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Any Other A346 Operators Offer A Lower-deck?  
User currently offlineheathrow From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2005, 980 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 20613 times:

Hi there. Saw the previous thread from 2009, but it's locked and didn't answer the question I have.

Are there any other airlines that offer a lower deck on the 346? If no, why not? If yes, who?

Also, are there any other aircraft (I believe 333 and L1011?) which had a lower deck for passenger use?

Thanks in advance for the replies,

Rudi

21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinedeltamartin From Sweden, joined Dec 2010, 1061 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 20623 times:

I've read somewhere that MyTravel used to have a lower deck with lavartories on their A330's.

User currently offlineheathrow From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2005, 980 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 20535 times:

That's what I saw in the previous thread, but have never heard about it prior to today. I am interested in which airlines have chosen this option now!

User currently offlinemattuk From UK - England, joined Sep 2010, 102 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 20517 times:

Quoting deltamartin (Reply 1):
I've read somewhere that MyTravel used to have a lower deck with lavartories on their A330's.

This is correct, the AIH / MYT A330-200 aircraft all had lower deck toilet facilities with access from the centre of the main cabin.

"Airtours International has the first A330's in the world to feature downstairs toilets. Five of the seven on board are situated on a downstairs deck, accessed via a stairway at the centre of the aircraft. Putting these toilets downstairs makes the main cabin a more pleasant environment."

Quote taken from:
http://www.simshack.net/product_info.php?products_id=53


User currently offlineMYT321 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2007, 87 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 20370 times:

These birds are now with TCX, my parents flew MAN-HOG on one last month.


"The A380 is coming to MAN"
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 19339 times:

Quoting heathrow (Thread starter):
are there any other aircraft (I believe 333 and L1011?) which had a lower deck for passenger use?

The Boeing 377 Stratocruiser had a lower-deck lounge that seated about a dozen.

http://www.britishairways.com/cms/global/assets/images/history_and_heritage/40s_fullsize/1940_49_48.jpg



User currently offlineDTWAGENT From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 18576 times:

I believe that LH is the only carrier that has the lavs on the lower level. As most have crew bunks on the lower level. And yes the L1011 did have that option for a lower level lounge. PSA was the only customer to order this. As the other airlines did not see the need for this. Hope this helps.

Have a good one
Chuck


User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4840 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 17950 times:
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How does the presence of such lower deck areas, or even the cabin rest areas, affect fire safety etc. I ask because one of the problems with certifying combis these days relate to fire/smoke spread from the cargo to pax compartment.

User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6475 posts, RR: 32
Reply 8, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 17103 times:
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As far as I know, birds that have or had any kind of habitable "human" facilities (modern) below decks were:

The 747s: As a matter of fact, I remember reading a story that the UA crews were pissed about the PA 741 they got on the purchase of the Pacifici routes as those came with lower deck galleys and the UA crews hated them. The conclusion being that not all 747s came with lower deck facilities. It was probably a customer issue, like on Air Force 1 or Japan AIr !

The DC-10: The main galley was there. Althought Im not sure it came as standard, but it was promoted as the best soultion to customers, probably because of all then crap the L1011 was fitting down there. Bunks and shit for passengers I doubt it. Adn I believe later DC-10´s dispensed with lower deck facilties.

The L1011: The king. A galley, a passenger lounge (which failed miserably) and much more crap down there. Useless in my opinion.

About the airbii, officially, I know that the lower deck option was originally offered after the brilliant minds at Toulouse decided that the lower deck cabin crew rest area planned for the A342 (necessary, due to its range, otherwise no respectable union member cabin crew would have flown the bird) had a lot more potential and thus offered it to the airlines for a variety of uses. That evolved into what eventuallly LH got for its A346 and later adapted to other A33/4 family with other arlines, the ones you see now flying with A333/2 with lower deck facilities.


User currently offlineLufthansa411 From Germany, joined Jan 2008, 692 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 16939 times:

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 6):
I believe that LH is the only carrier that has the lavs on the lower level. As most have crew bunks on the lower level.

Actually, the LH birds have lavs, a galley and the crew bunks downstairs. The latter two are accessible via a door like panel downstairs.



Nothing in life is to be feared; it is only to be understood.
User currently offlineShmertspionem From India, joined Aug 2006, 453 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 15629 times:

At least 1 Air India 330 has it - the one leased from Novair. Here is a cabin picture (not of the lower level lavs though) but the lower level lavs are mentioned in the photo description.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Air-I...d=ef7a474297f79cec7b467cd44fb266f7

I would reckon placing the lavs and stuff under-deck would have a lot to do with economics - the cost benefits of having more deck space vs less cargo space ....... but i think an equally important consideration would be the resale value of a plane with such a non standard configuration

Also the Il-86 used to have a lower deck for passengers to stow their coats - a toilet, a lift and a galley. I remember flying in them and thing "how cool". I read this was done to reduce ground crew support on embarkation-disembarkation - especially in far flung Siberian airports

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Atlan...d=ca34002dd23fbf465d014e5fbf946eed

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/9/0/4/1750409.jpg


China Airlines seems to use lower deck crew bunks on their 340's
http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/0/4/5/0406540.jpg

and here is a picture of the mytravel lower deck loos
http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/9/7/9/0784979.jpg

The Tu-114 also had a lower deck galley as can be seen here
http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/8/7/1/0470178.jpg



cheers



Vi veri universum vivus vici
User currently offlineflyglobal From Germany, joined Mar 2008, 596 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 15602 times:

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 9):
Actually, the LH birds have lavs, a galley and the crew bunks downstairs. The latter two are accessible via a door like panel downstairs.

Correct its a combination of all.

