home court, and improving their fleet for better economics and service.

777jaah



Next flights: AV BOG-ADZ-BOG, AV-UA BOG-IAD-ORD-IAD-BOG, BOG-FLL-BOG, LA BOG-MIA-BOG J
User currently offliner2rho From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2739 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5786 times:

Interesting, so in this case the fleet commonality factor has outweighed the aircraft efficiency factor, as an F100 is clearly the more efficient a/c. They must've gotten a good deal on these A318's, plus the advantage of them being available short-term. Good to see these 318's carry on instead of being scrapped for spares like Frontier's.

User currently offlinetavong From Colombia, joined Jul 2001, 836 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 5686 times:

Quoting 777jaah (Reply 17):
I was one of them....I always Boeing almost had the order in their bag, but as it turns out, AV is more than happy with their bus fleet

it´s well known that they chose the A32X fleet cause they could get these planes in a short term. The A330 is a given choice since at this tme there was no Boeing alternative in the short term AV wanted their planes.

Quoting r2rho (Reply 18):
Interesting, so in this case the fleet commonality factor has outweighed the aircraft efficiency factor, as an F100 is clearly the more efficient a/c.

I´m also surprise, i really don´t see the benefit of the A318 over the Fokker 100, but seems that the F100 are needed in Brazil and AV must got a killer deal to get the ex-MX A318s.

Maybe this is a movement to standarize their hard product and help them compete better with LAN?

Gus
SKBO



Colombian coffee, the best...take a cup and you will see how delicious it is.
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9941 posts, RR: 15
Reply 20, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5539 times:

Quoting r2rho (Reply 18):
as an F100 is clearly the more efficient a/c.

On what is this assumption based? Do you have some facts?
A388


User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8862 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5511 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 10):
I've heard in some non-official sources from Central America that TACA is not totally happy with the E90 experience, based on their cargo constraints.

This also applies to the A-318 on certain routes with-in South America.

Quoting tavong (Reply 19):
Maybe this is a movement to standarize their hard product and help them compete better with LAN?

LAN has relatively new A-318 a/c that are configured in a single-class cabin. IIRC, most of MX's A-318s are over five years old already. Regardless, the A-318 did not prove popular with LAN; hence the entire fleet of 15 A318s will be phased out by 2013.


User currently offlineBogota From Colombia, joined Sep 2004, 820 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5483 times:

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 21):
LAN has relatively new A-318 a/c that are configured in a single-class cabin. IIRC, most of MX's A-318s are over five years old already. Regardless, the A-318 did not prove popular with LAN; hence the entire fleet of 15 A318s will be phased out by 2013.



Yes, but that has to do with the specific engine type the LAN chose for the A318, which is a different type engine from those that AV will operate. Anyhow it is a great, fast solution to the old looking F100 product wise which are far behind the rest of AV fleet. AV must be preparing itself the the landing of LAN at its home turf.


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7614 posts, RR: 42
Reply 23, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5447 times:

Quoting tavong (Reply 19):
i really don´t see the benefit of the A318 over the Fokker 100

For one, a standardized narrowbody fleet. Another benefit is lowering the average age of its fleet.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8862 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (3 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5420 times:

Quoting Bogota (Reply 22):
Yes, but that has to do with the specific engine type the LAN chose for the A318, which is a different type engine from those that AV will operate.

That is a good point, however it is better for LA to phase them out allowing LA to increase capacity in certain markets. Starting next month, all LA A320-family a/c delivered by Airbus will feature the CFM56-5B engine type.

Quoting Bogota (Reply 22):
AV must be preparing itself the the landing of LAN at its home turf.

AV also needs to upgrade 2K's fleet relatively soon. During Q1 of 2012, LA will start to take delivery of the A321 a/c. It will be interesting to see where LAN deploys them. During 2012, LAN will be operating the A318/A319/A320/A321/A343 simultaneously!


