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VS's B 747-400s/A380s  
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9191 posts, RR: 15
Posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 11320 times:

How many B 747-400s does VS have? Where do they fly them to? I wonder why they don't put the B 747-400s on the LHR-HKG-SYD route. They did LHR-HKG for a while.

How many A 380s did they order? 6? How many options? Will they place them on the LHR-HKG-SYD route? They should since this is a very busy route

26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 10710 times:

12 (13 if you include the one leased to Aerosur). They fly on all leisure routes from LGW/MAN and seasonally on LHR-JNB/JFK/EWR/SFO/MIA/BOS. There are two different configs;a high density leisure and a lower density config for the LHR routes (although they also do LGW-BGI and a couple of others).

Generally there are three or four based at LHR, with the rest at LGW/MAN.

The B744 is simply not suited to the HKG/SYD route. For one thing it would use all of LHR's B744 fleet, and that alone is enough to justify its exclusion. VS are quite flexible with their fleet, with many stations seeing all 3 aircraft types over the course of the year. Putting B744 on this route would make things very tricky if an aircraft went tech for example.

Besides, the A346 offers a better congfiguration for the demand. The extra economy seats would put a strain on yields.

The A380 order was for 6+6. Again, I doubt they will go on the HKG/SYD route (when and if they arrive). The route is not as busy as you think. When VS ran the second daily service for a while the yields fell through the floor.

Ultimately, the A346 is the perfect aircraft for the route, so there is no sense in changing it



So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
User currently offlineCharlieNoble From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 10492 times:

Quoting SevenHeavy (Reply 1):
Ultimately, the A346 is the perfect aircraft for the route, so there is no sense in changing it

How can that POSSIBLY be? Everyone 'knows' that the A346 is useless  

Kidding.


User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3297 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 10363 times:

Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):
How many B 747-400s does VS have? Where do they fly them to? I wonder why they don't put the B 747-400s on the LHR-HKG-SYD route. They did LHR-HKG for a while.

How many A 380s did they order? 6? How many options?

For fleets :
www.airfleets.net
http://jethros.eu/fleets/fleets.htm

For what flies where
http://www.libhomeradar.org/databasequery/index.php

Current B744s are everything from LGW and LHR-JNB, LHR-EWR and LHR-JFK. LHR-SFO has gone to the A346 for the winter and LHR-BOS is an A343 currently.


User currently offlinesmi0006 From Australia, joined Jan 2008, 1546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 10246 times:

I do recall talk of VS starting a service to MEL via PVG, maybe from MAN? Any chance we could see this service with an A330? Have they been commited already and we shall have to wait for the 787, or simply VS chatter?

User currently offlineBA174 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 765 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 10165 times:

Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):
How many B 747-400s does VS have? Where do they fly them to? I wonder why they don't put the B 747-400s on the LHR-HKG-SYD route. They did LHR-HKG for a while.

How many A 380s did they order? 6? How many options? Will they place them on the LHR-HKG-SYD route? They should since this is a very busy route


Many on this forum including me doubt VSs A380s will ever see the light of day. They seem struggle with the 744s now hence their HD LGW usage.


User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3297 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10109 times:

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 4):
I do recall talk of VS starting a service to MEL via PVG, maybe from MAN? Any chance we could see this service with an A330?

Not in a million years. Virgin Manchester ops are UK based point to point leisure, so a split load to Melbourne via Shanghai is kind of remote, given Emirates being able to offer the same with more frequency for less on the A380.


User currently offlineSevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 9
Reply 7, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 9975 times:

Quoting BA174 (Reply 5):
Many on this forum including me doubt VSs A380s will ever see the light of day. They seem struggle with the 744s now hence their HD LGW usage.

I wouldn't say they struggle. The aircraft is perfect for the LGW/MAN operation and they do very well at LHR by using the aircraft to JNB in the winter, and SFO/MIA in the summer. JFK/EWR and even BOS benefit from the extra capacity at times as well.

Its the same story with VS as with most other carriers. They could fill an all B744 fleet in the summer, but that would hurt like hell in the winter  
Quoting CharlieNoble (Reply 2):
How can that POSSIBLY be? Everyone 'knows' that the A346 is useless

Kidding.

Mind you, I probably should have quantified my statement by adding "within the VS fleet". I'm sure there's a few people itching to tell me how much more efficient the B77W would be  



So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
User currently offlinedeltaflyertoo From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 1662 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 9204 times:

This thread has me thinking....does anyone know or have a good guess as to what routes the A380 will be on?

User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5301 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8963 times:

I guess the A340-600 is more economical for them on

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 4):
do recall talk of VS starting a service to MEL via PVG, maybe from MAN? Any chance we could see this service with an A330? Have they been commited already and we shall have to wait for the 787, or simply VS chatter?