By the way, even If I mostly had business class flights. The Lavs down there for economy passengers are way more comfortable then any other lav in the bow of the outsiede shape of the plane. Similar to some 744 birtds where a single lav is in the 'middle' of the plane for business or first class (depending on configuration).
So when flying A346 in LH Business class I usually preferred to use the lower deck LAVs in favor for the business class lavs at the side wall.

10 people passenger limitation are in the lower area for safety due to available oxygen masks.

regards

flyglobal


User currently offlinehiflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2177 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 12284 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 8):
I remember reading a story that the UA crews were pissed about the PA 741 they got on the purchase of the Pacifici routes as those came with lower deck galleys and the UA crews hated them.

Must have read that story backwards.... The pa 747 fleet was all upper deck galley...the UA and AA that came to PA were lower deck and the PA crews hated them....PA put those birds into the CRAF program and had the galleys moved back upstairs and a full cargo area reinstalled. FYI UA got the L100-500 and the 747SP and a few DC10-30's from PA in the deal..not 747s. UA's widebody fleet was all lower deck galley until then.


User currently offlineLH526 From Germany, joined Aug 2000, 2380 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 11236 times:
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Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 9):
Actually, the LH birds have lavs, a galley and the crew bunks downstairs. The latter two are accessible via a door like panel downstairs.

.. and are a very tight squeeze in parts to walk in, poor soul the sole FA having to man the station there  



Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 10661 times:

Quoting hiflyer (Reply 12):
The pa 747 fleet was all upper deck galley...the UA and AA that came to PA were lower deck and the PA crews hated them....PA put those birds into the CRAF program and had the galleys moved back upstairs and a full cargo area reinstalled. FYI UA got the L100-500 and the 747SP and a few DC10-30's from PA in the deal..not 747s. UA's widebody fleet was all lower deck galley until then.

When UA was awarded SEA-HKG and SEA-NRT in 1983 (their first international routes other than Canada), they had nothing that could operate SEA-HKG nonstop, so they made a lease/exchange deal with CP Air which lasted from 1983 to 1987. CP provided 3 of their DC-10-30s to UA and took 3 UA DC-10-10s which were used on CP domestic and some shorter international routes (often used YYZ-AMS and YYZ-LIM). I remember hearing that many CP flight attendants didn't like working on the UA DC-10-10s due to their lower-deck galleys which complicated service.


User currently offlineEBGARN From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 226 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 10627 times:

Quoting deltamartin (Reply 1):
I've read somewhere that MyTravel used to have a lower deck with lavartories on their A330's.

Also Novair had it in their A330-200. I've been there, done "that"!  

They got rid of the 332 last year, I believe. Now they have a wet lease 330-200 or -300 from Air Europe.



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User currently offlineShmertspionem From India, joined Aug 2006, 453 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 10394 times:

Quoting LH526 (Reply 13):
and are a very tight squeeze in parts to walk in, poor soul the sole FA having to man the station there

It seems the FA doesnt maintain them at all. The passage is nice and wide - but the toilets are as tight a squeeze as any on the main deck. On my last flight from MAA-FRA in june last - the entire lower deck was worse than an Indian public toilet - water and toilet paper all over - flowing into the corridor as well and the worst part is after meal service the lower deck is where the apple juice (pre poured into paper cups) are kept for passenger comfort !!!! yuck!!!

Quoting EBGARN (Reply 15):
They got rid of the 332 last year,

yep that the Air India 332 - pic posted in last post.



Vi veri universum vivus vici
User currently offlinetristarsteve From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 4053 posts, RR: 33
Reply 17, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 10091 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 8):
The L1011: The king. A galley, a passenger lounge (which failed miserably) and much more crap down there. Useless in my opinion

The lower galley was a standard fit on the Tristar.
But it took up a chunk of the fwd freight hold. BA modified all their Tristar 200 and moved the galley up to the main deck and removed the two lifts, and extended the fed freight. Obviously they worked out they could make more money with freight than pax. The BA Tristars had the large fwd freight door, so the fwd freight took pallets.
I used to like the lower galley. When I flew as a flying mechanic, I used to curl up on the table in the door way with a book when the cabin was full of 350 passengers!


User currently offlinecvg2lga From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 635 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 9668 times:

Some time ago, back in 05 I believe it was, AF was bringing their A340 into CVG. I got to go onboard with the caterers and the lady in charge of AF's catering and she took me on a tour of the plane. They had a deck downstairs, I can't remember if it was explicitly for crew or whether or not it had restrooms too.

Tchau

DA-



They don't call em' emergencies anymore. They call em' Patronies.
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 19, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9620 times:

Quoting tristarsteve (Reply 17):
The lower galley was a standard fit on the Tristar.

Don't think that was true for the L-1011-500. Did BA's L-1011-500s (now with the RAF) have a lower deck galley? I don't believe so. That would have really eaten into the -500s reduced cargo/baggage capacity due to the shortened fuselage.


User currently offlinetristarsteve From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 4053 posts, RR: 33
Reply 20, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9502 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 19):
The lower galley was a standard fit on the Tristar.

Don't think that was true for the L-1011-500

You are right. But the -500 was not a standard Tristar!


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6475 posts, RR: 32
Reply 21, posted (3 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 9216 times:
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Quoting hiflyer (Reply 12):
Must have read that story backwards.... The pa 747 fleet was all upper deck galley...the UA and AA that came to PA were lower deck and the PA crews hated them....PA put those birds into the CRAF program and had the galleys moved back upstairs and a full cargo area reinstalled. FYI UA got the L100-500 and the 747SP and a few DC10-30's from PA in the deal..not 747s. UA's widebody fleet was all lower deck galley until then.

Probably, but thanks for the correction though. I don´t remember where I read it though and it was a long time ago.


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