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Lufthansa Encouraging Canada To Block EK: Flanagan  
User currently offlineEK156 From United Arab Emirates, joined May 2005, 765 posts, RR: 3
Posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 15146 times:

Emirates Vice Chairman stated that Lufthansa is encouraging Canada to block Emirates's expansion into Toronto, Vancouver and Calgary!

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/lufth...ansion-claims-flanagan-365633.html

How will this end? Sweet or Sour?

55 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineojas From India, joined Mar 2008, 2970 posts, RR: 24
Reply 1, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 15122 times:

It is stating the obvious, after all a major beneficiary in stalling EK's expansion was LH.


A lion does not concern himself with the opinions of the sheep
User currently offlineFLYYUL From Italy, joined Jun 2000, 4976 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 15006 times:

Double daily YVR/YYC-DXB, where the hell do they find this stuff?

User currently offlinesebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1663 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 14990 times:

I'd have a hard time accepting that the Canadian government is doing all of this because a large German airline was asking for it, or because Air Canada was asking for it at the behest of its German partner. It sounds like a lot of manure to me. Does LH benefit if Canada takes a hard line against EK? Yes. But if Air Canada's situation wasn't the primary concern, this would not be an issue. You can argue that almost any Canadian expansion by any airline from Africa, the Middle East or South Asia would impact LH's codeshare business with AC but that has not stopped the Canadian government for granting access to Turkish, Egyptair, Qatar, etc. The aggregate capacity added by these new entrants is significant enough to impact AC/LH codeshare business.

User currently offlineAirMale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 377 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 14941 times:

My God, Emirates. Stop your whining. Canada said you get 3 frequencies and now say thank you and carry on with your business. Do we need to hear you complaining all the time? You behave like a four year old who keeps nagging his parents for a new toy.....


.....up there with the best!
User currently offlineblueflyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3967 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 14601 times:
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Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
How will this end? Sweet or Sour?

I think EK will keep on whining for a while but the current situation isn't likely to change anytime soon and I am sure EK knows it. Canada didn't bow to political pressure by the UAE on behalf of EK, so I think Ottawa is pretty much immune to any whining from Dubai, even if it attempts to drag in a foreign carrier into the mix.

I don't see any more attempt at applying political pressure either. Canadian troops having left already, there isn't much of any significance the UAE can throw in and while Canada has been restrained in its retort (it hasn't retorted really),the balance of power is very much with Canada. If the UAE miscalculates and pushes too hard, EK may find itself locked out of the Canadian aerospace entirely, quite a pain when trying to reach the US.

Quoting AirMale (Reply 4):
You behave like a four year old who keeps nagging his parents for a new toy.....

And how many parents would give in eventually just to have the $%^ kid shut up? Thankfully, Canada prefers ear plugs to the tyranny of whining.



I've got $h*t to do
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 14504 times:

other than passengers strictly bound for Dubai, EK offers nothing different other than any European 1-stop service that goes Canada-TransitPoint-India

in fact, i'd also think it's foolish for all those EU carriers to grant open skies to EK


User currently offlineThorben From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 14363 times:

EK has a valid point. On routes from YVR or YYC to the Indian peninsula or Eastern/Southern Africa, the choice to go via DXB or go via FRA is not much different from the perspective of the flight length. Canada has opened itself to many immigrants from these places, and many of them certainly do have the money to fly to their old homes regularly. Add to that business created through that.

Canada is not doing itself a favour by limiting EK to three flights a week. This only hurts Canadian citizens and businesses, which is bad for the country, even if AC benefits. Competition makes room for improvement, not protectionism.


User currently offlinelonghauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4923 posts, RR: 43
Reply 8, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 14119 times:

Quoting FLYYUL (Reply 2):
Double daily YVR/YYC-DXB, where the hell do they find this stuff?

Emirates and Etihad were both offered daily flights to YYC and YVR, which they declined. Clearly it is YYZ they are after and nothing else. But in the PR spin they can't say that. In the meantime they will promise daily A380s to every city in Canada.

Quoting AirMale (Reply 4):
You behave like a four year old who keeps nagging his parents for a new toy.....

Yes, the little Princes in the desert are not used to hearing the word "no". Nor are they accustomed to discovering something their money will not buy!



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineAirCanada787 From Canada, joined Nov 2010, 282 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 13852 times:

Quoting AirMale (Reply 4):
My God, Emirates. Stop your whining. Canada said you get 3 frequencies and now say thank you and carry on with your business. Do we need to hear you complaining all the time? You behave like a four year old who keeps nagging his parents for a new toy.....

