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Replacing C/D Concourse At IAD  
User currently offlinecapitalflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2010, 343 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 12653 times:

Preparing myself to fly out of the pole barn that is the C/D concourse at IAD got me to wondering, when will it be replaced? MWAA has always expressed a desire to replace it, but it never seems to be discussed and there doesn't seem to be any active planning. In 2006, a rehab was completed that was supposed to lengthen its life by 8-10 years. Assuming the concourse was near the end of its useful life in 2006 (not a far-fetched conclusion), that means by 2016 C/D will have again outlived its usefulness.

So, will it ever get replaced?

85 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineizbtmnhd From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 269 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 12586 times:

Quoting capitalflyer (Thread starter):

It's been rehabbed from the rehab from the rehab from the rehab from the rehab!

From my understanding MWAA wants UA to put up most of the costs to build Tier 2. Maybe with the merger this will be done.

It really needs to be done. Dulles is a very dysfunctional airport. It has a train system built for a Tier that's been in planning stages for decades and yet dosen't link effectively the concourses where a majority of the largest carrier's flights operate because MWAA considers that space 'temporary'. This situation also forces the continuing operation of ye ancient Mobile Lounges to the D concourse.

Dulles pax movement was pretty stagnant for the last decade (the Independence Air bubble year aside), so maybe if UA closes CLE and ups its ops at IAD we'll see someone's hand being forced into addressing this issue.

[Edited 2010-12-16 16:59:56]

[Edited 2010-12-16 17:06:27]

User currently offlineAmwest2united From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 409 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12469 times:
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Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 1):
From my understanding MWAA wants UA to put up most of the costs to build Tier 2. Maybe with the merger this will be done.

It really needs to be done. Dulles is a very dysfunctional airport. It has a train system built for a Tier that's been in planning stages for decades and yet dosen't link effectively the concourses where a majority of the largest carrier's flights operate because MWAA considers that space 'temporary'. This situation also forces the continuing operation of ye ancient Mobile Lounges to the D concourse.

It is amazing that most airports help pay for the new terminals to grow it's business, but IAD, MWAA treats UA like they should UA should pay for everything and then caiter to Other airlines more. I would imagine that there could be a chance UA will decrease flights, but would expect them to grow to take some preasure off EWR.



Life is what happens to you while you making plans to live it!
User currently offlineEricR From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 1904 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12462 times:

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 1):
Dulles pax movement was pretty stagnant for the last decade (the Independence Air bubble year aside), so maybe if UA closes CLE and ups its ops at IAD we'll see someone's hand being forced into addressing this issue.

If I were MWAA, I would wait a couple years to see how the UA/CO merger affects the traffic at IAD before investing too much money in a new terminal.

[Edited 2010-12-16 17:41:04]

User currently offlineMPDPilot From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 993 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12420 times:

Quoting Amwest2united (Reply 2):
It is amazing that most airports help pay for the new terminals to grow it's business, but IAD, MWAA treats UA like they should UA should pay for everything and then caiter to Other airlines more. I would imagine that there could be a chance UA will decrease flights, but would expect them to grow to take some preasure off EWR.

I thought Dulles has a huge master plan and Concourse C/D is just part of it. Having United pay for that part isn't unreasonable. They have paid for their part of the master plan, the train, the Concourse A/B rebuild. And I believe they are ready to go on C/D as they have built the tarmac to handle the new building.



One mile of highway gets you one mile, one mile of runway gets you anywhere.
User currently offlinecapitalflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2010, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12292 times:

The other part of the equation too would be that Metro to IAD will be done in about 2016 as well, and costs for phase two to the airport have already gone up nearly $1 billion since the project broke ground. So would they even have the money to do the bond issue that would be needed for a new terminal?

I think United is going to have to foot much if not all the bill. So who knows when it gets built.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22992 posts, RR: 20
Reply 6, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12259 times:

Quoting capitalflyer (Reply 5):
The other part of the equation too would be that Metro to IAD will be done in about 2016 as well, and costs for phase two to the airport have already gone up nearly $1 billion since the project broke ground.

They've also just spent a bunch of money on the secure-side train and new security checkpoint (both of which are enormous improvements).

