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DCA Landings On Runway 33  
User currently offlineRICBWI From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 86 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 5025 times:

Hey gang,

I was out at DCA yesterday and saw several mainline craft land on runway 33. I did not realize at 5,200 feet that Runway 33 was used for mainline traffic--its "only" 5,200 feet. I know it was very windy yesterday--I'm assuming that was the reason. Nonetheless, since most traffic was using Runway 1 (1600 feet longer) i'm curious as to what would cause some arrivals (non peak period) to be on 33. I'm not a pilot but I think i'd rather have the extra 1600.

Thanks

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinephllax From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 425 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks ago) and read 4917 times:

Back when I was in DC in the 93-97 time frame, I used to see 727's, DC9's and MD 80's land on 33 all of the time along with the props.

User currently offlineapodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4124 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 4723 times:

There are a couple of reasons this might happen in DCA.

1. Even though Runway 1 is longer DCA often has strong crosswinds from the west, which would make 33 an easier landing even with the shorter length, since the headwind will reduce the landing distance needed as well as the groundspeed on final.

2. Because Runway 1 is also the primary departure runway, DCA may need a little more time to get departures out, or the plane thats cleared for takeoff on 1 takes his time on the runway, and in this case circling to 33 actually buys ATC more time with runway 1. I was in a CRJ jumpseat one time going into DCA and a Shuttle America E170 was cleared for takeoff as we were coming in to land on runway 1. The 170 took his time moving onto 1, so at about 500 ft AGL we requested and were granted a circle to land on 33 to buy time for the 170 and to prevent us from going missed completely. I have never seen a cockpit more busy in the next few seconds than I did that day.

3. The turnoff of runway 33 brings you right into the remote parking area that US uses for the RJ's and props. Air Wisconsin, PSA, and Piedmont will often take runway 33 to shorten the taxi time after landing with that in mind, much like 35 in PHL.


User currently offlineIAHFLYR From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 4790 posts, RR: 23
Reply 3, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 4707 times:

Quoting apodino (Reply 2):
much like 35 in PHL.

Yes, and landing 35 at PHL using CRDA in the TRACON is also a large increase in the capacity. If PHL can't land on 17/35 the arrival rate crumbles.



Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
User currently offlineflyby519 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 1082 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 4565 times:

There were very few smooth landings on RWY 1 today! 33 was definitely a lot easier if you could take the short runway.


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User currently offlineUTAH744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 184 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 4523 times:

Flying DC-9s into DCA in the 80's and 90's we used 33 when the crosswinds were high, and sometimes when it worked for ATC. The DC-9-50 used all of the runway.


You are never too old to learn something stupid
User currently onlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 10992 posts, RR: 52
Reply 6, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 4450 times:

It happens actually rather frequently! Especially on windy days, like today.

At the end of 33:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Damon Marcus Lewis



Turning around ON 33 after landing on 33:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Damon Marcus Lewis




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User currently offlineRICBWI From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 4259 times:

Interesting stuff.

Thanks everyone!


User currently offlinecatiii From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 2796 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4068 times:

Happened to be in DC today for a day trip (down and back from LGA) and the winds were steady out of the west gusting to about 35 knots at one point.

User currently offlinecapitalflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2010, 324 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 3734 times:

What about 4/22? I have seen maybe one takeoff on 4, if I remember it was a Dash 8 headed for EWR. It was able to make a right turn and go around Capitol to the east rather than having to loop around from the west as departures on 1 would require. Could CRJ or E Jet use this runway (4911') for flights headed to EWR/LGA/JFK/BOS?

User currently offlineapodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4124 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3486 times:

Quoting capitalflyer (Reply 9):
What about 4/22? I have seen maybe one takeoff on 4, if I remember it was a Dash 8 headed for EWR. It was able to make a right turn and go around Capitol to the east rather than having to loop around from the west as departures on 1 would require. Could CRJ or E Jet use this runway (4911') for flights headed to EWR/LGA/JFK/BOS?

It is possible, however it has to be a rather light load in order to do it (40 pax or less aprox). Truthfully, though 4 departures actually benefit flights to the south (I.E. Florida and the Coastal areas) more than flights to the northeast, because the right turn actually shaves about 10 minutes off a flight headed for the DAILY fix. Occasionally, you will see a steep right turn off of 1 for a DAILY departure since the normal left turn up the potomac requires a vector all the way around the north side of P 56 and then back down the east side of P 56. SWANN and PALEO departures (The ones up to NYC and BOS), actually don't gain anything with a right turn or a 4 departure, and 1 is still easier for them.


User currently offlineMDShady From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3480 times:

Doesn't landing on 1 @ DCA require an incredibly long downwind? Hence aircraft from the NE may be able to cut it short and land on 33?

User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3761 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3471 times:

Quoting MDShady (Reply 11):
Doesn't landing on 1 @ DCA require an incredibly long downwind? Hence aircraft from the NE may be able to cut it short and land on 33?

Not as long as the downwind at ATL/ORD/IAH.


User currently offlineMDShady From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3460 times:

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 12):
Not as long as the downwind at ATL/ORD/IAH.

Yeah but what shortcut is available at ATL/ORD/IAH?


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