I have to agree that Emirates should stop pushing, as other have mentioned before in other threads, many other carriers have been granted additional frequencies over time. I seems to me like Emirates just wants everything upfront without having to wait or earn more frequencies. Maybe they should back off for a year or two and then ask for and demonstrate why they should be allowed to offer more service to Canada.



The mind, like a parachute, functions only when open.
User currently offlineLHPII From Croatia, joined May 2009, 179 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 13781 times:

Quoting Thorben (Reply 9):
Competition makes room for improvement, not protectionism.

....but you fail to realize that heavily subsidized EK could never be a fair competition to anyone and yes it could hurts airline jobs in Canada and elswhere more then it would benefit their businesses or travelling public.

EK is state owned and heavily supported enterprise wheras AC and LH are private and non-governments supported airlines.


User currently offlineveeseeten From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2008, 169 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 13760 times:

Quoting LHPII (Reply 12):
....but you fail to realize that heavily subsidized EK could never be a fair competition to anyone and yes it could hurts airline jobs in Canada and elswhere more then it would benefit their businesses or travelling public.

EK is state owned and heavily supported enterprise wheras AC and LH are private and non-governments supported airlines.

You're discounting the fact that EK is almost never the cheapest carrier in the market.

I'd really like to see some evidence supporting your claim that they're heavily supported (i.e. subsidised). Like any airline, they're clearly yield-mad. You don't even have to heavily interrogate their commercial proposition to work this out - go do a few price comparisons.

[Edited 2010-12-06 13:48:20]

User currently offlineAirNovaBAe146 From Canada, joined Jun 2008, 362 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 13693 times:

Quoting AirCanada787 (Reply 11):
I have to agree that Emirates should stop pushing, as other have mentioned before in other threads, many other carriers have been granted additional frequencies over time. I seems to me like Emirates just wants everything upfront without having to wait or earn more frequencies. Maybe they should back off for a year or two and then ask for and demonstrate why they should be allowed to offer more service to Canada.

+1.

The one thing that has struck me after the Emirates vs the Government of Canada spat for expanded access DXB-YYZ/YYC/YVR is that EK must have some phenomenal lobbyists working for them here in the Great White North.

Every time I see a media source with an item that even remotely spins the story in AC's favor, the next day there is a follow up from the Emirates perspective, on why giving them unlimited access to the Canadian market is such a great thing. It is too much of a coincidence, to me it means that EK has spent some serious money on a PR/media consulting/spin firm to get their story out.


User currently offlinesebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1663 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 13433 times:

Quoting Thorben (Reply 9):

Canada is not doing itself a favour by limiting EK to three flights a week. This only hurts Canadian citizens and businesses, which is bad for the country, even if AC benefits. Competition makes room for improvement, not protectionism.

There is no shortage of competition coming into the Canadian market. The Canadian government's Blue Skies policy clearly favors the creation of more point to point services over connections via city-state hubs like Dubai and Singapore. Turkish has started flights to Istanbul, Egyptair is starting flights to Cairo, Hainan is starting flight Beijing, Cathay increasing YYZ-HKG from 12 to 14 flights a week next summer, Qatar now has the right to serve Toronto-Doha, Sri Lankan seems likely based on recent news from Colombo. The government routinely agrees - with Air Canada's concurrence - to allow PK extra, ex-bilateral frequencies.

There is plenty of competition, and the number of carriers in the Toronto continues to grow by several new entrants annually. What the government does disagree with is large scale capacity dumping by city-state carriers like EK which may not only impact AC, but also impacts the ability of these new entrants offering point to point to sustain profitable operations. From a total economic perspective, a large increase in point to point services generates new trade links and more direct cargo routings, and is preferable to Canada's economic development than allowing the Wal-Mart of aviation to dump capacity here.


User currently offlineMarcoPoloWorld From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 639 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 12163 times:

Keep up the good information work, EK and UAE. The Canadian government may not budge, but at least this might help educate its constituents as to exactly what is going on here. This is just like the gov't prohibiting all importation of a certain good just because it is cheaper to produce elsewhere.

Quoting sebring (Reply 13):
From a total economic perspective, a large increase in point to point services generates new trade links and more direct cargo routings, and is preferable to Canada's economic development than allowing the Wal-Mart of aviation to dump capacity here.

But that's for the market to decide, not the gov't. And ahm, if EK is a four-star airline, and AC is a three-star, I guess the Wal-Mart reference is in regard to AC?  

Quoting longhauler (Reply 8):
Emirates and Etihad were both offered daily flights to YYC and YVR, which they declined. Clearly it is YYZ they are after and nothing else.