Another part of the problem at IAD is that most of B is extremely underutilized (the likes of SK essentially have their own gates), and that doesn't really help the finances.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinebohica From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2699 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 9 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11927 times:

Quoting capitalflyer (Thread starter):
So, will it ever get replaced?

Hopefully soon. It is sad that the capital of the United States of America has a third world facility in Concourse C/D. I can only imagine the negative first impression it leaves on visitors to Washington, DC. It is a dark, dirty, and user unfriendly facility.

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 1):
It's been rehabbed from the rehab from the rehab from the rehab from the rehab!

  
If you take a slum and add new carpeting and a fresh coat of paint, what do you get? A slum with new carpeting and a fresh coat of paint. The only acceptable rehab of the current concourse C/D is with a wrecking ball.


User currently offlineKLM777300ER From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 36 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 11749 times:

I've said this before, but I think putting C/D aside, Dulles is actually a great airport to use in terms of facilities with the new security mezzanine and aerotrain and expanded international arrival building, the B concourse etc...not the quickest facility like Reagan, but not a nightmare like it once was.

I have been waiting for MWAA to give the go ahead for the new C concourse (and I remember a long time ago someone even posted links from the architecture firm working on the design with images of what the concourse would look like). But MWAA is caught up in the Metro project for the time being. So it seems UA either will have to take initiative, or we will have to wait it out...

With that being said, C/D has so many nostalgic memories for me that I will actually be sad to see it go. I am not saying it should stay as I realize it is a crappy/temporary/was never supposed to be here 25 years later facility, but from a purely nostalgic perspective, some of my best flights and trips to Europe, the Middle East, and Far East Asia have all started in that concourse.


User currently offlineSRT75 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 260 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 11617 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 6):
Another part of the problem at IAD is that most of B is extremely underutilized

Does CO plan to move its operations to C/D in the near future in light of the merger?


User currently offlineworking2gether From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 83 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 11121 times:

Quoting KLM777300ER (Reply 8):
(and I remember a long time ago someone even posted links from the architecture firm working on the design with images of what the concourse would look like)
http://www.kpf.com/project.asp?R=1&ID=60

Quoting SRT75 (Reply 9):
Does CO plan to move its operations to C/D in the near future in light of the merger?
CO does not have a big operation at IAD with only a few turboprop flights to EWR each day.

I have heard rumors that within 2 years, construction is set to begin for the new C/D Concourse. There has already been changes with the new train station at C Gates. MWAA has put up costly banners displaying the new concourse and shops and construction has blocked off part of the outer side of C train station.


User currently offlinefun2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1043 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 11041 times:

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 1):
Dulles pax movement was pretty stagnant for the last decade (the Independence Air bubble year aside), so maybe if UA closes CLE and ups its ops at IAD we'll see someone's hand being forced into addressing this issue.

These terminals are a complete embarrasment to UA. I'd certainly push for a new one, and if new UA does want to pay for it, they can put those pax via CLE at no additional cost. I absolutely avoid IAD because of the complete dissatisfaction of that hub. Try to get food..joke...need to wait 20 minutes in an overcrowded terminal with everyone banging into you. Only place worse was the old US flight outpost AC had at YYZ.


User currently offlineAADC10 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2091 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 10852 times:

There is no specific financing in place to build the replacement C/D concourse. UA is expected to pay the bulk of the cost for its construction, as they did at ORD but UA is not simply being cheap, they do not have the money. Extra cash had to be reserved for the CO merger and issuing more junk bonds is extremely expensive to an already highly indebted company. UA also has to finance the 787s and A350s they have on order, although they will not arrive for several years. I am not sure but I assume that CO had already had the financing for their aircraft orders.

While there is always a chance that a booming economy would allow UA to build the new concourse, I would expect that C/D will get another refurbishment before the new concourse is built.


User currently offlineTomFoolery From Austria, joined Jan 2004, 529 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 10459 times:

Quoting fun2fly (Reply 11):
I absolutely avoid IAD because of the complete dissatisfaction of that hub.

I just avoid the carriers who dominate the C/D terminal. During the high traffic times, it is absolutely packed. Concourse B is fantastic...open, bright, good food, but as was pointed out, it is so under utilized. The utilization issue could be why there seems to be so much space. Lets see what happens when we start getting some serious utilization densities like at C/D.

