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Tupolev Rolls Out First Tu-204 SM  
User currently offlineSIBILLE From Belgium, joined Jun 2005, 483 posts, RR: 2
Posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 hours ago) and read 20101 times:

Here is the link on flightinternational.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...olev-rolls-out-first-tu-204sm.html
According to other russian sites, they will need 3 prototypes to complete certifications.
Customers could be Red Wings with more than 40 and Iran Air Tour.
Hope this aircraft will have more success than original Tu-204.

[Edited 2010-12-28 08:56:48]

21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinenycbjr From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 447 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 19916 times:

Wow, its the 757NG! hehe kidding aside it looks like a reasonable replacement, too bad no Western airlines would ever look at it.

If it looks good, it wil fly..

Cheers
  


User currently offlineUAL747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 19909 times:

Quoting nycbjr (Reply 1):
If it looks good, it wil fly..

Huh? I can design you a perfectly good looking aircraft and it wouldn't get off the ground.


User currently offlinenycbjr From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 447 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 hours ago) and read 19581 times:

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 2):

Lol it was a mis quote from Jack Northrop IIRC...Not implying anything  


User currently offlinepylon101 From Russia, joined Feb 2008, 1604 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 19296 times:

Actually any TU-204 is a nice airplane.
It really looks like 757-200 unless you are close to the machine.
Still it has FBW, supercritical wings and all the stuff.

The SM version may have a good chance to guarantee 10 more years for TU-204 - untill MS-21 unfolds.


User currently onlinekanban From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 3640 posts, RR: 27
Reply 5, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 17038 times:
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the thing I find curious is it rolls out on the 28th, immediately does taxi tests and is scheduled to fly on the 29th...

Do they have a process for calibrating engines and all the electronic gear before roll out, or was this plane unofficially rolled out and engines run etc., then back in for the "official" roll out?


User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6748 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 16361 times:

About Iran Air Tour, the problem is the engines which have some PW technology.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineBureaucromancer From Canada, joined Feb 2010, 165 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 16325 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 6):
About Iran Air Tour, the problem is the engines which have some PW technology.

Some PW tech or actual imported parts? If they've just been sharing technology I would think that it wouldn't be terribly hard to find their way around ITAR etc.


User currently offlinedoug_Or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3424 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 15363 times:

The article didn't say much about the plane itself. What kind of innovations and improvements does the SM version have over previous 204/214 models?


When in doubt, one B pump off
User currently offlinepylon101 From Russia, joined Feb 2008, 1604 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 14888 times:

From Wikipedia - but all appears to be correct.

Tu-204SMThe Tu-204SM is an enhanced version of the Tu-204-100, with improved engines, a new avionics suite, a new auxiliary power unit and new air-conditioning and cabin pressure control systems. The cockpit crew has been reduced from 3 to 2. The plane's payload capacity has been increased from 21 to 23 tons, and it has an improved commercial range of 4,000–4,600 km.[1] The aircraft will be powered with the Aviadvigatel PS-90A2 engine, certified in 2009 on RA-64048.[6] Tu-204SM has been developed to address the deficiences detected during the operation of the Tu-204-100 version.[1]

Atlant-Soyuz will be the launch customer of the aircraft, with deliveries starting in 2011. The company has an order for 15 Tu-204SMs. A large order by Iran Air Tours is under threat because of the US sanctions against the Iranian economy, as the American company Pratt & Whitney's has been involved in the development of the engine with Perm Engine Company. It has been proposed to re-equip the Tu-204SMs with the Tu-204's Russian-made PS-90A engines to make the sale possible.[6]


User currently offlineSoyuz From Australia, joined Sep 2010, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 13148 times:

I'm a supporter of the TU-204. It's a little battler. Sales/deliveries have been trickling through over the past 15 years or so and the SM should definitely narrow the gap between the 204 and equivalent western models. However, I'm very skeptical about its future. The Lebedev/Redwings order for 44 frames sounds too good to be true - particularly given that the airline had some significant and well documented issues with the earlier versions of the 204. I'm also not aware of a formal contract having been signed. The Atlant-Soyuz order is a bit on-again-off-again (the last I heard was that it's off again - source: http://www.aviaport.ru/digest/2010/11/25/206224.html) and I find it hard to believe that Tupolev will essentially re-re-engine an aircraft with an older, less advanced power plant in order to sell a few frames to Iran. Like I said, I'm hoping that my pessimism is misplaced and I wish this machine lots of orders, deliveries and ADEQUATE AFTER SALE SUPPORT.