From what I recall, they "declined" because in that scenario, they would have been offered less total seat capacity. Rest assured that EK would - at a minimum - fly to YVR if they could do it as part of a net capacity increase.


User currently offlinelonghauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4923 posts, RR: 43
Reply 15, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 11519 times:

Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 14):
This is just like the gov't prohibiting all importation of a certain good just because it is cheaper to produce elsewhere.

You mean like the United States taxing and prohibiting the import of cheaper goods?
Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 14):
From what I recall, they "declined" because in that scenario, they would have been offered less total seat capacity. Rest assured that EK would - at a minimum - fly to YVR if they could do it as part of a net capacity increase.

They were offered one daily flight to each destination, YVR and YYC, no limit on seats to either place. The answer was that they would not "grace" either city until they got unlimited access to YYZ.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineairceo From Canada, joined Feb 2010, 98 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 11269 times:

Anybody want some cheese with their whine? Seriously EK, double daily to Calgary? Surely they're just having a laugh at this point...


airceo



blogger at airceo | reach me: @airceo or fly@airceo.com
User currently offlinethenoflyzone From Canada, joined Jan 2001, 2416 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11022 times:

Quoting veeseeten (Reply 11):
You're discounting the fact that EK is almost never the cheapest carrier in the market.

Excuse me, so how do you explain the following....

http://www.emirates.com/ca/English/a.../fares_to_match_star_alliance.aspx

Thenoflyzone



us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
User currently offlineQuokka From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 10952 times:

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 17):

From the link that you posted:

Quote:
Emirates’ tariff was not the lowest available fare offered by a non-EU carrier in any of these cases, and tariffs of several EU carriers were significantly less than those of Emirates.


User currently offlinesebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1663 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 10903 times:

Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 14):

But that's for the market to decide, not the gov't. And ahm, if EK is a four-star airline, and AC is a three-star, I guess the Wal-Mart reference is in regard to AC?  

Here's what you should understand. Canada is not one market. As a very large land mass, it is agglomeration of many regional markets. And what benefits one market may be to the detriment of another. Many countries - the Emirates certainly among them - use aviation as an economic development tool - and Canada is no less entitled to do so, for its benefit. A million cheap flights to Toronto does nothing to the people in Edmonton or St. John's or Halifax or Montreal. There is nothing in bilateral aviation that requires one country to grant another exactly what it wants.


User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 10845 times:

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 17):
Excuse me, so how do you explain the following....

http://www.emirates.com/ca/English/a....aspx

that's the thing that annoys people - you negotiate these things privately, not making ultimatum demands on your own website. the more i see their propaganda the more i don't believe in their message of "good intent"

And EK should really just blame themselves for being stupid and not grabbing the 6x weekly Canada-UAE frequencies when they were wide open, thus giving EY a chance to jump in, and now both carriers offering a low-frequency route that doesn't help build your brand that much except confuse consumers.

And EK/EY shouldn't be bitching either - even QR (the one sleeping with UA), only got 3x weekly


User currently offlineczbbflier From Canada, joined Jul 2006, 973 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 10532 times:

Quoting Thorben (Reply 7):
EK has a valid point. On routes from YVR or YYC to the Indian peninsula or Eastern/Southern Africa, the choice to go via DXB or go via FRA is not much different from the perspective of the flight length. Canada has opened itself to many immigrants from these places, and many of them certainly do have the money to fly to their old homes regularly. Add to that business created through that.

Canada is not doing itself a favour by limiting EK to three flights a week. This only hurts Canadian citizens and businesses, which is bad for the country, even if AC benefits. Competition makes room for improvement, not protectionism.

In years gone by when the majority of immigrants to Canada came from Europe, under a highly regulated regime, Canada found ways to allow for low-cost flights to exist: charters. Indeed, until the Canadian aviation industry was deregulated (and in Canada it is still only partially deregulated), a significant portion of the leisure market was charter (sorry no citation).

Canada is not open to wholesale raping of its airline market. Would EK be contributing to the aviation industry north of the 60º parallel, where it is still completely regulated? Would it be interested in flying to Inuvik or Iqaluit? How about paying into a "Support-the-Canadian-Airlines-that-Fly-in-the-North fund", which might include Air Canada?

To assert that there is enough capacity for two non-stops YYC to DXB is patently absurd. There is hardly enough demand for the summer-seasonal flights to LHR on all carriers with ALL the outbound connections to fill one single A380.

I suppose there might be the demand if people flew YYC to YYZ via DXB....

To put it another way:
- Total population of Calgary: 1,230,000.
- Capacity of an EK A380: 500
- Flights per Day: 2
- Number of days to fly the entire population of Calgary (man, woman, child) to DXB: 1,230 days or 3.36 years.