Tom



Paper makes an airplane fly
User currently offlinecaptainstefan From United States of America, joined May 2007, 429 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 10262 times:

Quoting working2gether (Reply 10):
I have heard rumors that within 2 years, construction is set to begin for the new C/D Concourse.

How many times have we heard that over the past 20 years?

Regardless, that terminal should be in the Guinness Book for world's largest double-wide trailer.


  



Long Live the Tulip!
User currently offlinewashingtonian From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 9897 times:

Hah, funny timing on this thread. I flew United from IAD this morning and while walking in that ugly passageway from the Concourse C aerotrain station to Concourse C I thought to myself how sad it is that hundreds of thousands of passengers will have to schlep through that during the next decade until Concourse C/D is replaced.

One major complaint about IAD. They spent billions building the new aerotrain and security checkpoint and I swear for the life of me the security lines are worse than they used to be. I used to never have a problem going through security at IAD except perhaps at like 4PM sometimes. But now there seems to always be a line. They have all of these checkpoint stations but only seem to have two open at a time. And then only one or two TSA agents checking IDs. It can regularly take 15-30 minutes to clear TSA there. Perhaps I don't travel as much as others but I never really have long TSA lines, except at IAD now. It's a shame and pathetic that they have a gorgeous new security checkpoint but don't have enough TSA stations to process passengers efficiently.

As for C/D, it's not horrible but it's not great either. United could do a lot to fix it up if they plan on being there for another decade. They still have old logos (heck if you look closely in certain areas you can see TWA colors still) that look straight out of the early 1990s, and some new lighting and signage would do wonders. But the restaurant selection is ok, etc.

As for it's replacement, it is long overdue, especially now that the aerotrain station opened up at the site of the future concourse. It's simply ridiculous that passengers have to backtrack to get to the train. When the Concourse does eventually open up, it will be amazing, especially if United presumably consolidates its entire operation in the new concourse. There is no reason it can't be like Delta's terminal at DTW. It will be a great O&D and connecting hub for United.

Once it's complete there will hopefully not be any major flaws left with IAD, and that is quite an accomplishment for a major international airport.

Oh, one problem though. If they do built a full-length Concourse C/D replacement, they will also have to tunnel to extend the aerotrain. I imagine this will be costly and somehow they will avoid doing it. Thus we could have a situation in which a full-length Concourse C/D is only served by one aerotrain station. That will be unfortunate if that happens....

Quoting bohica (Reply 7):
It is sad that the capital of the United States of America has a third world facility in Concourse C/D. I can only imagine the negative first impression it leaves on visitors to Washington, DC. It is a dark, dirty, and user unfriendly facility.

Well it's not THAT bad. It is dark and dirty and dated, but not that different than parts of most major American airports.

Quoting KLM777300ER (Reply 8):
I've said this before, but I think putting C/D aside, Dulles is actually a great airport to use in terms of facilities with the new security mezzanine and aerotrain and expanded international arrival building, the B concourse etc...not the quickest facility like Reagan, but not a nightmare like it once was.

Absolutely agree. If you are flying any airline other than United or Ethiopian, the terminal experience can be quite nice.

Dulles has come FAR this decade. Concourse B is fully built out, there is an underground walkway to A/B, the new security checkpoint, the new aerotrain, the new runway, the new ATC tower, Metro is currently being built out towards IAD as I type this, and more. The renovated FIS facility will be all done in 2011 too. Also lots of new international carriers and service.

Quoting KLM777300ER (Reply 8):
With that being said, C/D has so many nostalgic memories for me that I will actually be sad to see it go. I am not saying it should stay as I realize it is a crappy/temporary/was never supposed to be here 25 years later facility, but from a purely nostalgic perspective, some of my best flights and trips to Europe, the Middle East, and Far East Asia have all started in that concourse.

All on United or back in the day when most international airlines used C/D?

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 12):
as they did at ORD

When did UA re-build their ORD facility?


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4282 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 9588 times:
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If the nice Dulles people can just replace the miles and miles and miles and miles of *bad* Las Vegas lounge carperting with something lighter and brighter (like the new carpeting in BWI concourse D) and update the 70s yellow wall paint -- the place will be 1000% brighter.

Maybe even bump up the ceilings a couple of inches?

Call in Mike Holmes. He can do it.   