Won't be with the 330 as the 330-300 doesnt have the range and will also not have crew rest. i expect the 330's to be used mainly to caribbean/MCO/LAS/LOS/NBO/ACC and east coast usa

Quoting deltaflyertoo (Reply 8):
This thread has me thinking....does anyone know or have a good guess as to what routes the A380 will be on?

I doubt they will take the 380. I think they will stick with the 744 which is relatively new in terms of age for a few more years.


User currently offlineSevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8929 times:

Quoting deltaflyertoo (Reply 8):
This thread has me thinking....does anyone know or have a good guess as to what routes the A380 will be on?

Well.......assuming they show up, SFO, LAX, JFK, MCO, JNB (in no particular order)



So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9952 posts, RR: 15
Reply 11, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8680 times:

Quoting ANstar (Reply 9):
Quoting deltaflyertoo (Reply 8):
This thread has me thinking....does anyone know or have a good guess as to what routes the A380 will be on?

I doubt they will take the 380. I think they will stick with the 744 which is relatively new in terms of age for a few more years.

It still surprises me an airline like VS doesn't have the A380 in their fleet with all the luxurious additions just as EK has on their A380's. I would have expected VS to introduce the A388 as their prime flagship in terms of inflight product seeing how VS loves the media attention. Then again, they have to be able to fill the A380 yearround and more surprising things have happened at VS such as their A330 order and 787 order, thereby moving away from the quad engined fleet and campaign. Apparently they are going "smaller" with regards to their future fleet. I assume they know why they have decided to go into a slightly different direction. I only hope to one day see/photograph the new VS colors myself.

A388


User currently offlineplanesailing From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 816 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 8207 times:

Quoting BA174 (Reply 5):
They seem struggle with the 744s now hence their HD LGW usage.

Even these do not go out full. The MCO and LAS routes seem sustainable, but the Carribean routes using these aircrafts do not always go out full, or even near this.

Whilst the A330's are due in with some coming to LGW, it seems they want to add more MCO rotations rather than use these on the Carribean routes where 450 seat aircraft at times go out with 250 passengers.


User currently offlineSevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 8038 times:

Quoting planesailing (Reply 12):
Even these do not go out full. The MCO and LAS routes seem sustainable, but the Carribean routes using these aircrafts do not always go out full, or even near this.

LAS is almost always full. MCO has quiet sectors because it is so heavily biased towards the UK school holidays. This generally means that if one sector is quiet, the return will be packed (and vice versa)

I'm not sure what stats you are basing your caribbean information on but you rarely see quiet flights. Of course there are always exceptions to the rule but year round the load factors are extremely high.



So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5301 posts, RR: 7
Reply 14, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 7798 times:

Quoting planesailing (Reply 12):
Even these do not go out full. The MCO and LAS routes seem sustainable, but the Carribean routes using these aircrafts do not always go out full, or even near this.

I've seen more flights full than empty to the caribbean too.


User currently offlineplanesailing From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 816 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 7701 times:

Quoting SevenHeavy (Reply 13):
I'm not sure what stats you are basing your caribbean information on but you rarely see quiet flights. Of course there are always exceptions to the rule but year round the load factors are extremely high.

I have access to the boarded inbound and outbound passengers information. Whilst this is not indicative of the yield that VS is making, it does show the popularity of the routes.

Whilst I haven't checked everyday, I have been surprised that at times, the load factors for some of the routes, UVF, ANU, TAB, GND certainly are not full. But then again, 450 seats on a route such as these is a large amount of passengers to be moving.

MCO I rarely see quiet, be it in or out of school holiday season.


User currently offlineStarguy From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2005, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7622 times:

Quoting SevenHeavy (Reply 13):
LAS is almost always full. MCO has quiet sectors because it is so heavily biased towards the UK school holidays. This generally means that if one sector is quiet, the return will be packed (and vice versa)

I'm not sure what stats you are basing your caribbean information on but you rarely see quiet flights. Of course there are always exceptions to the rule but year round the load factors are extremely high.

I'm glad someone in the know has said it. It is well known that during the economic downturn, VS's leisure routes were all very high performing routes, several of which are going to be expanded with the arrival of the A333's early next year. The success of the leisure routes is mirrored by the consistently profit making Virgin Holidays, which is the driving force behind this.


User currently offlineLV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7334 times:

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 3):
For fleets :
www.airfleets.net

I find airfleets.net to be unreliable. Off topic but off the top of my head it mentions nothing about FX' 727s


User currently offlineleezyjet From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 4042 posts, RR: 53
Reply 18, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7191 times:

Quoting SevenHeavy (Reply 7):
I'm sure there's a few people itching to tell me how much more efficient the B77W would be

A B77W would have been even better and more efficient than the A346 !!.