User currently offlineSevernaya From Russia, joined Jan 2009, 1419 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 12977 times:

Quoting Soyuz (Reply 10):
The Atlant-Soyuz order is a bit on-again-off-again (the last I heard was that it's off again - source: http://www.aviaport.ru/digest/2010/11/25/206224.html

I suppose with the soon to be declared bankrupt Moscow Airlines this order is off.



Всяк глядит, да не всяк видит.
User currently offlinepylon101 From Russia, joined Feb 2008, 1604 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 12947 times:

Difficulties were related to diversions to Krasnodar due to one engine shut-down. Mostly.
It happens 2-3 times during the season.

Oddly enough VIM 757-200 used to have about same number of diversions for the same reason - and again to Krasnodar.


User currently offlineSchorschNG From Germany, joined Sep 2010, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 11882 times:

The specs of the SM show how bad the "classic" Tu-204 apparently was. I actually didn't know that it still had 3-man cockpit. Replacing APU and Air Conditioning implies, that these systems were notorious trouble makers. The reliability of the -204 Classic more or less makes a modern commercial service impossible.

The orders for these aircraft are always suspicious. Airlines like Red Wings, which operate 8 aircraft, making orders for 40 new? Possible, yes, but not the kind of solid customer you need. Atlant-Soyuz isn't really an airline, it is a flying museum with many types on order. Sometimes it looks like a "parking lot" for surplus Russian aircraft production, given the fact that the airline is owned by the City of Moscow.

I personally see no future for the Tu-204SM. Although I think the engineering is solid and a great leap forward for the Russian aviation industry, it still cannot compete versus a B737-900ER or A321-NEO. Only if it is sold in a closed market (in Russia you pay 40% import taxes on aircraft) or a market inaccessible to Western manufacturers (Iran, Venezuela, Cuba) using American parts (which is true for all Airbus).
The Tu-204SM will be built and produced in small numbers, if necessary "Illushyn Finance" (another funny organisation) will buy the surplus and hide it somewhere.



From a structural standpoint, passengers are the worst possible payload. [Michael Chun-Yung Niu]
User currently offlinef4f3a From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 246 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10888 times:

perhaps o leary will order it as no one else wants to sell him planes  

User currently offlineRubberJungle From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10533 times:

Picture of the maiden flight on Flightglobal:

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-204sm-conducts-maiden-flight.html


User currently offlineLightbug From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 10 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8777 times:

Quoting SchorschNG (Reply 13):
The specs of the SM show how bad the "classic" Tu-204 apparently was.

Keep in mind that the "classic" TU-204 is a pretty dated aircraft too, initially developed more than 20 years ago.


User currently offlineYAK42 From Ireland, joined Oct 2000, 801 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (3 years 10 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 8050 times:

The PW involvement in Aviadvigatel could actually kill off The Tu204. Iranian operators were set to be by a long way the biggest customers for the type.

User currently offlinepylon101 From Russia, joined Feb 2008, 1604 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (3 years 10 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7860 times:

I believe that cooperation of "Aviadvigatel" (manufacturer of PS-90) and P&W is strategic.
And considering all factors they will prefer to put Iran contract at risk.
Though PS-90A is available for Iran.
And this engine is not that bad in terms of fuel consumption.
P&W cooperation delivered more reliability, longer service periods.

Even in base version TU-204 is quite competative, at least for some markets.
I am sorry - but in 1990 nobody was thinking of competition with A-B.

Anyway. Cooperation of Perm Motors and P&W is considered important not only for longer TU-204 years.
But what's more important - for MS-21.

I should say that cooperation between US and Russia is not highlited in mass media.
But in reality US-RU cooperation is more advanced compared to EU countries (Italy and Alenia is exception).


User currently offlineYAK42 From Ireland, joined Oct 2000, 801 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (3 years 10 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 7720 times:

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 18):
Anyway. Cooperation of Perm Motors and P&W is considered important not only for longer TU-204 years.
But what's more important - for MS-21.

But there will be no future for these aircraft without orders.


User currently offlineRubberJungle From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7344 times:

Flightglobal now has a video of the Tu-204SM's maiden flight.


http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...tu-204sm-flies-for-first-time.html


User currently offlinekeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (3 years 10 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 7288 times:

I think the SM could be important replacing some of the russian dated aircraft currently in use.

Longer term it seems the MS21-400 will eclipse the 204.



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