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4282 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 9552 times:
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Quoting captainstefan (Reply 14):
Regardless, that terminal should be in the Guinness Book for world's largest double-wide trailer.

That's not nice.

Nevertheless -                              


User currently offlineKLM777300ER From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 36 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 9529 times:

Quoting washingtonian (Reply 15):
All on United or back in the day when most international airlines used C/D?

Almost exclusively with United, except for Austrian, who was at D back in 2002 when I flew them. All other international airlines I have used out of IAD have been out of B. I do remember in the mid-90s as a little boy (~5 years) when my grandparents would take me to Dulles to spot planes (the hobby started early lol), and since this was obviously pre-9/11 when one could go beyond security without a boarding pass, we would go to C/D via the mobile lounges and stop at the little candy stand. It used to be such a treat  


User currently offlinecapitalflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2010, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 9215 times:

In addition to new C/D concourse, I would imagine they would try to consolidate UEX operations in the same concourse. Thank God I have never had to make a connection between A and C/D.

Is there room to extend the C/D concourse to create an A type extension (holding room with multiple ground level gates)?

On a side note, nothing annoys me more than flying into ORD concourse C and then having to hoof it to the stupid little bus that you have to walk down the stairs to get to, and then climb back up the stairs into Terminal 2 only to have to sprint to make it to F11C. Absolutely awful.


User currently offlineiaddca From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 286 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 9180 times:

metro will not be at IAD by 2016, probably 2018 or 2019

the security lines have gotten much worse the last 6 months, they seem to be short staffed all the time now


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22992 posts, RR: 20
Reply 21, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 9100 times:

Quoting iaddca (Reply 20):
the security lines have gotten much worse the last 6 months, they seem to be short staffed all the time now

   It's a staffing thing. When the new checkpoint was first open (~a year ago, or a bit more), it was a dream.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineizbtmnhd From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 269 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 9040 times:

I'm kinda intrigued by the local defense of IAD. It's not as nice as you think:

Let's be honest, C/D isn't a 'below average' facility, it's an elongated shed. Literally. It's embarassing and it is borderline third world. This isn't even open for debate. Same goes for the FIS facilites in that shed. If you're looking for 'below average' you need not look further than the overcrowded low ceilinged A concourse.

IAD is still a large transfer airport, most of those people are making those transfers via United. Anyone flying United knows the problems with Dulles. They are still very large.

There are other issues beyond UA's control: There's the issue of lack of climate control in the main terminal on the arrivals level. Summer time can be quite uncomfortable.

Another abyssmal fact about IAD is that it dosen't have a hangar facilites for widebodies or even large narrowbodies. The moderately large hangar recently built for private aircraft collapsed last winter!

The work is far from done.



As for Metro, there's no date. There's no money to fund it completly at this point. The desired date is 2016.

[Edited 2010-12-17 22:24:42]

[Edited 2010-12-17 22:26:00]

User currently offlineLawair From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 201 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (3 years 9 months 4 days ago) and read 8993 times:

Quoting bohica (Reply 7):
It is sad that the capital of the United States of America has a third world facility in Concourse C/D.
Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 22):
It's embarassing and it is borderline third world.

I hope we're not talking about third world/developing Asia... Terminals in Myanmar, Vietnam, and even the Philippines (not NAIA T1) are rivaling, if not surpassing, Dulles Terminal B at this point.
  

That said, C/D's not that miserable though. I feel like I've seen worse in some other US cities...though I guess we could hope for more from DC though.


User currently offlineKLM777300ER From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 36 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (3 years 9 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 8945 times:

Some of us do defend IAD because it holds a special place for us, and because, well, those of us living in the DC area really don't have much of a choice for direct international flights to Europe, Asia, Africa, and South America (please, BWI does not count as a viable option...). So whether or not we like it, we have to embrace IAD for what it is.

And I go to college in Philly, and trust me, I would take IAD including C/D over any of the terminals in PHL excluding Terminal A, and B at IAD beats Terminal A at Philly by miles in my opinion. So there definitely are worse US airports terminals (Terminal C at Boston    ). But this is just my opinion, and I am used to people generally dismissing IAD.