Somehow I just don't think the demand is there... not all Calgarians want to go to Dubai. Most would rather drive to Tabor for corn.

And for those who might say there are other populations nearby that would supplement the population of Calgary, prove the point that others just don't know the Canadian market: there is no other population base nearby. Unless you count Strathmore- pop. 12,000.

Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 14):
Keep up the good information work, EK and UAE. The Canadian government may not budge, but at least this might help educate its constituents as to exactly what is going on here.

On the contrary- it will entrench Canadian opinion that a foreign company is looking to force itself upon us- something that Canadians are very sensitive to considering our long and checkered past with other multi-national companies that think that Canada is just another blob on the map to plunder.

Those heretofore companies learned that if you slowly, insidiously, creep into Canada, you can eventually own the market. But a hubristic shove from an outsider will get the same response from the populace every time- even from free-traders: and that response sounds quite similar to "Phahque Awph"! So the government isn't manufacturing this response, it's reflecting the genuine mood of the population as a whole.

Everybody's got a proverbial line drawn in the sand: Would Dubai allow gay marriage? Nope. And Canada's limits are drawn, this time, on capacity dumping.


User currently offlineLufthansa411 From Germany, joined Jan 2008, 692 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 10053 times:

Quoting czbbflier (Reply 21):
Canada is not open to wholesale raping of its airline market. Would EK be contributing to the aviation industry north of the 60º parallel, where it is still completely regulated? Would it be interested in flying to Inuvik or Iqaluit? How about paying into a "Support-the-Canadian-Airlines-that-Fly-in-the-North fund", which might include Air Canada?

Maybe that should be the condition for EK to be granted open skies? You can fly as many a/c as you want into Canada, and to any port you want, but for every 100 seats you offer, you must fly to a city north of the 60 degrees with at least a daily flight? Maybe that would help even out competition?

Other than that I think Emirates is just trying to play the bully and it is just making them look bad. Plus, the source doesn't come from a very neutral POV.



Nothing in life is to be feared; it is only to be understood.
User currently offlineCysafan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 9073 times:

Oh great !! Ek is getting aggressive... Their plans is to push all the airlines down to their monster feet and be the King of Airlines .The evidence can be shown by the number of wide-bodied aircrafts they ordered, pushing here and there to be the world 's largest Airline. It is good to see that Lufthansa supports the fact to block EK. If EK continues to be unblocked , you will see in a few years time , EK will throw in bunches of A380s to fight with Air Canada and its competitors verses their smaller aircrafts and it will be a bad time for AC and its competitors to stay afloat.

User currently offlineThorben From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 9009 times:

Quoting LHPII (Reply 10):
....but you fail to realize that heavily subsidized EK could never be a fair competition to anyone and yes it could hurts airline jobs in Canada and elswhere more then it would benefit their businesses or travelling public.

EK is state owned and heavily supported enterprise wheras AC and LH are private and non-governments supported airlines.

Has already been discussed countless times before. EK is not subsidized, they pay market prices for planes, fuel, landing rights etc. like all others. They may have lower staff and tax costs because of the system in the UAE, but what is the UAE supposed to do? Introduce a tax and social security system as expensive and complicated as the German, to make EK as uncompetitive as LH? What a silly idea.

Quoting sebring (Reply 13):
There is no shortage of competition coming into the Canadian market. The Canadian government's Blue Skies policy clearly favors the creation of more point to point services over connections via city-state hubs like Dubai and Singapore. Turkish has started flights to Istanbul, Egyptair is starting flights to Cairo, Hainan is starting flight Beijing, Cathay increasing YYZ-HKG from 12 to 14 flights a week next summer, Qatar now has the right to serve Toronto-Doha, Sri Lankan seems likely based on recent news from Colombo. The government routinely agrees - with Air Canada's concurrence - to allow PK extra, ex-bilateral frequencies.

There is plenty of competition, and the number of carriers in the Toronto continues to grow by several new entrants annually. What the government does disagree with is large scale capacity dumping by city-state carriers like EK which may not only impact AC, but also impacts the ability of these new entrants offering point to point to sustain profitable operations. From a total economic perspective, a large increase in point to point services generates new trade links and more direct cargo routings, and is preferable to Canada's economic development than allowing the Wal-Mart of aviation to dump capacity here.

The government shouldn't be concerned about somebody's p2p-profitability, they should be concerned about a healthy competition on the market that allows best offers for the customers.

Quoting czbbflier (Reply 21):
Canada is not open to wholesale raping of its airline market. Would EK be contributing to the aviation industry north of the 60º parallel, where it is still completely regulated? Would it be interested in flying to Inuvik or Iqaluit? How about paying into a "Support-the-Canadian-Airlines-that-Fly-in-the-North fund", which might include Air Canada?