25 Bogota : That is a different story, AV for the time being will simply replace the older 100 seaters with a better product. We shall see, hopefully Colombia wi
26 SCL767 : At BOG, LAN will be able to serve most international destinations in North America, South America and Central America utilising a single-body a/c. Th
27 Bogota : That is exactly what I heard, interestingly it was from a Chilean ex-pat party here in BOG where most of them seemed to know very little about aviati
28 Post contains images tavong : I really see the A318 has a short-term and cheap replacement for the F-100 , that gives AV time to choose either C-Series/MRJ or an E-Jet (if a E-NG
29 Avianca : wouldnt be the A318 a perfect aircraft for thiner routes like the current LIM-UIO-MDE / LIM-GYE-CLO, maybe to splitt of the flights and serving each a
30 Bogota : I was actually thinking of BOG flights to DEN, ORD, MCO, YYZ or south to BSB, ASU, MVD even COR.
31 Avianca : would make sense, despite of ORD, MCO and YYZ what should be bigger markets. Maybe they could use them also on JFK flight from smaler colombian citys
32 Bogota : That is true JFK could also be very good and although I think decentralizing is also the way to go, BOG still lags behind other hubs to fully compete
33 Avianca : what could be possible flights to JFK, PEI (can the aircraft make it?), BAQ, CTG maybe even ADZ? maybe also a BOG-MAO flight could be very possible.
34 Summa767 : BSB will probably happen soon, but operated by OceanAir in A319s. I guess that AV will fly to MCO,and maybe it could start with an A318. ORD might ha
35 A388 : I think AV already started doing so with 2K now having a brand new A320 in their fleet and I remember reading some time ago that more brand new Airbu
36 trigged : I know N808FR and N809FR are listed as scrapped, but are they completely gone or just de-registered and partially parted out?
37 N471wn : I am not sure but they will never fly again.....new birds wasted
38 SCL767 : Currently, Aerogal has two new A-320s. However, AV will need to transfer over even more A-320s to 2K since their current fleet of over 10 B737-200s a
39 trigged : Just wondering if there is enough left for GECAS to use as spare parts or put them back together and sell them. I would assume that the airframes wer
40 N471wn : [quote=trigged,reply=39]Would make sense to dissect them somewhat carefully and store the parts. I think that is what is being done
41 danimarroquin : now , after the big news of the A318 , and the cancellation of BOG - LAX from AV . would the A318 have the legs to do the BOG - LAX with out no proble
42 av757 : Avianca is phasing out the Fokker 100´s before the year 2014 as was planned because their dispatch reliability has decreased drastically during this
43 SJOtoLIR : Maybe it's not related to the capability of the aircraft since the 319 could do it better in terms of the autonomy of planes. It's rather about to bo
44 Post contains links and images DEVILFISH : The Great Circle Mapper gives the BOG-LAX distance as 3,023 nm ..... http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=bog-lax&DU=nm&SU=mph The new Airbus perform
45 EddieDude : 1800 nm does not sound right. MX did MEX-JFK with A318s quite often, and that is 1816 nm (2090 mi)!
46 laca773 : An A319 is not necessarily needed to operate BOG-ORD. If they need the capacity, then yes, but the A318 is a very capable a/c to cover routes such as
47 A388 : That is true, I wasn't aware 2K had so many 737's. I wonder if AV will order more A320's in order to be able to transfer part of their existing A320
48 Aviopic : Your information does not correspond with Avianca's own dispatch reliability report. The difference in overall dispatch reliability between 2009 and
49 777jaah : I have to say an 319 is not the best product in premium routes. I just flied JFK-BOG in a 319 in J last week, and it really sucks compared to the 330
50 av757 : Today we have only 13 operable F100´s that is 3 AOG due to maintenance. Parts supplies are becoming scarcer by the day, and to find certified parts
51 Aviopic : AOG and MX are not necessarily the same thing. With a flight hour agreement there wouldn't have been a problem, it's a matter of choice. Afaik all LG
52 Post contains links DEVILFISH : It would not be in Airbus' interest to cite a low figure if it wasn't called for. 16 nm over the published range is one thing (Airbus most probably h
53 EddieDude : Every now and then there'd be an A320 on the route. I had the chance to fly one from JFK to MEX once. Red-eye. And the headwinds were quite strong. I
54 SJOtoLIR : VX LAX-YYZ.........1890 nm..........320 AZ MXP-DKR.......2276 nm..........320 (no longer in service) TA SAL-LAX.........2016 nm..........320 All the
55 EddieDude : Quite well said. MEX-JFK faces the altitude issues (although usually you get quite favorable tail wind), whereas JFK-MEX does not have altitude issue
56 Post contains images laca773 : . I think we'll see AV eventually utilize the A318s they receive on other routes that are outside their domestic network. It's in their best interest
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