25 kgaiflyer : You got that right. Then there's terminals 2 and 8 at LAX. And terminals A, B, and D at STL. And the central terminal at LGA. And Concourse A at EWR.
26 Post contains images kgaiflyer : You need to specify "ground level" commuter terminal Concourse A -- **Not** the upper-level Concourse A where OS, QR, KL, and SA board. In the 'groun
27 Coairman : Does anybody have interior photos of the b and c united terminals? I would like to see them. Are the facilities worse than CLE's Terminal C? I have ne
28 Bartond : Could not agree more with this. I fly DEN-IAD-RIC a lot through Dulles and it amazes me to fly a 752/763/772 to IAD in to C/D terminal then connect t
29 bohica : My previous statement was made generally. I was not targeting any specific country or region, nor was it my intention to offend anyone.
30 Lawair : No worries. No offense taken. I was just intentionally taking your statement out of context to point out some irony.[Edited 2010-12-18 23:13:57]
31 Post contains links kgaiflyer : Photo links? This is the best I can do on short notice. http://www.flickr.com/photos/crumbs/131761437
32 captainstefan : What exactly do you want me to concentrate on? I'll be flying to DXB tomorrow via IAD and can shoot what you want to see.
33 Post contains links 747fan : http://www.flickr.com/photos/wakethesun/4984891400/ This captures the look of the UA concourse pretty well. It largely reminds me of ATL's concourses
34 AADC10 : It was completed in 1988. During the Gulf War it seemed like money poorly spent. Considering that UA is trying to slow down the runway construction a
35 Coairman : I wanted shots of the boarding areas and maybe the food court (if there is one). I work in CLE and think Terminal C is drab in the gate C-2 thru C-18
36 tharanga : The locals defend it because they see the huge investments that have been made in recent years. Aerotrain, runway, the walkway to B, the new security
37 bjorn14 : Does UA operate any other gates than in C/D? What would be the gate capacity if a new C/D was built?
38 kgaiflyer : Yeah, I was delayed flying CLE-BOS a couple months ago and wound up going over to D concourse for a bite to eat -- not only because it has better kar
39 izbtmnhd : My point about C/D isn't just about the ceilings and lighting. It's also not a very good facility. It leaks when there are heavy downpours in the summ
40 kgaiflyer : As mentioned in several posts above, about half of UAX operates out of 'ground level' concourse A (gates A-1 to A-6 -- each gate has 6 positions) and
41 Post contains links kgaiflyer : No, there is none. Restaurants are randomly placed along the C/D concourses. During a 'bank' eveything and its brother has a line -- even the bad, gr
42 FriendlySkies : I don't know that the ORD expansion is a good comparison...UA doesn't want to pay for a new terminal for their competitors. Building a new C/D at IAD
43 Post contains images DCA-ROCguy : Heehee. I rarely use IAD, because the access from the eastern side of DC is bad, and isn't going to improve much when the Metro opens. I predict big
44 Post contains images izbtmnhd : The hangar was torn down this past summer/fall. I believe all the aircraft have been removed. There's been talk of a temporary smaller hangar at anot
45 United787 : Terminal 1 was completed in 1987 and the Gulf War was in 1990, I don't understand the correlation... I agree with FriendlySkies, not a good compariso
46 iaddca : Logan Terminal C at least has windows out to the tarmac, Boston Beer Works, and short walks. Only the arrivals level is a pit. Dulles C/D gets very li
47 ScottB : There's one other wild card here as well -- the potential for DCA to be opened up to more beyond-perimeter flying. If this does happen, it could seri
48 FriendlySkies : Unless you start seeing A330s and 777s flying out of DCA, IAD's viability as a hub in UA's network would certainly not be damaged.
49 Post contains images kgaiflyer : I remember months ago loose talking on weekends from congressional staffers about a few 757 routes like DCA-BDL-ORY (I suppose EC) and DCA-BDL-AMS (I
50 AADC10 : Traffic took a nose dive during the Gulf War and sent several carriers, most notably PA over the edge. UA spent a huge amount of money on ORD T-1 and
51 Coairman : [quote=kgaiflyer,reply=38]Yeah, I was delayed flying CLE-BOS a couple months ago and wound up going over to D concourse for a bite to eat -- not only
52 washingtonian : Yes. For local O&D on an airline other than United, IAD is quite nice. It really depends. I assume that they will build it out full-length and co
53 ScottB : The problem isn't UA shifting IAD-LAX flights to DCA; it is the large slot holders at DCA (specifically US and potentially DL) using their portfolios