?

I don't understand that. EK would offer connections from Vancouver, Calgary, and Toronto to the Middle East, Africa, and the Indian peninsula. Their overall impact on the Canadian market would be rather small, especially because they are so far away from Canada.


25 parapente : It's a case of King Kanute I am afraid. Emirates has a winning hand.The location, the aircraft and infrastructure.Nobody wants to go "via" anywhere if
26 blueflyer : No, the government's goal is to think of the greater good, not the convenience of the 50 daily passengers who do want to fly to DXB. If the governmen
27 SKAirbus : Playing devil's advocate here but the Canadian Goverment wouldn't batter an eyelid at injecting cash into Air Canada if they failed, plus it seems th
28 Post contains images einsteinboricua : Sounds like EK has picked up a thing or two from FR
29 Post contains links Quokka : This accusation is becoming tiresome. It is constantly made by EK's detractors without ever any evidence being offered. EK publishes audited accounts
30 Post contains images SeeTheWorld : And allow gay marriage ..... [Edited 2010-12-07 06:06:53]
31 yenne09 : This thread seems to go out of his focus. When we negotiate we always ask for more to have less. It is sure that Emirates has to gain access to as muc
32 mogandoCI : i'm not praising this practice on LH either. it's poor sportmanship to whine and complain on your corporate website like that, but EK is a worse offe
33 gipsy : I presume that they are subsidized in a way every Government owned airline is. By getting cash. Sure they have to buy planes to market prices and acc
34 C172Akula : I'm not in favour of EK pushing us around, but just wanted to point out some of the other major population centres that use YYC: -Red Deer (~83,000)
35 Post contains links C172Akula : WS is also in talks with EK for possible interline and code-share agreements. If this does come to pass then I think 2x daily to YYC/YVR are really ou
36 YXXMIKE : A quick history lesson for EK here, don't attempt to strong arm Canadian Governments they tend to frown upon it. Canadian governments tend to have an
37 Post contains images L410Turbolet : *cough* Arthur Andersen *cough*
38 SR4ever : Didn't CU make refuels in Gander, by the way?
39 AirNovaBAe146 : As EK is running at or near capacity on their 3x weekly A380 flights YYZ DXB, I'm a bit buzzled as to how this WJ codeshare will help them. Its not li
40 BMI727 : Referees rarely change their calls, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't get on them. Better fares. Leave behind some people flying on bargain ba
41 C172Akula : Do you mean this statement for EK or WS? Because the average WS flyer is the bargain basement pax, so I don't see how WS shuttling pax to YYZ for EK
42 BMI727 : Emirates mostly, but WS could probably benefit too.
43 Threepoint : This gets my vote as the best comment on the thread, for its humour and subtle accuracy. There is no indication the Govt of Canada will support Air C
44 Post contains images C172Akula : Oh come on now, if that was the case why do we have so many flights to Europe for a city our size? I would have to say the majority of Calgarians I h
45 YXXMIKE : I believe the Russians also used Gander as a fueling stop as well, I remember an old colleague of mine who used to work at YQX in the eighties tellin
46 C172Akula : I guess if EK ever did get their wish and started YYC-DXB 2x daily we'd probably see it drop to 1x daily and then even less, eventually ending with t
47 Pnwtraveler : Concern about competition is exactly what the government is respecting. IF they flooded the market with seats many direct flights would end and carri
48 Post contains images czbbflier : For some reason, this post was deleted because it quoted an innocuous comment... however, be that as it may, here is the re-edited post.... * * * * *
49 PanHAM : Exactly. (Sorry, I did not read all the other replies). A sovereign government does not need the advise of a foreign carrier. EK is like a small chil
50 david_itl : Why? This is always the retort of those who have no answers to those airlines who dare to want to fly to cities other than the major one in a country
51 AirCanada787 : For me that is a key point in all of this, I just don't feel like EK should be telling us, or any other country how many landing rights they should r
52 C172Akula : I listed all those communities that utilize YYC because a previous poster thought that Strathmore (~12,000) was the only major population centre near
53 LHPII : you are wrong on most of the points: 1) they pay market prices for planes....not quite, EK recieves export credit subsidies for aircraft financing fr
54 czbbflier : First, this clearly has been written by someone who lives on an island where you can never be more than 42 miles from the sea, with a population of 6
55 Viscount724 : YYC has had direct service to Europe for half a century, first CP to AMS followed by AC (then TCA) to LHR. YYC's population then was about 250,000.
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