 



"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
User currently offlineBoeingBelly From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2010, 6 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6907 times:

Correct me if i'm wrong but Virgin canceled the A380 and used the delivery slots for more A346's due to not wanting to be a guinea pig for the A380 like they were for the A346! These orders were then changed to A330's as they take more direction from Virgin Holidays as they have helped keep the airline surviving.A thread was on here a couple of weeks ago about the A330 and that two will go to MAN and the rest are going on lease to China(dont know who though)

User currently offlineSevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6802 times:

Quoting leezyjet (Reply 18):
A B77W would have been even better and more efficient than the A346 !!.

Tut tut.......I would have expected better from you  



So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
User currently offlineeicvd From Ireland, joined Mar 2008, 2179 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6726 times:

Quoting LV (Reply 17):
find airfleets.net to be unreliable. Off topic but off the top of my head it mentions nothing about FX' 727s

Doesnt mention any 727's, same with the other fleet website www.planespotters.net


User currently offlineBongodog1964 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 3658 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6695 times:

Quoting BoeingBelly (Reply 19):
Correct me if i'm wrong but Virgin canceled the A380 and used the delivery slots for more A346's due to not wanting to be a guinea pig for the A380 like they were for the A346! These orders were then changed to A330's as they take more direction from Virgin Holidays as they have helped keep the airline surviving.A thread was on here a couple of weeks ago about the A330 and that two will go to MAN and the rest are going on lease to China(dont know who though)

The remainder of the A346's were converted into A333's. The A380 orders remain live, I believe though that they don't have firm delivery slots allocated at present. Many on here are of the opinion that they never will   


User currently offlineSevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6668 times:

Quoting BoeingBelly (Reply 19):
Correct me if i'm wrong but Virgin canceled the A380 and used the delivery slots for more A346's due to not wanting to be a guinea pig for the A380 like they were for the A346! These orders were then changed to A330's as they take more direction from Virgin Holidays as they have helped keep the airline surviving.A thread was on here a couple of weeks ago about the A330 and that two will go to MAN and the rest are going on lease to China(dont know who though)

Some or all of that could be true but in reality none of this has ever been confirmed (with the possible exception of the A346-A333 conversion) - all rumour.

Quoting planesailing (Reply 15):
I have access to the boarded inbound and outbound passengers information. Whilst this is not indicative of the yield that VS is making, it does show the popularity of the routes.

Whilst I haven't checked everyday, I have been surprised that at times, the load factors for some of the routes, UVF, ANU, TAB, GND certainly are not full. But then again, 450 seats on a route such as these is a large amount of passengers to be moving.

MCO I rarely see quiet, be it in or out of school holiday season.

I don't know any details about the source of your info, maybe its better than mine.......

[Edited 2010-12-28 13:40:20]


So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
User currently offlinewilld From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2008, 246 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (3 years 11 months 4 days ago) and read 5877 times:

MCO seems a very good shout for 380 operations by VS however that is if VS get the aircraft. Over on V-Flyer, where I most contribute, myself, and others, seriously doubt that VS will get the 380.

Quoting SevenHeavy (Reply 23):

Quoting planesailing (Reply 15):
I have access to the boarded inbound and outbound passengers information. Whilst this is not indicative of the yield that VS is making, it does show the popularity of the routes.

Whilst I haven't checked everyday, I have been surprised that at times, the load factors for some of the routes, UVF, ANU, TAB, GND certainly are not full. But then again, 450 seats on a route such as these is a large amount of passengers to be moving.

MCO I rarely see quiet, be it in or out of school holiday season.

I don't know any details about the source of your info, maybe its better than mine.......

I would agree regarding MCO. I fly out there in and out of school holiday season and really if you look at the UK school holiday calendar (taking into account earlier Scottish holidays etc) there is very few times in the year when MCO is out of the school holiday season, especially if you think that most families who fly over half term will take an extra week either side! Having said that I flew out this year just before thanks giving and we had less than 250 on board and that was with only one MCO rotation that day. Equally I have found mid September to just be as quiet.

One cannot underestimate the role that Virgin Holidays play with VS ex LGW. Together with Travel City Direct (which may equate to why MCO does so well these days) they play a huge role for VS.

As for the 330s I Would imagine these will eventually end up flying out to the Caribbean it is just for the moment that VS want them into MCO. They seem much better suited to the Caribbean to those islands such as TAB, GND and SJU that are currently double drop.


25 skipness1E : It's pretty good for anything built from the 1990s, not so much historical For UK fleets, Jethro's is pretty hot. tbh I rather suspect that SRB will
26 United Airline : Most LHR-HKG flights are always full. Guess they are profitable? I know a full flight doesn't mean it is a profitable flight if you fill it up with p
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