54 capitalflyer : Not gonna happen. One of the reasons MWAA fights Congress to limit additional beyond perimeter slots is this very possibility. They wouldn't expand a
55 capitalflyer : Is there room to extend the C/D concourse to create an A type extension (holding room with multiple ground level gates)? In looking at Google view of
56 ScottB : If the Congress cared about what the MWAA wanted, there wouldn't be any beyond perimeter exemptions to begin with.
57 kgaiflyer : The location of G made no sense before. But across the taxiway from C and connected to the train makes all the difference in the world. By the way --
58 Post contains images DCA-ROCguy : I think EWR is more of a threat to IAD than a lot of people here seem to think. Economies of scale. Bigger planes at EWR to handle connecting pax, an
59 kgaiflyer : Which implies that the members of Congress who have free parking privledges from MWAA want small putt-putt planes and reduced services at IAD. We're
60 ScottB : The members of Congress with free parking privileges from MWAA want non-stop flights home from DCA. Non-stop international flights from IAD don't rea
61 iaddca : I flew TWA DCA-LAX in the early days of beyond perimeter flights in 2001, and remember thinking that being forced onto a narrowbody because we were at
62 Post contains images kgaiflyer : And (except in the DC area ) business always wins.
63 capitalflyer : Just arrived back at IAD. To answer a earlier posts I saw no evidence of construction at C28 of escalators for UAX flights. I did see plenty of airsta
64 SRT75 : I think that IAD should be relatively immune to EWR post-merger. I say this because IAD is not at capacity, while EWR is operating over-capacity. The
65 Post contains links STT757 : EWR will continue to grow, by replacing smaller aircraft with larger aircraft. They've already have begun doing this by redeploying UAX 70 seat ERJ-1
66 Cubsrule : Loss of capacity is probably all right if the total capacity at EWR plus IAD stays stable, but from a competitive perspective, more frequency on smal
67 Post contains images kgaiflyer : As far as CDG is concerned, switch away -- AF already *owns* IAD-CDG. There will be little point in anyone else flying the route after the AF 380 arr
68 drerx7 : Star will still need to maintain this route of course - but tongue and cheek I agree.
69 washingtonian : True. But this could be avoided if they implement it the way they were talking about in the past two years. Instead of simply removing the perimeter
70 Cubsrule : It's no worse than C to A at EWR.
71 washingtonian : Personally, I think it's easier at EWR except for having to re-clear security. At least clearing FIS at Terminal C at EWR is a pleasant experience, a
72 ScottB : That provides IAD with little protection, though. US Airways has 11 daily slot pairs parked on DCA-PHL; virtually all of these could be redeployed to
73 Cubsrule : That is correct.
74 capitalflyer : This could work well with CO new 752 with flat beds.
75 kgaiflyer : There is a shuttle bus service that connects A-28 to C-71 making clearing security again unnecessary. I've done it many times. And no -- it is not be
76 Coairman : I agree EWR will upgadge from Expressjet and Chataqua RJs to ERJ-170's and mainline flying to help fill the upgadged international flights from 757's
77 washingtonian : The poster said C to A at EWR. Obviously A to C is a different story.
78 kgaiflyer : I don't know why that would be. Remember -- C has four wings and services international, domestic, and most of the Q400 services. Unless I've missed
79 Cubsrule : Not really. Either an international-domestic or a domestic-domestic connection involving a terminal change at EWR is a pain in the rear end.
80 jfk777 : The United concourses at IAD are a shame, they should have been replaced years ago. They are a "temporary" structure still in use since the 1980's. Th
81 AADC10 : But how will they get to their international junkets? What about the Ambassadorships in their retirement or their staffers that move on to overseas p
82 kgaiflyer : And the military. Last time I looked we had several hundred thousand men overseas.
83 ScottB : Most Congressmen go on very few international trips. The handful who are appointed as ambassadors in retirement (most ambassadors are career diplomat
84 capitalflyer : I don't think IAD is a big military airport. I would imagine most would use Air Mobility Command facilities at BWI. They have several gates of their
85 kgaiflyer : No -- not in the troop-movement sense. But the military transacts business, moves families, brings officers in for briefings, etc. Have you forgotten
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